Patterico's Pontifications

10/18/2012

Welfare Spending Jumps to Over $1 Trillion in 2011

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 7:56 am



Hope and change!

The government spent approximately $1.03 trillion on 83 means-tested federal welfare programs in fiscal year 2011 alone — a price tag that makes welfare that year the government’s largest expenditure, according to new data released by the Republican side of the Senate Budget Committee.

The total sum taxpayers spent on federal welfare programs was derived from a new Congressional Research Service (CRS) report on federal welfare spending — which topped out at $745.84 billion for fiscal year 2011 — combined with an analysis from the Republican Senate Budget Committee staff of state spending on federal welfare programs (based on “The Oxford Handbook of State and Local Government Finance”), which reached $282.7 billion in fiscal year 2011.

The data excludes spending on Social Security, Medicare, means-tested health care for veterans without service-connected disabilities, and the means-tested veterans pension program.

But never mind that. Let’s concentrate on the real issues.

Binders full of women!

Big Bird!

172 Responses to “Welfare Spending Jumps to Over $1 Trillion in 2011”

  1. You would expect some of this in a recession, so 2011-to-2007 comparisons should be up. But some of this (particularly food stamps) indicates a widespread easing of requirements rather than economic conditions. An administration can simply let the bureaucracy know that more leeway is to be granted and get vast expansion of programs. Congress needn’t be consulted, especially if there’s no budget.

    If you look into the rules for getting food stamps, it is remarkable that so many get them.

    Kevin M (bf8ad7)

  2. Honestly I really don’t expect Romney to do anything about this if he wins. I doubt he’ll even slow the growth.

    time123 (33ce8e)

  3. Food stamp eligibility is normally limited to those with minimal liquid assets, and limited to 3 months every 3 years for unemployed childless adults. However, these limits are currently being waived by the feds and most states. This has led to a sharp spike in food stamp eligibility, particularly the waiving of the 3 month cap.

    Kevin M (bf8ad7)

  4. Welcome to Michele Obama’s astounding recovery.

    SPQR (ae79c0)

  5. This is a racist dog whistle

    JD (3e4cef)

  6. This is truly sad. I didn’t realize that dependency spending was that high.

    Imagine all the great things $1 trillion could do. Imagine if we simply didn’t have a deficit and only minimal, for the truly desperate, welfare. Our children would be less dependent on government, because that world would have more prosperity and jobs.

    But it would have weaker politicians.

    They want us to need them.

    Dustin (73fead)

  7. time123, indeed Romney isn’t the kind of guy who would whack these programs, regardless of Obama’s lies. But Romney will have to work with Republican and conser ative Democrats in Congress. So we should see some trimming back to more sustainable levels. Obama and the Democrats have intentionally aimed the US at the cliff.

    SPQR (ae79c0)

  8. time123, indeed Romney isn’t the kind of guy who would whack these programs, regardless of Obama’s lies. But Romney will have to work with Republican and conser ative Democrats in Congress. So we should see some trimming back to more sustainable levels. Obama and the Democrats have intentionally aimed the US at the cliff.

    Comment by SPQR — 10/18/2012

    And as you know, Obama in his second term would only accelerate the growth in welfare spending even farther.

    I think Romney is unlikely to go as far as I want (and we need), but I think cuts are on his agenda. The moment I realized this was a possibility was when he picked Paul Ryan as his running mate.

    Dustin (73fead)

  9. Without changing a single law, but instead enforcing rules now waived, Romney could cut a number of these programs way back. Many were designed with cut-offs that limited benefits to the lower edge of the bell curve, but waivers have allowed the cut-off to move into the meat of the curve, exploding benefits. Marginal changes on some of these programs can have large results.

    For example, again enforcing the 3 month limit on food stamps for childless households would probably undo a lot of the recent explosion in that benefit.

    Kevin M (bf8ad7)

  10. _______________________________________

    Welcome to Michele Obama’s astounding recovery.

    But for the first time in her life, she’s at least proud of the US. And during a commemoration for 9-11, when she muttered “all this for a flag,” she at least had the good sense to not be caught live on microphone.

    She’s a class act.

    nydailynews.com: The First Lady broke debate rules Tuesday night when she clapped after a controversial exchange between moderator Candy Crowley and Mitt Romney. The illicit applause, shown in a video posted by Real Clear Politics, came after Crowley tried to correct the Republican presidential nominee as he slammed Barack Obama’s response to the Sept. 11 Benghazi attack.

    The rules read: “All members of the debate audience will be instructed by the moderator before the debate goes on the air and by the moderator after the debate goes on the air not to applaud…

    Mark (ece7bc)

  11. Comment by Mark — 10/18/2012 @ 8:44 am

    Mark, surely the lesson of the past four years is that there are certain people to whom the rules simply do not apply.

    JVW (f5695c)

  12. SPQR, you may be right…but if a politician won’t tell me what they’re planning to do with some specific detail I don’t have confidence that they’ll do it. Per Dustin we can guess what he might do base don his running mate but that’s more wishful thinking than anything else. All his incentives will be not to make cuts to programs.

    time123 (33ce8e)

  13. Per Dustin we can guess what he might do base don his running mate but that’s more wishful thinking than anything else.

    Honestly, you’re right. It’s just that I can’t do much more than hope for DC to start taking our deficit seriously. I’m sure there were Obama fans who hoped Obama was going to cut deficits and create all these new programs and more welfare as he promised. That seemed like a lie to me… he couldn’t keep both promises (and of course he hasn’t even tried to).

    I think at worst, Romney will be a moderate who preserves many entitlements and some welfare programs without making the cuts we need. I wishfully hope he is better than that. I don’t realistically expect a balanced budget (what we actually need) from either party any time soon.

    But I think that’s already enough to have a powerful reason to support Romney beating Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  14. ______________________________________________

    certain people to whom the rules simply do not apply.

    Li`mou`sine´ lib`er`al

    n. 1. a wealthy or well-to-do person of liberal political inclination. It is sometimes used as a term of contempt for those espousing the cause of poor people, without having to endure the discomfort that their policies may inflict on others, such as the lower middle class.

    champagne socialist

    n. a professed socialist who enjoys an extravagant lifestyle.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  15. This is truly sad. I didn’t realize that dependency spending was that high.

    Imagine all the great things $1 trillion could do

    Dustin, yep – I just cancelled a 6.84 million dollar indistrial project and a group I consult acted on my example and cancelled over 1.2 billion, in industrial projects

    We are disgusted with the elbowing to tax us rich industrialist.

    The project I cancelled would have more than bankrupted me for life and even though it would make money – the stress – just isnt worth it

    Romney is going to be worse than Obama on this number – ryan too.

    Its too bad this was almost 700 permanent good paying jobs that will never return.

    F$%K Romney, Ryan and their hey lets tax the crap out of industry bullSH*T

    Okay lets all think Obama is horrible – we all know that – I’m just wondering if he can be surpassed

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  16. Romney is a horrible mistake – we have another election where we are deluiding ourselves to 8 years of social engineering instead of 4 uyears of socialist engineering.

    No one has talked about cutting these programs – Romney wants to be president he just has no clue as to what to do. Ryan, confirmed to me he is a very well meaning guy who is an idiot.

    We have a horrible mistake trying to unseat a unmitigated disaster…

    Its like the snail riding on the turtle throwing his hands up and screaming wheeeee!

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  17. EPWJ, yours is another example of business not being able to make things happen because the policies during the Obama administration got in the way.

    You have provided a powerful reason to support Romney/Ryan.

    Dustin (73fead)

  18. And EPWJ, while I agree Romney is not as conservative as what this country needs, I’m not about to abandon this country. There is no alternative if we want to replace Obama. We need to be serious and pick the best candidate, who is now Romney.

    I was frustrated too when he was nominated, but I think he’s an obvious improvement over Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  19. Lets just pray the senate is ours and the leadership ignores Willard

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  20. I heard candidate Ted Cruz say that winning the WH and both houses of Congress would just be the beginning, that the more conservative folks would need to then keep fighting and pressure on the more status quo folks for significant reform.

    Of course, anybody who doesn’t claim allegiance to his Obamaness and the leftism for which he stands will also be fighting the press over the terrible deed of the day.

    I think simply saying OK to the Keystone pipeline, end the moratorium in the Gulf, and calling off the EPA hounds will be a boost to the economy which should help decrease those numbers to start.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  21. Dustin.

