Polls are closed and results are starting to come in. Me, I will stay glued to the Decision Desk HQ, in particular the South Carolina GOP results (obviously). Their Twitter feed is here.
UPDATE:
Jeb Bush: "Tonight I am suspending my campaign." #SCPrimary
— NPR (@NPR) February 21, 2016
Who would have ever thought it, at the beginning of this campaign?
Pronounced "Patter-EE-koh"
E-mail: Just use my moniker Patterico, followed by the @ symbol, followed by gmail.com
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Ding.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:13 pmExit polls show what you probably would reasonably expect: Trump, Cruz, Rubio. I have been worried about Rubio coming in second. We’ll see.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:14 pm‘Tis a profound shame that there were so many early absentee ballots. Those are far more likely to favor Trump, as the late breakers crush him 84-16.
Friggin’ Carson staying in could also be the difference if the result is within 5 points, as is being broadly suggested.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:16 pmThese results are very preliminary with less than 1% of the vote tabulated.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:18 pmAlso, it is very significant that the lead story spouted by Megyn Kelly as she came on the air was that Bush is having a horrific (my term) result.
No coincidence whatsoever that the only Luntz tweet I’ve seen about the results is that the bottom three won’t be able to justify going on, per the exit polling.
You seeing a theme here? 🙂
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:19 pmNow, with a little over 1% of the vote tabulated the results (rounded off), Trump 33%, Rubio 22%, Cruz 21%, Bush 12%, Kasich 7%, Carson 5%.
FOX NEWS is calling the race for TRUMP.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:31 pmropelight, we all have access to the updated results on the internet. But thanks for your ‘circa 1984’ minute by minute updates, bud. “Back to you in the studio, Dan Rather!” (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:35 pmCalled for Trump but we knew that. By how much, and who is second?
Patterico (7f9b4d) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:37 pmCONGRATULATIONS TO GEORGE W. BUSH FOR KEEPING AMERICA SAFE FROM A JEB BUSH PRESIDENCY!
DCSCA (a343d5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:39 pmyes yes Mr. Trump is #1 in america!
especially south carolina where the ineffectual and smarmy governor’s endorsement and one of those fun sets of appetizers in the cones with some dippin sauce will make for a tasty snack
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:44 pmI wish Kasich, Bush, and Carson would withdraw so that either Cruz or Rubio can take on Trump head-to-head. Trump is a 30% or thereabouts guy, but that means that he’s not the first choice for about 70% of primary voters.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:45 pmThere’s “flexibility!” to defeat him—but not if his opposition is splintered among several candidates.
don’t skimp on the dippin sauce like in the pic i don’t know what’s wrong with these people
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:45 pmBetter watch out Patterico. Make sure your comments are approved by Cruz Supporter. He gets testy if you don’t get his permission first.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:45 pmAnd Ropelight gets testy when it’s pointed out Trump won’t dismantle ObamaCare because he likes forcing people to buy something.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:47 pmKasich is going to use any pretext to get to Ohio (March 15) so he can win delegates there and be a potential kingmaker at an open convention.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:52 pmsomeday soon all these fractious primaries will be over and we can all be trumpfriends together
it’ll be summertime we can make some of Mr. 57’s limoncello!
and we will laugh and we will dance and we will make merry all the day and all the night for we know our cause is just
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:53 pmIf the numbers at Decision Desk hold, Cruz takes 2nd in votes, but gets zero delegates. Rubio a whisker-close third to Cruz in votes, but he wins some delegates.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:56 pmThe numbers did not hold in the latest update, but Rubio still in line to take some delegates.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 4:57 pmFYI:
Trump supporters: 31%
Non-Trump supporters: 69%
Some of these guys really need to drop out. Bush, Kasich, Carson.
Patrick Henry, the 2nd (ddead1) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:01 pmIf they asked me how I voted in an exit poll I’d mislead them every step of the way… just the way I’d play it.
Too bad Trump is being rewarded for bad behavior.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:02 pmYeah, I’m not liking the spread, and that Rubio stands a chance to take second.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:02 pmTrump is only winning all the delegates in the states by 30%…..we need all the other candidates to drop so Cruz can pull the real conservative votes. Problem is all the other candidates would rather see Trump as their happy jolly Boss then Ted who will make them work for the people. Ted has already said in his book that DC politicians dont want to actually do what they say but get around doing what they are elected to do.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:03 pmIt’s early yet, and with less than 3% counted, IMHO 2nd place is still in contention. I’m really hoping Cruz takes it.
I also hope Bush & Kasich hang on until Super Tuesday, though that’s for tactical reasons, not because I like either of them (I don’t).
Arizona CJ (da673d) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:04 pmBest comment on FOX so far:
If the anti-Trump wing of the GOP hasn’t gotten it yet, they won’t get it, not till it’s too late.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:09 pmTrump supporters: 31%
Non-Trump supporters: 69%
Some of these guys really need to drop out. Bush, Kasich, Carson.
Patrick Henry, the 2nd (ddead1)
……………….
Amen, and Hillary is chomping at the bit to run against Trump. Two democrats duking it out…
I heard the msm has all kinds of material they are holding on Trump until he gets the nomination to release…. and then it will be another worse of two evil elections.
The people needed to stand with Ted if they really wanted the best person to fight crony corruption in DC. Trump has built his business on back door deals and America is too stupid not to see.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:13 pmSC primary has made me feel terrible.
Dejectedhead (cf5b30) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:13 pmanti-Trump wing of the GOP hasn’t gotten it yet,
?????
…………………………………………….
Trump is NOT anti GOP …..ONLY Cruz is anti GOP….. even Jimmy Carter said so.
Trump is moldable…. Cruz is not.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:16 pmThe good news and the bad are identical–what Trump will actually become is a mystery wrapped in an enigma subsumed by a conundrum, etc., and comprehensive POSes like Ryan prove that you have a pig in a poke regardless with the GOPe so be adults and quit yer whinin’.
Hope for the best and prepare for the worst.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:18 pmIf any of the candidates really want to be antiestablishment they will drop so Cruz can easily beat Trump. Trump is pulling mostly moderate voters.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:20 pmAnd if you can’t trust Jimmy Carter who can you trust? Harry Reid?
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:21 pm21. Fantasy. SC turnout surpassed 2012 by 2PM in many precincts. Your enemy is the totally disaffected who have not voted in more than a decade.
America cannot stand Donks or Thugs another term.
Burn it down.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:22 pmIf it is not Ted, I’ll bring the matches.
mg (31009b) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:27 pmSome of this bashing of Ropelight is asinine. The guy is just giving his opinions on the actual topic of the discussion. Some folks are contributing nothing but insults.
Looks like another third for Rubio. Looking forward to hearing about how this means he won again.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:29 pm31. Ted and Roobs in a dead heat. Whaddaya think the GOPe will do with that?
We need Cruz as SC Chief any way it can happen.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:29 pmlook out Jebbio’s closing in fast from behind!
it’s gonna be a nailbiter
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:31 pmThis whole Rubio vs Cruz thing is deadly. It’s like the Hulk vs the Thing inside the Titanic. There’s a bigger problem and by ignoring it, their petty feud — and it is so petty that it makes people like Kasich look good — let Trump get away with murder. If Trump becomes the nominee it will largely be Cruz’s fault since he’s the one who will not let go of the Gang of 8 thing.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:32 pm35. You need help, big time.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:35 pmRubio is the one who would not let go of the Gang of 8.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:36 pmyou’ll never convince me that Trump isn’t the fault of jeb’s early frontrunner by donortrash decree status
bushfilth and his utter lack of self-awareness are what you can thank for Mr. Trump
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:36 pmStrange goings on in Cherokee county!
felipe (56556d) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:41 pmhf-
yup
What are we going to do?
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:41 pmTrump is beating Rubio and Cruz soundly at all turns.
If it continues, it’ll be Trump.
So, really, you guys would stand down rather than vote against Hillary and… well… FOR CHAOS?
That’s a very strange view. Politics ain’t beanbag. Rubio’s dishonesty in the Gang of 8 ‘thing’ is one of the very few things he’s ever done in his miniscule career. His telling Univision he won’t get rid of DACA until legislative amnesty happens is an Arafat level lie. If Cruz wasn’t willing to challenge Rubio on this, he wouldn’t have that fire in the belly to run or lead in the first place!
No, it’s Rubio who is letting Trump run away with this. Rubio was very hesitant to criticize Trump, hoping Cruz and Trump could fight while Rubio slips ahead. Rubio has latched on to Trump’s “Cruz is being mean” attack to defend his amnesty efforts.
It is not petty to oppose amnesty, Kevin. It’s a legitimate stance on a major political controversy.
I won’t vote for Rubio in the general, and there are a lot like me. I warned y’all not to nominate Romney last round and when you guys lost, instead of apologizing for nominating a guy who would lose, y’all blamed the party for not supporting someone they didn’t agree with.
But I’m talking to someone who says Kasich looks good. Clearly we have different goals in mind for this country.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:42 pmWell it’s a middle weight competition.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:42 pmTo all and sundry: I am officially divorced from Kristin Joann Pederson, PhD., Microbiologist.
Her debt to me is yet to be settled–baby steps.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:43 pmRubio let go of the Gang of 8 before it reached the first vote. He learned a harsh lesson and I’m glad he can learn lessons. Many politicians can’t. Trump can’t even learn from what he said yesterday. Cruz is the one who will take an unpopular position and continue to push it no matter what. Sure his gallery loves it, but it remains unpopular and fruitless. Can’t anyone here play this game?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:43 pmJeb suspense campaigned… awesome…. hope all follow and get behind Cruz.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:44 pmHappy–
Romney killed that when he threatened to get in the race when Bush played the inevitability card. Considering that Trump filled the vacuum left by Romney’s withdrawal, I’m sorry he got out. I would rather see Archie Bunker running for President than Donald Trump.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:45 pmBYE-BYE JEB! CONGRATULATIONS TO GEORGE W. BUSH FOR KEEPING AMERICA SAFE FROM A JEB BUSH PRESIDENCY!
DCSCA (a343d5) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:46 pmJeb suspense campaigned… awesome…. hope all follow and get behind Cruz.
Jeb’s voters will split between Kasich, Rubio and Cruz. unless Kasich is also out (he should be). In which case they will both go 70/30 to Rubio/Cruz. NONE will go to Trump.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:47 pmUPDATE:
Who would have ever thought it, at the beginning of this campaign?
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:47 pmWhere will Jeb!’s MONEY go? Not that it particularly helped Jeb!
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:47 pmBush just said it himself… Yay!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:48 pmMost of Bush’s supporters will switch to Rubio. If so, he’ll be elevated to Trump’s main opponent. Cruz takes another hit.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:48 pmKevin M,
Haven’t you ever visited the Barry Goldwater Presidential Library?! Me neither! (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:48 pmI think Jeb’s voters will go Kasich/Trump/Rubio. Because, other than immigration, where Trump flipped before he flopped, Trump is the least Conservative of the remaining candidates. And Jeb was second in that ranking, until he dropped out.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:52 pmRubio’s Achilles heal is illegal immigration, and his albatross is the Gang of 8’s amnesty bill. The time has come when all GOP candidates will turn on Rubio and rub his nose in amnesty pie.
ropelight (b80664) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:52 pmA huge consideration now is the future debate dynamics. Bush was reliable in taking on Trump, allowing Rubio and Cruz to not offend Trumpists. Now, just when Trump’s support is beginning to erode, both Rubio and Cruz simply must go after Trump in unison.
And then freakin’ Kasich will stand aside tut-tutting about how mean everyone is and how the real object of their fire should be HRC. Makes me sick.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:53 pmMelancholy – the Fox News Channel’s election headquarters. One word description.
Poor Megan (Doesn’t get to keep her gyno “y” because gyno “y”s are for winners.)
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:54 pmActually no, romney filled a narrow technocrat niche, more white collar, whereas trump is more populist, blue collar.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:54 pmRomney had even less case to make for a run than Jebbio I thought
when a whole nation picks a sleazy food stamper over you it means you’ve been judged and found extremely wanting
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:55 pm47. “Jeb’s voters will split between Kasich, Rubio and Cruz.”
How deep do you dig for this stuff? The duodenum? Cruz isn’t even fluent, comprende? The GOPe hates him far more than Trump.
Mendacity your surname?
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:55 pmI think Bush supporters go to Kasich (who most closely resembles Bush), and as we have seen, being in the bottom third doesn’t seem to impact these voters all that much. They hung with Bush long after the writing was on the wall. If they do go to Rubio, it will be because of the Gang of 8. Funny that.
Dana (86e864) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:56 pmcongratulations Mr. gary that’s a nice grim milestone to get behind you
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 5:56 pmYes, Cruz and Rubio must go on the attack against Trump. No more parochial debating about who said what at 3AM on the Senate floor about a bill that didn’t even pass. No more counting angels on the head of a pin. Just mock Trump for being the flip-flopping, nasty, unhinged Democrat that he is.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:00 pmAs noted up-thread, Bush made it official; He’s suspending his campaign.
My message to Jeb: What the voters did to you was an act of love.
Arizona CJ (da673d) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:01 pm61. Been telling any who will listen: Marry for love.
If it goes wrong you had something, while it lasted.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:01 pmif Bush is out what’s lispy fruit loop Dr. Ben Carson’s rationale for continuing to bumble along aimlessly?
these people are so weird and their thinkings are wholly opaque
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:02 pmSo, really, you guys would stand down rather than vote against Hillary and… well… FOR CHAOS?
Since all the Trump voters are voting for Trump because they want to BURN IT DOWN then at this point what difference it make.
Susan (b75f73) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:02 pmThe next debate should be limited to the “top 3 in the polls” for those that cannot take the hint.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:03 pmyes yes marry for love!
those are good words to live by
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:03 pmyes yes #67 nails it
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:03 pmWhile I am at it…thanks for nothing Pope Francis, you idiot. Tear down your own damn wall. Don’t make the Mexican faithful contribute to the cost, either.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:04 pmoh look NPR’s tweets have the blue socialist check mark what says their tweets are entirely legit and approved
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:05 pm62. Quintessentially obtuse. Roobs, the GOPe darling, is going to crush Cruz to a greasy stain by the third ballot.
Cruz will get nothing in return for fellating Roobs on the latter’s upgrade to nomination.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:06 pm66. Soes we can start from scratch. “Do not despise the day of small beginnings.”
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:09 pmBye bye jebra! Canada turd crud can’t even beat that punk rubio.
trump our next president (1d176a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:09 pmDNF, did Karl Rove diagram that on his whiteboard?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:11 pmBecause they want to protect the west and western civilization. Build the wall. Moratorium on Muslim immigration. Defense of Europe (providing leadership and historical clarity to them). Etc.
Trump has faults—but he’s the opposite of, “Burn it down.” He’s, “Save what matters most.”
By the way, which GOP candidate won NH and SC, then lost the nomination?
It’s a trick question: none.
P.S. Bush’s voters will mostly defect to Rubio as mentioned by ropelight above. There are similarities. Bush voters were very Hispanic friendly. Rubio is the closest left to an establishment favorite. With Rubio this close tonight, he’s poised to be number two in the remainder of the race.
P.P.S. Trump, Rubio, and Carson all attacked Cruz’s honesty. That hurt him. That’s why Cruz didn’t score a solid second tonight.
It's A Movement (7a5333) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:12 pmProbably in a Cayman account in Hillary’s name. That’s where most money in politics seems to end up.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:12 pmIs this a sock I see before me?
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:13 pmIt isn’t Perry. Must be Christoph.
Nah, it’s Perry Mr. Hitchcock. He stands out like a sore thumb.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:16 pmHey crud suppository punk rubio is beating your canada turd crud!
trump our next president (1d176a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:16 pmYup, it sounds white supremacist-y. Which is what he is now.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:17 pmBTW, very Lady Macbeth of you.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:17 pmLooks like Rubio is barely ahead (.3%) per Decision Desk HQ, but has been ahead by more earlier in the night.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:17 pmYup, it sounds white supremacist-y. Which is what he is now.
Eew.
Dana (86e864) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:17 pmJeb’s voters will split between Kasich, Rubio and Cruz. unless Kasich is also out (he should be). In which case they will both go 70/30 to Rubio/Cruz. NONE will go to Trump.
Kevin M
……………..
Ka-sick and bone head Carson needed to be gone yesterday
Even gang of 8 Rubio needs to Go.
There is only one race here: Cruz and Trump….
Remember most of these primaries are open so democrats are voting for Trump.
Cruz is the only conservative that will fight the establishment and the voters need to see the truth. Trump is not the answer to 8 years of BO…. Only Cruz is the antidote to BO
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:18 pmNo, It’s a Movement sounds like Christoph.
Watch:
Hey It’s a Movement: are you Christoph?
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:18 pmDana, did you miss it when I was talking about this the other night? He mentioned me on Twitter and I looked at his Twitter account (and blocked him).
Eew indeed.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:19 pmIt’s A Movement was Christoph. trump our next president is perry.
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:19 pm“Since all the Trump voters are voting for Trump because they want to BURN IT DOWN then at this point what difference it make.”
…………………………………
All the Trump voters are democrats that voted for BO….. Trump will be more of the same gridlock in DC as BO and his executive orders were.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:21 pm74. I’ve not seen any voter affiliation polls to date for this election. If memory serves they come late, like Sept. or beginning of Oct. Last time I seem to recall Thugs 22-23%, Donks 33-34%, Indies low 40s and the rest eff your mother.
