Message Sent to Ali Akbar: Resign or It All Comes Out
Here is the message, which Ali put on Pastebin:
“Yo, Ali, you are a liar– you did a years long crime wave, and there is more going to come out. You fucked me over three years ago, and you are getting your dues now. Dude, you need to resign and go off and hide. Man, the Feds gonna expand their investigation into your crime wave. And you know what I am talking about. I do feel sorry for Mama Lydia, but for you to invoke her on your FB page is disgusting. She is not proud to have a felon turned Uncle Tom and she has told you that many times. If you don’t resign, this is going to keep dribbling out and will cross into what you did in other states, and involve drugs — yeah, come on Ali, it was not just some booze. And it could bring down others close to you and you know what I am talkin about. Remember those pictures, or were you too stoned to remember. Well, I remember and I’ve got the pics. Ali, we used to be tight. You need to walk away dude, now or it’s all going to come out. Peeps already talking about you, and they looking to drop some dimes. Walk away now — think of yourself and your family. You already fucked up enough things. Dude, you ain’t gonna win this one – all the shit that you, Mama Lydia and your bro been trying so hard to hide under the rug is gonna come out. You ain’t gonna be able to stand no federal investigation.”
It sounds like it’s written by someone who thinks everyone is a criminal, and that vague threats of criminality will frighten people.
And that is my last word until at least Sunday. I intend to observe a day of silence tomorrow, in brotherhood with other Kimberlin victims. And then, I’m going to observe another day of silence on Saturday. Just because.
UPDATE: Michelle Malkin explains the reasons behind the day of silence. The idea is: contact your member of Congress to get them to investigate the SWATtings and other harassment. Michelle explains how here. Excerpt:
Never in the eight years that I have worked as an independent blogger have I seen such a concerted threat to the fundamental right of citizen journalists to speak their minds freely and without fear of bodily harm.
Again, I will say: there are mainstream media journalists who are scared to write about this story. I do not say this lightly. I have been told this is the case.
Follow the link to Michelle’s column to see what you can do.
I confess I do not get the underlying reasoning of this silence deal, but I fully respect your choice.
I hope you have a fantastic weekend, Pat.
Ed from SFV (68921e) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:09 pmAnd the creeps strike again. That is all probably a pack of lies. But if not, does anyone really care that a college age student might have smoked pot?
Obama did blow, and he’s our president! It all comes off as very desperate.
Noodles (3681c4) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:16 pmIt is about time for a Rauhauser reputation management and security message
JD (318f81) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:24 pmWell… After a couple of days off, here’s hoping you come back large and in Charge. Tights and Cape Shit.
In the meantime… Enjoy the Silence
Auntie Fraud (2f38aa) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:27 pmOh Auntie–absolutely did not need that trip down memory lane.
elissa (b4c7e6) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:30 pm“here’s hoping you come back large and in Charge. Tights and Cape Shit.”
That’s some good stuff right there.
Noodles (3681c4) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:31 pmHeh, I was sure Auntie was going to send us to this Silence…how to date oneself.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:34 pmEd from SFV,
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (9a7ab6) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:37 pmIf a significant section of the blogosphere follows the day of non-posting, it will attract the attention of the MSM. Any coverage of the day of silence will have to include some mention of its purpose. If some of the big left-liberal blogs take part in solidarity with the principle of free speech, we’ve an even better chance of getting this issue on the MSM’s radar.
James Wolcott sees the day of silence as fodder for his twitter feed. He is foolishly oblivious that this is not about left or right, but everyone who values free speech. And as a blogger, he should be concerned. I suspect he is one pushing the left/right narrative.
If the Internet seems less deranged tomorrow, credit the National Day of Blogger Silence, as RW bloggers go off the air in mute solidarity.
A nat’l Day of Silence is usually associated with the LGBT annual event, proof that there is nothing the rightwing won’t shamefully hijack.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:40 pmUsing that logic, liberal politicians should never be able to “hijack” religion for political purposes by holding or attending a prayer service.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:47 pmSo, I guess a little partying with pot constitutes a “crime wave” now…
Jay (daef37) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:48 pmHere’s one. I will quote it so you don’t have to click on Breitbart Unmasked to see it:
Anyone who has read Rauhauser for any length of time is laughing out loud.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:52 pmBrother Bradley – There was fantastic momentum building the last two days. To me, the self-imposed silence is ill-timed. The time to strike is while the iron is hot.
Ed from SFV (68921e) — 6/7/2012 @ 10:53 pmI just noticed Erick Erickson’s tweet on Patterico’s sidebar:
Not surprising.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:34 pmWell…see you guys when we’re done being quiet.
This will be the longest 24 hours of my life.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:42 pmSounds of Silence, Dave.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:43 pm“Anyone who has read Rauhauser for any length of time is laughing out loud.”