    I am, the arguments with Palin and her defenders in how a single person can convince government to confiscate private property like she did and paint it conservative has bothered many conservative business people for along time – and watch Romney and Ryan – who both I will contend have never ever created a job, watching them backtrack is more than disconcerting, as they take Palins example and are about to spread it to the rest of American industry

    I understand the move to the middle to win the election but everyone is banking he will move back to the right – a place neither has ever resided – but there will be no cuts just tax increases. They will eliminate deductions for business, they will eliminate my deductions all for risking everything to give people who I will employ to vote against me.

    My wife and I decided – hey let those people we were going to hire – let them pool their money get a loan, get a client, get a product and have a freakin go at it themselves

    That collectivism worked out great for Stalin

    Romney is unserious, Ryans unseriousness stems from his inability to grasp just exactly what it takes to succeed, with china, europe and those pesky Canadians stealing concepts, engineering, and customers wither through open espionage or through their own protectionistic governments.

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  22. Lets just pray the senate is ours and the leadership ignores Willard

    Comment by EPWJ — 10/18/2012

    It very well may be the case that if we’re blessed enough to win the Senate that the GOP will be constantly fighting against the moderate Republicans in order to actually accomplish something in the limited time they have with power.

    If they do not fix this government’s spending, they will not have power for long, but if they do manage to get things right, I think we’ll see so much prosperity that they will win hearts and minds of voters.

    It just takes some courage.

    Anyway, I’d sure rather our Senate and House have to convince Romney to get on board than to see them try to convince Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  23. __________________________________________

    Romney is going to be worse than Obama on this number – ryan too.

    Worse? Romney has plenty of squish in his history, but to saddle him and Ryan with an even greater amount of the ultra-liberal instincts of Obama seems disingenuous.

    Not quite sure what your MO is. Maybe you’re sort of a variation of Sybil, or schizoid in terms of ideology. I know you’ve gotten into tussles here with your support of liberals like Dede Scozzafava, so something doesn’t add up quite right.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  24. Romney wants to be president he just has no clue as to what to do. Ryan, confirmed to me he is a very well meaning guy who is an idiot.

    So, pray tell EPWJ, who do you think knows what to do and can pick a colleague who is not an idiot an who would that “not an idiot” be.

    Maybe we should just go ahead and elect Billy Ayers and Rev. Wright, let the country collapse into chaos, Billy’s millions of people die, and start over with a pristine nation getting it’s energy from hydrothermal power from “Old faithful”, while we study by candlelight the last printed editions of pre-Rosetta Stone teach yourself Chinese and Arabic.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  25. R.I.P. Sylvia Kristel, forever “Emmanuelle”

    Icy (a80d45)

  26. It would appear that the level of troll just got higher … *finally* !

    Demonising Romney isn’t working … so – plan B …

    Let’s see – it should go along the lines of “Obama SUX ! Sadly, Romney isn’t any better … how can we know that Romney will deliver on his campaign promises ?” – and other much gentler attempts to sow doubts about Romney …

    Thus – in this thread, see #2, #12, #15, and #16 …

    After sleeepy, tye, and The Emperor – don’t those four posts seem positively reasonable …

    We are in a major economic bind due to federal policies … we have the chance to elect a man who has experience and a track record of getting entities out of major economic binds … like the Winter Olympics …

    Please don’t lose sight of that …deciding *not* to vote for Romney, this time, might as well be an active vote for 4 more years of Obama …

    Alasdair (2cd241)

  27. Comment by Mark — 10/18/2012 @ 9:18 am

    Yes, EPWJ routinely spends a lot of time being quite reasonable, then does things like claiming Palin is the worst excuse there ever was for a Conservative.

    Lots of things I don’t know and lots of things I have to learn, but when people go all hyperbole negative when the only other option is about as good as shooting yourself in the head it is hard for me to take the person seriously.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  28. and watch Romney and Ryan – who both I will contend have never ever created a job,

    An objective lie

    JD (43ce10)

  29. – but there will be no cuts just tax increases

    Completely baseless

    JD (43ce10)

  30. For the last time, EPWJ is an idiot, not a troll!

    Icy (a80d45)

  31. Meanwhile, the leftist crusade to protect us all from the evils of rampant unchecked free speech continue unabated:
    AUSTIN, Texas (AP) – A Texas judge is expected to rule Thursday whether a group of cheerleaders should be allowed to continue quoting biblical scripture on banners at high school football games. District officials barred the Kountze High School cheerleaders from displaying banners with religious messages such as, “If God is for us, who can be against us,” after the Freedom From Religion Foundation complained. The advocacy group says the messages violated the First Amendment clause barring the government – or a publicly funded school district, in this case – from establishing or endorsing a religion.

    Icy (a80d45)

  32. That’s a shame, Icy. All that time and effort in our legal system, just to stop some kids from praising God at school.

    The left has been on a freedom from speech kick for some time now.

    Dustin (73fead)

  33. But, that can’t be.
    Everyone knows that the budget is driven by the Military-Industrial Complex, and that the deficit/debt is the result of Bush’s two wars paid for with a credit-card, and his giveaway to the Rich via tax-cuts for everyone.

    I’m confused…..Please, Snoozy/Pillman, ‘splain this to me!

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  34. _____________________________________________

    Here’s another person who’s going to be taking a trip on the government-funded gravy time. Except unlike a welfare recipient, he’s going to be able to ride it for the rest of his life.

    cnbc.com:

    From the standpoint of a public pension, Obama is well-heeled.

    As president, he will receive $191,300 annually for life — win or lose in next month’s election — and receives a travel allotment as well as mailing privileges. Should Obama lose, his presidential pension kicks in immediately after leaving office.

    Given that the president enjoys a normal life span, the pension allotment would be worth upwards of $6 million. In addition, Obama may be due a nice pension for the eight years he served in the Illinois Legislature as a state senator. Illinois is infamous for its lavish pension plan for former lawmakers.

    But what about Romney?

    His Individual Retirement Account could be worth in the neighborhood of $87 million, as documented in an extensive report from the Washington Post. But as for a strictly public pension? Zip, zero. Romney only served one term as governor of the Bay State and did not take a salary, so he is eligible for nothing.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  35. What kind of a Double-Dip will Biden receive – Senate + VEEP?

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  36. I labor under no illusions. Romeny will likely be statism if slower as opposed to Obama’s socialism.We can hope a conservative Congress forces his hand. There is much about Romney’s neocon advisors that gives me pause when it comes to foreign policy. Yet there is no question that on fiscal issues he would be far better. Because Obama has no plan at all. The status quo is insane.

    “Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner, speaking on behalf of the Obama White House, to Rep. Paul Ryan: ‘You are right to say we’re not coming before you today to say ‘we have a definitive solution to that long term problem.’ What we do know is, we don’t like yours. ‘”

    Nothing has changed since February.Obama’s campaign consists of Romney being the devil, paying for the birth control of 31-year old professional students(a task 15-year old boys have accomplished with little problem for almost a century by familiarizing themselves with the “Family Planning” aisle at their local CVS), and subsidizing muppets. The idea that we’re borrowing 40 cents of every dolalr of federal spending isn’t ever discussed.

    Bugg (234f77)

  37. Why do you think so many people are unemployed?

    Thanks George W. Bush and Republicans.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  38. F$%K Romney, Ryan and their hey lets tax the crap out of industry bullSH*T

    Huh?

    Did the Internet cross-link with Bizarro world again?

    Rob Crawford (e6f27f)

  39. And you nitwits accuse Liberals of being “hateful” and unbalanced…

    Tagg Romney Says He Wanted to ‘Swing’ At President Obama in Debate
    4 hrs ago – ABC News 2:09 | 136,414 views
    One of Mitt Romney’s sons let loose on how he really feels about the president.

    Spoiled little prick should crawl back into his gold-plated hole and STFU.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  40. For the last time, EPWJ is an idiot, not a troll!

    The sole distinction between the two is “active” vs. “passive”.

    Rob Crawford (e6f27f)

  41. Tillman — GFY.

    Rob Crawford (e6f27f)

  42. Tagg? What ever.

    Is there an Obama plan? Or is it simply more empty hope and change-and more debt?

    Bugg (234f77)

  43. “Tillman — GFY.”

    As soon as I get off your mother.

