Patterico's Pontifications

2/20/2013

Exclusive: More Hagel Idiocy

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 10:11 pm

If this doesn’t disqualify him, I don’t know what does. Chuck Hagel in 2002, speaking highly about . . . Joe Biden:

Joe Biden is one of the preeminent foreign policy thinkers in our country. You can deal with him. He’s always straight up. He knows what he is talking about. He’s fair, very experienced, and a very good listener. He’s a formidable guy who’s also a pleasure to deal with.

This should be disqualifying — but in a world where a guy just slightly stupider than your Dumb Uncle Rufus can be the Vice President? It is, once again, a bug that Obama sees as a feature.

Thanks to Charles C. Johnson.

48 Comments

  1. “[O]ne of the preeminent foreign policy thinkers in our country.”

    That’s what he said. About Joe Biden.

    Comment by Patterico (9c670f) — 2/20/2013 @ 10:13 pm

  2. It is proof that the lint in my clothes dryer is smarterer than Hagel.

    Comment by JD (b63a52) — 2/20/2013 @ 10:14 pm

  3. i just found out this week his wife isn’t even a real doctor

    no one tells me anything

    I always wondered how he could’ve married a doctor doctor him being so dumb and undisciplined and all and I would think well good for him

    but it was all a hoax

    like the food stamp multiplier effects

    Comment by happyfeet (acd614) — 2/20/2013 @ 10:17 pm

  4. Hagel will fit right in with the other two stooges, Biden and Kerry.

    He knows what he is talking about.

    He demonstrated that the other day when he was giving advice on home defense guns.

    “Kate,” Mr. Biden said, looking into the camera as if to the questioner, “if you want to protect yourself, get a double-barrel shotgun, have the shells, a 12-gauge shotgun.”

    Noting that he has two at his secluded home in Delaware, locked in a cabinet, Mr. Biden said he told his wife: “Jill, if there’s ever a problem, just walk out on the balcony here, walk out, put that double-barrel shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house. I promise you, whoever’s coming in is not going to.”

    “You don’t need an AR-15,” Mr. Biden continued, referring to a popular style of assault rifle like the one that the police said was used in the Newtown, Conn., school massacre in December. “It’s harder to aim, it’s harder to use. And in fact, you don’t need 30 rounds.” As he spoke, the vice president lifted his hands as if aiming a rifle.

    Get a double barrel shotgun, then go out and empty it into the air from the balcony.

    Brilliant.

    Oh, and 12ga. shotguns kick a lot harder then the .223/5.56 Nato round in the AR.

    Which is why a lot of police forces moved away from the shotgun and went to the AR; they’re easier to shoot. It’s a combination of the low recoil energy of the round and the ergonomics of the rifle. They’re also pretty accurate.

    But I guess Sheriff Joe doesn’t need to worry about accuracy if he’s just going to try and hit the sky. All he has to worry about is not hitting anyone in his Secret Service detail, who’ll be the ones actually protecting this clown.

    If you were going to use a shotgun for defense then you know you still need to worry about accuracy because shot doesn’t spread that much at normal in-home ranges. Except maybe if you live in house with rooms the same size as the Palace of Versailles.

    Oh, yeah. He knows what he’s talking about.

    Idiots, all of them.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/20/2013 @ 10:52 pm

  5. Finding an actual living person in this country who looks up to Joe Biden and is not institutionalized is a very scary thought.

    Comment by daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 2/20/2013 @ 11:07 pm

  6. Then again, rumors were afoot that Obama was thinking of selecting Hagel as a running mate or Secretary of Defense in 2008. Dumb and Dumb.

    Comment by daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 2/20/2013 @ 11:09 pm

  7. If this doesn’t disqualify him,…

    It won’t.

    Comment by Blacque Jacques Shellacque (9841d7) — 2/21/2013 @ 12:14 am

  8. Say there Daleyrocks; they’re in a race for Dumb, Dumber and Dumbest. I’ll put my money on Slow Joe to take it by a nose.

    Comment by Comanche Voter (29e1a6) — 2/21/2013 @ 4:48 am

  9. [object TextRange] is reporting that Shelby (R-AL) will vote for Hagel.

    It’s over.