You mean because it doesn’t sound a thing like Rauhauser of course, right?
Heh!
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:43 pmDoes anyone still talk like this? Sounds like really bad Hollywood dialog. Who under the age of 50 remembers dime phone calls? Who today associates phone calls with pay phones? This really rings false. I’m not up on current street slang, but I’d bet it’s long moved on from “drop some dimes”!
Chuck Roast (44a80a) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:49 pmDay of silence… I think another blogburst is a better idea.
Harrison (975823) — 6/7/2012 @ 11:50 pmI like this idea. My understanding is it will encourage people to contact their Congressmen and Senators requesting an investigation, and give them more time to do that because their favorite blogs will be dark.
Plus, these bloggers have been under a lot of strain. A day or two off will probably be welcome.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:00 amWhat? They are going to go after Ali Akbar’s record now? I have to say that selection of focus doesn’t seem random. It seems somehow predictable.
MayBee (2f6e35) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:12 amHello darkness my old friend…
Gazzer (8f33d0) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:18 amThat threat letter is a masterpiece of White Suburban Punkese.
Glen Wishard (88ea55) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:21 amPatterico, you had your name changed to Los Angeles County Deputy District Attorney John Patrick Frey?!? Bet you he made that up.
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 1:01 amDana, better to go to the original silence
😀
IGotBupkis, Legally Defined Cyberbully in All 57 States (8e2a3d) — 6/8/2012 @ 1:19 amR.I.P. BOB WELCH
Icy (521935) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:30 am“That threat letter is a masterpiece of White Suburban Punkese.”
My thoughts exactly, Glen.
Gary Rosen (afeaef) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:36 amTbogg, the Silence of the Lames.
kinda says it all.
wheelers.cat (9b2d17) — 6/8/2012 @ 4:46 amWheelers is still butthurt over her proggies getting spanked, again. No surprise nishi is a fan of tbogg.
JD (c543e6) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:19 am23. He will always be Rico to me.
27. Too bad there’s still us wingnuts spewing into dead air, making it difficult to sort out the voices in Libbies’ crania.
gary gulrud (dd7d4e) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:25 amPretty hilarious that the BK crime family thinks that people convicted of crimes should shut up.
SPQR (26be8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:04 amI don’t think a prosecutor would be hard-pressed to fit that threat letter into the definition of extortion under federal law with Ali’s resignation being the “thing of value” sought. In fact, a determined L.E.O. would be able to use the extortion letter to open the gateway to see what other communications were sent out by the suspect to snag any co-conspirators.
Oh, right. Holder’s justice department. Silly me.
Komissar Vladimir (163d77) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:21 amFlash Forward, January 2013:
Barack Obama sworn in for 2nd term.
Venusian (62b020) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:36 amFormer Pres. Bill Clinton brought up on treason charges for speaking ill of Dear Leader by new Attorney General Brett Kimberlin
Former AG Eric Holder takes helm of reconstituted & merged ACORN and AFSCME
Gov. Scott Walker security detail abducted by Secret Service leaving Walker unprotected in Madison.
Former NY Mayor Mike Bloomberg sworn in as Surgeon General and head of FDA
Retired MD Judge Vaughey nominated to US Supreme Court
Former NY Times reporter, David Sanger, who wrote of top secret defense & intelligence programs named head of NSA
Former WH Press Secretary Jay Carney nominated for VP after Biden resigns to become UN Secretary General
DNC Chair, Debbie Wasserman-Shultz excited about new role as anchor of NBC Nightly News & new hairdo.
Last night, @Ali was tweeting to suggest that Twitter users report @OccupyRebellion for violations of the Twitter terms-of-service.
Considering the outcry over the “Conservative Gulag” into which many conservative twitter users have been placed by unscrupulous opponents, I’m not sure how to feel about this.
If any account is violating the TOS, it’s @OccupyRebellion.
Pious Agnostic (7c3d5b) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:52 amPious – I disagree with Ali on that. Everyone should see what bile occupyrebellion/Raihauser is spewing.
JD (c543e6) — 6/8/2012 @ 7:01 amTbogg, Denebian slime devil, nice company you’re keeping.
narciso (494474) — 6/8/2012 @ 7:08 amIt’s become routine to read the most dishonest and dramatic accusations they can come up with.
That comment is obviously Neal, and his remarks about harassing the judge (in order to make it seem like an attack via Aaron) is a plausible thing Neal and his crew would do.
They are ‘all in’.
Kommisar is right. That is an extortion letter. Those smearing Ali are the criminals. They try this crap to everybody. They’ve been smearing Patterico for many months, including claiming he made up the swatting and orchestrated Weinergate. They never offer evidence for their accusations. They just keep drumming up more smears. Most people are not used to engaging someone with absolutely no conscience. Smear enough, and some fools out there will assume there must be something to it.