    [no more]

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  44. Tagg isn’t running for president, so the fact he resents his dad being called a liar by a liar is not a big deal.

    It’s instructive that Bush derangement and attacks on family are the only arguments for voting Obama lately. What happened to Big Bird?

    This is the reason Obama’s negatives are shooting up.

    Dustin (73fead)

  45. “Tagg? What ever.”

    Who raised Tagg?

    Who taught him to disrespect his superiors and elders?

    Who made him the spoiled little entitled prick that he is?

    And WHO THE HELL NAMED HIM???

    LOL.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  46. I guess we can write off MI:

    http://ricochet.com/main-feed/What-About-Michigan

    But PA is going Red because of the EPA.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  47. Who taught that aggression is the appropriate solution to dealing with people you disagree with?

    His parents Willard and the empty headed stay at home servile mother of his.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  48. Introspection and self-awareness are not amongst its strengths.

    JD (8a1df4)

  49. “Welfare Spending Jumps to Over $1 Trillion in 2011″

    You would cut off benefits to the people who have lost their jobs, their pensions, their livelihoods because of the greed and malfeasance of Bush and his Republican accomplices in raping America, like Romney.

    These people worked hard, paid their taxes, and you would deny then the right to receive the benefits that they accrued as US Citizens….just so the spoiled wealthy don’t have to pay a few more pct in income taxes.

    Sociopaths.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  50. _____________________________________________

    _________________________________________________

    Who taught that aggression is the appropriate solution to dealing with people you disagree with?

    If Obama had a son, it was his son, Trayvon Martin.

    Keep in mind that some of the rowdiest, meanest, cruelest behavior in America emanates from communities where just about everyone is of the left, just about everyone votes for the left.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  51. “Introspection and self-awareness are not amongst its strengths.”

    Agreed, Tagg et al., and others of his ilk, are among the most delusional among us.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  52. Let’s discuss who really raised Obama-his wack job mom, his commie grandparents, terrorist/spoiled brat Bill Ayers, commie Frank Marshall Davis, the loony Rev. Wright.Yes, let’s discuss the values our 44th President holds dear. Do you really want to go there?

    If you call the man’s dad a liar every day several times a day you aren’t going to engender warm feelings. Tagg did not act on those feelings. He obviously learned how to behave from his parents.

    Again, there is no plan other than to borrow more and spend more.

    Bugg (234f77)

  53. “Keep in mind that some of the rowdiest, meanest, cruelest behavior in America emanates from communities where just about everyone is of the left, just about everyone votes for the left.”

    I bet you can’t give even one example to support your prejudice…er, I mean claim.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  54. “He obviously learned how to behave from his parents.”

    Yep…short fuse, different set of rules, aggressive in response to slights of character and questioning of superior social position…agreed.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  55. Illman’s spittle-flecked hatred is always so enlightening.

    JD (8a1df4)

  56. “Illman’s spittle-flecked hatred is always so enlightening.”

    As is Tagg Romney’s.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  57. And Obama learned he could fall back on AA to cut the line when and where ever possible. And that actually accomplishing anything or working hard didn’t matter as long as you had a well-spoekn shopworn piece of liberal boilerplate to keep the leftist rubes happy to vote for a pleasant but empty suit. Obama-still voting present, still embracing the soft bigotry of low expectations.

    Bugg (234f77)

  58. nd you nitwits accuse Liberals of being “hateful” and unbalanced…

    Tagg Romney Says He Wanted to ‘Swing’ At President Obama in Debate
    4 hrs ago – ABC News 2:09 | 136,414 views
    One of Mitt Romney’s sons let loose on how he really feels about the president.

    Spoiled little prick should crawl back into his gold-plated hole and STFU.

    Comment by P. Tillman — 10/18/2012 @ 10:03 am

    While most reasonable people clearly understand Tagg was joking and yet felt defensive of his father (as most sons would), I am more concerned about a grown woman venting with “unbalanced hatefulness”,

    [Michelle Obama’s] pride visibly chafes at being asked to subsume her personality, to make herself seem duller and less independent than she is, even in the service of getting her husband elected President of the United States. In Wisconsin, I asked her if she was offended by Bill Clinton’s use of the phrase ‘fairytale’ to describe her husband’s characterisation of his position on the Iraq war. At first, Obama responded with a curt ‘No’. But, after a few seconds, she affected a funny voice. ‘I want to rip his eyes out!’ she said, clawing at the air with her fingernails. One of her advisers gave her a nervous look. ‘Kidding!’ Obama said. ‘See, this is what gets me into trouble.’

    So Tillman, should this Spoiled little prick have crawled back into her gold-plated hole and STFU.?? Are you an equal opportunity reactionary?? Or is it selective… as in (D) and (R)???

    Dana (292dcf)

  59. _______________________________________________

    I bet you can’t give even one example to support your prejudice…er, I mean claim.

    I’ve lived in neighborhoods and attended schools where I could observe the quirks of changing demographics up close and personal.

    In your case, I hope you’re not one of those kumbayah liberals (white or black, although in your case, I’m guessing you’re white) sequestered away in some generally protected little bubble, where talk is cheap and the going is easy.

    “It’s racist and non-populist to not support our local schools!” said Michelle Obama.

    “Honey, you’re right about that,” replied Barack.

    “Psst,” said Michelle. “Sweetheart, can you get applications for Sasha and Malia to attend that private school several miles away.”

    “Okay, dear,” sighed Barack. “My limousine liberalism makes my head spin.”

    Mark (ece7bc)

  60. “While most reasonable people clearly understand Tagg was joking”

    Translation:

    “Most reasonable people” = Wingnuts

    “Joking” = caught saying something they really believe. Just like everything that well-known comedian Rush Limbaugh says.

    Comedy (from the Wingnut dictionary): Any comment or statement that portrays your political enemies as subhuman, evil, amoral, or of the lower species and races. Displaying overt disgust or hatred for your political enemies. Any statement that is not factually accurate but conveys these ideas.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  61. P. Tillman,

    What did you think of Mrs. Obama’s comment? Did you think differently – that reasonable people of course knew she was joking – because she said she was??

    Dana (292dcf)

  62. “I’ve lived in neighborhoods and attended schools where I could observe the quirks of changing demographics up close and personal.”

    Still don’t get what you mean by “changing demographics” nor how this has anything to do with your comment about how “rowdiest, meanest, cruelest behavior in America” arises from “ommunities where just about everyone is of the left, just about everyone votes for the left.”

    Do these people have Democratic party bumper stickers on their cars?

    Do they have Democratic lawn signs?

    Do they openly discuss politics in public?

    Really, I’m not sure what connection you are trying to make.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  63. “Joking” = caught saying something they really believe.”

    All those typical white people, clinging to their guns and religion. (Employ Southern/inner city African-American accent here)And we all know that the Chocolate City got short-changed after Katrina because of…….

    Bugg (234f77)

  64. “What did you think of Mrs. Obama’s comment? ”

    I don’t like it…I don’t think its appropriate at all to convey the idea that physical aggression is an acceptable response to critics.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  65. “What did you think of Mrs. Obama’s comment? ”

    Now tell me why you believe that the Right thinks it’s ok.

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  66. I don’t like it…I don’t think its appropriate at all to convey the idea that physical aggression is an acceptable response to critics.

    Comment by P. Tillman — 10/18/2012 @ 10:46 am

    So, then you would have to agree that she, Spoiled little prick, should crawl back into her gold-plated hole and STFU, no? Because I don’t recall you saying that and reacting with such vehemence toward her.

    Dana (292dcf)

  67. Wow, the desperation in troll land is getting serious.

    Illman has obviously been given orders to up his posts, and apparently, dumb them down.

    The stupid, it smells of fear on the left.

    Keep pushin those binders and big bird illman, you are driving the undecideds to us in droves.

    Well played sir!!

    kinlaw (2fb87c)

  68. Dana – illman is blissfully self-unaware.

    JD (8a1df4)

  69. “So, then you would have to agree that she, Spoiled little prick, should crawl back into her gold-plated hole and STFU, no? ”

    Clearly her comments derive from a far different place than Tagg’s, who was raised in the protected cocoon of Mormonism and wealth and entitlement, unlike Michelle Obama.

    There is no moral equivalence, although I know Wingnuts love to play this game (all amoral people do).