    Comment by aunursa (7014a8) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:05 am

  10. “When queried about Hagel’s comments, Vice President Biden replied, ‘Hey-hey! Chuck Hagel is a great guy. God love’im, he’s a tremendous shortstop for the Orioles and a real credit to his race.’”

    Comment by MarkJ (42fe5b) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:45 am

  11. I just thought this tidbit of information about the guy Hagel thinks “knows what he is talking about” would be interesting to people.

    Joe Biden’s Shotgun Advice Could Land Jill Biden in Jail

    Felony aggravated menacing, reckless endangering charges could result from shooting gun in air

    A sergeant with the Wilmington, Del., police department explained to U.S. News that city residents are not allowed to fire guns on their property.

    The sergeant, who preferred not to be identified, said that Wilmington residents are also not allowed to shoot trespassers. “On your property you can’t just shoot someone,” he said. “You have to really feel that your life is being threatened.”

    Defense attorney John Garey—a former Delaware deputy attorney general—agreed, and added that several criminal charges might result if Jill Biden took her husband’s advice.

    …”It is not uncommon” for people to be charged with crimes under similar circumstances, he said. “I’ve seen cases where lawful citizens have used guns outside their homes and they end up arrested.”

    Rob Wiltbank, a gun rights advocate who founded Delaware Open Carry in 2008, told U.S. News he agrees with the vice president that a shotgun would be good for home protection, but he was also troubled by the hypothetical.

    “It would be incredibly irresponsible of a gun owner to blindly discharge a firearm into the air,” said Wiltbank. “What goes up, must come down and this specific behavior has been the cause of many negligent homicides over the years.”

    There were so many stupid aspects of Joe Biden’s advice I suppose it slipped my mind to mention all of them. Of course the legal liability is important. A gun is deadly force. You don’t brandish it to scare people (although if they do get scared and flee that’s a plus). You don’t shoot blindly into the air as some sort of Bidenesque warning shots. If you’re not shooting at the intruder but in some other direction one can reasonably conclude you weren’t really in fear for your life.

    Also, you’re legally liable for every shot downrange in most jurisdictions, even the most gun friendly. You may not get criminally charged if the shooting was justified, but even if you hit your target but the projectile passes through and hits an innocent you can get sued. Or if most of that buckshot from your lupara (I think Biden gets his gun knowledge from reading the Godfather) hits your target but some misses and hits someone else.

    I also didn’t realize Biden’s house was within the city limits of Wilmington, which makes his advice especially dangerous. Articles I read described his house as “remote” but I guess to the WaPo or NYT Wilmington is remote.

    A satellite image of the home on Google Maps, which features a scale tool, indicates that the nearest neighbor’s house is approximately 100 feet away. Further away, on the other side of the home, there is a school with outside sports facilities.

    Biden. Part of the Obama administration brain trust. Soon to include Hagel.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:43 am

  12. “Joe Biden is one of the preeminent foreign policy thinkers in our country. You can deal with him. He’s always straight up. He knows what he is talking about. He’s fair, very experienced, and a very good listener. He’s a formidable guy who’s also a pleasure to deal with. . .”

    No doubt we will later find the clause that was lopped off of the end of that sentence:

    “. . . and he is not forced to answer to the beck and call of the Jooooooooos.”

    Comment by JVW (4826a9) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:54 am

  13. I’m convinced that Barry selected Joe as VP in 2008 because he didn’t want anyone, who, by comparison, would overshadow Barry.

    Obama had to pick someone with “experience” to balance the ticket, since he himself had only served in the Senate for 3 1/2 years.
    BUT he couldn’t pick Hillary, or a Richard Gephardt, or a Tom Daschle, or a Tom Harkin, or any of the various career Democrats who were decently articulate and well-versed, because it might elicit too many whispers of, “Uh, that guy (or gal) knows more than Obama.”

    Therefore, Biden became the perfect choice.
    He was a career politician who had served on “important” committees, but he was a bit of an airhead who would never overshadow Obama.
    In fact, he would make Obama look reasonably intelligent by comparison.

    And that entire paradigm can only be achieved by Democrats, since only they can always count on an acquiescent media to not throw any fastballs at Slow Joe’s head.