At the end of the day, it all revolves around the same agenda. The Alicia Pain emails and the Swattings soon after… the lawfare against Aaron Worthing… the Ali extortion letter… Neal’s beandog harassment (which included harassment about a conservative’s “f—able” children, if you didn’t know)… the incredible abuse Liberty Chick has taken… it all revolves around an agenda of shutting down free speech.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 7:16 amYes it’s extortion, and by another one of these insultingly poorly-drawn socks that BK et al think are genius. Yo.
Sarahw (b0e533) — 6/8/2012 @ 7:29 amComment by Venusian — 6/8/2012 @ 6:36 am
It was all perfectly logical, until you got to the last line –
AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92) — 6/8/2012 @ 9:22 amDWS will never change her hair!
Better Flash forward:
January 21st, 2013
President Romney’s Cabinet:
Secretary of State: John Bolton
Secretary of Treasury: Glenn Hubbard
Secretary of Interior: Rick Perry
Secretary of Defense:
Dick CheneyWalter BishopJack WelchAttorney General: Rudy Giuliani
Budget Director: Paul Ryan
EPA Director: Sarah Palin
FCC Chairman: Bill Gates
Fed Chairman: Martin Feldstein
Ambassador to the UN: Liz Cheney
Secretary of Homeland Security: Newt Gingrich (with instructions to fix it)
Secretary of Commerce: Herman Cain (with instructions to close it down)
Secretary of Education: Clint Bolick (with instructions to close it down)
Secretary of Labor: Donald Trump (with instructions to close it down)
Secretary of Energy: George Kaiser (with instructions to close it down)
Ron Paul appointed to audit federal reserve; Fed Chairman Bernanke resigns, but is arrested trying to leave country.
Randy Barnett appointed to US Supreme Court, replacing the failed nomination of Eric Holder.
Ken Starr appointed special prosecutor to look into Solyndra, Fisker and other direct subsidies.
Michele Bachmann appointed special prosecutor to look into “Fast & Furious” and political abuses of Voting Rights Act enforcement.
All regulations issued by the Obama administration are suspended pending review.
TSA ordered to turn over airport security to local authorities in 90 days and disband.
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 9:32 amAD, I believe that was a reference to the fool’s errand attempt to soften Washerwoman Schultz’s image to make her come across as more feminine. *shudder*
Icy (f2a23b) — 6/8/2012 @ 9:36 am________________________________________________
Former Pres. Bill Clinton brought up on treason charges for speaking ill of Dear Leader by new Attorney General Brett Kimberlin
What’s disconcerting is that your scenario really isn’t all that off base. It’s too close to a possible reality to be merely a LOL.
The various forms of corruption — involving both money, decisionmaking and policymaking — can end up so extreme, that I suspect a lack of awareness of just how bad that can become is a major reason Aaron Walker walked into the courtroom and didn’t realize fully what he was facing with a character like Cornelius Vaughey. That what should have been an open-and-shut case in his favor would instead turn out as a visit to Bizarro World, to a kangaroo court in a Banana Republic similar to Cuba or Venezuela.
Mark (9aa697) — 6/8/2012 @ 9:49 amIcy, making DWS “more feminine” would require “gender assignment” surgery.
AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92) — 6/8/2012 @ 9:58 amKevin M.,
I hate to quibble but I’m not sure Donald Trump is the best person to shut anything down. He seems like the type who would love the attention too much to carry through.
But I really like where you’ve put Perry, Palin and Ryan (if he’s not VP).
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:12 amScott Walker would make a fine VP, grooming him the way the GOP hasn’t been grooming successors effectively recently.
I like the subtle humor in putting Trump in charge of a useless department, given he’s famous for firing, but DRJ’s right.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:15 amAnd Walker’s been reelected! That’s rich, but it’s true. My main requirement for presidential timber is fiscal discipline and political success by being a reelected conservative governor. The democrats have accidentally given Walker this credential!
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:17 amWalker is great but for the GOP to pluck him out of Wisconsin after this recall — wouldn’t that make Wisconsin citizens feel like they made the wrong decision?
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:17 amIn other words, they voted for him and then he leaves? I think that would hurt him and the GOP too much. It’s the equivalent of Sarah Palin resigning, only at least she had a good personal reason — to protect her family. His reason would be personal advancement.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:19 amYes, it would, DRJ. Though Walker didn’t ask for this recent recall. And the nation needs conservative leadership.
I would love to see Ryan as VP.