    P. Tillman (fcbc8b)

  70. Isn’t it amusing when the tapeworm sues for peace and proceeds to dictate terms? As tho the host is expendable.

    In 2008 the Fed’s spent 7% of revenue on debt interest. Today it is 15%.

    Louis F. has already put us on notice whitey is not to try to take back Amerikkka, there will be trouble. And with the generales in his pocket he might suppose that he sits in the catbird seat.

    Guess again.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  71. People, stop responding to the Tagg non-issue. The full quote clearly shows he knows he can’t, and wouldn’t, do that.

    Funny, the left isn’t reporting the whole quote.

    He’s talking about feeling something we all feel on a weekly basis at least: the desire to punch some idiot in the nose.

    kinlaw (2fb87c)

  72. And please, just ignore it. It will eventually go away in a snit because we won’t respond.

    kinlaw (2fb87c)

  73. “For the last time, EPWJ is an idiot, not a troll!”

    Icy – Why can’t he be both?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  74. Translation:

    “Most reasonable people” = Wingnuts

    Tillman, I would say that “most reasonable people” would indeed include both the right and left. I think you’re being a bit unfair not everyone on the left is driven by histrionics.

    “Joking” = caught saying something they really believe. Just like everything that well-known comedian Rush Limbaugh says.

    Would you also include Chris Mathews and Ed Schultz in this assessment?

    Dana (292dcf)

  75. __________________________________________

    Displaying overt disgust or hatred for your political enemies.

    I don’t believe the following person is a devout conservative Republican.

    I think he’d have really hit the nail on the head if instead of talking about race, he mentioned the prevailing politics of the communities in question. Areas where over 90-plus percent of the populace is liberal, or favors liberal politicians, or acts like rock-ribbed Democrats.

    If leftism were a race or ethnicity, that really would be the only group that matters most to the left, or that really is the most revealing about why they’re the way they are. And the way they are is hardly flattering.

    BTW, I’m not aware of any large sub-section of American society where 90-plus percent of people are conservative, 90-plus percent are rock-ribbed Republican. Moreover, I’m not aware of any community that is that way, but which also is perennially screwed-up, both socially and economically, year after year, decade after decade, and yet remains staunchly rightwing/Republican.

    Washingtontimes.com, August 2011:

    [Philadelphia] Mayor Michael A. Nutter, telling marauding black youths “you have damaged your own race,” imposed a tougher curfew Monday in response to the latest “flash mob” — spontaneous groups of teens who attack people at random on the streets of the city’s tourist and fashionable shopping districts.

    “Take those God-darn hoodies down, especially in the summer,” Mr. Nutter, the city’s third black mayor, said in an angry lecture aimed at black teens. “Pull your pants up and buy a belt ‘cause no one wants to see your underwear or the crack of your butt.”

    “If you walk into somebody’s office with your hair uncombed and a pick in the back, and your shoes untied, and your pants half down, tattoos up and down your arms and on your neck, and you wonder why somebody won’t hire you? They don’t hire you ‘cause you look like you’re crazy,” the mayor said. “You have damaged your own race.”

    Mark (ece7bc)

  76. “Who taught that aggression is the appropriate solution to dealing with people you disagree with?”

    Petey – Do you mean like in 2008 Obama telling his supporters to get in his opponents faces?

    How about in 2009 sending out the SEIU purple people beaters to disrupt town hall meeting on health care reform? Recall the violence from those incidents?

    How about the Obama supported Occupy movement and all of its violence?

    You are a hapless moron who’s got nothing and always will be.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  77. Clearly her comments derive from a far different place than Tagg’s, who was raised in the protected cocoon of Mormonism and wealth and entitlement, unlike Michelle Obama.

    There is no moral equivalence, although I know Wingnuts love to play this game (all amoral people do).

    Comment by P. Tillman — 10/18/2012 @ 10:50 am

    Ah, you have just made a moral equivalence yourself.

    Michelle Obama was raised in a cocoon of familial and financial security in the South Shore Methodist Church, including regular vacations at a cabin in White Cloud, Michigan. As she herself observed, She was raised in what she describes as a “conventional” home, with “the mother at home, the father works, you have dinner around the table”.

    What you fail to see and understand, Tillman, is that it doesn’t matter where the commenters have come from because, Tillman, love is by its very nature, protective and sheltering toward ones precious to us. Both comments by Mrs. Obama and Tagg Romney reveal their love for spouse and father. Both made jokes that are reasonable and are a healthy loving expression of seeking to shelter and protect those they have great love for.

    Love doesn’t recognize wealth, color, or political party. It crosses all party lines, Tillman.

    Dana (292dcf)

  78. _________________________________________

    Do these people have Democratic party bumper stickers on their cars?

    Yea, right. Like it’s an unknown or obscure fact that voting habits and voter surveys of the black community have long indicated an overwhelmingly amount of liberalism, or leftism. And we’re not talking a small majority, or even a large majority, but an overwhelming one. After all, the statistics reflect a figure of over 90-plus percent. That means it’s tough to know where the dividing line between race and leftism begins and ends.

    That’s why if one wants a living laboratory to study and assess the full effects of liberalism — in a pure or absurd amount — any community where over 90-plus percent of the populace votes for and favors politicians and ideas of the left is a good place to start.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  79. So, pray tell EPWJ, who do you think knows what to do and can pick a colleague who is not an idiot an who would that “not an idiot” be.

    We have rafters of people who not only are proven, but are heads and tails above these guys. Ryan was a political calculation based on the concept that Ron Paul was going to be a 3rd party spoiler – so Romney has already made a major miscalculation.

    I can only imagine the outrage if Biden had been condesending and rude to a Heather Wilson, long time conservative, retired veteran than the general disrespect for Ryan naivety

    Romney is going to mean well and he’s going to overcompensate by showing the left he too can tax infudtrialists – who BTW Romney dislikes and has a distaste for.

    Overwhelmingly he is more comfortable with retailers – which is odd since retailers are 100% dependent on manufacturers for their existence.

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  80. Pillman @ 1018….

    Guess you missed this:
    SO IS THE SECRET SERVICE LOOKING INTO THIS? OR ARE THEY BUSY WITH CALL-GIRL STUFF? Post-presidential debate, Obama supporters renew vows to murder Mitt Romney.

    Posted at 12:42 am by Glenn Reynolds

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  81. The Flemish, economic engine of Belgium, 2/3 of the population in a country with public debt above 160% of GDP just voted out the Socialists after 60 years of rule.

    Belgium has only had a government for 6 mo. after going without one for two years.

    Spain will be breaking up, now Belgium, France is cratering, Greece’s largest employer, Coca Cola, is leaving and some of us expect either to go back to 2008 or to continue on as we are.

    Neither is a possiblility let alone an option.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  82. Comment by P. Tillman — 10/18/2012 @ 10:14 am

    A person who leaves that post thinks he/she has the moral standing to accuse anybody of anything?

    Obama’s buddy Ayers just wanted to kill, I’m sorry, have die, 20 million or so people to bring about their vision, young Romney simply has a desire to land a punch on somebody calling his father a liar.

    Hmmm, everybody that can relate to Obama’s buddy Ayers raise a hand, any hand; everybody that can relate to young Romney raise a hand, any hand.

    I don’t even have to see to count, I can hear the difference in the rushing breeze.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  83. ____________________________________________

    She was raised in what she describes as a “conventional” home, with “the mother at home, the father works, you have dinner around the table”.

    She’s leeched off the benefits of normative, stable, reassuring social-cultural trends — which some would label as conservative — yet she is no less liberal than if she were the product of a single, underaged, welfare-dependent mother.

    The latter at least has a bit of an excuse for suffering the effects of foolish, left-leaning biases and thinking, but what is Michelle’s excuse?

    She makes me think of the people who are known to flee from economically messed-up blue states, move to so-called red states, and then continue the idiocy of the liberal voting habits they had when still living in the part of the country they’ve left behind. Call it (or them) a form of ideological-political cancer.

    Mark (ece7bc)

  84. Comment by EPWJ — 10/18/2012 @ 11:09 am

    That was a political nonsense non-answer as good as any that any Democrat has ever given. If there are so many, name 5 while you’re at it.