    On the other hand, Republicans are always better served to pick a bright policy wonk for VP such as Richard Nixon, Dick Cheney, Jack Kemp, or Paul Ryan, lest they get hammered by a vicious media, such as in the cases of Dan Quayle or Sarah Palin.

    Comment by Elephant Stone (3ef239) — 2/21/2013 @ 9:15 am

  14. So you have the spectacle of one of the only opponents of the Bin Laden raid, as the running
    mate,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 9:22 am

  15. narciso,

    Yeah, pal, you’re spot-on.
    Biden’s “expertise” (cough, cough) is allegedly in foreign policy, yet he’s been wrong about every major foreign policy stance that he’s ever taken.

    I wouldn’t be surprised that if sometime in the 1980s, he gave a speech at Podunk University where he asserted that the Soviets were not to be feared, but that the real under-the-radar threat is from an invasion by…the Canary Islands.

    Comment by Elephant Stone (3ef239) — 2/21/2013 @ 9:27 am

  16. For the nuclear freeze, against the Contras, opposed to the first Gulf War,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 9:35 am

  17. Biden has also been opposed to drilling in ANWR since at least the Carter administration. Back in the 70s he voted against the Trans-Alaska pipeline. Why? Because of course he thinks since the oil wouldn’t be online for to 10 years it wouldn’t effect prices.

    Even if that were true, let’s examine what that says about Biden. First, math! Carter hasn’t been President since 1980. 1980+10=???? Any answers, Slow Joe?

    But of course it’s not true. It just means Biden, like his boss, doesn’t understand how a futures market works. Also, he doesn’t understand that drilling, as well as just building the Keystone pipeline, has immediate economic benefits.

    Sometimes I’m convinced these people are just playing dumb. Reid, for instance, amassed a multi-million dollar fortune, estimated to be as much as $10m, despite never making making more than what he makes now as Senate majority leader; $193k. And he never got caught, like Jackson Jr.

    Biden is estimated to be worth around $500k. Unlike everyone else in Congress, what Mark Twain called America’s only native criminal class, he never parlayed his influence into a fortune.

    And no, I don’t see that as a sign of honesty on his part.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 10:09 am

  18. Stupidity cannot be cured with money, or through education, or by legislation. Stupidity is not a sin, the victim can’t help being stupid. But stupidity is the only universal capital crime: the sentence is death, there is no appeal, and execution is carried out automatically and without pity.
    Robert A. Heinlein

    Comment by mojo (8096f2) — 2/21/2013 @ 1:01 pm

  19. Schumer’s Dishonest Hagel Sob Story – Commentary blog Jonathan S. Tobin 02.20.2013 – 1:30 PM

    As Joe Biden might say, literally, a sob story.

    At a New York City event this morning reported by Politico’s Maggie Haberman, Schumer doubled down on his support for Hagel claiming the former senator cried when discussing his slurs about the “Jewish lobby.”

    (The former Senator is Hagel)

    The (linked) source for the Commentary blog post is this:

    http://www.politico.com/story/2013/02/schumer-chuck-hagel-almost-had-tears-in-meeting-87852.html?hp=l2

    Schumer made the remarks about President Barack Obama’s pick for defense secretary at a breakfast in lower Manhattan hosted by the Association for a Better New York and the Downtown Alliance.

    “Look, I had doubts about Sen. Hagel when his name was first floated, and I expressed those publicly on ‘Meet The Press’ and other places,” Schumer said. “And the president called me and said, ‘Before you come out with any decision, please sit down and talk to him.’ That was only fair.”

    Schumer said he spent 90 minutes asking Hagel questions — including about a “nuclear Iran” — and “he answered them very well.”

    “He struck me as sincere, and you know, you have to be sitting there at the meeting obviously, but I also told him when he used the word Jewish lobby what it meant to Jewish people,” he added.

    “And I told him what a double standard is. That Jewish people throughout the centuries have suffered a double standard. Everyone could be a farmer except Jewish people. Everyone could live in Moscow except Jewish people. I said when everyone else can lobby but all of a sudden when those of us who are pro-Israel lobby, it’s a negative, that’s a double standard. And I’m sure you didn’t mean it, but it harkens to the old days.

    “And he really, you know, he almost had tears in his eyes when he understood. So I believe he will be good.”