Things are looking up for the GOP. We’ve got a lot of younger leaders who have a lot of skill behind a podium.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:21 amAnd to contribute to DRJ’s argument, Governor is a much better position to be in than VP if someone really cares about making a difference.
I’m not sure every current governor would even want to be VP.
But I would like the VP selection be a choice grooming a potential successor. And I’d say Walker is my current favorite for the next contested GOP presidential primary, so that colors my hopes.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:23 amI still think it will be Rubio but, really, I don’t have a clue.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:24 amRubio is a good choice tactically. Those who see beating Obama as absolute top priority should be encouraged if that is the choice.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:33 am(I don’t)
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:34 amPelosi – the bishops don’t speak for the Church
JD (c543e6) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:47 amObama – the private sector is just fine.
I hate to quibble but I’m not sure Donald Trump is the best person to shut anything down. He seems like the type who would love the attention too much to carry through.
Trump is there because he’d be so annoying to the Department of Labor. they’d shut themselves down.
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:49 amThe only confrontational situation I’ve see Ryan really is is back during the Obamacare round table when he school President Obama. And he was terrific. However, does he appear to be able to do that on a national stage, and/or confrontationally put down the opposition’s myriad o attacks that will be fired off? Cheney had it in spades and with a serious dignity and gravitas maintained. Biden, well, Biden…. But how do you think Ryan would handle that aspect of the job?
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:52 amMy first choice, Sanford Sigoloff (aka Ming the Merciless) was unfortunately too dead to serve.
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:52 amKevin M, you may have just hightlighted Trump’s greatest strength: the ability to talk to death anyone. Talk about self-deportation! Of course, after his successes, he would be non-stop self-congratulating…. but, if it gets the job done…
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:55 amLike Vogon bureaucrats reciting poetry,
narciso (494474) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:58 amWhoever we pick for VP is going to be compared to Biden.
Lucky dog is going to come across looking like Einstein crossed with George Clooney.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:04 am*sigh*
The left doesn’t care about free speech. They call it oppression.
Rob Crawford (c55962) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:10 amEinstein crossed with George Clooney.
*swoon*
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:15 amIt sounds like it’s written by someone who thinks everyone is a criminal, and that vague threats of criminality will frighten people.
They underestimate people. People are simply not that narrowminded. Although they wish they were.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:26 amEinstein crossed with
Pious Agnostic (7c3d5b) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:38 amGeorge ClooneyRonald ReaganDRJ: I hate to quibble but I’m not sure Donald Trump is the best person to shut anything down. He seems like the type who would love the attention too much to carry through.
Trump is there because he’d be so annoying to the Department of Labor. they’d shut themselves down.
Comment by Kevin M — 6/8/2012 @ 10:49 am
— Give him this much: the man has no problem with telling people “You’re fired!”
Icy (f2a23b) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:51 amEinstein crossed with George Clooney.
*swoon*
Comment by Dana — 6/8/2012 @ 11:15 am
— Dana likes a man with a BIG . . . brain.
Icy (f2a23b) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:53 amThey also think most people can be blackmailed.
The way they do negative research on people, you’d think they were a certain type of politician, who tries to “disqualify” oppponents.
Like Clinton, Obama or Romney.
So they, too, try to blackmail (they’d prefer not to pull the disqualification trick too much) opponents on the Internet.
Maybe not that much of a surprise since Neal Rauhauser works for some politicians.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:56 amArizona Rep. Raul Grijalva (of Arizona’s 7th congressional districts) is/was one of his clients. Of course I don’t know what this signifies. He could have been a tangential client. I don’t know when or where or for how long he was a client.
In the end I found this one thing, though, from the Daily Kos: (and I’m sure there are more details to be found)
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2010/09/21/903952/-Congressman-Grijalva-8217-s-War-Dogs
A post by StrandedWind = Neal Rauhauser
Tue Sep 21, 2010 at 12:59 PM PDT
Congressman Grijalva’s War Dogs
I just got the most amazing little note – Congressman Grijalva is thanking us for the work we did in stopping a $5,000,000 media campaign against him in Arizona’s 5th Congressional District.
We did this. Beth, and Sandi Behrns, and I, we went first because we got the call to action. But all of you helped….
What exactly did Neal do?
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:59 amBefore that I attempted some general research.
In 2003 Grijalva was for Howard Dean. He was considered for Interior secretary at the end of 2008. He’s famous for urging a boycott of the state in early 2010. And…
http://romanticpoet.wordpress.com/tag/raul-grijalva-mecha-communist-marxist/
Some might know too, that while studying at the University of Arizona in the early 1970s Grijalva was a member of MEChA, the infamous Chicano separatist group known for its love of Cuba and its Marxist values.
I’m betting though that few voters know of Raul Grijalva’s connection to the Arizona District of the Communist Party USA.