    Oh, and make sure they are at least a little bit electable, since we are talking visible results here.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  85. Eob Crawford

    I guess when someone says hey I’m going to lower rates but eliminate loopholes – thats generally a tax increase

    whats wrong wuith just spending less – whats wrong with capping social security payments to the imagined amount someone actually contributed instead og a nearly 1000 minimum per month for 20 30 years? Add 500 per month per senior for medicare –

    How many of these paid in 10 years = 180,000 minimum in CASH benefits can we afford? Assuming people only live to 75

    If they live to 80 then its 270,000.

    If someone worked for 47 years from the age of 18 and retired at 65 then to put aside 180,000 for themselves they would have had have 1.15 million in lifetime income to age 65 and just live to 75. An Average of 25,000 per year every year of their life – a doable goal – if we didnt spend any of their contributions – whoops

    Problem is that at tht income bracket we dont charge them any SS due to EIC for many of those years especially if they have a family

    Watch Romney raise SS to 10% with no employer contribution but its a flat tax and also look for a 2% national sales tax

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  86. Belgium has only had a government for 6 mo. after going without one for two years.
    Comment by gary gulrud — 10/18/2012 @ 11:15 am

    Dag. as feets says, no one tells me anything. Any known quick link for a good overview of events, or a quick answer to how they held together without becoming a “failed state” like Somalia, Afghanistan, or possibly Libya?

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  87. I guess when someone says hey I’m going to lower rates but eliminate loopholes – thats generally a tax increase

    No, it is not.

    JD (8a1df4)

  88. No, I believe that lowering rates, and cutting loopholes (preferences) is, at worst, revenue-neutral; and, at best (see Tax Reform of 1986 and results), revenue-positive.
    It’s been done before, it isn’t Rocket-Science.

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  89. MD

    That was a political nonsense non-answer as good as any that any Democrat has ever given. If there are so many, name 5 while you’re at it

    Perry had a plan, Newt had a plan, Romney hand Ryan had rhetoric.

    Still have – the democrats are right they dont have a plan, honestly speaking to high level insiders in Romney’s camp – they are banking on another Clintonian run in the stock market fueld by massive drilling that bailed out Reagan when he opened the gulf

    Literally thats the plan – and I’m not criticising them, but they cant take the heat like Perry, Bachmann, Newt and others did. Romney caved in MA, he’ll cave in DC

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  90. Still have – the democrats are right they dont have a plan, honestly speaking to high level insiders in Romney’s camp –

    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

    JD (8a1df4)

  91. 85. Eob Crawford

    Comment by EPWJ — 10/18/2012 @ 11:20 am

    That’s all I bothered to read.
    I didn’t ask for a policy description, you said there were “rafters” of people who would be better, so after your non-answer I asked for 5, at least a little bit electable.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  92. 86. The short answer to their survival is that Brussels is home to the Economic Union government.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  93. Just declare yourself a Libertarian, since it is obvious that, in your eyes, the Perfect is the only objective; and you’ll never settle for the Good.

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  94. 93 is a response to 89.

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  95. Romney and Ryan cant say no, cant slap down silly manchilds like Biden and Obama, how are they going to stand firm, close government, face down the infidels, like GWB, Reagan, Nixon, etc.

    This is not a time to measure the draps, its time to take a measure of what America means

    And its definitely not Romney Ryan or Obabidenation

    A social butterfly running against a socialist…

    Great…

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  96. AD

    Perfect? Romney a democrat always has been – ran only as a repubican because he wanted to get rid of ted

    only because of ted he’s a republican

    Heck Id settle for – anyone but Romney against Obama

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  97. Comment by gary gulrud — 10/18/2012 @ 11:26 am

    Thanks. So in one way, as a very gross first approximation, it’s like saying Virginia is without a government for 2 years. There is enough local government and over-arching structure to maintain some order. Not to mention Belgians are Belgians and haven’t been too tribal based for a few hundred years, I guess. And they have good chocolate to eat and beer to drink.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  98. P. Tillman,

    Bro, you know your man is going to lose the election. You’re obviously angry about it. Go have a drink, man. Maybe that will calm your nerves—but probably not !

    Elephant Stone (65d289)

  99. Why do you think so many people are unemployed?
    Thanks George W. Bush and Republicans.
    Comment by P. Tillman — 10/18/2012 @ 10:02 am

    WASHINGTON (AP) – Weekly applications for U.S. unemployment benefits jumped 46,000 last week to a seasonally adjusted 388,000, the highest in four months.

    — But, but . . . Boooooooooooooooosssh!!!!!!11!!!!

    Icy (a80d45)

  100. The discussion is that Romney is changing the tax codes – and it isnt for job creators.

    speaking and listening in, the sense I’m getting is Mitt is going to promise whatever to get the job and like Reagan, is going to watch the stock market fuel the recovery – which it always does.

    Remember the cost cutting – Remember pats post that they only agreed to what 18 billion?

    With Romney the democrat, look for that trillion dollar deficit to be a norm

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  101. Perry had a plan

    — Yeah, but then he forgot it.

    Icy (a80d45)

  102. 82. “moral standing”

    The ‘rents were born in ’28 and ’29. It is amazing simply to consider the mettle of their older brothers and sisters, coming of age in the depression, enduring WWII and then building the America we fondly remember.

    Anyone cut from the same cloth?

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  103. If Obama wins, I am going rogue and applying for every handout I can find.

    Rodney King's Spirit (9ce6d4)

  104. Comment by Icy — 10/18/2012 @ 11:32 am

    But somehow the Unemployment rate will still go down.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  105. And please, just ignore it. It will eventually go away in a snit because we won’t respond.

    Comment by kinlaw — 10/18/2012

    +1

    Dustin (73fead)

  106. Comment by Rodney King’s Spirit — 10/18/2012 @ 11:39 am

    Some will move to Texas, and Montana and ND will merge. N. Dakota will become the richest country per capita in the world, selling oil to the US, then with less than 57 states.
    :-)

    Note to J. Napolitano- No, I am not advocating any armed rebellion.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  107. Look, I’m just trying to prepare you guys for hell, its goingto be hell, projections o fuel look horrendous. As Pat, JD and DRJ have pointed out Daleyrocks too, that things are bad for many reasons 99% Obama related – but reversing these is a job for Someone – that someone isnt running – that type of personality isnt apparent.

    Prepare yourselves financially, and emotionally for 8 years of the same not the last four years of the same

    EPWJ (e83e82)

  108. _____________________________________________

    “rowdiest, meanest, cruelest behavior in America” arises from “ommunities where just about everyone is of the left, just about everyone votes for the left.”

    Keep in mind that the following involves the type of suspects that the media (supposedly into the “who, what, when, where, why and how” of a story [snerk!]) consistently refuses to identify or describe beyond gender. But both the victim and the attackers are from a demographic that — based on surveys and election results — is overwhelmingly, absurdly, ludicrously of the left.

    If anyone notes the irony in what apparently triggered the attacks — in this age of Obama, GLBT and same-sex marriage, and yet the incident not (repeat: not) involving “rednecks,” please do so.

    baltimore.cbslocal.com, October 17, via drudgereport.com:

    Police search for two men after a brazen attack on an Maryland Transit Administration (MTA) bus. A teenager was beaten repeatedly and she says no one on the bus did anything to stop it.

    The attack happened last month on a crowded MTA bus. Nineteen-year-old student Ernestine Parker says she took a seat and was heading home. Parker says for no reason, two young men started punching and kicking her.

    “The bus was real packed and the men just started jumping on me, just fighting me. And I couldn’t really defend myself,” she said.

    Ernestine Parker says she doesn’t know her attackers but she believes she was targeted because of her appearance. “They thought I was a gay man on the bus,” she said. “That’s exactly what it was. I tell people I’m not going to change myself. I’m not going to change how I dress or anything. Because see, I know that I’m still a female. And I still carry myself like a female.”

    Mark (ece7bc)

  109. Clearly her comments derive from a far different place than Tagg’s, who was raised in the protected cocoon of Mormonism and wealth and entitlement, unlike Michelle Obama.

    There is no moral equivalence, although I know Wingnuts love to play this game (all amoral people do).

    Oh, please, please, please expand on this. Please explain to us exactly what you mean by this. The depths of moral depravity revealed by this little excerpt are just incredible. By all means explain how Michelle Obama’s comfortable and conventional background excuses her using violent rhetoric, but somehow Tagg having rich parents means he shouldn’t want to take a swing at someone who publicly abuses and lies about his father as 0bama did.