But only 50% have been voting. Neither Cruz nor Roobs dip into the disaffected. Sanders and Trump are beating the underbrush.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:21 pmDD tweeted they expect Rubio to beat Cruz by ~1.000 votes for second. 538 says it is more and more likely Trump will sweep all the delegates. None for Ted or Marco.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:21 pmI hope that John Kasich and Ben Carson will emulate Jeb Bush. Why? Because splintering the vote will not end in a brokered convention, but rather will end in a runaway victory in the GOP primaries for Donald Trump. I don’t think President Trump would be so bad, but there needs to be a clearer choice for the GOP electorate.
Andrew (b12b60) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:21 pmEvery candidate who is not Trump will say today that every other candidate who is not Trump needs to get out. Read that someplace.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:21 pmPOlitico is reporting that Ben Carson says even if he comes in dead last, he will stay in the race.
And Kasich team amusingly declares him winner of “governors’ bracket”. They believe that qualifies him to be in the top four:
Dana (86e864) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:23 pmeven if?
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:24 pmNow, a brokered convention might have some surprising results. Clearly it would not choose Trump — he either wins with a majority or he goes home. But it might not choose Cruz or Rubio either, if Trump’s delegates refuse to consider that and neither of them will let the other one win.
Maybe we get back to Walker after all.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:24 pmDesperate optimists, happyfeet.
Dana (86e864) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:25 pm75. Don’t know that I’ve seen Corpulent Karl since Aug. 15 at least as I haven’t had TV since.
Its Ok, soon I’ll be reunited with my library and will leave off singing to myself.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:26 pmCrud can’t come in second in SC so back to goldman sachs shill crud suppositories!
trump our next president (1d176a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:26 pmBeck speculated that Jeb was only in it this long because Barbara can’t stomach a Trump as president ….But if the Bushes get behind Rubio and not Cruz than Hillary will win because Rubio can’t beat Hillary. Trump as well has issues that Hillary will extort. Only Cruz can best
The Bushes would rather a Clinton in the house so they will get behind whomever can’t beat Clinton
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:26 pmJust another moby, a particularly unoriginal one.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:28 pmDana, I’d be very happy with Walker. I think he would make a serious VP choice, too.
I don’t think Trump’s most loyal fans will like Walker, who hasn’t been consistent on the immigration stuff.
—
Rubio is the establishment guy, so just about everything will go his way. Cruz is fighting the tide that has screwed everything up, and it’s a tough fight.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:29 pm93.Every candidate who is not Trump will say today that every other candidate who is not Trump needs to get out. Read that someplace
Trump is winning with only 30% and this is mostly of moderate/democrat voters. These are open primaries. Yes. The only race is between Trump and Cruz….. All the other candidates hurts the true conservative vote.
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:30 pmBeck has been unhelpful in this effort for Cruz.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:30 pmRubio can’t beat Hillary.
Except that polls say otherwise. It would certainly help if Trump were to endorse rather than, say, run as an independent.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:30 pmPerry is up late — it’s the full moon.
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:32 pmKevin,
did you every say Romney would beat Obama in 2012?
The polls said he would, but I recall saying they were wrong. Polls tend to overstate establishment GOP guys until nomination, when the press pulls the rug out (and they move to the middle, eliminating any reason to support them).
I won’t say Rubio can’t beat Hillary… I think she’s a particularly poor politician. But Cruz would do better against her. Reagan’s gift of speaking proudly about principles is a rare talent that actually builds a movement. Rubio just doesn’t have enough RAM to have that uploaded.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:33 pmIf Mr. Trump picked Mr. Governor Scott Walker as his veep I might have to rethink this whole voting thing
that would be so exciting!
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:33 pmNow will come the SCOTUS argument: Cruz will be of more benefit as a Justice.
Ted got that question at the Luntz group last night and effectively answered it. He said it is better to have him as a president who will insist on multiple conservatives with the multiple upcoming requirements than to hope someone else will nominate the right folks. 3 votes on the court are better than one. I add that if it were about scholarship and intellect, Scalia’s efforts would have counted or one helluva lot more. Nope. It’s about naked power. It’s about votes.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:35 pmI heard there’s a sore loser clause. If you compete in a Primary, you cannot run as an independent. What I heard is that several states have that clause for Presidential races. Can’t remember where I heard it or if it’s based in fact or not.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:35 pm.2% lead by Rubio with 93% of the vote counted at Decision Desk HQ.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:35 pm*retirements, not requirements.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:36 pmCruz will never be Justice on SCOTUS. Demorats and many statist Republicans won’t allow it.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:36 pmDing ding ding
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:36 pmOn to Nevada and then Super Tuesday!
Save the Foreskins!
It's A Bowel Movement (2601c0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:36 pmCool. Trump did not get his sweep of counties. At least one went to Rubio.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:37 pm104. Beck is Gollum. Gollum is Beck.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:37 pmJRT,
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:38 pmThe Bushes don’t want a Clinton in the White House. Why would you even suggest that?
And Rubio is actually defeating Clinton by nearly 5% points in the RCP average of several recent polls. It’s one thing to root for your favorite sports team to win. It’s another to suggest that there are secret agents controlling the ball via remote control from a grassy knoll behind the stadium parking lot.
113. So, there you have it, burn DC to the ground.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:39 pmRubio and Cruz outperformed the polls and Trump underperformed. A sliver of a silver lining there.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:39 pmNo amnesty for rubio!
trump our next president (1d176a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:39 pmi’m so happy Jeb is gone
this whole race has 82% more gravitas now
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:40 pm118. Come Nov. a potted plant thrashes Hillary.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:40 pmI agree Mr. gary
glad to see hillary hanging in there
if she’s the nominee the socialists lose cause she’s gross and disgusting
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:42 pmLast time, a ham sandwich could beat Obama. But we put up a vegan hamburger instead.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:42 pm122. And think of the $Hundred Million$ he lit ceegars with!
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:43 pmHe went over to the underverse, re rubio, once you fix the errant bit of subroutine, he’s rather fast on his feet.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:44 pmwow him and Meg Whitman should get together later tonight and kill an off-brand bottle of blended scotch
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:44 pmDNF,
You know who else I hear publicly talking about “burning it down”?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:45 pmThe Alinskyites, Occupy Wall Street, Ferguson rioters, and ISIS.
All the other candidates hurts the true conservative vote.
I get tired of saying this, but the GOP is not, and never has been, a conservative party. It is a broad-based center-right party that includes conservatives as a sizable segment. But if they think they ARE the party (as each wing sometimes does) they will get slapped down. Just like the mainstreet boys are getting slapped down now.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:46 pm125. Some of us recall that vividly. He was the only ‘electable’ option, but he couldn’t dispatch a stoned chief exec in debate.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:46 pmHyperventilating over trump, I have found isn’t worth the candle, as long as the loyal opposition is 51 flavors of blanc mange.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:47 pm130. Which is why the GOP is superfluous, pernicious and vile.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:48 pmIt really is long past time for SC to quit being an Open Primary state.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:49 pmJohn @ 110. Almost all the states have a sore loser law, or a requirement that you must register for November at the same time that you registered for the primary. So, when Trump, in the second or third debate, stated unequivocally that he was not going to run as an independent if he lost the nomination, well “Duh!” Like he could, except maybe in New York, Vermont and a couple of other backwaters.
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:50 pmLovvvvvvvvvvvvvve that Trump!
DCSCA (a343d5) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:50 pmhttps://www.yahoo.com/politics/live-blog-south-carolina-gop-primary-and-nevada-211903661.html
Cruz’s live speech amazing and brilliant
Cruz is the only Candidate that can AND HAS beaten Trump!
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:51 pm129. I believe you hear things, bumps and shrieks, but I don’t believe you retain or ascertain.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:51 pm95.5% of the vote counted and Rubio and Cruz are separated by .1% of the vote. 48 votes. 48.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:53 pmI remember hearing people talking about “burning it down.” “Burn, baby, burn!” was the cry. And they actually burned things. In the end they burned down the Democrat Party in 1968 in Chicago, wounding it so badly that Richard Nixon won the election. Not to be outdone, they continued the destruction, choosing the completely crazy George McGovern and the (actually crazy) Thomas Eagleton as VP in ’72. Nixon(!) won 49 states.
Even though they cheated and impeached Nixon for things that everyone was doing, they still only managed to win one election in the next 20 years. By the time they got back in in 1992, the Dem President was well to Nixon’s right, the Soviet Union was dead, their 7-2 Supreme Court majority was history, and the world was safe for capitalism.
Did not work well at all.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:53 pmThat misunderstands trumps support base, the uniparty has been selling American jobs, squandering the hard fought victories of our servicemen, leaving is blind and mute.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:54 pm(yes, I know he wasn’t really impeached, but resigned first. But the meaning is there)
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:55 pmI feel a little bit like Charlie Brown being out of the loop.
How can a person outvoted 2:1 win all of the delegates???
No answers required.
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:55 pmBedsMohels Are BurningOut where the water broke
It's A Bowel Movement (2601c0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:57 pmThe boys born under bloody cloaks
Baby dicks and thieving mohels
Stealin’ millions of foreskins
The time has come
To say fair’s fair
To blunt teh knife
To show we care
The time has come
Intact’s intact
It belongs to them
Let’s give ’em back
How can we cut when our boys are crying?
How do we sleep while their foreskin’s dying?
How can we cut when our boys are crying?
How do we sleep while their foeskin’s dying?
Kevin they implanted malware in the system, in the media, the bureAcracy, in the thought control educational sphere.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:57 pmThe problem is that Trump is not the man to fix it. Trump cannot even STATE what he wants to do — just keeps saying how great America will be again. Either he’s a complete blowhard, or his plan is so terrible he doesn’t want anyone to know. Maybe he’s going to default on the $19 trillion and Social Security. That WOULD be awesome, in a nuclear kind of way.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:58 pmBelieve us when we actual conservatives say we are inconsolable we failed to convince the right that McCain and Romney were MSM chosen loozers and had no chance in any universe.
we suck.
But look at the azzwipes we had to work with.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:59 pmIt really is long past time for the GOP to allow Open Primary states.
FIFY.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:00 pmRobert Reich weighed in with a video, explaining why Ted Cruz would be a larger disaster than Donald Trump. You can see it at http://hogewash.com and I would suggest Ted Cruz come on at the end and say “I’m Ted Cruz and I approve this message.”
Again, it’s Ted has principles and is strategic, whereas Trump has nothing to stand on except being Trump and is all over the place.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:03 pmNot addressed to anybody in particular:
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:05 pmSometimes we write something in a comment that maybe we shouldn’t have written. Patterico can delete comments and his email is on the sidebar. Just FIY in general.
I guess they like the idea of self-fulfilling prophecy, give the top person the lion’s share to discourage and dry up the funding of the others.
My whatever-you-want-to-call-it:
Trump wins almost all of the delegates and the nomination never having received more than 40% of the vote in any primary.
Clinton likewise has an overwhelming delegate lead in spite of getting 51% of the votes.
Hillary runs, Sanders runs, Trump runs and Cruz runs
But I guess that turns into a nightmare because it goes to the house…
And who are they going to pick….
And what percent of the public is going to be happy with that???
Time to primary the incumbents next election….
I really have no idea what is going to happen, and I’m not sure it’s going to get better before it gets worse…
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:08 pmBut hey, Nineveh ended up being spared after all, at least for a time.
G’night.
Sure but the top men, who make these decisions should be struck with birch sticks, till their morale improves. Exhibit a, the cnbc, abc and cbs debates.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:08 pm142. The RNC has reserved 40% of the delegates at convention. The way things are going third place plus the RNC have an overwhelming majority especially after a few ballots loosen delegates bound only for the first rounds.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:09 pmNineveh turned back to The Lord, that was the difference.
felipe (56556d) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:11 pmIf they stay to the conventions, none of them can run as independents in November, except in Connecticut, Iowa, New York and Vermont, which states have neither a sore-loser law nor simultaneous registration deadlines. And whom will this hurt?
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:12 pmThere was a site, CNN maybe, that had a “you pick the vote outcome and we tell you the delegate count” thing. I went through it once, and it said of the 2400 whatever delegates, the GOP had about 150 sitting on the sidelines for the convention.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:12 pmHow many will be in the Thursday’s debate?
3?
4?
5?
Three would be obvious, so it’s probably least likely.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:12 pmFive would be next obvious, since Kasich and Carson are pretty much tied for last.
But I’m figuring on 4, since that would allow CNN to boost Kasich into the “first tier.” The only thing that would prevent this is a fear of being called racist, so we’d be back to 3 or 5.
Trump won nearly every county. That may have something to do with it. Rubio won 3, Cruz none. There are 50 total delegates to be awarded so there is more2come.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:14 pm148. For one, I don’t dispute your comparison of the worth of Trump vs. Cruz at any level. The problem is America is really, really irked at government and the governing class.
Either appease us like a child migrant rapist or go home.
DNF (755a85) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:14 pmOpen primaries, rigged ‘debates’ it makes for an unsavory gumbo, to which the accompaniment has been xorker cardin, the continuing resolution.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:15 pm145.The problem is that Trump is not the man to fix it. Trump cannot even STATE what he wants to do — just keeps saying how great America will be again. Either he’s a complete blowhard, or his plan is so terrible he doesn’t want anyone to know. Maybe he’s going to default on the $19 trillion and Social Security. That WOULD be awesome, in a nuclear kind of way
…………………………………
Also, Trump says he will get along with everyone in DC. WE DONT want him to GET ALONG!!!
jrt for Cruz (bc7456) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:16 pmThanks for that info, man from the north.
So, in other words, it really is pretty much rigged anyway.
On the other hand, if 35% of the vote gets you 95% of the available delegates,
That 40% still isn’t enough.
The people are not going to get what they want, even if they knew what it was.
I sense nihilism creeping in, are least nihilism concerning the effectiveness of the political process as it now stands.
Our system of government will work only for a virtuous and educated public,
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:16 pmWe haven’t had that for a while.
BTW, Jeb! came in 4th and dropped out. Kasich LOST the governor’s battle.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:16 pmHillary lost by 7 points among the latinos. But really why even bother. Their outcome was predetermined before the first ballot was cast.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:17 pmCheck the map on the front page at http://nytimes.com More inside if you can get there.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:17 pmDNF, that was Robert Reich in the video saying Cruz was anchored, a “true believer” and Trump was less dangerous because he only believes in himself.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:19 pmIndeed Felipe, that’s about it
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:19 pmI guess to some degree it always is,
Just sometimes it is more obvious.
If you clear your land to prevent being burned out, the BLM will put you in prison, the FBI will hunt your friends, and lay in ambush to kill them. The same agencies will look the other way when the EPA poisons an entire river system..
You have to feel a little bit like it’s futile, otherwise you’ll go nucking futs.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:21 pmIt is a travismockasham, homely not at the level of the last Allen drury works.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:24 pmNot two mention the retreat from the constitutional redoubt re the court.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:26 pm#Travismockasham
It’s a movement, pass it on.
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:30 pmThis does not bode well for the Republic.
Bush supporters will probably break for Rubio. Carson may well stay in but if he does drop out I suspect his voters will break for Cruz.
But Cruz has to win some states eventually to make this happen.
With every “Trumpism” I become more convinced that I cannot vote for a Republican nominee that supports the Obamacare mandate, Planned Parenthood, eminent domain, and has an ego bigger than Obama.
It looks like I am going to be voting Constitution Party again in 2016.
I think I am watching America commit suicide by populism. I do not believe Yankee Trump could get that many votes in South Carolina. It defies reason and logic.
WarEagle82 (3f92a9) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:30 pmHere’s the thing Mr Eagle. At least two of you’re gotcha points are false, and the other two are true of politicians across the board.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:35 pmIts a contraction from bananas: a travesty of a mockery of a sham.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:35 pmAnyone ever seen the 1957 Elia Kazan-directed film, “A Face in the Crowd,” starring Andy Griffith, Patricia Neal, and Walter Matthau? Griffith was nominated as ‘Best Actor.’ Anyhow, Griffith plays a folksy populist singer/reality show type of superstar who recognizes that he can push little buttons which elicits “the people” to go wild with approval. There’s a real demogogic lesson to extract from it. Mind you, it’s even more prescient when one consider this was merely when there were only 3 TV networks. It pre-dated 24 hour television, cable, movies watched over and over on VHS tapes, the internet, MTV, Twitter, et al.
It reminds me of Trump in little ways, particularly with his recent remarks about talking about building a wall when he realizes a crowd is falling asleep, or that the media believes he could shoot someone dead in the street and not lose many votes. Of course, there was/is a cult of personality around Obama, with all the (faked) fainting spells at rallies, etc.
Some people might say the script was partially-inspired by Elvis’ meteoric rise in ’56, but by all accounts, Elvis was actually a very sweet, polite man who couldn’t say “no” to anybody’s requests. Whereas this character played by Griffith was a bull in a china shop, authoritarian, and bombastic—kinda like The Donald.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:37 pmPerhaps the script was a forewarning that “Hey, this superstar Elvis kid is actually a nice chap in real life, but what would it be like if a celebrity with his power were to actually misuse it?”
Yup. I’m still looking forward to Trump melting down in public the way Rhodes (Andy Griffith) did.
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:42 pmNarciso,
I never saw that one so I didn’t recognize the source,
But I did understand the meaning
I think we should march on Washington under the banner.