Some might know too, that while studying at the University of Arizona in the early 1970s Grijalva was a member of MEChA, the infamous Chicano separatist group known for its love of Cuba and its Marxist values.
I’m betting though that few voters know of Raul Grijalva’s connection to the Arizona District of the Communist Party USA….
Raul Grijalva’s first documented ties the the Communist Party USA date from 1993, when then Pima County Board of Supervisors member Raul M. Grijalva, penned an article on NAFTA for the Party’s People’s Weekly World, November 13 issue.
By 1993, there was no more Soviet Union even!!
I was looking for something dealing with blackmail or targeting of opponents, not this, though.
All I can find about his 2002 campaign so far is this:
http://www.nationaljournal.com/almanac/2010/person/raul-grijalva-az/
When the district was created in 2002, the Democratic primary in effect determined who would get the seat. Grijalva entered with a home-court advantage: 64% of the primary votes were cast in Pima County. His chief opponent was state Sen. Elaine Richardson, who was endorsed by the women’s fundraising group EMILY’s List and spent more than $500,000 on ads. She criticized Grijalva for wasting taxpayer money on a $3.8 million contract to survey all the manholes in Pima County. Although outspent nearly 3-1, Grijalva had a well-organized grassroots effort and endorsements from labor unions, teachers’ unions, and the Sierra Club. Mocking his opponent’s national funding, Grijalva created “Adelita’s List,” invoking a name alluding to the independent women who fought in the Mexican Revolution. He opposed the partial privatization of Social Security and a proposed increase in the retirement age, and he supported amnesty for illegal immigrants. He won the primary with 41% to Richardson’s 21%. In Pima County, Grijalva got 54% of the vote. He won easily in November and his daughter, Adelita, won a seat on the school board.
His main primary opponent was receiving money from “Emily’s List”
http://tucsoncitizen.com/morgue2/2002/08/28/226862-emily-s-list/
Not to be outdone, one of her main Democratic opponents – a man – created a women’s political committee with a similar name.
On his campaign Web site, Raul Grijalva invites women to donate money and become members of “Adelita’s List.”
http://nationaljournal.com/pubs/almanac/2004/people/az/rep_az07.htm
Dec 29, 2002 New York Times.
In three decades of public life, first as a community organizer fighting school segregation, then as a school board member and finally as chairman of the county board of supervisors in Tucson, Raúl M. Grijalva has never worn a tie. But last month, when he showed up lacking the appropriate neckwear for his official portrait as a freshman member of Congress, Mr. Grijalva received his first gentle lesson in the culture of the capital.
”They said, ‘Mr. Grijalva, we’ll take your picture tomorrow when you have a tie,’ ” the Democratic congressman-elect said in an interview at his Arizona home, recalling his hasty trip to the local Men’s Wearhouse. ”I knew I was going to need one of those. I just didn’t know it was going to be that soon.”
I can’t find anything. But maybe he didn;’t get connected with Those people till later.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:00 pmThis is one of Life’s Little Lessons – don’t make noises like David Koresh 2.0 when you have a cushy living situation courtesy of the same church that spawned the Branch Davidians.
What’s this? they mention David Koresh?
That was the greatest SWATing of all time! Done by Friend of Bill Jay William Buford head of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms in Little Rock, who probably murdered three of his own agents almost in front of KWTX-TV television cameras. In 1985 he had a conducted a raid in Arkanasas where eventually asurrender was negotiated. I would assume he was determined this time not to have arepat of that.
If you study the Waco warrant dates you will see activity seems to correlate with Bill Clinton’s election prospects. It seems to have stalled when Perot rose in the polls and resumed full pace right after the November election.
I don’t know if I should fill up the space here.
Let me just leave you with the most incriminatinbg link to the top:
There was an article about a week in the life of President Clinton in the Tuesday, March 9, 1993 Wall Street Journal. You can read. . .
For March 1:
He also wants to know the condition of one particular ATF agent who was wounded at Waco: Jay William Buford, an acquaintance of his from
Arkansas. ¯
AND
And Deputy Treasury Secretary Altman is dispatched to Waco to visit Mr. Buford and the other wounded agents.
And, under Wednesday, March 3:
Mr. Altman reports on his trip to Waco and his visit with the President’s friend, Mr. Buford, who was nicked in the nose by a bullet.
The president wants to know if there will be any permanent scarring. Mr. Altman says he doesn’t think so.
Now the thing is, Jay William Buford was not just any little old agent, but the head of the Bureau of Tobacco and Firearms in Little Rock and one of the chief planner of the raid. The raiders were divied into three groups – he headed the “New Orleans” group. the name “Little Rock” was kept out of this. He “improved” the Waco search warrant in January 1993. The story of his wounds also changed from time to time.