    Milhouse (454b9e)

  110. In retrospect I can see where the election of lying, duplicitous Shrillary in 2008 would have been better for the country than either McCain or Obama. So I guess EPWJ reasons four more years of Choom is better alternative than Romley. Only I’m not buying it. I already voted absentee for GOP. Assuming Mittens wins, how muh damage will O wreak in 3 1/2 weeks? Could GOP prevent a far left replacement for Ginsberg?

    calypso louis farrakhan (c3e31b)

  111. Milhouse, one thing I took away from his comment was that he thinks Michelle Obama can’t be held to the standard of other people, because of her background. He seems to have some bigotry issues not only against Ms Obama but also against “the protected cocoon of Mormonism”, whatever that means.

    This is typical of lefty trolls. The left has divided us into competing interest groups. Race, sex, religion, etc. All so we can vie for government goodies in a way that ultimately empowers politicians.

    Dustin (73fead)

  112. Correction- months. And how much does soros pay you trolls and mobys?

    calypso louis farrakhan (7ba7bb)

  113. Anybody with a Y chromosome and anybody that ever knew someone with a Y chromosome should understand the urge to throw a punch in protection of someone they cared about.

    Hey, even Jackson Browne, a well known conservative entertainer (not) wrote a song about getting in a fight defending someone he didn’t even know.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  114. Just declare yourself a Libertarian

    EPWJ is anything but a libertarian; he’s the worst of big business entitlement, upset at actual libertarians and conservatives who refuse to acknowledge that the GOP is the rightful property of big business. He’s not interested in free enterprise, he’s interested in preserving special privileges for Big Oil. That’s why the prospect of lowering rates and eliminating deductions of dubious fairness has him in such a tizzy. He’d rather have a Democrat than a Republican who’s not in awe of Big Oil.

    Milhouse (454b9e)

  115. Comment by Icy — 10/18/2012 @ 11:32 am

    Also, UE is increasing in MA.
    It’s all Gov. Romney’s fault….Oh, wait….

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  116. Perfect? Romney a democrat always has been – ran only as a repubican because he wanted to get rid of ted

    Yes, Romney is best seen as a very moderate Democrat. Which makes him a whole lot better than 0bama, Clinton, or pretty much any actual Democrat who might have a shot at the presidency. And he’s running with Ryan, who is a true blue Republican. I was very far from thrilled when Romney spoke about imposing tariffs on Chinese goods; as far as I’m concerned if you don’t believe in free trade you’re not a Republican. But when the alternative is 0bama it’s not even a question.

    Milhouse (454b9e)

  117. Note to J. Napolitano- No, I am not advocating any armed rebellion.

    And if you were? The first amendment recognises and protects our God-given right to advocate armed rebellion. As the Supreme Court made clear when it struck down the anti-communism laws.

    The only reason I’m not advocating armed rebellion is because I don’t believe it could succeed, and it would be criminal to waste all those lives for nothing. If it could succeed, and we despaired of achieving liberty in any peaceful way, then I believe we would have a moral duty to start one. Compared to what we put up with today, the list of grievances in the Declaration of Independence appear picayune.

    Milhouse (454b9e)

  118. things are bad for many reasons 99% Obama related – but reversing these is a job for Someone – that someone isnt running

    That is the point, and nothing else matters. The only decent candidate on the national ballots this year is Ryan, and he’s not running for president. And even he’s rather more moderate than is called for, but nobody to his right would be electable.

    Milhouse (454b9e)

  119. EPWJ back to concern trolling.

    SPQR (ae79c0)

  120. Comment by Milhouse — 10/18/2012 @ 12:11 pm

    Well, he’s a Liberaltarian!

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  121. Why have an Armed Rebellion?

    It’s called PAYBACK!

    And, in the remote chance that you succeed, it’s called REVOLUTION!

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  122. I see teh illthing has hijacked another thread. Banstick should be judiciously applied.

    Media Mutters (721840)

  123. And even he’s rather more moderate than is called for, but nobody to his right would be electable.

    It’s not that he’s too moderate, Milhouse. It’s that he recognizes what is politically viable and has staked out the best we can achieve right now.

    That’s impressive to me. It’s much easier for a politician in the House to take a hard line that is never going to result in any improvements. Ryan’s pragmatic position is what makes him dangerous to the entrenched spenders.

    EPWJ back to concern trolling.

    Comment by SPQR — 10/18/2012

    I do believe his intention is to reduce enthusiasm for the GOP ticket. Which is sad, considering how serious it is that Obama lose in 20 days.

    Most of us didn’t have Romney at the top of our list, but that would be true no matter who we nominated. the party picked someone, and he’s better than Obama, and we need to be enthusiastic about this election. Turnout is the deciding factor. We can complain about Romney’s shortcomings when they appear during his administration. We can hold his feet to the fire much better than we’d ever with Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  124. “I do believe his intention is to reduce enthusiasm for the GOP ticket.”

    I agree with that in epwj’s case; that’s what concern trolling is all about.

    Now, as to illman, I have no idea what he is trying to accomplish; I’m sure he thinks he is helping the leftist cause, although g*d knows how. Every line he is using is helping drive the undecideds towards R&R.

    kinlaw (2fb87c)

  125. I will go this far with PeeWee, Economic Reset is inevitable at this point. If the US were an island unto itself, maybe a way out could be found.

    But we are not. Our banks exposure to EU sovereign and bank debt is according to Nor Luap $1.5 Trillion. Their one and only out is for the ECB to backstop that debt at higher interest rates than US debt, and we’re off to the races.

    On the bright side they won’t have time enough to make that work. Greeks and Spaniards watching their ribs pop out will not let them. And their combined default totals $500 Billion just to start the global cascade of defaults.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  126. Gary, I think your vision of the future is pretty realistic, but just imagine if all the weight of this tremendous, enormous government was lifted off this economy.

    All we need is the will to make it happen (through the political process). All Europe needs is America showing them the way and not carrying their weight.

    We really can have a stable global economy if governments are put back into a limited role.

    Dustin (73fead)

  127. 124. I think Tilly’s plan, so to speak, is to frighten us into thinking methadone and thorazine shortages will bring our way of life to an end.

    We will not be able to go out in the evenings or or to lunch at noon without running the gaunlet of toothless pan handlers and indigents selling Chicklets.

    What he doesn’t get is a lot of us white folk don’t have cash in our pocket but 1 day in ten, don’t know our pin numbers for lack of use and have cut up our credit cards. There is no money.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  128. 126. Oh I agree, most of us will live thru the hard times, the system will end but the loss of life will not be shattering.

    A second Continental Congress is at the other end of our trouble.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  129. Hey, even Jackson Browne, a well known conservative entertainer (not) wrote a song about getting in a fight defending someone he didn’t even know.
    Comment by MD in Philly — 10/18/2012 @ 12:00 pm

    — Yeah, Daryl Hannah said something mean about a stranger . . .

    so he beat her ass.

    Icy (a80d45)

  130. Poll aggregators take another step:

    http://www.examiner.com/slideshow/rcp-averages

    Real Clear now gives Willard the EV lead 206-201.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  131. 130. BTW, Real Clear doesn’t seem to be paying attention to the fact that two states award EV by district and Maine will be giving one to Willard.

    207-200, with CO, FL and VA out of Ogabe’s reach make that 258-200.

    Put Axelrod on suicide watch.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  132. Just think what a simple announcement on the freeing up of the permit process for on/off shore federal exploration/drilling permits, coupled with permitting the Keystone-XL pipeline, and a muzzling of the enviro-whackos within the EPA would do to the international price of oil?
    (example: Oil futures dropped like a rock when GWB announced a freeing-up of off-shore lands in the Summer of ’08)
    Couple that with a clawback of whatever the govt could get of all of the unspent Stim $’s, and the shutting-off of the Fed presses.
    It might get a little uncomfortable for a few quarters, but what have you got to lose when UE is already at 8% (posted – most likely 14%+)?
    Then, Congress has to repeal ObamaCare, and FrankenDodd, totally.
    At that point, serious grown-ups in the Congress can sit down and decide what problems actually have to be covered by Federal Legislation, and what should be left to the States, or just ignored (Silent Cal: When you see ten problems coming down the road, just wait a while, most of them will veer one way or the other and disappear; then you can decide how to handle the serious one or two that remain. – paraphrase).