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:43 pmGnite for real
Jeb Bush: “Tonight I am suspending my campaign.” #SCPrimary
But Lindsey Graham said that wouldn’t happen!
And Bush is still coming it at over 10% – or was he at that point?
AP results, with 99% of the vote counted, are
Trump: 32.5% (about as high as you might expect, perhaps does not reflect current opinion after the last debate when he almost echoed Code Pink on the warm and the Supreme Court issue became more immediate
Rubio: 22.5%
Cruz: 22.3%
Bush: 7.9% Bush is definitely losing the Bush vs Rubio primary. The Nikki Haley endorsement may have really been the end. Jeb Bush switching to contact lenses was an act of desperation he shouldn’t have done.
Kasich: 7.6% He didn’t get that much of a boost from New Hampshire. Plus. he’s the most liberal.
Carson: 7.2% Carson had expected to do better.
Total: 100%
So all write-ins or votes cast for candidates who dropped out, are not figured into the equation.
They could amount to up to 2% or 3% even more maybe. There may be some early absentee, die-hard or die-hard Rand Paul, Carly Fiorina, Chris Christie or even Santorum and Huckabee votes cast.
I would have liked Bush to stay in to be a foil for Trump in the next debate and also be there for a brokered convention. But he’s getting one third of the vote of Rubio. He had to decide before the Florida primary, and the beginning of the winner take all states, but that’s more than three weeks from now. On the other hand, he wasn’t picking up any delegates and nationally, he is around 5%. He didn’t do too much better in South Carolina, even with some endorsements. He would have been a candidate whose absence would be greatly missed with a different balance of candidates, but here it was what it was. He also had trouble because he was not recently in office, while Rubio Cruz and Kasich were.That meant he was not such a contemporary figure.
Also, he showed himself to be not much of deep thinker. Rubio defended his brother Bush 43 better on Iraq!
Carson will stay in because Cruz tried to claim he was dropping out; to get some attention to his ideas, and because he might be the beneficiary if Ted Cruz and Donald Trump implode, especially if theer are fewer candidates in the field. He fells he has not yet gotten a chance to be heard, and for people to find out he is prepared (he thinks) to speak on every issue, including foreign policy.
Bush’s votes will largely go to Kasich (if he stays in) and Rubio.
Sammy Finkelman (882d94) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:47 pmCruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 6:00 pm
It did pass. The Senate. It didn’t become law. It died in the House.
Sammy Finkelman (882d94) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:51 pmnk, I think I may begin referring to Trump as ‘Lonesome Rhodes.’ (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:53 pmOh it’s a classic, the scenes in ny, where Allen is facing a sham trial, and south America.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:54 pmNope, they’re all accurate.
Patterico (86c8ed) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:54 pmElia kazan intended it to be some sort of commentary on mccarthy, but this isnt the 50s anymore, don’t expect a Greg stillson moment either.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 7:56 pmMwahahahaha… good riddance to jeb bush.
Trump will be the new president.
Ted Cruz… looks like he came in third.
YourMaster (c7e392) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:03 pminteresting if Rubio came in 2nd tho, it means ted cruz has significant problems. Mwahahahaha
Mr. Cruz started off casting a very narrow net now it’s starting to catch up with him
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:07 pmand this is before anyone’s really hauled out his wackjob daddy yet and thrown that big ball of crazy in his face
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:11 pmAn Arab lullaby to speed you on your way, good sir.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3bjZlmsb4A
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:12 pm#180 narciso,
I don’t think “A Face in the Crowd” was particularly suggestive of McCarthy. McCarthy had political power, but he wasn’t the charming guy on TV that the Griffith character was in “A Face in the Crowd.” This movie was about the power of the emerging mass media. The writer, Budd Schulberg, had also written “On the Waterfront” for Kazan a few years earlier, and that film is often believed to have anti-Communist sentiments, particularly with Brando “informing” on Johnny Friendly. Because as you recall, Kazan had been accused of naming names of people in Hollywood who’d possibly attended far-left/Communist meetings in earlier days. Of course, Kazan didn’t name any new names—he merely confirmed names of people who were already known. Kazan and Schulberg both had hung out with leftists in the ’30s, and both had come to recognize the evil of Stalin.
By the way, I just saw that columnist Cal Thomas had written a column last year that made reference to Donald Trump channeling Lonesome Rhodes. If I had seen that earlier, I would have mentioned it in my #174 comments.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:14 pmSay what?????
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:19 pmThat was for Steve57.
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:20 pmIf Lonesome Donald wins the GOP nomination, it is time for revolution.
The type of revolution is an open question.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:22 pmMy take:
(1) It doesn’t matter whether Kasich & Carson formally withdraw or not. Neither of them will ever see 3% again, anywhere. It’s now a three-man race.
(2) As much as I would wish that the Rubio and Cruz campaigns might declare a temporary truce to jointly attack Trump, that’s not going to happen before March 1.
(3) The March 1 primaries will therefore either give Trump the nomination or eliminate one of the remaining two. Cruz will win Texas, which has the most delegates up for grabs by far; if he can pick up even one or two other wins in addition to Texas, that’s the end for Rubio.
(4) In the resulting two-man race, Cruz will win every primary after March 1 and take the nomination on the first ballot.
(5) Trump will run as a third-party candidate, but he’ll continue to hemorrhage from his existing third of the potential GOP voters, which will be offset by some number of truly crazed numbskulls who’ll flee the Democratic Party after the Democratic superdelegates and powers that be ram her down the throats of the Democratic Party. Trump gets exactly zero electoral votes.
(6) Cruz will get the turnout last seen in 2004, when Dubya was reelected; it will indeed look quite a bit like the Reagan coalition too. Hillary does less well than Kerry did against Dubya, but better than Carter or Mondale did against Reagan.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:23 pmMaybe with a touch of huey long, but I see your point, trump is not a Johnny come lately, he’s been working this pitch for 13 years.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:23 pmA question: how do you suspend what was stillborn?
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:23 pmI suspect that Barbara Bush is who we have to thank for Jeb Bush’s withdrawal. It might have been Poppy or Dubya, but I suspect it’s Barbara. Whomever staged the intervention: Thank you.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:31 pmhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RawGr83DxpE
looks like the DNC/Hillary Clinton has rigged the nomination against Bernie. bwahahahaha
Clinton will be screwed if she goes up against Trump…
she has to know 2 things at this point. 1) she can’t attack trump without it backfiring on her rather severely (all trump has to bring up is how untrustworthy she is… email scandal, benghazi, her coming to the defense/and being an enabler of bill clinton’s rapes) there’s just so much to choose from there, that she’d be a bad pick vs him.
and 2)that bernie sanders supporters… who will feel disillusioned with the democrats
will probably leap ship and help Trump win. (they absolutely hate hillary and won’t back her)
on a sidenote, George Soro’s probably wanted Jeb bush as the nominee… on the GOP side…
YourMaster (c7e392) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:36 pmit would of been the easiest path to hillary’s victory if that happened. thankfully he is gone for good.
Of those who are in, I’m still for Cruz first, Rubio as second choice.
I don’t want Trump, because he’s shallow and a reed.
And his supporters seem to be giving me evidence thathe’s a bad choice.
Ibidem (f7be92) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:37 pmOn that note:
Wherefore David arose and went, he and his men, and slew of the Philistines two hundred men; and David brought their foreskins, and they gave them in full tale to the king, that he might be the king’s son in law. And Saul gave him Michal his daughter to wife.
And Saul saw and knew that the Lord was with David, and that Michal Saul’s daughter loved him. (I Sam. 18:27-28)
Interesting, someone who has a godlike moniker is in the tank for Trump. Kinda fitting, too.
John Hitchcock (63db1c) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:43 pmI don’t want Trump, because he’s shallow and a reed.
yes i worry about this
the propaganda slut media will begin hammering him with hyped up scandals and crises from day one
we just have to hope he has good people around him i guess
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:44 pmOh dear Lord, Hillary! is in Houston tonight, where I live. She’s here trolling for trial lawyer donations (by which I mean plaintiff’s personal injury contingent-fee lawyers’ contributions, and most of them don’t actually go to trial, but w/e), and she’ll get a bunch, probably at least $7-$8M. They wanted to see the Nevada results to be assured that the fix is sufficiently in; now that’s that.
I knew the temperature outside had dropped suddenly, and all the small animals seem especially nervous.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:45 pmIts been Norwegian blue for six month now.
narciso (732bc0) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:45 pmBe curious to see polling for March 1. veryyyy.
Rodney King's Spirit (8d9ee7) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:49 pm#189 Beldar,
I like your prediction. Say, I was reading a post @ Hot Air yesterday or so, and they were hypothesizing that if Trump becomes the nominee, there might be a push for Romney to get on the ballot as an “Independent.” And here’s what the potential doomsday scenario they came up with…Clinton would likely get a max of 40% of the popular vote in Texas. That leaves 60% to be split between Trump and Romney. If either one of them falls below 40%, Hillary wins Texas and the electoral college victory would be hers. Now, it doesn’t have to necessarily be Romney in the hypothetical equation…Cruz could be the nominee, and Trump could be the “Independent.” You think Trump could pull 20% of the electorate in a three way race in TX?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:50 pmIf anybody runs against Trump and Hillary as an independent in Texas, it’s going to be Ag80. We owe him that much from 2012.
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:55 pmMeaning to say, who believes that Romney would do such a thing?
nk (dbc370) — 2/20/2016 @ 8:56 pmBTW, I predicted on February 9, the night of the New Hampshire primary, that Trump would win one-third of the vote in South Carolina — slightly less than the percentage he won in New Hampshire. I was right.
Texas has 155 delegates. Texas may save the Republic. I’m fine with that.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:00 pmFor the first time, Republican presidential candidate Donald Trump has specifically promised he would sign a bill as president to de-fund Planned Parenthood. Trump has repeatedly indicated he opposes Planned Parenthood funding but has always stopped short of committing to sign legislation to stop the flow of taxpayer funds to the nation’s biggest abortion business.
link.
I was asked about healthcare by Anderson Cooper & have been consistent- I will repeal all of #ObamaCare, including the mandate, period.
I was referring to a backstop for pre-existing conditions. I will eliminate the law, in its entirety, & replace it w/ something much better.
I will replace it with private plans, health savings accounts, & allow purchasing across state lines. Maximum choice & freedom for consumer.
I’m self-funding and I am going to take care of the people – not the special interests and insurance companies like the other candidates.
link.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:03 pmi heart maximum choice & freedom for consumer
we’re with you Mr. The Donald
happyfeet (831175) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:06 pm@ CS (#200), who asked: “You think Trump could pull 20% of the electorate in a three way [Trump-Clinton-Cruz] race in TX?”
Not in a million years.
In 1992, when the race was George H.W. Bush (another favorite son) versus Bill Clinton versus Ross Perot (a Texan, if not anyone’s favorite son), Perot got 22%, Clinton 37%, and Bush 40%. Turnout was depressed; Poppy Bush was popular here, but he never, on his best day, inspired a fraction of the enthusiasm that Ted Cruz generated for his primary runoff win over David Dewhurst. Cruz is vastly better known now in Texas than he was when he beat Dewhurst, and all those voters will turn out to vote for him on March 1, and they’d turn out again in November.
Hillary will do less well in Texas than Wendy Davis did against Greg Abbott in 2014. Davis didn’t quite manage 40% even in a two-candidate race. Abbott beat Davis among Hispanic males, for example.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:08 pmOne thing which is certain at this moment: Cruz has completely lost the expectations game coming out of SC. He was crazy to not make a huge point that SC was not critical but that instead, it was a waystation to the SEC. Doing it after the fact is too damn late.
Ironically, Juan Williams is the only commentator I saw who early on proclaimed the evening a good one for Ted right away, and stuck with it. Everyone else went the other way and insisted that being 2nd was mandatory for Ted. Had TC laid down a proper predicate, he’d be in much better shape right now.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:10 pmPut it this way: Short of being caught in a hotel room with the proverbial dead girl or live boy, Cruz will win Texas against anyone in any combination.
I’m confident Cruz will also do well in Arkansas (where he’ll pick up all those people who turned out for Tom Cotton, who has a whole lot in common with Ted Cruz) and Oklahoma. I don’t have a good enough sense of how many nutcases live in Alabama or Virginia to predict how well Trump will do there.
Rubio will win Massachusetts. Heh, I don’t know why that state gets to participate in the GOP primaries anyway.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:11 pmEd: No, what had to happen for Cruz tonight was to eliminate Jeb Bush; to confirm the irrelevance of Kasich and Carson; and to at least match Rubio, to remain in the showdown for the anyone-but-Trump voters (which still comprise 2/3rds of the GOP).
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:14 pmBeldar – I agree that TC just needed to hold serve and get a winnowing – most especially of Jeb. My point is that he made a bad political miscalculation that hurts as he tries to summon up momentum for the SEC primaries, his true home turf.
The revisionism amongst the commentariat that SC was his true turf is a lie, and it is leaving a mark. It is giving Rubio unearned standing.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:20 pm@ CS (#200): I’m sorry, re-reading, I see that I completely misunderstood your question.
I can’t answer it as asked. There’s no way Mitt Romney is going to run an independent campaign, but if he did, he’d be ignored in Texas.
If Trump is the nominee, he’d win Texas in a depressed turnout, but there’s no scenario in which turnout is suppressed sufficiently that Hillary could be the top vote getter.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:22 pmpapertiger, it doesn’t matter what you write or link here.
Anyone capable of being fooled by Trump is already fooled. Some of them have abandoned him, and more will, because they’ll wise up. I doubt you’ll be one.
But it doesn’t matter a hoot in hell what Trump “now” claims he’s for. That’s not going to change anyone’s mind about anything. We already have conclusive proof that there are suckers who will vote for Trump no matter what he says his positions are today, or what he said they were yesterday, or what he may say they are tomorrow. You are one.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:28 pmrubio will not win Ma. trump will.
mg (31009b) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:32 pmMass-holes are stuck on trump.
mg (31009b) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:33 pmmg, Trump may lead in polling in MA, but he’ll never win there. MA is the center of the universe for very conventional Republicans, and it’s a “modified closed-primary” state. If you weren’t already registered to vote as a Republican there by Jan 16, and if you didn’t “enroll” as an independent or unregistered voter by that same date, you get turned away.
If they had that rule in SC today, Trump would have come in third behind Rubio & Cruz (although it would have been tight still), based on how dramatically the late deciders broke against Trump (Rubio & Cruz basically split them).
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:45 pmTrump will probably win Virginia, though.
It will be very interesting to see what Jeff Sessions does this week. Sessions basically wrote Trump’s immigration plan (which Trump probably still hasn’t read). Of course, that was also basically the same thing that Sessions and Cruz have been fighting for hand-in-hand in the Senate. I know Jeff Sessions is way to smart to be suckered by Trump, and I believed at the time Sessions showed up on-stage with Trump for the roll-out of “Trump’s plan” (before which, he had only stuttering incoherent insults) that Sessions was mostly trying to capitalize on Trump’s celebrity to get the plan a wider, closer look (which it did).
Sessions didn’t endorse anyone in 2000, 2008, or 2012. I’m hoping he breaks his silence this time, though. That could be YUUUUGE, and Alabama has a nice handful of delegates.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:49 pm*too smart. (sigh)
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/20/2016 @ 9:50 pmIf I am TC, I offer Sessions the AG job in return for a strong endorsement and campaigning immediately.
I do the same if I am Rubio.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/20/2016 @ 10:00 pmThe late and genuinely funny Ann Richards, one-time governor of Texas, famously said of George H.W. Bush, during her keynote address at Michael Dukakis’ 1988 Democratic National Convention: “Poor George, he can’t help it — he was born with a silver foot in his mouth.” It was funny because it had some element of truth, but of course poor George went on to knock the snot out of Dukakis by winning 40 states and 426 votes in the Electoral College.
That quote is similar to, and often confused with, another one which came not from Ann Richards, but from former Oklahoma football coach Barry Switzer: “Some people are born on third base and go through life thinking they’ve hit a triple.” I’ve often heard people swear that it’s seared — seared! — into their memories that Ann Richards said that George H.W. Bush was born on third base, etc.
So that’s the quote that came to mind tonight while I was watching Jeb’s announcement that he’s giving up (“suspending his campaign”). “Stranded on third at the bottom of the third inning,” I thought to myself. “And ejected from the game.”
Jeb could have saved a ton of money if he’d done this after Iowa, and he actually should have done it last September, about when Rick Perry dropped out.
***
That Rick Perry is looking smarter and wiser than ever, huh? Perry now supports Ted Cruz. I heard David Gergen beclown himself (again) tonight on CNN, saying something like “I was in Houston last week, and I was amazed at how tight the race seems!” He was insisting that “Cruz is going to have to spend time and money in Texas now to shore that up!”
Yes, the Cruz campaign will be careful not to take Texas for granted. Yes, some money (but not much) will be spent here, and it will be on GotV, not on TV ads, but that was always in the plans. Cruz might have Perry and other supporters campaign in Texas for him, and he’ll be here in Houston for the next GOP debate (which I desperately wish I could score a ticket to).
But no, Texas is not in play.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:21 amBeldar – I’ll send you a lobster if rubio wins Ma. Un-enrolled voters in Ma. will go for teflon don.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:14 amI will not be voting for either one of those hacks.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:17 amDo you live in MA, mg? 😀 I’ll defer to your on-the-ground experience and judgment if so, having been to MA only once and finding it, in general, a difficult place.