    Anybody believe Senator Schumer’s account of this meeting? I also wonder if Schumer tells the same story everywhere he goes. Note: Schumer gives himself an escape clause. He said, “almost”

    The idea that Hagel convinced Schumer of something was not credible to begin with. But this could be the definition of insulting people’s intelligence.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/21/2013 @ 4:00 pm

  20. In the meantime, Senator Shelby has said he will vote for Hagel.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/21/2013 @ 4:01 pm

  21. Professor Hagel Hagel’s Georgetown syllabus littered with anti-Israel authors

    The material also argues that America is weak.

    Also:

    “The 21st Century has ushered in a global transformation that is redefining the world order,” states the course description. “This transformation is shifting geo-political centers of gravity and is re-casting geo-political influences as the world experiences an unprecedented diffusion of power.”

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/21/2013 @ 4:37 pm

  22. 21. Anybody believe Senator Schumer’s account of this meeting? I also wonder if Schumer tells the same story everywhere he goes. Note: Schumer gives himself an escape clause. He said, “almost”

    The idea that Hagel convinced Schumer of something was not credible to begin with. But this could be the definition of insulting people’s intelligence.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/21/2013 @ 4:00 pm

    The thing about this story is that Schumer would have us believe he told the 66 year old Hagel something about Jewish history, and consequently European history, that Hagel was hearing for the first time in his life.

    Like maybe the history of Jews in Europe wasn’t all that pleasant and there could even have been some discrimination.

    So Hagel didn’t use the term “Jewish Lobby” because he’s a Joooo Hater. He only used the term because he doesn’t have the wisdom and common sense I’ve seen every single Seaman Recruit I’ve ever run across. But now that Schumer filled him in he’ll straighten up and fly right. And that’s supposed to convince us to feel better about Hagel becoming SecDef.

    I can’t wait till he talks to the troops and throws around other insulting ethnic terms and references because Schumer didn’t fill him in on the finer points of each one of those.

    And, no, it’s not the least bit believable, Sammy.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:11 pm

  23. What strikes me about that syllabi is how pedestrian, it is, Khanna, Beinhart, Brezinski,
    (who suggested four years ago, the US should shoot down Israeli jets on the way to bombing Iran’s nukes)didn’t see Zakaria or Friedman on that list,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:18 pm

  24. 23. What strikes me about that syllabi is how pedestrian, it is, Khanna, Beinhart, Brezinski,
    (who suggested four years ago, the US should shoot down Israeli jets on the way to bombing Iran’s nukes)didn’t see Zakaria or Friedman on that list,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:18 pm

    Naturally. He worked for our Joooo-hater-in-chief emeritus.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:37 pm

  25. Once upon a time, I thought he was the smart member of the Carter administration,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:41 pm

  26. 25. Once upon a time, I thought he was the smart member of the Carter administration,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 5:41 pm

    You could still be right. But that’s an indictment of the Carter administration, not high praise for Brezinski’s intelligence.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 6:47 pm

  27. 13. I’m convinced that Barry selected Joe as VP in 2008 because he didn’t want anyone, who, by comparison, would overshadow Barry.

    Comment by Elephant Stone (3ef239) — 2/21/2013 @ 9:15 am

    I’m sure you’re right about Biden. Actually his entire cabinet. President Tiger Beat needs to be protected from having his illusions about being the smartest man in any room shattered. He can however be the smartest man in a room where everyone else has been handpicked by his handlers like Valerie Jarrett.

    But Hagel is different in one regard. He’ll do his boss’ bidding without argument. Hagel isn’t to the left of Obama on foreign policy; he’s perfectly in tune with Obama’s second term FP agenda. And when it comes to slashing the military Hagel will go along with that, too.

    Just like with FP, though, Hagel won’t be running things at DoD. It’s all going to be done from the WH. Hagel is just there to stare at his computer’s screen saver and drink his Ensure. But when the WH guts the military Hagel’s fingerprints will be on it. GOP fingerprints.

    Remember, King Putt can’t be blamed for anything that goes on in the executive branch. He doesn’t even know what’s going on in the executive branch.