    The Federal’s have to get out of the way of investment and job creation –
    AND STOP SPENDING SO MUCH F…ING MONEY THEY DON’T HAVE!

    AD-Restore the Republic/Obama Sucks! (b8ab92)

  133. After several weeks of almost non-stop and hysterical concern trolling around the time Ryan was selected, Eric has been blessedly pretty quiet recently. (Like while most of the polls were heavily favoring the President’s re-election.) Now that the tide has turned for Romney and the president is struggling in many important states, heeeeeere’s EPWJ back to tell us how horrible he thinks Mitt is.

    You can draw your own conclusions. I drew my own conclusions about this particular commenter’s motives and honesty weeks ago –and they have just been reinforced today.

    elissa (5ee50f)

  134. Well we knew Bubba was voting Romany but still what was the WH thinking?

    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/10/bill-clinton-romneys-argument-is-true-obama-hasnt-fixed-country-its-not-fixed-video/

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  135. 133. Speaking for myself, I am encouraged by what I’m hearing from Romany, enough to think Tagg may have become his closest, most trusted advisor.

    So backbiting is not in order. OTOH, noises like “he was the only electable Republican” this late in the day are risible.

    Willard did great in the first debate but others would have done as well, and proven as likeable. The game changer was Amerikkka seeing what a useless ph*ck Barry was when the chips were down.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  136. “EPWJ back to concern trolling.”

    SPQR – I don’t know, the awesomeness of Rick Perry’s optional tax plan was truly a wonderment to behold. He actually BOGO’d the tax code. For taxpayers making less than $500,000 you could choose between paying under the existing tax rules or under Perry’s new optional flat tax rate of 20% which preserved many of the same deductions. Of course to figure out which one to choose, you would have to calculate your liability under each. So instead of one new simplified tax system, Perry was proposing maintaining two separate tax systems for people to game.

    It was a stroke of pure genius.

    Don’t get me started on Cut, Balance and Grow.

    The butthurt is deep in EPWJ.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  137. For taxpayers making less than $500,000 you could choose between paying under the existing tax rules or under Perry’s new optional flat tax rate of 20% which preserved many of the same deductions. Of course to figure out which one to choose, you would have to calculate your liability under each. So instead of one new simplified tax system, Perry was proposing maintaining two separate tax systems for people to game.

    But one of these systems was dead simple, so administering it would be easy. It would reduce the workload on the taxpayers (most of whom could opt for the simple one) and probably on the IRS. Think about the most complex tax at your workplace. If you still had to do it 5% of the time, but 95% of the time it was replaced with something easy and effective, would this be a bad thing?

    Saying we would have to calculate our liability under both is probably not true for the vast majority of taxpayers. I know I could just rely on the flat rate, and wouldn’t need to look at the old system.

    Perry was proposing maintaining two separate tax systems for people to game.

    If people take the lowest tax liability available, they are just following the law. It’s not gaming the system.

    This proposal avoids scare tactics that this is a ‘massive tax hike on the middle class’. After all, if it’s so bad, just opt for the old system. The only talking point remaining is class warfare.

    After a while, when we realize the simpler code is actually much better, we can end the old code, saving money. Baby steps. Rick Perry didn’t balance the Texas budget in one swoop. It took a lot of 2%, 4%, 6% cuts here and there. That’s what I like about Romney’s PBS point. It’s not pretending to be the solution. It’s just a step towards a goal.

    This is long term leadership. I think many of Perry’s proposals, such as the $10k degree, are insightful and realistic. In fact, Texas State University has a $10k degree program now. This is going to catch on.

    The butthurt is deep in EPWJ.

    I had the same thought. Why attack Perry? He’s endorsed Romney. Be more magnanimous and help Perry and Romney keep this party together so we can beat Obama. I think the reason you’ve attacked Perry was largely because you wanted to irritate EPWJ. Is there any other possible explanation in this thread? Is he intentionally seeking that kind of reaction? If we didn’t fall for this BS, Axelrod would have to make it up.

    Dustin (73fead)

  138. Think about the most complex tax at your workplace.

    I meant ‘task’, not ‘tax’. Sheesh.

    Dustin (73fead)

  139. The pollster that days ago abandoned FL, NC and VA as lost to Down Low:

    http://washingtonexaminer.com/poll-shows-romney-leading-in-blue-pennsylvania/article/2511153#.UICHI-xPE1o

    Rasmussen is guessing OH will be D+3 on election day. Was D+0 in 2004 with Booosh winning by 3.

    They will both go Romany and we’ll be in bed 11:30 EST.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  140. “It would reduce the workload on the taxpayers (most of whom could opt for the simple one) and probably on the IRS.”

    Dustin – No, it would self-evidently not. Any interested taxpayer would calculate their liability under both systems to make sure they were paying the lowest legal liability. The IRS would have to keep two code systems updated on a yearly basis for inflationary adjustments and legal changes. To the extent a taxpayer had discretionary income or deductions available under the complex existing system which were not advantageous under the flat tax system, it encourages taxpayers to time or game their income and deductions and switch back and forth between the systems. Nothing illegal about it. If the goal is simplicity, Perry’s proposal did not achieve it.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  141. “I had the same thought. Why attack Perry?
    I think the reason you’ve attacked Perry was largely because you wanted to irritate EPWJ.”

    Dustin – Why not ask EPWJ reemerging to reprise his attacks on Romney instead? Is there a purpose there apart from EPWJ being a sore loser? I view EPWJ as an economic illiterate. He claimed Romney’s plan would not work and that Republicans should have supported someone with a plan that would have worked – guess who. That person’s tax plan, as I described above, is a joke. Feel free to disagree.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  142. Ace on the Jon Stewart interview:

    “you get the feeling Obama’s chief problem with the deaths of these men is the impact they have on the campaign”

    Yes, Amerikkka, he really isn’t into you.

    gary gulrud (dd7d4e)

  143. “watch the stock market fuel the recovery – which it always does.”

    Funny, didn’t work out that way for Obama.
    His stock market is up, but that’s just because he’s inflated the currency and the Dow is tracking that.

    luagha (5cbe06)

  144. And we have so much to show for that one trillion!

    SAT scores up, poverty eradicated, single motherhood a thing of the past, meaningful jobs galore.

    Patricia (e1d89d)

  145. All you need to know how bad the Obama campaign is going is that they are sending Ol’Hairplugs to the very blue Minnesota.

    Bugg (642d2d)

  146. Correction-it’s Mrs. Biden.

    Bugg (642d2d)

  147. Why not ask EPWJ reemerging to reprise his attacks on Romney instead?

    Because I expect less from him, to be honest. He’s a concern troll. Let’s not be trolled.

    Dustin (73fead)

  148. “Because I expect less from him, to be honest.”

    Dustin – He is not honest, that’s true, which is why I felt compelled to correct him about Perry’s tax plan. Having two tax systems is not better than one.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  149. Put Axelrod on suicide watch.

    Comment by gary gulrud

    “suicide watch”?!?! Judging by his color, that poor man has been dead for approximately 2 1/2 weeks. To this point, the forensic pathologists have been unable to determine the exact time of death because the man is so repellant that even insects avoid him.

    Colonel Haiku (00b186)

  150. Having two tax systems is not better than one.

    To each his own, but I’d much rather see us change to a simpler system, and I think Perry had a good proposal towards getting there that would eliminate most of the democrat criticisms in a pretty clever way.

    It’s not ideal, I agree. Just replacing our tax code with the simpler flat tax would be much better. But I think Perry recognizes that actually getting there requires this kind of path.

    I didn’t agree with every aspect of Perry’s flat tax. I don’t think we need a mortgage tax exemption, for example. I do think cut balance and grow is a great option for younger Americans who don’t want to give away their social security contributions, but would rather own them.

    I think our social security system is a pyramid scheme that robs the future, and while Perry’s proposal would need tweaking, it was a great conversation starter for those who want a frank look at some of our problems.

    Romney will, no doubt, be a huge improvement over Obama, and it will be far easier to realize any reforms if the GOP has to pass bills by his administration than it would be with Obama. I hope Romney is more than that, and does not preserve our current entitlement crisis. I could offer reasons why I’m not hopeful, but I also could offer reasons why I am hopeful. But since Romney is a no brainer improvement over Obama, it’s not really relevant, and we’ll have to wait and see.