Meanwhile, Jeremy Carl, writing on NRO’s The Corner, makes some pretty good points about Cruz’ prospects for SEC/Super Tuesday on March 1:
He blew it with the “perhaps” in the last sentence, but yeah. That’s pretty much been the Cruz path to nomination all along.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:38 amFixed link.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:39 amYes, Beldar on Cape Cod. The local media never mentions Cruz or Rubio. Trump, burn out and bill’s wife is all the talk. Trump has had many local events with Radio host Howie Carr and an event at local car dealers home, Ernie Boch jr. Which had hundreds of the elite, wealthy un-enrolled voters. Boosh may have had more mass-holes on his side than rubio.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:54 amCruz/West or were done.
Okay, I’m not going to take your bet then, mg, as much as I like lobster. I hate to lose bets, and I don’t know what I’d offer in exchange unless it’s BBQ. If you’re a BBQ fan and you ever get down to Houston, I’d buy you a snootfull. I trust your description of MA’s status and inclinations far above my own, but I did suspect it’s not natural Cruz territory. Good on you for lighting the proverbial candle.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:01 amFell in love with BBQ back in the 70’s in Austin, Texas when I was building a house on the shores of Lake Travis. Now I do my own, have a couple of smokers. I still love the BBQ shrimp recipes -Jalepeno, lime and shrimp I learned from the locals.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:14 amI went to N.H. to listen to Ted speak, because no way will he be speaking in Ma. I predict trump will win easily because these people are fools.
Rubio did well in South Carolina, which was also a good State for George W Bush. Does Rubio remind anyone else of Bush? Both are attractive, personable men of average intellect. Rubio is more articulate than Bush, but Bush had more executive experience on his resume. When it comes to policies, both worked across the aisle, favored amnesty or something close to amnesty, and are neocon/interventionist hawks on foreign policy.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:43 amWorking across the aisle is commendable when you win. Team republican has been caving the aisle issues since old man boosh took over for R.R.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:00 amWell it proves one thing, Mr. Hooper. It proves that you wealthy college boys don’t have the education enough to admit when you’re wrong.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:25 am161. I think you’ve explicated the virtue leg B4.
We’re prolly just coasting on inertia.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:45 am227. Apart from an epiphany along the way, yes I can see that.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:46 am224. We’re done then. GOPe will not accept either Trump or Cruz as headliner.
As the electorate cannot force their hand without agreeing overwhelmingly on an anti-establishment ticket its down to Cruz and Trump hook up or we’ve lost.
This next term requires a Churchill or a Washington in any case, so don’t sweat
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:58 amTiger, it isn’t education that clouds the vision. Political blindness is volitional.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:58 amTrump said he likes the individual mandate. He had to backtrack that because that is an absolute loser.
Trump said he would fund Planned Parenthood.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:05 amAnd Ropelight knows Trump said he likes the individual mandate and before Trump backtracked, Ropelight said he was still all-in for the lying Leftist Democrat Donald Trump. Speaking of political blindness and a lack of intellectual integrity, Ropelight has that in spades.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:07 am229. It proves the 1% are on the bridge riding the ship 20,000 fathoms down into the debris field.
The 0.1% have their bunkers and islands, larders full certain to survive the conflagration.
The 99% are left with just their numbers and God’s favor, a remnant to emerge once the sharks are sated.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:08 am235. “intellectual integrity”, seriously?
We’re getting to the knee slappers now.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:09 am“The American people want their BS up front, where they can get a big strong whiff of it.”
https://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=XPrRxhYJMkQ
I couldn’t comment last night, pretty sure in my anger I would be rightfully banned. Turns out the Yankees in NH were not outliers, the folks in the south are equally poor in judging the merits of a candidate. Over 50% had no problem pulling the lever for pro-amnesty, partial birth abortion, pro-healthcare mandate, and status quo Washington politics.
At one time I said I’d vote for whoever the party nominates…I lied. Rather buy ammo and pray for SMOD.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:19 am212. Not fooled by Trump does not make one not a fool.
Our society cannot hold together, as MD suggests, by virtue, by industry, or enlightened design and guidance.
We have none.
Begin by looking to the Federal Reserve with nothing left to try other than Negative Interest Rates, a complete and utter failure in Japan and no help at all in Europe.
The Chief Exec has virtually no hope to change their course even had he a clue to the wind’s direction.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:20 amYeah I know. It’s just I’ve always wanted to use that line.
Trump pissed off the Pope. It has to be easier to piss off Beldar than the Pope, despite both of them practicing the same profession (pontificating to the choir).
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:23 am238. It is certain we will continue on our course unless,
We burn it down.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:24 am240. “both of them practicing the same profession (pontificating to the choir).”
Word.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:26 am234. Speaker Ryan says immigration caps will not be discussed, despite 2/3 of the electorate demanding a moratorium on Muslim immigration and Southern Border walls.
He didn’t have to backtrack because he is ensconced.
What is the likely interplay between a titular head of government, persuaded of an alternative vision and the Borg, his putative minions?
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:35 amFor those who support Trump and Rubio…what historical evidence exists that those candidates will nominate textualist judges, shrink government, control spending, audit the federal reserve, repeal the healthcare mandate, follow current law on immigration, rescind all prior executive orders, reform entitlements, reform tax law, eliminate crony government subsidies, and can be trusted to show self restraint due to respect for our Constitution.
The question is rhetorical.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:35 amThe question is rhetorical.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:35 am
Trump’s campaign is economy in motion. Demonstrating he frugality of a Quaker. Bet he turns the lights out when he leaves a room.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:42 amThis Cruz vs. Trump contest is like watching “Ground Hog Day” with an insensate hero.
This is 2016, not 2008, the damage is done, the day past saving. Yet we fight on over personalities to no purpose whatever.
Your backs are to the wrong goal.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:42 ampaper, did you accidentally ingest the drugs happyfeet enjoys? I have no idea as to your point.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:43 amI don’t believe we are in a time past saving…albeit it is readily approaching. Unfortunately only a minority are focused on the matter, the rest are committed to wishful thinking or wilful ignorance.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:48 amI agree the question is rhetorical. Trump won the nomination. The rest of the way, the media will puff up some nontroversies to sell newspapers, but it won’t change the outcome.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:48 ampaper, is it firm support of Trump’s detailed policies, both foreign and domestic, or an inherent self-destructive nature that doesn’t care who else suffers with that mindset? Either way, your affirmations force me to stay on the ledge and ponder the hard ground. The burn it all down crowd are killing whatever hope some of us had.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:57 amSince when do firm detailed policies matter in a Presidential election?
Name me one.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:59 amBuckle up pieter. Use a safety harness on the ledge. It’s going to get worse from this point on.
For instance Fox News has Trump +30 in Michigan.
CNN has Trump +26 in Nevada.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:00 am1980, 1984
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:00 amIt’s personal now:
#235, John Hitchcock, I support Trump unapologetically and among the informed – political blindness is volitional. As for your charge I lack intellectual integrity, I view that as the sort of over-the-top accusation a sore looser makes when his irrational hopes have been dashed against the reality of a vote tabulation. Cruz came in third after both Trump and Rubio and that burns you up.
You’ve been especially vicious attacking me with cheap insults for supporting Trump, so much so that not long ago you lost me as a friend, even though we were largely on the same page for years, both here and on Dana’s sites. Now, though, you’ve gone beyond your previous mean-spirited assaults and make a dull-witted accusation from which there is no return.
We both have lengthy records of commenting here, regulars know us both, I’m content to let them decide which of us exhibits intelligence and which of us demonstrates integrity. Conversely, which of us has been revealed as knee-jerk stupid and unnecessarily mean-spirited is also up for consideration.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:03 amThat has already been decided, ropelight. You have the liar papertiger, the foul and disgusting hf, and dnf on your side. You can have them.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:05 amSplat! At least I’m off the ledge.
You know what has me flummoxed? The fact so many supposed evangelicals and TEA partiers ignored their moral principles and political convictions. Absolutely mind boggling.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:06 amYou also have StormFront and the likes of Christoph on your side. You can have THEM too.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:06 amI expect to hear the words “Trump” and “juggernaut” being used in the same sentence shortly. I’ve long ago noticed how the media, especially the farthest left media just love that word.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:09 ampaper, I was being facetious about “detailed”…Trump changes with the expedient political winds, there is no way anyone can know what he actually believes. His ability to not be held accountable is stunningly amazing.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:11 amPieter, I don’t think “evangelical” means what the media thinks it does because evangelicals don’t go for fowl-mouthed prevaricators nor especially divorcees. And when one considers Cruz is an actual evangelical the idea that masses of them went for Trump somehow doesn’t fit.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:13 amTrump is to the Left of McCain, Christie, Graham, Romney, Lieberman, Manchin.
There are no Conservative voters for Trump. Only Leftist voters, uninformed voters, former supposedly Conservative voters, and tantrum throwers. That is all there is for Trump.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:17 amHoagie, perhaps those voters asked if they self-identified as evangelicals have no idea. Maybe the country is full of Trumps that eat their little cracker, drink their little wine with no interest for asking God for forgiveness. Humility is hard but I will make the effort…look a squirrel!
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:20 amJohn, absolutely concur. What else could possibly explain?
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:21 amAnd yet he keeps winning. Why? Every media outlet including FOX and all the pundits are calling Trump the Republican candidate and yet I’ve (we’ve) been waiting since Reagan for a real conservative like Cruz and he’s going nowhere.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:21 amThe Gallup Poll has a new estimate of the number of libertarians in the American electorate. In their 2015 Governance survey they find that 27 percent of respondents can be characterized as libertarians, the highest number it has ever found. The latest results also make libertarians the largest group in the electorate, as compared to 26 percent conservative, 23 percent liberal, and 15 percent populist.
I remember being called a tea bagger for insisting that government balance our checkbook.
I remember Thad Cochran’s iteration of Hitchcock’s cry, “Racists!11! teabaggers”.
Let’s try something different.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:21 amAnd there, papertiger accuses me of using a homoerotic slur approvingly. And it’s already known I’m a loud and proud TEA Partier. More evidence, as if we needed any, that papertiger is a liar.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:24 amRopelight, are you going to stand by and let your bud papertiger lie about me like that? I expect you will.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:25 amFark “Let’s”. You lose. Your antics are amusing in a YouTube of a temper tantrum sort of way.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:26 amgrumpy pooper is grumpy
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:26 ampaper, are you aware Trump financially supported anti-TEA party republican candidates and the democrats? He has stated in interviews, years ago when it mattered, his not supporting the grassroots movement and only tenuously approved some of their efforts. In fact, he has never supported any conservative cause when it mattered.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:29 amI never saw John at the tea party meetings. You need a name tag my friend.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:32 amPieter, he supported paying off the national debt back before there was a “tea party”.
Not just balancing the budget, which is the best you’d get as a commitment from conservatives.
It’s just “back when it mattered” he didn’t win.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:36 amHitchcock, I’m not going to argue with you, so quit trying to provoke me. You’re on your own.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:42 amhttps://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2009/01/27/insult-becomes-compliment/
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:42 amYep, as expected, ropelight will silently stand by as the liar papertiger hurls lie-filled attacks against me. Because ropelight is not principled.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:44 amSunday! SUNDAY!!! Sunday! … be there!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:48 ampaper, you and your candidate can’t have it both ways…the debt will never controllable without entitlement reform and a myriad of other significant changes to shrink the federal government. You are being fed platitudes rather than meaningful policy.
The guy can’t even sell meat or liquor successfully, what makes you so sure he run a 4T dollar enterprise? A vote for him is status quo cronyism and backroom BS deals with democrats.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:53 amhttps://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2011/05/29/robert-reich-is-all-wet/
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:58 amJohn Hitchcock,
Some of the Trump Fans play the same card that Trump does. He runs around, spewing vulgar insults, yet then he demands that everyone “better be nice to me.”
When I start seeing a bunch of middle-aged guys wearing orange comb-overs at the supermarket, then I’ll know we’ve totally lost the country. (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:58 amTiger, don’t let sour grapes troglodytes get you down in the hole they’re in. Ignore stupidity, it can only fester in the presence of adverse attention. Ignored it turns on itself and eats it’s allies.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:13 amThere ropelight is, actively cheering on the liar who claimed I used homoerotic slurs against the TEA Party (of which, I am one). Don’t you go telling me you have principles, ropelight, or that you value civility, when you do nothing of the sort.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:18 amTrump doesn’t strike me as very Libertarian. The Libertarian Party believes in:
Trump believes in cronyism (he acts like a real estate developer, not a free market capitlist, and admits buying politicians is the way he does business) and taxing success. He seems more like a Nationalist than a capitalist, and we all know he rejects free trade (so I won’t bother with a link, because too many links put comments into moderation).
And he’s felt this way since 2011, at least, on everything.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:24 amif you happy and you know it then your face will surely show it
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:27 amI left the following comment but it went to moderation because of too many links. Here it is without all but the last link:
282.Trump doesn’t strike me as very Libertarian. The Libertarian Party believes in:
Trump believes in cronyism (he acts like a real estate developer, not a free market capitlist, and admits buying politicians is the way he does business) and taxing success. He seems more like a Nationalist than a capitalist, and we all know he rejects free trade (so I won’t bother with a link, because too many links put comments into moderation).
And he’s felt this way since 2011, at least, on everything.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:27 amYou are being fed platitudes rather than meaningful policy.
Yeah primary season! Is this your first go round, pieter?
John, you have any documentation proving your tea party bonafides? Are we supposed to take your word for it? Because I’ve never seen you claiming credentials until just now, and it seems pretty convenient for your argument.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:29 amrope, the sour grapes analogy fails…I never hoped for unprincipled charlatans to succeed and later miss the mark, blaming everything except the quality of the candidates. Nice try, though.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:33 ampaper, is that an admission that substance, historical convictions and blatant political expedience are irrelevant? What next, admitting the window tastes like waffles?
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:37 amExactly what part of real estate development precludes one from being a free market capitalist? As both I’d like to know.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:38 amhttps://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2011/07/30/tea-party-hobbits/
Read it, papertiger, and note the date.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:40 amMr. Trump isn’t a harvardtrash ideologue that’s for sure
history suggests that poor pitiful failmerica’s been raped more than plenty by them harvardtrash ideologues
and i am nothing if not a student of history
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:41 amDRJ, I’ve seen third party sources claim that Trump is for free trade. Crap trying to get a rise probably.
Fact is “free trade” isn’t when China uses forced labor, money market manipulation, and milking foreign business as regular as Bessie.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:41 amHere’s another one for ya, papertiger.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:43 amhttps://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2010/03/28/hundreds-of-people-at-least-dozens-at-searchlight-tea-party/
papertiger,
John Hitchcock just gave you a clear link to his blog in #278…and yet you still challenge him to provide “documentation” of his tea party bona fides! Why don’t you go read his blog post about Robert Reich that was written in May 2011—he linked it for you.
There’s really no sense of irony with you Trump guys, is there? You demand that John Hitchcock provides “documentation” of his tea party credentials, yet you don’t make the same demand from your Presidential candidate. Then you accuse Hitchcock of only making arguments for expediency, yet you continue to support the Presidential candidate who flip-flops about what he ate for breakfast yesterday. (I bet Trump ate waffles.)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:43 amRev. Hoagie:
Here is the link I gave for that statement, and this excerpt from the link explains it:
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:48 amRight now Cruz Supporter, the documentation doesn’t look good for our guy: Delegate count Trump 61, Cruz 11 and Rubio 10.
I cannot understand why the only true conservative is being trounced. Has the Republican party moved left without telling me?
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:49 amon this episode of lol failmerica
tune into see poor pitiful and none-too-fresh-smelling failmerica, raped and bleeding out like a gutted pigstate, rally just enough strength to enthusiastically fellate her chineser betters*
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:51 amHere ya go, papertiger.
https://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2012/01/21/voter-fraud-perjury-identity-theft-and-democrat-involvement/
I have a very long, loud, and proud TEA Party history on the internet. Your continued dishonesty and ugliness won’t change the Truth because you are full of Dishonor.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:53 am*in to* i mean
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:53 amBottom line Trump wins again, Cruz supporters in a blind rage, refuse to see spewing invective as self-defeating extension of the two-faced nasty campaign’s chickens coming home. Cruz is ineligible, he was born in Canada to a Cuban father turned bible thumper.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:54 ampapertiger,
Trump has specifically said he is for fair trade, not free trade. I don’t know what he means by that but I think it means whatever he thinks is fair.
“Government according to Donald” is not what the Constitution means.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:55 amHitchcock, you’ve got a lot of nerve talking about honor. You certainly haven’t displayed any around here. Like a lot of phony jerks you talk about honor but behave dishonorably attacking others for the great sin of refusing to kowtow to your blustering bully act. You’re a cowardly little man.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:57 amyeah cruzers take the high road much you poopers?
just follow Mr. Trump he’ll show you the way
we’ll study nuclear science
we’ll love our classes
we’ll have a crazy teacher who wears dark glasses!
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:58 amI understand what they’re saying there DRJ but it worked just the opposite for me. Of course not being on Trump’s level may have made a difference. I developed a few shopping centers and I too ran into the perennial regulatory agencies and bureaucrats. By the way there are three levels of the blood-sucking pigs: federal, state and local and they all have their hands out. On my last project I was so harassed by the EPA I finally made a side deal and sold the entire kit and caboodle to a yuuuuge retailer (guess who?) for a yuuuge profit and got out of the deal. They obviously had the crony contacts and/or the will to play the game I lacked and the job was completed within three months.