It seems like there is some video footage of the raid, shot by TV station KWTX-TV Channel 10 in Waco. It shows two groups of four agents climbing
ladders to reach a second floor roof (where supposedly a weapons cache was located)
Once there, one group of agents break a second-floor window. Three go in, and the fourth apparently throws some kind of smoke grenade into the house after them.
Shortly afterwards, the fourth man then fires a MP-5 machine-gun into the room.
Originally, the BATF claimed that three men died in that room, and that is what a caption to a picture in the March 15, 1993 issue of Newsweek indicates. (you must get the physical magazine – this is not retrievable on the Internet I believe)
However, in the final Treasury Department report, the group that went to the “weapons” room (which wasn’t actually a weapons room, but that was the reason for sending them there) consisted of only three men, and all three survived, and one of them is Buford!!
While Robert J. Williams is said to have died outside the room on the roof, and he was left for
a long time that day to be photographed by television cameras, Todd McKeehan and Conway LaBleu are totally bereft of any place or cause of
death!!
And there was a report in the New York Times of March 28, 1993, that only the team leaders had radios. Why do you suppose the three men, if
this is what it looks like, did not have radios, but only Buford did?
What do you think could be the explanation for all that?
At the trial Buford said that he didn’t support the idea of staging a military style raid, although he also claimed it was impossible to arrest Koresh outside. Now why would he be going around like he was the one high ranking official most opposed to what happened?
I am trying to explain why Bill Clinton murdered the Branch Davidians.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:17 pmFormatting got all messed up, and this is only a little part of the story.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:19 pmIf someone wants to talk about the Branch Davidian raid, I can contribute a lot.
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:20 pmI should explain also that Buford was in charge of the investigation of the attempt to murder Alice McArthur by boimbing in Little Rock in 1982 (She was later killed another way)
Sammy Finkelman (d22d64) — 6/8/2012 @ 12:22 pmShorter Obama today: “The private sector is doing fine, [but the public sector isn’t growing fast enough].”
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 1:02 pmComment by Kevin M — 6/8/2012 @ 9:32 am
Walker nominated for Sec. of Labor, just to see heads explode and MSNBC and others go apoplectic.
I think Walker doesn’t need the VP nomination to give himself and his family a break. As far as what the state would think, I don’t know, If the also recall-successful Lieut. Governor is enough of a Walker look-alike, maybe the people who voted for Walker would feel just fine if he went to DC, local boy proves his worth and gets promoted.
MD in Philly (3d3f72) — 6/8/2012 @ 1:23 pmChé Grijalva (as those of us that live in the next district over — Gabby Giffords’ old district — affectionately refer to him) deserves every attack he receives. The man is a big-government, hate-filled (and hate-fueled) Socialist scumbag.
And if Neal is responsible for fending off a big attack against him, it pretty much leaves no question as to where that crew’s political sympathies lie.
Icy (f2a23b) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:40 pmI woke up this morning with a funny thought. (At least it amused me.)
Only one man can save us from Brett Kimberlin.
Only one man is annoying enough, determined enough, sufficiently equipped with endless diarrhea of the typewriter, able to piss off judges with hyper-legalistic gamesmanship in nothing flat.
Cyrus Sanai.
Help us, Cyrus Sanai! You are our only hope!
(All right, I was half asleep at the time. Forgive me.)
luagha (5cbe06) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:51 pmWasn’t Grijalva the guy who called for a boycott of his own state, in support of illegal immigration?
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:52 pmMD, leave Walker where he is. He’s doing God’s work.
Kevin M (bf8ad7) — 6/8/2012 @ 2:55 pmEinstein crossed with George Clooney.
*swoon*
Comment by Dana — 6/8/2012 @ 11:15 am
Such a person already exists and it’s a demoncrap. Einstein’s looks, with Clooney’s political stance and lack of intelligence. Her name is Diane Washerwoman Schultz.
peedoffamerican (ee1de0) — 6/8/2012 @ 3:12 pmIn an October 2010 post, the Other McCain said Neal Rauhauser’s group Progressive PST had worked for Grijalva:
McCain also said Rauhauser claimed he was being threatened and stalked by Tea Party extremists.
DRJ (a83b8b) — 6/8/2012 @ 4:06 pm“…claimed he was being threatened and stalked by Tea Party extremists.”
Those people are just so intolerant….and mean.
AD-RtR/OS! (b8ab92) — 6/8/2012 @ 4:16 pmMe either. I am with Professor Reynolds on this one. Shutting up is the LAST thing people should be doing, in my opinion. Malkin switching her page black is a great idea. Not so much into the whole silence thing myself but to each their own.
crosspatch (6adcc9) — 6/8/2012 @ 4:22 pmLOL
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:19 pmThanks for doing what you’re doing. God bless you.