    But I think if you give Perry’s proposals another look, free of the drama of the primary, you might find some of his ideas are not so bad after all.

    Dustin (73fead)

  151. All you need to know how bad the Obama campaign is going is that they are sending Ol’Hairplugs to the very blue Minnesota.

    Comment by Bugg — 10/18/2012 @ 5:14 pm

    All you need to know how bad the Obama campaign is going is that they are sending Ol’Hairplugs to the very blue Minnesota Las Vegas Nevada.

    FIFY

    peedoffamerican (ee1de0)

  152. And if you were? The first amendment recognises and protects our God-given right to advocate armed rebellion. …
    Comment by Milhouse — 10/18/2012 @ 12:28 pm
    If I were I would want a bigger budget for legal help than I currently have…

    – Yeah, Daryl Hannah said something mean about a stranger . . .
    so he beat her ass.

    Comment by Icy — 10/18/2012 @ 2:08 pm
    I have no clue what you are referring to, but as it was a pretty tangential thought referencing a song I haven’t heard for at least 30 yrs, it doesn’t matter that much to me.

    I’ll comment that I see very few Obama signs and bumper stickers around as I drive through my section of Philly and the Northern suburbs. In fact, I bet 95%+ of the few Obama signs I do see are linked with a local Congressman for reelection. I don’t know if that means they think Philly is going to go so slanted for Obama not to bother here, or if it is an indication of how low the enthusiasm is.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  153. daleyrocks, it would mean three tax systems. We already have two remember … tax and AMT.

    MD in Philly, I’m seeing few Obama/Biden signs in my neighborhood, which normally runs a bit Democratic (we have a GOP state assemblyman, a Democratic state senator, and a Democratic Congressman). Hilariously, I was visiting a rental property we own, which is vacant, and I kicked off the local DNC twit who was trying to plant a set of Democrat signs in my yard. Dirty SOB.

    SPQR (768505)

  154. Dustin,

    eh – Romneys not a conservative – what are your epectations of him?

    EPWJ (2925ff)

  155. Seriously – what is Romney’s tax plan – he’s been running for SIX years non stop and he still doesnt have a plan other to say he’s amking sure my six figure tax bill is still six figures?

    Terrific!!!

    But the socialite is marginally better than a socialist I grant you that

    EPWJ (2925ff)

  156. Seriously – what is Romney’s tax plan – he’s been running for SIX years non stop and he still doesnt have a plan other to say he’s amking sure my six figure tax bill is still six figures?

    LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

    There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

    JD (8a1df4)

  157. JD

    So what is his plan JD, spell it out?

    EPWJ (2925ff)

  158. Are you incapable or unwilling to listen to Romney and Ryan explain it?

    JD (8a1df4)

  159. eh – Romneys not a conservative – what are your epectations of him?

    Comment by EPWJ — 10/18/2012

    Romney, like my favored Rick Perry, is a politician. Neither of these guys are perfect. Perry was poor on the stage, and Romney has been pretty awesome in stage. I think that has come in handy towards achieving priority one.

    My expectations of Romney:

    1: to take the government’s foot off the gas pedal of expansion, from food stamps to spending generally.

    2: to use his considerable experience running things to use in having an administration that isn’t a disaster. Fast and Furious and Benghazi’s weird mixed narratives, the Opsec failures surrounding the Bin Laden raid… etc… I think a lot of the problem here is that Obama is unable to run this complicated machine of a government. I expect Romney will be more competent.

    3: fewer liberal judicial appointments. I will be surprised if I get the kinds of appointments I want, but Romney’s appointments so far include Paul Ryan, so I think he will at worst have an average appointment record. This is a huge improvement that will have consequences for the rest of my life.

    ——–

    On taxes specifically, I expect Romney will not end the Bush era tax cuts, and I am hopeful that he will also significantly cut the corporate tax rate. The rest of Romney’s proposals I am not expecting to actually occur, through no fault of Romney, but because politicians tend to give and take. I don’t expect any progress towards a flat tax, which I’ve wanted for a long time.

    Bottom line: we do not have a taxing problem so much as we have a spending problem anyway. I expect Romney will pass budgets and I expect that the deficit will go down. That’s a great reason for Perry supporters to get enthusiastic about beating Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  160. He’s concerned.

    SPQR (768505)

  161. And Romney is plenty more conservative than Dede Scozzafava.

    Dustin (73fead)

  162. Dustin,

    you are projecting – hoping – you have to look at his reccord and what he’s saying.

    JD

    I have listened to a big bag of pie in the sky nonsense like Ryans plan to balance by 2103 (I was orginally hoping Ryan misspoke but he did say 2103)

    geeezus

    romney wont gice specifics still hasnt since
    Perry asked him

    EPWJ (2925ff)

  163. a big bag of pie in the sky nonsense

    Something you are quite familiar with.

    JD (8a1df4)

  164. If Romney-Ryan can reduce the tax rate while reducing actual spending, they could balance the budget way before 2103 or 2020.

    What everyone forgets, and the media continually ignore, is that what Washington calls cuts in spending is not actually cuts in anything. Baseline cuts are meaningless in stopping the growth in government. Actual cuts will have to made to slow our steady slide to EU-like problems.

    Ag80 (b2c81f)

  165. Meh. Perry gave specifics and all it got him was carping about the flaws in his plan. No plan is perfect, after all.

    And no plan stays unchanged when the legislative process begins. Specifics are pretty much a fiction.

    I have heard plenty of specifics about Romney’s tax proposal, but I don’t take them as more than a general intention, because a lot of that will be changed in committees and backrooms.

    you have to look at his reccord

    If I wanted to, I could cover a long list of issues in Romney’s record I disagree with. But he’s better than Obama, and now is the time for Republicans to unite and enthusiastically beat Obama.

    Dustin (73fead)

  166. Here’s Romney’s key qual from his record: he hasn’t screwed up the largest economy in the world.

    SPQR (f804ad)

  167. “But I think if you give Perry’s proposals another look, free of the drama of the primary, you might find some of his ideas are not so bad after all.”

    Dustin – I looked again tonight before commenting to refresh my memory, thanks.

    I thought you wanted to stop talking about Perry and unite behind Romney. The best way to do that is to stop talking about people who are no longer running and stop feeding the troll. Heed your own advice.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  168. SPQR–he’s near the top of the concern-o-meter

    elissa (5ee50f)

  169. I thought you wanted to stop talking about Perry and unite behind Romney.

    There is no contradiction between positively talking about Perry and supporting Romney, who at this point is the most conservative candidate who can beat Obama.

    It’s just consistency. I always passionately support the most consistent conservative who I think can win, particularly on the issue of balanced budgets.

    The best way to do that is to stop talking about people who are no longer running and stop feeding the troll. Heed your own advice.

    When I explain my disagreement with EPWJ’s concern troll shtick, I use reasoning instead of insults. I think this method actually deflates the concern trolling, because it makes EPWJ’s BS a convenient segue to arguments that prove that conservatives should unite and beat Obama, even if the nominee has some flaws.

    I’ve learned through my own errors that the sore and personal approach is genuinely feeding the troll, and the reasoned one is actually deflating the troll.

    Dustin (73fead)

  170. Two very recent New York Times articles:

    The Disability Trap

    Discussion of Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security programs has been at the forefront of election-year debate. But there has been no discussion of S.S.I. The fact is that expenditures for the S.S.I. program are rising while the economic status of disabled people is on the decline.

    The very program that is supposed to be their safety net is actually the source of the problem, experts say. S.S.I. traps many disabled people by limiting their income to levels just above the poverty line, and taking away their cash benefits if they achieve any level of security….

    ….He now receives a monthly check for $506 through the S.S.I. program, and he is allowed to earn $85 more. (He also receives some assistance toward his rent and food expenses.) Once he surpasses the $85, his benefit check will be reduced by $1 for every $2 he earns. And if his income reaches $1,097 a month, he will no longer be eligible for any cash S.S.I. benefits at all. So he must be poor or he must give up all government support. Mr. Crelia is never permitted to have more than $2,000 in the bank, a restriction that places the trappings of a middle-class life — a car, a modest home, a family — far out of reach.

    Weighing the Odds of Disability, for Insurance Purposes

    Sammy Finkelman (d22d64)

  171. ebt baby you and me girl

    happyfeet (9011eb)


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