Any rate, I understand what was meant now.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:58 amCruz did lose, ropelight, and it is disappointing. Maybe he can come back in the SEC primary and maybe he can’t. I don’t think Trump will win the nomination but he might.
However, I’m happy with my candidate, even when he loses, because I know what he stands for. I also know what Trump stands for and I don’t agree with him. He is not principled or conservative, and he scares me as much as Hillary.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:58 amRev. Hoagie,
You got tired of the hassle but Trump is energized by it, and not because he wants to change it. He wants to personally win, in any way, and at any cost. We have a Constitution that governs us, not Donald’s business ethics.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:01 amDRJ, resistance is futile, you will be absorbed.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:01 amHoagie, in 1994, the Democrats got their heads handed to them, and subsequently lurched Leftward. The Republicans moved Left to fill the void.
In 2010, the Democrats were dealt a historic crushing blow by the TEA Party, and the Ruling Class Republicans, refusing to see the truth, took the credit. The Democrats again lurched Leftward. And the Ruling Class Republicans again moved Left to fill the void.
For about the past 30 years, the grass roots Republicans have, by a super-majority around 7/10, declared the Ruling Class Republicans to be to the Left of and out of touch with its base. Independents had the same view by a simple majority. Only Democrats, by a plurality and not a majority, have viewed the Ruling Class Republicans as representative of its base.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:02 amHoagie, yes. Yes, it has.
Out- outrageous federal spending, adherence to pro-life beliefs, repealing Obamacare, entitlement reform, shrinking government, support and defend the constitution, and ending crony capitalism.
In- pro-amnesty, pro-healthcare mandate, pro-planned parenthood, pro-corporate welfare, go along to get along deals with the both party elites, the next 30 years of the USSC are of minor consequence.
Get with the program…the next 5 years will be yuuge with great deals to make this country as classy and successful as what was wrought in Atlantic City.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:04 amRopelight, your calling someone a “bible [sic] thumper” says a lot more about you than it does about anyone else. You have neither honor nor shame.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:08 amIn fairness, though, I like that Trump is willing to speak out on political correctness and immigration. I give him credit for changing the debate.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:09 amI’m a “Bible thumper”. Loud and proud. And Principled.
https://truthbeforedishonor.wordpress.com/2011/05/15/the-bible-says-dont-judge-right/
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:10 amAre you channeling Star Trek or communism, ropelight?
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:10 amRev Hoagie,
Trump seems like he has fixed support of around 33% of the GOP primary electorate. That means there’s 2-1 opposition to him among people’s “first choice.” And I think if you haven’t already been seduced by The Donald, then you’re probably going to go for Cruz or Rubio when your state’s primary comes around. By the same token, if you’re STILL with Trump at this point despite all of his shenanigans, then you’re probably not going to change your mind about him—short of him being caught with a live girl or dead boy in his bed.
I think support for Trump is less policy-based, than it is emotionally-based. Of course, he hasn’t really mapped out many policies—but he says some things about immigration and ISIS that people want to hear. He’s the rogue who knows how to tell a woman she’s the most important woman in the room. Even after he’s cheated on her many times before.
The anti-Trump vote among the GOP primary electorate is about 67%. Our problem is the two-thirds of the pie has long been divided among too many candidates. Meanwhile, Trump’s picking up delegates. Carson and Kasich are good men. But they need to drop out for the good of choosing one candidate to be the alternative to Trump.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:11 amOne of his selling features. Trump said Hillary is in the pocket of bankers, realestate moguls, and insurance interests. Who better to tell the story than a guy who has been there?
Trump presents these facts as a cautionary tale, while you misrepresent them as the goal.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:11 amIt is his goal, papertiger, but why do you think he will be able to change it? He never tried before and he won’t try now, unless you want another President who does everything by executive order.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:14 amI doubt that the anti-Trump anti-Cruz Repubs will give up easy
I’m not going to do the calculations myself,
But I wonder what it will look like if Trump wins all of the primaries with 35-40% max until Texas, which Cruz will need to, and probably will, win.
Will Cruz look strong enough to make others drop out?
MD not exactly in Philly (deca84) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:15 amWill Cruz get enough of a lift with Texas to take first in some other 3 way primaries?
Will Cruz getting stronger get the other R’s to start in on the Oh no, theocracy!! banter”
Will someone in the 9th circuit jurisdiction find a way to challenge Cruz’ legitimacy?
(Note, I did not say that there was a legitimate challenge, only that anything can be claimed in the 9th circuit.)
And how could Trump possibly get rid or cronyism everywhere in America? The way to change things is to undo government regulations — something Trump wants more of, not less.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:16 amDRJ, there was another guy who enjoyed a certain measure of success condemning the status quo without any discernible filter. Communists, Jews, the unfair treaty of the victors, failure of his own government to take care of the little man, advocated universal healthcare, free education, government work projects, nationalism on a scale unseen…the folks could not get enough and cheered, raising an arm in fervent praise.
Sanders and Trump. Little difference. Sieg heil…whatever.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:20 amGeorge W Bush wasn’t a principled conservative so when the financial crisis hit in 2008, his response was to use government to fix it. (Bush is what I call a Dallas conservative, because Dallas Republicans love using government to fix problems. It’s one reason there aren’t many Dallas Republicans left and Dallas is run by Democrats.)
Trump is the master of using government to fix things. It’s how he has operated in business and it’s how New York operates. It’s all he knows. Did he grow up memorizing the Constitution? Does he even know what it says, let alone the rationale and ideology behind it? He doesn’t.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:27 am318 Trump is the master of using government to fix things …
What I want fixed is immigration and that requires government intervention.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:32 amoh goodness the Associated Press propaganda sluts want you to know for sure that president food stamp is not responsible for the burgeoning mischief of his ISIS friends
ISIS started long before food stamp took office you see
yes yes and for so you know all the facts they repeat the date 2006 six more times for you
ok good good obama’s legacy is now secure, thanks AP propaganda sluts!
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:32 amAbsolutely DRJ, what you say in #316. The regulations set up bureaucrats and politicians as the receivers of bribes to bestow favors on people simply wanting to do business but find the environment corrupt. Some call it “picking winners and losers” I call it picking pockets.
Business and development suffer, the taxpayer suffers, jobs suffer and America is pushed aside so bureaucrats, politicians and their crony’s steal a bundle all while bemoaning the 1%. And I will tell you as sure as I’m sitting at my computer when you hear “EPA” you know the shakedown will be fast, sure, large and uncompromising. I once had a fed EPA clown stop a $15,000 a day project because of “traces of toxic paint”. You know what the “toxic paint” was? Blue spray paint from the state EPA regulators marking gas lines on asphalt.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:33 amMD, Trump would have twice the success if the economy were to absolutely tank…it’s bad now but could go full depression in short time. The people will cling to a hopeful voice, one that clearly identifies the enemy, willing to punish ruthlessly those that have harmed us (worse than waterboarding), and absolutely promises to restore our greatness. The impoverished hungry and scared are easily led.
The folks will wilfully gnore the blatant red flags of his candidacy, put on the arm band and dutifully await orders.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:34 amThere is a group of dwarves in CS Lewis’ The Last Battle, book 7 in the Chronicles of Narnia series, who refuse to see the truth of the huge meal presented to them by Aslan Himself. Like those dwarves, the Trumpsters refuse to see truth, even when it is glaringly pointed out to them. And like the dwarves, the Trumpsters lose out in the end, too.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:34 amJames B. Shearer:
Yes, because it’s one of the things the federal government is responsible for under the Constitution. Like Obama and Hillary, Trump thinks being President is a license to change anything he wants, and not what the Constitution prescribes. That is why Trump scares me as much as they do. Do you really want another President who has no concept of Constitutional limitations?
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:35 amIf you guys are going to get personal, I am too. I opened a fresh bag of Doritos yesterday and left it gaping open overnight. At least nine hours. They’re not fresh anymore. So, as you can see, we all have our problems.
nk (dbc370) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:35 ampapertiger,
Just a short while ago in this thread, you were demanding that John Hitchcock prove to you that he has a history of tea party credentials which didn’t just pop up yesterday. Yet here you are again on the other hand, telling us not to worry about The Donald’s decades long affair with lobbying and buying influence because, well, he’s going to change next January!
There’s just no sense of irony, huh?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:36 amHoagie:
That might have been funny 40 years ago, like expensive military toilets. Now things like these are commonplace, and they are definitely not funny.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:37 amnk, too funny. 1st world problems are a b!tch.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:37 amPerry has a long history of ignoring all manner of links and evidence, then demanding links and evidence, and when given to him, ignoring that, too. Just like papertiger is doing now.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:41 amspeaking of gaping open Melania actually did speakings in SC
Nevada is where National Soros Radio expects us to see even lower turnout for Rs than there was for the geriatric socialist party
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:45 amMath is hard. While Trump figures to stumble in Cruz’s state of Texas, and Kasich’s Ohio, he’s gonna win Florida, which dooms Rubio.And he’s gonna win most of the delegates in purple and blue states, especially in the northeast. Hard to see how anyone other than Trump gets to 1237 delegates unless he completely implodes. We’ve been told since Day 1 that would happen and it hasn’t.
Will say again, I like Cruz, but he simply doesn’t have the crossover appeal Trump does. The Evangelical appeal and the anti abortion stand that helps him in the South in the primaries will doom him in the Electoral College.Might be a very formidable VP or SCOTUS nominee.
Rubio is a lying 2 faced snake fraud.If GOPe collapses around him as their firewall or plays games at the Convention, they will lose, and badly.
The high negatives thing is overrated. Against the Socialist or the lair Hillary!, that will matter less in a binary choice.
Bugg (fa64ec) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:51 am“
Cheap Sunglasses”“Fool the Masses”When he wakes up in the morning and he got hisself a win
The fan base is happy and ropelight’s got a grin
He hits the streets a-runnin’, gonna kick hisself some asses
And wade out press some flesh with teh masses
Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah
Gonna tell a big ol’ lie and then tell a whole lot more
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:56 amIf there’s any kinda pushback, my thugs’ll throw ’em out the door
I’ll capture all the anger and make it work for me
And the dummies on the left will vote for pantload Hillary
Oh yeah, oh yeah, oh yeah
Here is from adj Dana, posted this morning on his blogsite The First Street Journal:
He called Trump winning South Carolina “A Sad Saturday In America”.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:04 amPerry has a long history of ignoring all manner of links and evidence, then demanding links and evidence, and when given to him, ignoring that, too. Just like papertiger is doing now.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:41 am
Like I said. Get a nametag.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:06 amBugg,
So, you say Rubio’s a lying two-faced snake fraud—but Trump’s not? Wut?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:07 amDemanding is a strong word choice.
papertiger (c2d6da) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:07 amnk, try placing them 1 layer deep on a half-sheet, spritz very lightly with water or cooking spray, and put them in a hot over for about 3 minutes. It might help enough to use them in nachos.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:12 am318.George W Bush wasn’t a principled conservative so when the financial crisis hit in 2008 …
I don’t have a real issue with GWB’s response to the financial crisis, the bigger problem was all his errors (active and passive) which helped create the crisis.
And political principles are fine but they aren’t as reliable as well established natural laws. Sometimes your principles are wrong or don’t apply and it is no virtue to stubbornly stick to them when they clearly aren’t working.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:14 amThrow that Constitution out, right, James?
Meanwike, for the Trump folks, some food for thought.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:16 amI mentioned bible thumpers to get a rise out of you Hitchcock. Your sort of two-faced thumper is the kind true Christians avoid, the kind that wants to guilt trip others into kissing your fat ass. And, all the while the Golden Rule takes the measure of all those who spew hatred instead of treating others as you’d like to be treated. Hypocrites are always in need of some churchin’ up.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:22 am324Yes, because it’s one of the things the federal government is responsible for under the Constitution. Like Obama and Hillary, Trump thinks being President is a license to change anything he wants, and not what the Constitution prescribes. That is why Trump scares me as much as they do. Do you really want another President who has no concept of Constitutional limitations?
What the Constitution means is subject to interpretation. You may not like this but it is what it is. Obama has pushed for interpretations that favor his agenda, I would want a President who shared my agenda to do the same. I wouldn’t want him to just round up Congress and the Supreme Court and have them all shot but that isn’t what we are talking about.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:23 amHeh and true dat.
Matt Walsh writes, “Speaking of the country’s demise, Trump fans are gleefully ushering in tyranny. I am tired of hearing about their “anger.” They claim they are angry at the very thing they now embrace. They aren’t angry. They’re bored. They’re immature. They’re infatuated with celebrity and fame and money. They aren’t angry. I’m angry about what they are doing to my nation. The rest of us can be angry, but these people have lost the right to have their anger taken seriously.”
He continued, taking on the rabid nature of Trumpers:
“Reasons why I don’t care when Trump fans are insulted by my criticisms of them: 1) You people need to hear it. I’m not going to just sit here and let you hoist Trump on me without a fight. 2) Isn’t Trump’s brashness and “tell it like it is” persona the ENTIRE FREAKING REASON YOU SUPPORT HIM? If you really respect someone who just lays it out there unapologetically, you should have the integrity to still respect it when it’s targeted at you. The fact that you bristle when anyone speaks bluntly about you or Trump tells me you don’t actually want someone who speaks boldly. You want, it turns out, to be coddled. 3) See point 2. I want to emphasize it because it’s so important. Think of my approach towards Trump and you as one long experiment to test the sincerity of your claims. You failed the experiment.”
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:24 amJames,
You make the case that the Constitution is a living document. It makes me want to pull my hair out that you can believe that and be a reader of this blog.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:27 amFrom DRJ’s link (that she pointed the Trumpsters to):
Absolutely spot on.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:31 amDRJ, James uncritically linked VOX (VOX!) as a reliable source of information. He may read this blog, but he does not support any tenants of Conservatism, Constitutionalism, or Truth.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:32 am343You make the case that the Constitution is a living document. It makes me want to pull my hair out that you can believe that and be a reader of this blog.
The Constitution means what the Supreme Court says it means. The Constitution doesn’t change (absent amendments) but what the Supreme Court says it means does. I don’t know what is gained by denying this. Why do people care who replaces Scalia?
As for my blog reading habits I read a variety of blogs with different points of view. Trying to restricting my blog reading to blogs that I agree with about everything doesn’t seem practical or a good idea.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:45 amCS-Immigration is the central issue here. Trump has been consistent throughout. Rubio has been on every side of the issue depending upon the time of day or his audience.I’m supposed to more inclined to accept the known dishonesty of Rubio because…?
Walsh seems rather upset about Trump not being a “principled conservative”. Yet we have a GOPe that has spent the better part of a quarter century telling us such wonderful stuff every campaign only the get to DC and ditch it at the first opportunity. Find it very hard to take such talk seriously based on the Bush I and II, McConnell, McCain, Boehner, Ryan, Romney et al. have done not any single conservative thing in a very long time. Trump could hardly be worse. Tucker Carlson’s take few weeks back was spot on. GOPe has been very content to have their think tanks and magazines as long as it never meant to accomplish anything nor get in the way of Georgetown cocktails and 18 holes at Congressional .rump is a threat to that go along get along (as is Cruz, but alas don’t see how).
Lots of Godwin’s Law in effect here-talk of armbands, tyranny, end of the Constitution. PLEASE.
Bugg (fa64ec) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:46 amHow to Make Potato Chips & Doritos Crisp Again
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:49 am(hint it’s a metaphor)
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:49 amJames, those jurists do indeed interpret petitions before the court in light of the constitution and US law. The metrics by which those jurists reflect is the entire point of why some prefer originalists or textualists. It shouldn’t be mere twisted and tortured semantics to render a ruling sympathetic to a particular ideology.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:51 amBugg, you’ve got something there. I’m for Cruz because I believe he’s the kind of conservative who won’t care about Georgetown cocktail parties and 18 holes. Like Trump, I guess, but with some government experience and some style and couth. Trump’s the kind of guy that thinks if he yells louder than the next guy it makes him right. I know guys like that and they’re all leftists. They try and out-shout you to win an argument, so I whisper and it drives them nuts.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 10:55 amI was not aware the Constitution had a particular ideology. I thought it was for all the people. That’s why I can’t stand democrats and vehemently hate communists, they gauge everything in government by “what’s good for me” not what’s good for America.
Rev. Hoagie™® (f4eb27) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:01 amThe Constitution means what the Supreme Court says it means. The Constitution doesn’t change (absent amendments) but what the Supreme Court says it means does. I don’t know what is gained by denying this. Why do people care who replaces Scalia?”
Now I am pulling out my hair.
felipe (56556d) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:04 amHoagie, swing and a miss. Reread what I wrote, put down your drink and close one if necessary.
pieter (ec44a2) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:08 amBugg,
Okay, so if immigration is your #1 issue, that’s totally fair. Obviously, everyone is free to vote for any candidate for whatever reason. But you made “lying” and being a “fraud” a predicate for not supporting Rubio, and all I’m saying is that Trump has told more lies than anyone. He’s done more waffling than a short-order cook at an IHOP Restaurant. He’s been consistent on ONE issue—which happens to be your #1 issue—but he’s been inconsistent on pretty much every other issue.
So, yeah, Rubio has some questions to answer regarding immigration…but Trump has some questions to answer regarding every other issue except for immigration.
