Comments on: The Power of the Jump™: The Overaggressive Cops Who Shot the Handcuffed Guy on the Ground http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/ Harangues that just make sense Thu, 23 May 2013 09:35:49 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.4.2 By: WarEagle82 http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1142701 WarEagle82 Sat, 05 Jan 2013 03:15:02 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1142701 <blockquote>The handcuffed guy had a duty to tell the police he was armed. </blockquote> Seriously? Don't most criminals have a <i>duty</i> not to commit crimes? They don't seem to be particularly inclined to observe their <i>duties</i> do they?

The handcuffed guy had a duty to tell the police he was armed.

Seriously? Don’t most criminals have a duty not to commit crimes? They don’t seem to be particularly inclined to observe their duties do they?

]]> By: MunDane http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1142190 MunDane Thu, 03 Jan 2013 17:48:33 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1142190 I remember a story from the some University police (I think CSU, but not positive) a few years ago, a suspect threw a gun away, and when it hit the ground, it went off. The police shot him. The department got sued since he was unarmed, and settled out of court. I remember a story from the some University police (I think CSU, but not positive) a few years ago, a suspect threw a gun away, and when it hit the ground, it went off. The police shot him. The department got sued since he was unarmed, and settled out of court.

]]> By: ropelight http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1142094 ropelight Thu, 03 Jan 2013 15:23:07 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1142094 When the cops stopped Haslip's vehicle he tried to run away but he was caught and handcuffed. However, if he was going to use a gun to facilitate an escape he most likely would have pulled it prior to getting caught and cuffed, but he didn't, and he couldn't have already had it in hand or it would have been detected as he was cuffed. (Presumably with his hands behind his back.) So, unless Haslip had a concealed gun we just might be looking at a <i>bad shoot</i> conspiracy complete with use of a throw-down. Unless the gun can be conclusively linked to Haslip, the cops are going to have some 'splanin to do. When the cops stopped Haslip’s vehicle he tried to run away but he was caught and handcuffed.

However, if he was going to use a gun to facilitate an escape he most likely would have pulled it prior to getting caught and cuffed, but he didn’t, and he couldn’t have already had it in hand or it would have been detected as he was cuffed. (Presumably with his hands behind his back.)

So, unless Haslip had a concealed gun we just might be looking at a bad shoot conspiracy complete with use of a throw-down. Unless the gun can be conclusively linked to Haslip, the cops are going to have some ‘splanin to do.

]]> By: Dirty Old Man http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141966 Dirty Old Man Thu, 03 Jan 2013 04:18:54 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141966 Man, I haven't read this rag in years. Every time you run one of these nuggets I remember why. Man, I haven’t read this rag in years. Every time you run one of these nuggets I remember why.

]]> By: askeptic http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141898 askeptic Thu, 03 Jan 2013 01:56:20 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141898 It should be SOP that when you put the cuffs on, you frisk the individual - not in a moment, but immediately. This means checking all the usual places, even asking them if they have anything in their pockets that could stick, stab, or cut you; plus, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to remember to just ask the guy if they have any weapons, reminding them that if they lie, that's another charge. These cops got in a hurry, and it's going to cost them, and the taxpayers of Moreno Valley. A bsd shoot like this should mean at least 30-days off w/o pay, if not termination. It should be SOP that when you put the cuffs on, you frisk the individual – not in a moment, but immediately. This means checking all the usual places, even asking them if they have anything in their pockets that could stick, stab, or cut you; plus, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to remember to just ask the guy if they have any weapons, reminding them that if they lie, that’s another charge.
These cops got in a hurry, and it’s going to cost them, and the taxpayers of Moreno Valley.
A bsd shoot like this should mean at least 30-days off w/o pay, if not termination.

]]> By: Dustin http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141886 Dustin Thu, 03 Jan 2013 01:27:41 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141886 Well holy crap Patterico isn't lying when he says something is graphic. I'm not surprised that hiding a firearm in the crotch is an effective way to avoid detection. Patting someone down well enough to detect a small gun, like an LCP or a flashlight zip gun, ... I do not envy those who have that responsibility. The handcuffed guy had a duty to tell the police he was armed. Hopefully the next guy who evades an effective patdown is smart enough to volunteer the information. Well holy crap Patterico isn’t lying when he says something is graphic.

I’m not surprised that hiding a firearm in the crotch is an effective way to avoid detection. Patting someone down well enough to detect a small gun, like an LCP or a flashlight zip gun, … I do not envy those who have that responsibility.

The handcuffed guy had a duty to tell the police he was armed. Hopefully the next guy who evades an effective patdown is smart enough to volunteer the information.

]]> By: Michael Ejercito http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141876 Michael Ejercito Thu, 03 Jan 2013 00:55:31 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141876 Why not just blame the gun instead of the police? Why not just blame the gun instead of the police?

]]> By: luagha http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141731 luagha Wed, 02 Jan 2013 19:37:03 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141731 The mexican suicide in #8 is a well-known real case, taught to police. The people in the department office thought the arresting officer had done a full search so they weren't in a hurry to do it; and the arresting officer left the full search for the people at the office to do. The mexican suicide in #8 is a well-known real case, taught to police. The people in the department office thought the arresting officer had done a full search so they weren’t in a hurry to do it; and the arresting officer left the full search for the people at the office to do.

]]> By: Sammy Finkelman http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141659 Sammy Finkelman Wed, 02 Jan 2013 16:22:10 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141659 It sounds like the cops panicked. They are trained to react when another cop says gun. Little details like the man is handcuffed and (presumably) isn't trying to do anything, (was he?) are ignored. The man had let himself be handcuffed without reaching for his gun. Now he's going to fire it? Possible - but do cops shoot everyone they see with gun?? Why should the cop get scared <i> after </i> he is handcuffed? If anything, the man was trying to hold on to the gun for when he finds himself in a better situation. It sounds like the cops panicked. They are trained to react when another cop says gun. Little details like the man is handcuffed and (presumably) isn’t trying to do anything, (was he?) are ignored.

The man had let himself be handcuffed without reaching for his gun. Now he’s going to fire it? Possible – but do cops shoot everyone they see with gun?? Why should the cop get scared after he is handcuffed?

If anything, the man was trying to hold on to the gun for when he finds himself in a better situation.

]]> By: ropelight http://patterico.com/2013/01/01/the-power-of-the-jump-the-overaggressive-cops-who-shot-the-handcuffed-guy-on-the-ground/comment-page-1/#comment-1141650 ropelight Wed, 02 Jan 2013 15:36:17 +0000 http://patterico.com/?p=71993#comment-1141650 If Haslip had the gun in his hand then shooting him is understandable. But if he didn't have the gun in his hand then shooting him probably wasn't necessary. Which doesn't excuse the LA Times from the charge of journalistic malpractice. If Haslip had the gun in his hand then shooting him is understandable. But if he didn’t have the gun in his hand then shooting him probably wasn’t necessary.

Which doesn’t excuse the LA Times from the charge of journalistic malpractice.

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