    But then if Hagel’s an idiot, what does that make the GOP Senators going along with this travesty? Hagel’s got enough GOP votes in the Senate now to be confirmed.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:00 pm

  28. Well Ashton Carter, will be running things, he was the apologist for China and North Korea, back in the Clinton era,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:08 pm

  29. A tough row to hoe
    Mental midgets like Hagel
    Press lays down like dogs

    Comment by Colonel Haiku (1b3d9e) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:33 pm

  30. Springtime for Hitler
    Winter for Poland and France
    One toke over line.

    Comment by felipe (3243af) — 2/21/2013 @ 7:51 pm

  31. Springtime for Hagel
    Winter for Marco and Ted
    Now ain’t that the truth?

    Comment by felipe (3243af) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:08 pm

  32. Hagel is an insult to prove who is boss.

    Comment by Ag80 (b2c81f) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:33 pm

  33. narciso, thanks for reminding me. Hagel may have a more active role than I’ve discussed.

    Well Ashton Carter, will be running things, he was the apologist for China and North Korea, back in the Clinton era,

    Hagel can be the chief apologist for the Mullahs, Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Muslim Brotherhood.

    Between the two they’ll have all the bases covered.

    But don’t you just love how Hagel spills the beans and reveals what’s really going on? Such as when he went off script and kept saying he supported Obama’s strong position on containment.

    And regarding your observation concerning Ashton Carter and how he’ll really be running things? Whereas Hagel has already admitted, after first admitting he needs to learn about the DoD on the job because he doesn’t really understand it now, that he won’t really be running anything. He’ll be “the leader,” he’ll be “responsible.”

    He won’t be the leader, but you damned well be sure when things fall apart that Obama will make sure his GOP patsy is the one who’s held responsible.

    Oh, and speaking of the Mullahs:

    UN Nuclear Agency Documents Iran Atom Advances

    Those tough sanctions really have the Iranian regime quaking in its boots. Just like the NORKs demonstrated the other day our sanctions have them quaking in theirs.

    U.N. nuclear inspectors have counted nearly 200 advanced machines fully or partially installed at Iran’s main uranium enrichment site, the International Atomic Energy Agency reported Thursday, confirming diplomats’ accounts that Tehran has begun a major upgrade of a program that can be used in the making of atomic arms.

    …The advance is significant both in terms of technology and timing. The IR-2m centrifuges can enrich three to five times faster than the outmoded machines now being used at Natanz. For nations fearing that Iran may want to make nuclear arms that means a quicker way of getting there, should Tehran actually break out of its present peaceful enrichment program to openly work on a weapon.

    This line was a hoot:

    The start of the upgrade is also of concern to six world powers that are preparing to open talks with Iran about its nuclear program on Tuesday in Kazakhstan. They want Tehran to cut back on enrichment, saying the installation of new machines instead sends the signal that the Islamic Republic is expanding that activity.

    “Waah,” say the six world powers, “You guys are making us look bad.”

    Newsflash: they haven’t just sent a signal they’ve expanded their enrichment activity. They have expanded their enrichment activity.

    I’m sure those talks will be productive. I expect the US negotiator to get pantsed.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:44 pm

  34. Hagel is an insult to prove who is boss.
    Comment by Ag80

    This

    Comment by JD (b63a52) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:46 pm

  35. Yes, he’s sort of like William cohen, but much more obnoxious,sort of the way James Webb, turned out to be,

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/21/2013 @ 8:58 pm

  36. Just know that the very first time Hagel does something really, really stupid, the media and Obama will go back to reminding us that he is a Republican.

    Comment by JVW (4826a9) — 2/21/2013 @ 10:49 pm

  37. 36. Just know that the very first time Hagel does something really, really stupid, the media and Obama will go back to reminding us that he is a Republican.

    Comment by JVW (4826a9) — 2/21/2013 @ 10:49 pm

    And as is the case with sequestration, just because Hagel was Obama’s idea and Obama’s choice Hagel won’t be Obama’s fault.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/21/2013 @ 11:17 pm

  38. I found this commentary on Hagel’s confirmation by Paul Mirengoff at Powerline particularly on point. By way of background, the legislation he’s referring to is a GOP plan to give the federal departments and agencies discretion as to where the make the sequestration cuts so it’s not the “meat cleaver” approach Obama’s whining about.