This is not necessarily directed at you, Bugg, but I just don’t understand why Trump supporters can’t just admit, “Yeah, Trump’s Trump. He lies, he flip-flops, he’s vulgar, he’s got some sketchy connections, and he’s greased politicians in the corridors of power for decades. He’s a snake—but he’s my snake, I’m still voting for him in the primary because I think he can win the general election!”
But the scorched earth approach where every other candidate is called trash or psycho or a fake Christian, and so on, it just limits your ceiling in the general election. Reagan expanded the electoral map because he tried to persuade his opponents rather than kick them in the teeth.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:10 amActually, Trump declared Romney’s idea to convince the illegals to self-deport to be mean-spirited. So, he has flip-flopped on the whole illegal immigrant thing. He hasn’t been solid on that one, either.
Everything Trump has said over the years in the political arena have been pretty much attempts to gauge the public and how his own ego and wallet will be fattened. When Romney wanted the illegals to leave via self-deportation, it was incumbent on Trump to be against it. The people he ran around with would be less interested in giving Trump money if he were for it. Now, he’s for deporting illegals because he can get a huge swarm of termites to come flying to him.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:24 amThat’s quite a euphemism. Rubio didn’t just lie then, he’s been lying all month about it now. Why would we believe his answers? Bugg’s right. Rubio is indeed a fraud. He’s a slick salesman who said one thing in english and quite another in spanish.
You say this matters to people who have immigration as their #1 issue because you miss the point. The point is leadership and integrity.
I think you mean that Rubio and his zealous supporters have limited the ceiling on the general election. Rubio was a big deal to the Tea Party before he got to DC. When he became a business as usual politician, he damaged the GOP. That’s not bugg’s fault.
Indeed Rubio is a big reason Trump is even a factor. A third of the party doesn’t trust the establishment at all.
That doesn’t make any sense to be either. At least Trump’s vocal fans seem to just not care.
But Rubio’s fans are just as stubborn, and often quite tricky about where they are coming from. You for example use the name ‘Cruz Supporter’ but in my limited reading of your comments are more passionate about your support for Rubio.
And the way you speak to Trump’s supporters is needlessly demeaning that I can’t blame them for refusing to budge. You’ve arranged things so that if they change their mind, they were stupid losers. That’s the politics of domination that the GOP establishment played in 2012. It led to a loss, just as it will if Rubio wins the primary, polls be damned.
Dustin (2a8be7) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:25 amIf Rubio wins the nomination, I’ll grit my teeth, vote for him, and shower afterward.
If the lying Leftist Democrat Trump wins the nomination, that line in my ballot will be empty.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:36 amCS-
Think in the primaries, Trump is trying to clear the field. Suspect in the general he might be a bit more circumspect. And really if you are running against a liar like Hillary or an avowed socialist, the contrast could not be more stark.
Cruz’s problem can be encapsulated in his embrace of/endorsement by loony toon Glen Beck.I really don’t get this. The man is an emotional apocalyptic fruitcake. Want to appear on his radio show, fine. But make him a de facto advise/cheerleaderr, that’s an issue. That would be death in general election. Fasting for Cruz? You’re eliminating a lot of independents who might otherwise consider voting for Cruz.
Rubio will say anything to anyone for a vote. There is no core. He was Tea Party vs. Charlie Crist. And gets to DC and falls right into the GOPe. That is unacceptable. It’s how we got here in the first place.
Bugg (fa64ec) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:38 amWhy not just go ahead and vote for Hillary, John? If you can’t stomach Trump under any conditions, why be content with half-steps. Be a man, vote your true beliefs. If Trump is so bad you can’t possibly vote for him then why not express your disdain fully and vote for his opponent? Do your part to make sure Trump never sets foot in the White House?
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:44 amGlenn Beck is to Ted Cruz as Reverend Wrong was to Barack Obama.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:48 amRopelight, your false dichotomy lie is full-on horse crap. And I’m not the only one refusing to vote for Trump. Patterico himself said he will never vote for Trump. Why don’t you tell Patterico that his true beliefs are with Hillary? Coward much? Bomb thrower much? I thought you didn’t like bomb-throwers. Oh, wait, you do like bomb-throwers as long as they’re Trump or other Trump idolators.
My Iraq vet daughter and my police officer son-in-law won’t be voting Trump, either. And they’re both in Ohio. My daughter said she might write-in Mickey Mouse if Trump gets the nomination because she will never, ever, vote for Trump.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:53 amBeck my be a bit over the top and too histrionic for some, but comparing him to Jeremiah “GD America” Wright!?!?
You suck, mister!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:58 amMay not my
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 11:59 amI agree with you, Haiku.
Ropelight has become like the port-a-pot man: sucking the crap in with one end and blowing it out the other.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:02 pm#358 Dustin,
Cruz is my first choice, but I’ll be satisfied if Rubio is our nominee, too. We can only choose from whose names appear on the ballot. This blog is already full of strong voices for Cruz, so I absolutely do stand up for Rubio when I feel it’s necessary.
I think you misunderstood my point about Trump, and it was probably my fault for not being clear.
Bugg was saying, “I can’t vote for Rubio because he’s a lying, two-faced snake fraud about immigration.”
Okay, fair enough. And my reply is, but Trump is a lying, two-faced, snake fraud about every issue except for immigration.
It’s so overwhelmingly documented that Trump is a liar, a flip-flopper, a fraud, etc., yet Trump’s fans refuse to even acknowledge those things even when confronted with video and audio clips. By the same token, I definitely believe that Rubio ought to have taken ownership of his poor judgment with the Gang of 8, and just come out and admitted, ‘Yeah, that was totally regrettable, and I see why people are angry, especially since I was elected with lots of tea party support, and I just want you all to know I learned my lesson.’ But instead, Rubio twists himself into a pretzel in order to protect the initial failure of admitting it was a MISTAKE. That causes him to get into these parochial debates with Cruz about who said what at 3AM on the floor of the Senate. And so the immigration issue has snowballed on him, when he could have actually done some damage control a year ago.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:04 pmColonel, the difference is between analogy and metaphor. I made an analogy, you took it as a metaphor. I’m sure you know the difference.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:13 pmYes, ropelight, you said something along the lines of:
Car is to train as Neptune is to applesauce.
John Hitchcock (71906d) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:18 pmI wouldn’t expect you to understand John, but I expect more from the Colonel.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:20 pm#360 Bugg,
Believe me, I totally am sympathetic to the immigration issue. If we forfeit our borders, we essentially forfeit our sovereignty. And that’s a dangerous slippery-slope, which ultimately leads to minimizing personal property rights, et al.
And there’s no question that Trump is forceful yet charming—when he’s not being vulgar. And he won’t cower in the corner as Romney did when Candy Crowley began carrying water for Obama in the debate in 2012. I just don’t trust that Donald would govern as a conservative if he were elected, and I don’t know that he can even win the general election because his history of flip-flops, and name-calling and vulgarity really turns off a lot of people.
There seems to be a lot of Texans here, so let me give you an example of a race the GOP lost simply due to ‘foot-in-the-mouth’ syndrome. The 1990 TX Governor’s race had Clayton Williams squaring off against Ann Richards. Williams was initially ahead, even as late as August, I believe. But he was kind of a brash bull in a china shop kind of guy. He refused to shake Richards’ hand at the debate, and he publicly said (echoing earlier remarks made by basketball coach Bobby Knight) “If rape is inevitable, just lay back and enjoy it.”
Now, that remark almost looks like ‘Sesame Street’ compared to the culture now. But that kind of contrast between a bull and a female candidate didn’t play well, even in Texas.
In a general election campaign, when the media are hitting Trump every day, will he respond with something really vulgar that can’t be pushed back into the toothpaste tube? I fear, “yes.”
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:21 pmColonel, the difference is between analogy and metaphor. I made an analogy, you took it as a metaphor. I’m sure you know the difference.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:13 pm
You can make a Venn diagram and ‘splain it, ropelight.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:28 pmColonel, you can google the terms, analogy and metaphor and learn something I assumed you already knew.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:32 pmNo time for that, I’m still determining whether you are behaving in a condescending or patronizing manner. And then I’m on to pondering why an intelligent fellow such as yourself would be so enamored of this orange bewigged fellow.
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:46 pmRopelight–
Would you be for Trump if you thought he wasn’t honest about his real priorities? If you thought he’d make a deal about immigration just to get something done? Or are you with the other bomb-throwers who just want to “let it all burn, and Nero is the man to do it”?
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:48 pmOh, and ropelight is right, it’s an analogy.
A is to B as C is to D does not mean a is anything with respect to C except direction. The degree is related to the relationship between B and D.
As in:
Valley Forge was to Washington as the Long March was to Mao.
This does not mean that Washington was like Mao, OR that Valley Forge was like the Long March.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:52 pmJH is getting a little to into certain things..
Bugg (fa64ec) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:52 pmRubio/Che Guevara/ 2016
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:02 pmRubio/Act of Love/ 2016
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:03 pmHillary Clinton For Prison in 2016!
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:04 pm@ Bugg: Elections aren’t binary choices, even if no third-party candidate runs.
There’s a factor called turn-out.
There was a very clear choice between Mitt Romney and Barack Obama, and between John McCain and Barack Obama. Neither Romney nor McCain was a principled constitutional conservative, a “movement” conservative who can go back to very first principles and explain their entire political philosophy in a coherent way that fits together like a Swiss watch. (That’s Cruz.) They were conservative-ISH, and they could mouth the words of conservatism, but they fell short of the standard I’d prefer. But yet: There was still a Grand Chasm-sized gap between either of them and Barack Obama. The GOP didn’t lose those two elections because the voters who showed up couldn’t figure out a difference between the candidates on the ballot.
But the fact that they were conservative-ISH, or put another way, establishment Republicans, meant that tons of people who turned out to vote for George W. Bush in 2004 did not turn out in 2008 or 2012. If they had, Obama would have lost.
I will readily conceded that Trump is a different kind of candidate than either McCain or Romney. But he has no record in public office. His record as a private citizen is that of claiming to be a Democrat, talking like a Democrat, supporting Democrat positions, and using crony capitalism in conjunction with corrupt politicians to rig the system for Trump’s personal benefit (about all of which, he brags). Trump might turn out a high percentage of absolute crazy people — there are at least four of them I can name who comment here — who would blindly follow Trump off the cliff he’s dragged his corporate empire four times, i.e., into bankruptcy. But there’s no way he turns out GOP voters (whether they’re conservative or not) or movement conservatives (whether they identify with the GOP or not) because he’s the exact opposite of what they’re looking for, which is someone with a record of not just talking the conservative talk but walking the walk.
Hillary Clinton will crush Donald Trump in the electoral college. Donald Trump is the greatest gift she could possibly have received, the only way she could drag her scandal-ridden carcass across the finish line and back into the WH. It won’t be because she’s the “binary choice” that people are forced to make as the less-worse alternative. It will be because she’s a machine Democrat who has all the levers of that machine well in hand, and it will turn out the Democratic voters to oppose Trump who would otherwise have stayed home and not voted.
I find no comfort in your analysis, and I believe it’s very wrong.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:04 pmColonel, not condescending or patronizing just not talking down to anyone.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:12 pmThank you, Beldar. That’s pretty much how I see it.
But there are a lot of people with hands over their ears, muttering to themselves.
And they will be carrying on like crazy once they helped HRC win.
I just don’t understand it. We don’t learn from our mistakes, apparently.
Simon Jester (2708f4) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:12 pm375 … If you thought he’d make a deal about immigration just to get something done? …
The President doesn’t need to make deals to get something done about immigration, he has a lot of discretion as we have seen with Obama. And with a Republican Congress I would think some sort of enforcement only legislation would be possible.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:17 pmWorking on my father -in laws roof today, the seagulls kind of made me think of trump- they fly in, make a lot of noise, poop all over everything and then leave.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:19 pmSimon – does that mean voting for dole, juan and mitt helped the r.n.c.?
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:21 pmAn analogy is a comparison of two things so if this is an analogy, which two things are you comparing? Haiku took it as a comparison between the relationships of Beck/Cruz and Rev. Wright/Obama. I think that’s a reasonable comparison.
If not, then you were making two analogies, n’est-ce pas?
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:23 pm383 And they will be carrying on like crazy once they helped HRC win.
And who is helping HRC win, the Trump supporters or some of his opponents who apparently think HRC isn’t so bad compared to Trump.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:23 pmBeldar, talk to Patterico and to Hitchcock, and some of the others, they’re the ones who say they’ll stay home if Trump is the nominee.
How about you? If Trump is the nominee will you vote for him?
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:25 pmFortunately, the Fifth Circuit disagrees the President has limitless power to do what he wants with immigration, James.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:25 pmAlthough it wasn’t addressed to me, I’m going to answer a question ropelight asked (#361) of someone else:
I’ll vote for the Republican Party’s nominee. I still do not believe that will be Donald Trump, but whether it’s Hillary or anyone else, I’ll vote, and I’ll vote against that Democrat.
But it certainly won’t be because I believe in Trump, if he’s the Republican nominee. If he were to become the Republican nominee, then my world will have narrowed to a three-way (not two-way, as Bugg assumes) choice: Stay home, vote for the Republican, or vote for the Democrat.
There is no doubt at all that voting for the Democrat would be voting against my true beliefs. And my true beliefs also include the conviction that my duty is to participate in national elections, even in a losing cause, rather than to concede them and stay home. I’ve never missed voting in a presidential election since my first one in 1976 (I voted for Ford), and I won’t miss this year either.
If I’m obliged to vote for Trump because he’s the Republican nominee, then I’m left hoping that somehow, against all the evidence and everything that’s rational to hope for, Trump would actually govern in some less destructive manner than Hillary Clinton (or the Democratic nominee) would. The best I could hope for in that scenario is that Trump becomes a figurehead president, someone whose policy strings are pulled by some advisors (I have no idea who they might be, unless it’s Carl Icahn, who makes my skin crawl but is a vastly better businessman than Trump) behind the scenes. Trump would likely do a great deal more damage to America; there will be tons more crony capitalism, for example — Trump’s the kind of guy who might push for legislation to put the “Trump Brand” onto the American flag, just stitch his name right across the front there! But I’d rather have crooks who’ll loot and carry off everything they can than Democrats who’ll continue their crusade to change the structural underpinnings of the Rule of Law and the Constitution.
And he might die in office or be impeached. If Trump were to get the nomination, it’ll be awfully important to me who becomes his Veep.
So personally: #1, I won’t be voting for Hillary, and #2, I will be voting for the Republican nominee. But there not enough people who share my commitment to #2 in order to make up for the ones who might have voted against Hillary but who’ll stay home if Trump’s the alternative. My vote will end up being cast in a losing cause, but regardless of that, I’ll at least know I’ve done my personal best.
The GOP nominee can only win by mobilizing that turnout from 2004 — and it won’t turn out for a clown like Trump.
And when Hillary’s in the White House, ropelight, I’ll blame Trump — and people like you who have actively supported him despite knowing that he’s a vulgar fraud. (I’ve finally figured you out.)
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:26 pmJames,
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:27 pmWhat’s worse, a crap sandwich (Hillary) or a sandwich made of crap (Trump)? And as far as Obama’s illegal and unconstitutional “discretion”, it is both unconstitutional and illegal.
Is trump over his head in a puddle?
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:30 pmBy the way, how is that a metaphor? I don’t get it. A metaphor is an unusual descriptive comparison, such as “All the world’s a stage.”
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:31 pm“Speaking of the country’s demise, Trump fans are gleefully ushering in tyranny. I am tired of hearing about their “anger.” They claim they are angry at the very thing they now embrace. They aren’t angry. They’re bored. They’re immature. They’re infatuated with celebrity and fame and money. They aren’t angry. I’m angry about what they are doing to my nation. The rest of us can be angry, but these people have lost the right to have their anger taken seriously.”
Dearest Matt, I AM angry and a good survival skill for you would be to learn to never mislabel “anger” as “bored”. I’d argue that a better case could be made that Trump supporters have, in their hasty anger, assembled a circular firing squad. You use the word “immature” but it sounds more like you are an elitist whining about 30% percent of the nations voters being philistines. 30% tells me that there is more going on than just immaturity and boredom. Matt, doesn’t it sound a bit elitist to declare that only people like yourself have the right to be angry? Wow. Wouldn’t it be more productive to find a way to help your favorite candidate co-opt that anger rather than writing/vomiting all over?
“Reasons why I don’t care when Trump fans are insulted by my criticisms of them: 1) You people need to hear it. I’m not going to just sit here and let you hoist Trump on me without a fight. 2) Isn’t Trump’s brashness and “tell it like it is” persona the ENTIRE FREAKING REASON YOU SUPPORT HIM? If you really respect someone who just lays it out there unapologetically, you should have the integrity to still respect it when it’s targeted at you. The fact that you bristle when anyone speaks bluntly about you or Trump tells me you don’t actually want someone who speaks boldly. You want, it turns out, to be coddled. 3) See point 2. I want to emphasize it because it’s so important. Think of my approach towards Trump and you as one long experiment to test the sincerity of your claims. You failed the experiment.”
Most people bristle at blunt talk Matt, and you are certainly no exception. I appreciate your willingness to fight for what you believe, but you need to prep your battlespace a little better.