Gorges Smythe (7e1159) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:23 pmAce finally got his BK post up.
gp (0c542c) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:24 pmHer name is Diane Washerwoman Schultz.
Comment by peedoffamerican
It was all perfectly logical, until you got to the last line –
DWS will never change her hair!
Comment by AD-RtR/OS!
much more bark than bite
Colonel Haiku (ee1764) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:38 pmMs. Debbie Poodleman Shultz
gift keeps on giving
I want to know a few things before this goes any further.
1. Where did this National Bloggers Club come from? This is literally the first I’ve heard of them. If PJ Media was doing this, I’d at least know who they were.
2. Why is Ali using a system that requires you to give personal details in order to donate? That’s just not cool. What if the information gets leaked – I can’t afford to have Kimberlin start ruining my life.
3. Is there anyone else monitoring the fund or in the national bloggers club aside from Ali? I’m on a trust but verify level toward Ali, since I seriously haven’t heard of him before.
By the way, people are welcome to look at my blog and previous posts here. I support the anti-Kimberlin alliance 100%, and I think Kimberlin and his cronies should be brought to justice and have the book thrown at them.
I just want to make sure there isn’t something fishy going on here, and I want information that is free of Kimberlin tampering.
OmegaPaladin (a63d4d) — 6/8/2012 @ 5:41 pmLinked:
Silent Like a Carpet Bombing
Zilla (e2ca46) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:21 pmYeah, I understand that point.
There’s a paypal option for those who want to avoid sharing some information.
I can’t fully answer your other questions, but the National Bloggers Club has a board of directors (Michelle Malkin is on the board of directors). I believe they were founded in February 2012.
I do think that the National Bloggers Club needs a website (their facebook page is inadequate) that lists their board and provides more information.
I believe that it’s safely legitimate, based on my trust for those who promote it.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:45 pmSuch a person already exists and it’s a demoncrap. Einstein’s looks, with Clooney’s political stance and lack of intelligence. Her name is Diane Washerwoman Schultz.
Hilarious….but sooo not what I had in mind.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/8/2012 @ 6:49 pmDustin,
If you know of a way to let the National Bloggers Club folks know about this, please tell them to set up a website, and to include the paypal link prominently alongside the Rally information. I keep my blogging life separate from my facebook and other official info.
OmegaPaladin (a63d4d) — 6/8/2012 @ 8:42 pmOmega Paladin, for the record, I think your caution and need for verification and privacy is entirely reasonable. I have thought many of the the same things, and feel very much the same way that you described @5:41. Thanks for your input, too, Dustin.
elissa (4c962f) — 6/8/2012 @ 8:57 pmOmega Paladin,
I have the impression that national bloggers club is a small organization with limited resources. A paypal link would be easiest to set up with some subsequent validation by Malkin. Or send your money to the aclj or volokh.
scable (40a8c6) — 6/8/2012 @ 10:00 pmCan I comment yet?
Ghost (6f9de7) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:32 pmSweet! I don’t know if I got stuck in moderation or something, but I haven’t been able to comment theough this whole thing. It’s messed up beyond belief. My prayers are with you and your families, those affected by this thuggery. Stay safe.
Ghost (6f9de7) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:35 pmI agree with Elissa.
There’s always that worry out there that someone’s just trolling. All these Kimberlin related threads bring in a number of weird commenters.
So when folks have legitimate and constructive concerns, they have to walk on eggshells about it. It’s one of the many tensions of this fiasco. There really are many.
Anyway, I will pass along your suggestion to Ali in an email.
Scable’s ACLJ suggestion is a great one, too. And they are excellent on first amendment advocacy. Incidents like this one make me worry about how many incidents like this I never hear about.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/8/2012 @ 11:39 pmWhy don’t all of the bloggers victimized by Kimberlin’s (and his pals) terrorism, file a class action lawsuit?
SFC MAC (81dbc7) — 6/9/2012 @ 3:02 amBrett Kimberlin is not only a dangerous criminal, a domestic terrorist bomber, a murderer, a liar and a punk, but he is the slime on the bottom of humanity’s and America’s shoe, that needs to be scraped off every now and then.
TeaPartriot4ever (b4d9e0) — 6/9/2012 @ 3:03 amThanks, Dustin.
My friend was wondering about the national bloggers club and Ali. The way to handle a slimeball like Kimberlin harassing you is to get out in front of it. In PR work, you need to present a solid front with answers to common questions to keep the bad guys from creating a false impression.
OmegaPaladin (a63d4d) — 6/9/2012 @ 9:42 amDustin – if the National Bloggers Club is a 501(c), I’d suggest they get in touch with the Foundation Center. They offer web-site support, and can help with the whole transparency issue that’s making people uneasy.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/9/2012 @ 1:37 pm.