    In light of Hagel’s impending confirmation, however, I wonder whether the legislation should carve out the Department of Defense. It’s possible that America would be better off with indiscriminate cuts to that organization than with cuts that result from the “discretion” of the village idiot of Washington, D.C.

    Comment by Steve57 (60a887) — 2/22/2013 @ 4:59 am

  39. The nondiscretion means 50% of the value of the value of the cuts to come form the defense budget. I don’t think where in the defense budget is specified.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:03 pm

  40. Hagel is for increasing benefits, reducing immediate readiness, and making long range plans at the excpense of immediate reasdiness. Plans do not involve any ground troops, or only involve equipment or dealing with the Far East.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:05 pm

  41. Paul Krugman’s take on the sequester:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/22/opinion/krugman-sequester-of-fools.html?ref=opinion&pagewanted=all&_r=0

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:06 pm

  42. Krugman:


    The right policy would be to forget about the whole thing. America doesn’t face a deficit crisis, nor will it face such a crisis anytime soon. . . Unfortunately, neither party is proposing that we just call the whole thing off. But the proposal from Senate Democrats at least moves in the right direction, replacing the most destructive spending cuts — those that fall on the most vulnerable members of our society — with tax increases on the wealthy, and delaying austerity in a way that would protect the economy.

    House Republicans, on the other hand, want to take everything that’s bad about the sequester and make it worse: canceling cuts in the defense budget, which actually does contain a lot of waste and fraud, and replacing them with severe cuts in aid to America’s neediest. This would hit the nation with a double whammy, reducing growth while increasing injustice. …

    ….A middle-of-the-road solution would presumably involve a mix of spending cuts and tax increases; well, that’s what Democrats are proposing, while Republicans are adamant that it should be cuts only. And given that the proposed Republican cuts would be even worse than those set to happen under the sequester, it’s hard to see why Democrats should negotiate at all, as opposed to just letting the sequester happen.

    So here we go. The good news is that compared with our last two self-inflicted crises, the sequester is relatively small potatoes. A failure to raise the debt ceiling would have threatened chaos in world financial markets; failure to reach a deal on the so-called fiscal cliff would have led to so much sudden austerity that we might well have plunged back into recession. The sequester, by contrast, will probably cost “only” around 700,000 jobs.

    But the looming mess remains a monument to the power of truly bad ideas — ideas that the entire Washington establishment was somehow convinced represented deep wisdom.

    Comment by Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:08 pm

  43. Talk about missing the point;

    http://theweek.com/article/index/240394/the-hagel-pinata

    Comment by narciso (3fec35) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:17 pm

  44. Read up today, FWIW in Time magazine(snap visit to my physician) on the F-35 Lightning II which I had conflated in my mind with the F-22 Raptor.

    The former has been in production since 2005 and will be done with its design phase 20?? The latter has been in operation about as long but has yet to see action in battle.

    They’re both worth something like $300 Million per copy. Add in maintenance costs and, who knows, $450M?

    Don’t worry about the program tho, Congress coughed up $6 Billion just hours before passing sequester to build the 30 odd Lightnings to be delivered this year on the way to 2500 or some such.

    Because all the versions ranges run from 600 miles down to 450, they fly to the battle in formation with tankers.

    So we have to cut costs, keeping one carrier group in the Mediterranean. But really what difference can it possibly make? Like we’d use one to save an Ambassador or something.

    Comment by gary gulrud (dd7d4e) — 2/22/2013 @ 1:31 pm

  45. Hagel has been confirmed, 58-41.

    Comment by DRJ (a83b8b) — 2/26/2013 @ 3:19 pm

  46. Yes, and of those 41, the ones who voted For Cloture will have a lot to answer for when Hagel becomes, in actuality, the folly that he is believed to be.
    If he were to be Les Aspin, that would be a Best Case Scenario.

    Comment by askeptic (b8ab92) — 2/26/2013 @ 3:24 pm

  47. We are so screwed.

    Comment by JD (b63a52) — 2/26/2013 @ 3:26 pm

  48. FWIW, in one mock battle one F-22 took out 4 F-16′s by itself. still, it would be nice to have more than a few dozen.

    Comment by MD in Philly (3d3f72) — 2/26/2013 @ 3:37 pm

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