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:34 pmAt this point in the festivities I’d recommend studying your opponents supporters and figuring out how to effectively, positively, market your candidate to them, how to flip as many of them as possible before the real battle… and ignore the remaining true believers. Arguing/fighting with true believers of any stripe is like arguing with the North Koreans. Pointless, leads to nuclear exchange, even if you win the quickdraw the fallout drifts across allies and then winds up on the West Coast.
It isn’t coddling either. Trump has found a way to project himself as a protector of those who all this PC nonsense is aimed at cowering. And alone these people are made to cower or be ruined. Teach your favored candidate how to stand up and say No to illegals taking their jobs, God bless them for not wanting a handout, and teach him to insist the left stop criticizing the good, the honest decent God fearing, gun owning, patriotic. Teach your guy how to play the media like Trump does. Teach him how to stand up and say he will protect your rights, and these rights, and his rights and her rights… because right now 30% think only Trump can do that. The Trump supporters are not looking to be coddled, they want a leader who will lay waste to those who would lie, cheat and steal away their rights. So instead of fighting Trumpsters, why not get your guy trained up, polished up, geared up, resourced and get him into the fight hard.
Trumpsters are not looking for someone who will lay waste to the liars, cheaters, and thieves. Because Trump does all those things and they back him. They don’t want someone to lay waste to him.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:37 pmA simile?
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:37 pmTrump’s opponents have withheld their criticism but Trump hasn’t. It’s time Trump shows he can take criticism and respond like an adult.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:37 pmA simile is a comparison such as “crazy like a fox.”
I think it was an analogy (comparison) of the relationships between Beck/Cruz and Wright/Obama and, like the earlier comment, I think it’s interesting that a commenter who claims to be conservative would compare Beck with Wright.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:39 pmBut maybe he didn’t mean it that way. Maybe he means that Beck/Cruz are the same as Wright/Obama. If so, that’s interesting, too.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:40 pmCall me a cynic, but I’d say most people think ALL politicians do all those things.
That is why I went to the trouble of mentioning rights and I meant those found in the Bill of Rights and in those granted by the Creator.
But assuming you sit in the expert seat at this minute: What do they see in Trump then?
Honestly and without attacking.
Is it a cult like messiah thing?
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:43 pmYes, it is a cult of personality thing. And a tantrum thing. That’s all that it is.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:44 pmTrump is a completely dishonest narcissistic egomaniac who is full of vulgar bombast and thin of skin. His followers love him for his vulgar bombast and are willing to believe his lies, completely uninterested in much else. Trump has bumper-sticker slogans with nothing to back them up, and at least one of his slogans is 180 degrees from his 2012 slogan.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:49 pmI consider both Beck and Wright to be crazy. Beck seems kinder and I agree with some of his conservative views… but Beck can fling himself off the deep end with the best of them.
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:52 pmI roll to my rifle.
The democratic party is made up of shallow, small men.
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:02 am
I am so ready for this. Bring it, ladies.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:53 pmropelight, when you asserted that Beck is to Cruz as Reverend Wright is to Obama, you’re comparing their relationships of influence.
Reverend Wright was Obama’s pastor, mentor, and surrogate father figure for a couple of decades. But Beck has never been a mentor to Cruz. Beck is merely a talk show host who began rooting for Cruz to win the nomination a few weeks ago.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:53 pmBut the fact that they were conservative-ISH, or put another way, establishment Republicans, meant that tons of people who turned out to vote for George W. Bush in 2004 did not turn out in 2008 or 2012. If they had, Obama would have lost.
And yet, by nearly all measures, Mitt Romney was more “conservative” than the spendthrift statist George W Bush.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:53 pmhttps://www.bing.com/search?q=A-WA%20-%20Habib%20Galbi%20-%20Official%20Video&pc=cosp&ptag=A0E8C88C5FC&form=CONBDF&conlogo=CT3210127
This, I meant.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:55 pmKevin M, GWB was no Conservative, but if you think Mitt was to the Right of Bush, your metrics are way off-kilter.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 1:55 pm390.Fortunately, the Fifth Circuit disagrees the President has limitless power to do what he wants with immigration, James.
Who said anything about limitless power? Do you disagree that the President has a lot of discretion regarding immigration?
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:01 pmHe does not have discretion. He has to execute the Laws that are on the books. And everything Obama has done has been illegal and unconstitutional.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:03 pmhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3bjZlmsb4A
In case I wasn’t clear.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:04 pmJust like every Sanctuary City is violating the Law and the Constitution, every one of Obama’s actions with illegal immigration has violated the Law and the Constitution.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:05 pm392 … And as far as Obama’s illegal and unconstitutional “discretion”, it is both unconstitutional and illegal.
Well then Trump can make a difference just by executing his discretion not to do things that are unconstitutional and/or illegal. And if I am not mistaken current law does give the President a lot of discretion in immigration matters. Do you think such laws are unconstitutional?
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:06 pmYou are mistaken. About this and just about everything else.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:07 pm413 … every one of Obama’s actions with illegal immigration has violated the Law and the Constitution.
Every one? You realize his administration does occasionally deport an illegal?
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:10 pmI cannot see the bulk of the party accepting Trump. They will know that he is a 49-state loser and will pull out all the stops to beat him. The day the math appears unavoidable, they will have to begin plan B — start organizing for an Independent Republican candidate, or hijack a ballot-qualified minor party, and hope they can force the election into the House.
If people have to choose between Trump and Hillary or Trump and Bernie, someone in the middle is going to be appealing. I’d rather it wasn’t Bloomberg but any port in a storm.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:11 pmThere are a lot of reasons to dismiss my various points of view, but I’m not throwing a tantrum, and although I find Trump entertaining, it bites bitter to be told its a cult of personality with me.
I do like that when he is told “you can’t say that” or “you can’t do that” over some PC thing, he doubles down and then steamrolls. The GOP candidates have a tendency to stop, clutch their pearls and apologize (which as Trump would point out, is LOSING.)
I’d rather vote for Cruz, but he is losing and it looks like he isn’t good enough to give me a chance to support him in the general election
Demeaning people because they are willing to support a Trump over Clinton or Sanders is a losers gambit.
I live in California.
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:14 pmUnder Democrat near super majority rule
The state is run by snobbish elites in the Bay area, and more snobs down the coast to about Oceanside. We had a clown in Governor Arnold, and although he was terrible in many ways, he was better than Jerry Brown, and better than the guy he replaced (Gray Davis).
So back in those days I had to choose between Gray Davis and a steroid-addled buffoon. I chose the steroid-addled buffoon and would do so again
Kevin M, GWB was no Conservative, but if you think Mitt was to the Right of Bush, your metrics are way off-kilter.
I guess it really matter here whether you define “conservative” to mean “statist Christian” or not. I don’t.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:15 pmEvery one? You realize his administration does occasionally deport an illegal?
By accident, I’m sure.
Kevin M (25bbee) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:16 pmJames,
The Fifth Circuit and federal district Judge Hanen have stopped Obama’s immigration plans, so there are limits to what a President can do with respect to immigration.
Under the Constitution, a President has the power to execute the laws but not to change, make or write laws. Obama has tried to change existing immigration laws. Trump’s rhetoric suggests he thinks he can do whatever he wants, which means he also sees himself as a dictator rather than someone who faithfully executes the law.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:18 pmKevin M,
Romney is more conservative that Bush 43? That explains why we have BushCare in Texas.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:19 pm“Trump is a completely dishonest narcissistic egomaniac who is full of vulgar bombast and thin of skin.”
Granted.
So? If Trump can run the country as well as he’s run his campaign so far then he’ll be better than Obama or Carter were and better than Clinton or Sanders would be.
By the way, Governor Schwarzenegger was: “…a completely dishonest narcissistic egomaniac who is full of vulgar bombast and thin of skin.”
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:21 pmSo I have experience with the type
I intended to make an analogy between the destructive aspects of Obmaa’s unsavory association with Reverend Wrong and Cruz’s unfortunate association with Glenn Beck. Both Beck and Reverend Wrong inflict powerful negatives on candidates seeking approval from the voters.
The distinction between analogy and metaphor is basic to standard English, it’s taught in High School or was in the early 60’s.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:23 pmI’m not going to count the minutes or seconds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3bjZlmsb4A
When the Jeep with the Warn winch shows up I am proud to be an American.
I have never been prouder of a lousy six cylinder engine than I was right there.
Yeah, says himself (pounding said self in the chest) I’m responsible for thisl
As opposed for once in my life a Clevor.
A heep But my country calls. I answer. I will maintaing this pile of crap.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:27 pm422The Fifth Circuit and federal district Judge Hanen have stopped Obama’s immigration plans, so there are limits to what a President can do with respect to immigration.
Of course there are limits. And in any case the next President can change course. So it would be better if the law was changed as well. Unfortunately given the number of open borders Republicans this may not be possible even with Republican control of Congress. However there is still a lot the President can do on his own.
Under the Constitution, a President has the power to execute the laws but not to change, make or write laws. …
The President (or the executive branch) can issue regulations which can look a lot like laws. And the President can set enforcement priorities. He could for example make relying on illegal workers unprofitable (or at least less profitable) by repeatedly raiding workplaces with large numbers of illegal workers.
… Trump’s rhetoric suggests he thinks he can do whatever he wants, which means he also sees himself as a dictator rather than someone who faithfully executes the law.
The comment I was originally replying to was worried that Trump would make deals just to get something done. This seems like the opposite worry.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:40 pmObama had Wright and Ayers, Trump had the mob, and Cruz has Glenn Beck. Compare and contrast.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:43 pm#419 steveg wrote,
“Demeaning people because they are willing to support a Trump over Clinton or Sanders is a losers gambit.”
Whoa, bud. After all of the nasty vulgar insults thrown around by Donald J. Trump, you’re complaining about Team Trump’s voters being “demeaned”?
By the way, Arnold wasn’t a bad governor. He sought out to govern right of center, but in November 2005, the California voters rejected all of his special election measures. I think a lot of people have forgotten about that. Naturally, Arnold concluded, “Okay, the voters don’t want these reforms, so I will stop pursuing them.”
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:44 pmSo much in life is relative to what could be worse. I don’t live in my dream house right now, but it’s a helluva lot better than living in a cardboard box.
Arnold was much better than Gray Davis, and much better than Jerry Brown, as you stated.
Yes, and that should worry you but it doesn’t because you’ve already said you don’t care who the next SC Justice is. Understanding the Constitution is vital but Trump doesn’t seem to care.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:46 pmBeldar: I understand your argument. But as a counter; suspect Trump will in fact turn out a lot of disaffected middle and working class whites in the west, midwest and northeast and in purple states like WVa, Va and Fl that otherwise would not vote for the Republican candidate otherwise. And certainly did not turn out nor vote for Romney nor McCain. And Hillary! is not Obama. The black turnout, as well as the white liberal guilt faction, is not going to turn out for her as they did for The One. Especially if she continues to cheat Sanders at every turn. That is going to leave a bad taste in liberal’s mouths. Simply let’s agree that we are in uncharted waters here.
Bugg (fa64ec) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:47 pm@ Kevin M: Dubya is his father’s son. His campaigns for governor in Texas, and then his campaign for the presidency in 2000, went under the “compassionate conservative” label, which was mostly marketing. The real difference that Dubya resolved to create between himself and his father was that Dubya was committed to eliminating the “wimp” meme that, for some very good reasons, had dogged his father and contributed mightily to his losing to Clinton in 1992. Particularly after 9/11, when Bush was thrust into circumstances where his more “muscular” approach to politics was comforting to a badly rattled country, he differentiated himself from his father pretty effectively. John Kerry was an awful candidate, and some folks turned out to vote against him; but most of the record numbers who gave Dubya his reelection victory were voting for Dubya.
Our host and I disagree on whether it was right and smart and appropriate to invade Iraq, but I’m sure we agree that regardless of that, doing so effectively exhausted Dubya’s political capital. It didn’t replenish itself during his second term, and that’s also when Dubya seemed to drift — mostly because of who he had advising him — into a closer and closer reflection of his father.
I understand that. At 58, I find myself to be more like my own father than I ever could have guessed or believed.
But neither George W. Bush nor Mitt Romney has ever, ever been a movement conservative, a constitutional conservative. They both pretended to not be “establishment Republicans” when they ran for POTUS, and Bush did a better job of that than Romney. Romney’s very articulate, and he doubtless could sit down and write up a flow-chart or a PowerPoint slide which preaches the conservative gospel, but he had never internalized it, and he never spoke that language. That’s why he fell so spectacularly far short of Ronald Reagan in inspiring American conservatives, and that’s why he lost in 2012.
John McCain, of course, couldn’t is just a plain old garden-variety establishment Republican, even farther from the Reagan/Cruz mold than Dubya or Romney.
So: Was Romney “more conservative” in any meaningful sense than Dubya? Naw, I don’t think so: Not ever, and certainly not as judged in perspective over their entire political careers.
I still love (a carefully chosen word) George W. Bush, and I respect and admire him, and I’m grateful to him for his service to the nation: He saved us from ManBearPig and a continuation of the Clinton Kleptocracy in 2000, and he met the challenges of 9/11. I forgive him for fading down the stretch, for becoming more timid and more compromising, and (as you wrote) more statist (actually, I’d phrase that in terms of him becoming less actively and less effectively opposed to statism, because he frequently didn’t even recognize it the longer he was in office). Dubya was the best available GOP candidate at the time, that much is clear, and he won — twice.
But I never mistook Dubya for having the kind of brilliant and deeply imbued constitutional conservatism that motivates Ted Cruz, or that motivated Ronald Reagan. And I never had any illusions at all that Mitt Romney was that kind of conservative, nor anything other than a very conventional establishment Republican trying very hard to look more conservative, and more committed to conservative core principles, than he actually was.
Neither man was capable of leading a Reagan-scale revolution. I don’t believe Marco Rubio is either. But I believe that Ted Cruz is, if he can get the nomination. For reasons I’ve explained earlier here, I’m still optimistic about that.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:54 pmFor any of you Trumpites…kindly name any issue of significance where you believe Cruz would not fight like hell, a la Trump, on the side of the issue Trump supports (at least for today). I can think of 2. Planned Parenthood funding and expansive usage eminent domain. Trump is dead wrong, literally, on these.
Name the issue(s) where Cruz abandoned a core principle articulated to the Texas voters and went another way – as Rubio did with the Gang of 8.
Then, please and thank you, explain how you can say credibly that Trump, who has a litany of flip flops through the years, would be more reliably counted upon to stick to his guns.
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/21/2016 @ 2:56 pm@ Bugg (#431), who wrote,
I agree that Hillary won’t possibly generate the kind of Messianic Reaction that Obama did among the Democratic faithful.
But she’ll work the machine, and the machine will work for her — not as well as for the Miracle Worker, nor even as well as it did, twice, for Bubba. But well enough. Nevada’s results just proved that.
I watched a news clips from a Sanders rally in South Carolina in which a young black woman, identified as a South Carolina state legislator who’s long been identified as a Hillary Clinton supporter, was excoriating Hillary in the rhythmic and rhyming call-and-response tones of a black gospel church: “We ain’t anyone’s firewall, Hillary! You don’t own our vote, you have to earn our vote!” The crowd roared approval.
Anyone care to bet whether that same woman is using those same rhetorical devices to turn out Hillary supporters come November, though, after she’s got the nomination? The truth is that black and (to a lesser extent) Latino voters are Hillary’s firewall, and while she doesn’t own them, she’s definitely still got a long-term lease on them.
She will have to be beaten. And Trump can’t.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:02 pmDRJ, if you’re reading this: I’m curious on your take, as a fellow Texan, on Cruz’ chances of pulling better than 50% in Texas on March 1.
I think he will. I think he’ll match, and possibly exceed, the 56% he pulled against Dewhurst in the primary. And I think it will be precisely because of Texans who believe that Cruz has kept the promises he made about what he’d do when he went to Washington.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:04 pmSee what I mean, DRJ?
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:06 pmBugg,
Trump is going to turn out disaffected white voters in West Virginia?
Obama got 35.5% of the vote there in 2012.
West Viginia is not a “purple” state.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:06 pmI read somewhere that Cruz had visited GWB a few years back, looking for his support and Bush said something like, “if you think I’d support you, you don’t know who or what I am…”
Colonel Haiku (2601c0) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:10 pmOh — and Bugg, one last point. I agree that we’re in uncharted waters when it comes to Trump.
But what’s going on with the Dems is absolutely clear and thoroughly predictable. It’s 1968 all over again. Sanders thinks it’s 1972, but he’s wrong. And his supporters are all way to young to even remember 1972.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:12 pmHumphrey would have won in 1972 if George Wallace had been the GOP nominee, by the way. Trump is in the same strategic situation as Wallace was.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:12 pmACK: Humphrey would have won in 1968, I meant to say. Or just … never mind. 😀 I’m getting sloppy.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:13 pmWest Virginia is an enigma. They vote strongly for Republicans for President and Democrats for practically everything else… on a statewide level.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:13 pm430Yes, and that should worry you but it doesn’t because you’ve already said you don’t care who the next SC Justice is.
I believe you are misreading one of my previous comments. I do care who the next Supreme Court Justice is.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:19 pmI’m not kidding.
I left so I could have the opportunity to do just one push up single-handed. Just once. One time. One hand.
Can’t say I can do it tomorromw.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:26 pmJohn Hitchcock, but we’re talking about the Presidential election, right? West Virginia’s not in play.
And statewide, since you mentioned it…
House of Delegates 64-36, GOP.
State Senate 18-16, GOP.
Lieutenant Governor, GOP.
And then in DC, there’s the Congressional Delegation, 3 of 3, GOP.
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:27 pmAnd Senator Shelley Moore Capito, GOP.
I said it was a losers gambit. Because attacking individuals rather than attacking Trump alienates people and now I think: Whoa. These Cruz supporters are the same type of d**cks as they complain about the Trump people being.
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:29 pmHeck with it.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:41 pmremarkably scandal-free
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:41 pmCol. H (#438): You should read Cruz’ book to understand his relationship with the Bushes. They won’t forgive him for being a bomb-thrower. But they’d get behind him if he had the nomination, and they might get behind him if Rubio were forced out. I think it’s more or less inevitable, though, that Jeb, at a minimum, will endorse Rubio in the next week.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:45 pmEd
Trump is Patton to Cruz’ Bradley.
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:51 pmAlso am confident that if Cruz pushes the Keystone Pipeline through, there will be use of eminent domain at some point.
Right now more people seem to think people think Trump’s fighting style is superior to Cruz’. It is actually up to Cruz and his supporters to convince the persuadable Trump voters that Cruz’ style is superior, because Cruz needs to flip them.
More candidates need to get off the stage so we can see Cruz go toe to toe with Trump (and Hillary)
My fault.
Bi curious, Beldar.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:55 pm@ steveg: You’ve just insulted Patton, and I don’t think Cruz has much in common with Bradley. Patton was a great military leader with a big personality — and a big mouth and poor self-control. Patton had results you could point to on the battlefield throughout his entire career, dating back to WW1.
The only think Trump has in common is the big mouth and poor self-control.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:55 pmJames #443:
This is the comment I interpreted as saying that you don’t care who the next SC Justice is:
James #347:
Maybe that was a mistake in typing. Did you mean to say “Why don’t people care who replaces Scalia?”
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:56 pmI quibble with everyone, Steve57. 😀 It’s not your fault.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 3:58 pmsteveg,
I’m just curious, what is your personal reaction when Trump calls Megyn Kelly a “bimbo,” or says that she’s “bleeding,” or when he calls Dr. Carson “psycho”?
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:01 pmI just don’t understand how that tactic wins undecided voters.
i applaud Mr. Trump’s unvarnished opinion on various and sundry cable news strumpets and also on lispy fruit loop Dr. Ben Carson
he calls em like he sees em
atta boy DJT don’t let the poopers get you down
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:04 pmPatton also understood history and leadership, and how they impact people and events.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:06 pmBeldar:
I’ve been thinking about this since I read your comment last night.
I don’t know. The oilfield is hurting right now and that makes Trump’s message resonate. I hope people remember that Cruz has remained true to his principles but, because the GOPe has caved at every turn, Cruz doesn’t have much to show for his efforts. Voters may decide to give someone else a chance.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:09 pmHowever, I will be very disappointed if Texas doesn’t vote overwhelmingly for Cruz. It will be due to the voters’ weakness and failings, not Cruz’s.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:10 pmTrump has a punch that stings Cruz and it is the “Cruz is a nasty liar who no one likes” punch
Cruz needs to be able to slip that punch and hit back… probably by telling the world that Donald has no specifics, he has no answers, he cannot debate substance, and is using this type of attack to hide behind.
Not sure why Cruz wastes time on Rubio.
If Cruz initiates a series of very public, well orchestrated fights with Trump he’ll get all the publicity he wants for free and damage Trump a bit as well as a know nothing bully hiding behind bluster… otherwise I’ll be voting (again) for a dude with weird red hair and a tentative grasp on ethics… and an “Uncle Teddy” in the political family tree.
I’ll never forget Arnold describing spending a couple of weeks in the summers with his wife’s “Uncle Teddy” and thinking “so that is why….”
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:11 pmhappyfeet, at least we agree that Trump’s views are “unvarnished.” That’s for sure! (LOL)
Cruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:13 pmBecause we have to get down to a two-man race for anyone to knock out Trump, and Cruz wants to be the other man (with Trump).
Trump consistently gets approximately one-third of the vote but that’s probably all he will get because of his high unfavorable ratings. That’s why Hillary will beat him but it’s also why the Republicans need to winnow down the field, so only one man is left to face Trump. The remaining 50-60% will move to that last man and knock out Trump.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:17 pmBeldar and DRJ
I was talking fighting style.
Cruz
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:22 pmI thought Trump was treating her with the same deference he would a man… which was none. I thought Trump lied about what he’d meant to say about Kelly and I think he lied about the handicapped guy too. (Patton would have whipped Trump for talking to Kelly like that, but the arena today is for boys and girls so…)
412- Steve57
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:23 pmcrystal clear
Can someone explain to me why Carson still seems convinced Cruz knew (and has lied about)the dirty tricks in Iowa?
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:24 pmThat’s why Hillary will beat him
this is pessimism number one she’s a disgusting incontinent old woman number two she might get indicted cause of being a criminal number three she can’t make america great again she’s too nasty
most important the primary turnout for the geriatric socialist party is low low low
the turnout for Team MAGA and the others is high high high
advantage: Mr. The Donald
happyfeet (831175) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:25 pmTrump/Captain Francesco Schettino 2016
mg (31009b) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:26 pmsteveg – I said “expansive usage” of eminent domain. Keystone would be a classic usage, as Cruz has repeatedly explained. Military analogy? Trump is Custer.
You talk about a fighter? Cruz took to the floor of the Senate and called his Leader a “LIAR.” That has real costs and Ted is paying right this very minute. He also took on big time money and power in Texas just to get elected. Would you favor me with a life-changing deal where Trump went against interests which were outrageously better funded and connected? The Donald is famous for taking on and beating up little guys.
I completely agree that Trump’s style has powerfully resonated with a plurality of voters. No question. What did style get us in ’08 and ’12?
I genuinely appreciate and honor your prior response. Have you one for this post?
Ed from SFV (3400a5) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:31 pmTrump is to Cruz what Kaitlyn Jenner is to Scarlett Johanssen?
nk (dbc370) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:37 pmbesides much of the pointless bloviating ala williamson, wilson et al, one thing that made it look like trump had skin in the game, was that whole series of boycotts and cancellations against his business ventures,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:42 pmwell mccain was so energetic, that was the knock against thompson, that he dropped the ball in the 9th innnings, and romney took his squash racket and went home,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 4:45 pmSteve 465,
I think Carson sees this as an opportunity to keep fundraising and stay in the race. He probably also has convinced himself that Cruz lied on purpose to hurt him, so he’s doing the right thing.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:10 pm#450, steveg wrote, It is actually up to Cruz and his supporters to convince the persuadable Trump voters that Cruz’ style is superior, because Cruz needs to flip them.
Try calling Trump’s supporters dirty names, insulting them, calling their intelligence and integrity into question, no doubt such a show of contempt will persuade them the only honorable course of action is to kowtow to their tormentors and accept their expressions of hatred as candy kisses.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:12 pm#450, steveg wrote: It is actually up to Cruz and his supporters to convince the persuadable Trump voters that Cruz’ style is is superior, because Cruz needs to flip them.
Try calling Trump’s supporters dirty names, insulting them, calling their intelligence and integrity into question, no doubt such a show of contempt will persuade them the only honorable course of action is to kowtow to their tormentors and accept their expressions of hatred as candy kisses.
(Don’t know how that happened.)
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:15 pm— adj Dana
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:16 pmnk (#469), you made me laugh, thank you.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:24 pm@473,short of giving an MMA Answer.
Steve57 (b30def) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:28 pmYou’re welcome, Beldar.
And the Doritos turned out ok with generous scoops of chilled chunky medium salsa, happyfeet and ropelight. 😉
nk (dbc370) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:28 pmropelight, it’s not about “flipping” Trump supporters. It’s about raising enough doubt in the minds of the very few of them who aren’t as rabid as the Trump supporters here that they ought to stay home.
Trump’s about to stub his toe in Texas and the SEC states. He’s no longer going to be looking like a winner; he’s no longer going to be leading in delegates. That’s not going to affect you, because nothing could affect your choice now. Nor is it likely to deter you from voting; I’ll give you full credit for determination & energy. But you’re not representative of the average Trump voter. A lot of them are going to find their enthusiasm levels lagging.
That is a high complement, ropelight. I hope you take it as such.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:30 pmon paper, he should have no presence, beldar, and cruz should own it all, but mostly likely he will split the vote, as in south carolina,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:36 pmCruz Supporter (102c9a) — 2/21/2016 @ 12:04 pm
And my reply is, but Trump is a lying, two-faced, snake fraud about every issue except for immigration.
No. Including immigration.
Sammy Finkelman (882d94) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:40 pmTrue. With every election, it shows that Cruz was right that the Republican electorate doesn’t want the establishment brand of politics.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:47 pmVery kind of you Beldar. Thank you and Best Regards.
ropelight (8e5265) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:49 pmNo one needs to convince Trump supporters of anything. They will either stick with him or they won’t, but I think that will happen when there are only 2-3 candidates and the candidates get more specific. Just as some supporters fled Cruz in Iowa when he refused to support ethanol subsidies, some Trump supporters will have second thoughts when Trump has to get specific.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 5:56 pmStole this from Beldar (kind of, the three of you who haven’t already click his handle and read the top post).
You have to give Trump credit. He has the whole country talking about something few people wanted to talk about before. Donald Trump.
nk (dbc370) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:02 pmbecause it’s not about trump, but he does grab the third rail, on immigration, on the islamic threat, on our ‘elephant in the room’ trade policy,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:05 pm#468
Ed
I don’t have a response that goes beyond saying my misuse of your remarks on the “expansive use” of eminent domain was unintentional and due to distraction and laziness.
Hopefully expansive use of eminent domain will be squashed soon.
Cruz, Rubio and Bush are no “little” guys and Trump is a very destructive opponent.
I’d rather see him putting all this energy into attacking Hillary, but Trump seems fixated on eliminating the immediate opposition.
As I’ve said before, I like Cruz and think he needs to make inroads to Trumps “momentum” voters, flipping them or I’ll be faced with voting for the guy that won the delegates vs the guy I wanted.
Maybe Beldar’s math works out for Cruz… then he’d have to beat Hillary… something I am not confident in.
Do you think his wife has tapes of Hillay’s speeches to Goldman Sachs
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:09 pmjust as across the pond, farage and hannen, were the pioneers,
http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2016/02/good_fences.html
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:13 pmDRJ, your counterpoint about the state of the Texas economy and its possible effect on enthusiasm for Cruz has had me thinking. I think you’re right, but: I’m hopeful that the dampening you hypothesize will be less of a problem in this Republican primary than it might be in a general election.
Re whether Texans think Cruz has inadequate accomplishments to show for his bomb-throwing to satisfy his Texas base, that may also be, especially among those who had unrealistic expectations of what one junior senator could do in the space of a couple or three years. The last part of Cruz book summarizes his clear successes, of which there are a few, and his partial successes, of which there are many when viewed from a particular perspective. He claims, and I think genuinely shares, credit for working with House Republicans to expose the seamy side of, and then defeat, Obama’s immigration bill, for example; but I’m not sure how many Texans know of that.
But I still believe that the reason he’s in Washington as Texas’ junior senator — instead of David Dewhurst — is because Texans wanted someone to fight the big symbolic fights he’s been trying, obviously and sometimes gratingly or abrasively, to fight. I think the kind of voters who turn out for a Texas GOP primary in an election year are going to give him credit for being Don Quixote, even if the windmills are, in general, still standing, and even though Texas’ economy is unquestionably hurting.
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:15 pm#483
DRJ
How is that any different?
steveg (fed1c9) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:17 pmCandidates get more specific and that convinces voters.
But it is not just the candidates… we live in a very linked society today and we can influence others, if only by reposting Cruz’s views, his record, his positions.
Our host is putting his finger on the scale by posting Rubio’s doublespeak, Trumps flip flops etc.
We engage with one another and I know I changed my views a little more today and also appreciated the tone
@ steveg (#486): Thanks, but it’s Ted Cruz’ math, as calculated long before he ever announced. I’m just summarizing it. 😉
Beldar (fa637a) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:20 pmI think NRO had a column up by someone I didn’t recognize, that Cruz is to this point mirroring Santorum in 2012 for per centage of votes cast.
The problem isn’t the candidate. America is no longer a serious outfit and conservatives are past their expiration date.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:24 pmcould it have been david french,
fwiw,
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/431688/trumps-blue-collar-appeal
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:27 pmsteveg,
I think as people become aware of specific policy positions and details that directly affect them, they are more likely to decide they will or won’t support a candidate. For example, many Iowa conservatives saw Cruz as great in theory but that changed for those whose livelihoods depended on ethanol. Some of them had second thoughts.
The same will be true for other candidates, don’t you think? They will have to get more specific as time goes on, and specifics make people have second thoughts.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:28 pmsometimes there is an evolution,
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/02/contrary-to-what-cameron-and-osborne-say-gove-hasnt-been-an-outer-for-30-years/
he’s still one of the sharpest minds on the front benches along with liam fox, who should be reinstated,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:30 pmIt doesn’t have to be as direct as my ethanol example. As we get closer to the election, people will get more information and pay closer attention to what the candidates say. Not everyone has time to read all this stuff. As they learn more about the candidates’ positions, some will realize the one they initially liked isn’t the best choice for them.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:32 pm492. I’ll check that too but I found the article(normally I don’t go direct to NRO):
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/431667/ted-cruz-has-two-big-problems
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:33 pmBeldar 488: I agree. He’s done what we sent him there to do, in a time when that’s extremely rare.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:35 pm492. Ah, Lowry says its the half-educated working class whites and the Alberta dude evangelicals that Trump is sweeping up.
I get the feeling this election will leave marks.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:40 pmfloor wax, dessert topping, it’s more the nixon strategy, updated to 2016, with a touch of mad men gambit,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:41 pm499. The GOPe has its johns tied up in knots fighting amongst themselves over the happiest hooker title.
Funny, I’m not the least bit sad over the spectacle. We deserve it.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:47 pmcover bands are all the rage, that deal just gets better and better,
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/salman-rushdie-iranian-state-media-renew-fatwa-on-satanic-verses-author-with-600000-bounty-a6887141.html
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 6:51 pm501. There’s a get-rich-quick scheme somewhere in that.
DNF (755a85) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:01 pmthat was the iran deal, which among other winners, was an acolyete of carlos, anis naccache, who trained hezbollah, and killed one of the shah’s ministers,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:17 pmIsn’t Texas a Primary-plus-Caucus state? How does that work? I’m ignorant on those details. Also, who does that voting combination benefit?
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:21 pmwhat she might have been focusing on recently,
http://www.irondog.org/event-info/
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:28 pmTexas is not a caucus State. It is what this article calls a semi-open primary. It is an open primary because voters can vote in any primary they want — Democratic, Republican, Libertarians, Green, etc. — as long as they are registered to vote.
It is semi-open because once a voter votes in a particular party primary, s/he can’t switch to another party and vote if there is a runoff. For example, if I had voted in the Democratic primary when Cruz was running for the Senate, I couldn’t have voted in the Republican primary runoff between Dewhurst and Cruz.
Note that the link seems to say that voters don’t have to be registered to vote before an election, but I don’t think that’s correct. Voters have to register 30 days before the election. In addition, only citizens can vote (proof is required at registration) and photo ID is required to register and vote. If voters don’t have a photo ID with them, they can cast a provisional ballot and provide an ID later.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:56 pmThanks, DRJ. I thought I read last Presidential cycle that Texas had both a caucus and a primary at the same time. Maybe I didn’t read that.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 7:59 pmI’ve been voting in Texas since 1972 and I’ve never seen a caucus. Regular voting (secret ballot) in the primary and general elections. The only thing that has changed is it used to be with paper ballots and now it’s electronic.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:08 pmBut I think there are several States that have caucuses. It’s easy to forget which Is which.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:32 pmalaska and colorado, looks like,
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/us/elections/primary-calendar-and-results.html?_r=0
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:40 pmYou are right, John:
I didn’t know this because I’ve never voted in a Democratic primary.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:47 pmit’s like one of dr. doolittles hybrid animals,
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 8:50 pm453
Maybe that was a mistake in typing. Did you mean to say “Why don’t people care who replaces Scalia?”
No, the intent of my (rhetorical) question was to take for granted that people care and ask why. The answer of course being while it might be nice to live in a world in which the meaning of the Constitution doesn’t change (much) depending on who sits on the Supreme Court that isn’t the world we live in. So people who care about the meaning of the Constitution care about who sits on the Supreme Court.
James B. Shearer (0f56fb) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:10 pmotoh, well really there is no other hand,
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/georgeosborne/12167084/George-Osborne-will-abolish-pension-perk-in-tax-bombshell-claims-former-minister.html
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:20 pmfwiw,
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2016/02/21/donald-trump-consults-with-rudy-giuliani-as-he-builds-political-kitchen-cabinet/
narciso (732bc0) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:30 pmI was only partly right. I thought it was Texas, not just Texas Democrats. It seems strange, and maybe underhanded, to do a caucus-primary split like that. But that might be my cynicism and distrust showing through.
John Hitchcock (b4496b) — 2/21/2016 @ 9:46 pmFrom narciso’s link at comment 515:
Save us from Trump, his “deep GOP ties,” and the voters who fall for it.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/22/2016 @ 6:14 amTrump values = New York + GOP establishment values.
DRJ (15874d) — 2/22/2016 @ 6:16 am