QUESTION: Does this not qualify as criminal blackmail, or at least extortion?
Are not serious criminal charges possible against the one who wrote this?
Is it really that hard to get the FBI seriously interested in tracking the author?
.
IGotBupkis, Legally Defined Cyberbully in All 57 States (8e2a3d) — 6/9/2012 @ 2:13 pm“QUESTION: Does this not qualify as criminal blackmail, or at least extortion?”
Usually you have to be trying to secure something of value (money, goods, services) for it to be extortion or blackmail.
Of course, there’s zillions of laws out there, so this might well be illegal under some other statute.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/9/2012 @ 2:34 pmAkbar appears to be a convicted felon and thief according to the information presented by a couple of the ober-lefty websites.
This information appears to be correct, as far as I can tell, and I have to intention of donating money to some sketchy looking organization that has a convicted chief in charge of it’s fund-raising apparatus.
But, go ahead and keep the guy in place, if that’s what floats your boat.
Having a convicted felon in charge of the Justice Through Music organization appears to work just fine for them, so no reason the National Bloggers Club (whatever that is) shouldn’t do the same.
Just don’t ask me for credit card numbers…’cause you ain’t going to get them.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/9/2012 @ 4:33 pm“Convicted chief”???
I meant convicted thief.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/9/2012 @ 4:35 pmall thru His first term
Colonel Haiku (2c94c1) — 6/9/2012 @ 5:04 pmI Me Mine and I Me Mine
and more I Me Mine
Dave Surls, hitting the tip jar on the active blogs also helps. Ace, the other mCcain, malkin, and my personal favortie Michael Tottens.
Rising tide for all boats.
scable (40a8c6) — 6/9/2012 @ 6:42 pmPlease, no. The man is a fascist and a bully. Why not Clint Bolick for AG, and let Thomas Sowell wind down the Dept of Education. Or maybe have Randy Barnett as AG, and give the next three SC appointments to Alex Kozinski, Janice Rogers Brown, and Richard Epstein? (Actually I’d like to give the first one to Douglas Ginsburg, just to right an old wrong. And Epstein is too old.) J. Christian Adams as Deputy AG for Civil Rights.
Sarah Palin for Interior, or perhaps to pare down Energy to its essential functions and merge them with Interior, and then take over Interior. Give EPA to someone with unassailable scientific credentials and a keen eye for bullshit.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/9/2012 @ 10:40 pmNo! He’s needed where he is. He just got elected twice to do a job; let him do it and then think about other jobs.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/9/2012 @ 10:48 pm“But what if they have my looks and your brains?”
Milhouse (312124) — 6/9/2012 @ 10:51 pmI like that. No need for him to actually take the job; just announce the nomination, and let him take some time to think about it. After a week or two of thinking, and of protests from Wisconsin saying how much they need him there, he can gracefully decline.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/9/2012 @ 11:00 pmDon’t worry, no matter how they try they aren’t going to have children together.
Pious Agnostic (ee2c24) — 6/10/2012 @ 3:30 amPA, did you not notice the quote marks?
Milhouse (312124) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:25 amDustin, can you ask him why he lied on his Facebook page? Court documents reveal he stole a bunch of electronics, luggage, etc from some guy…NOT he stood by and watched some other guy use a debit card.
Convicted felon AND liar. Sounds to me you decided to fight fire with fire
timb (8f04c0) — 6/10/2012 @ 1:43 pmtimb – How does Ali compare to having an admitted tax cheat as a treasury chief?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 1:57 pmtimb – You also keep seeming to miss the point that folks have contributed over $1.6 million to two non-profit organizations run by a convicted felon who’s parole was revoked because he had not made any payments on a $1.6 million civil judgement against him. Do you see any issues with that or is your concern just selective as usual?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 2:03 pmAkbar appears to have been convicted of theft just five years ago…and, this is the guy who gets picked to manage a fundraising operation?
And, picked by people who have been screaming bloody murder for over a year about Brett Kimberlin’s past criminal record???
Count me out of this operation.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 2:11 pmYeah, weird that my questions about Ali and this on-going grift don’t include exciting questions about unrelated matters. I think you have the whole “Brett Kimberlin is so evil” thing well-covered.
I’m just wondering about the people you people are asking you to help out
timb (8f04c0) — 6/10/2012 @ 2:15 pm“Yeah, weird that my questions about Ali and this on-going grift don’t include exciting questions about unrelated matters.”
timb – I don’t see any grift. Do you have some inside information about current events or are you just stirring the pot with baseless speculation as usual?
Do you have any links to court documents or transcripts relating to Ali’s convictions that don’t involve going to blogs of the Kimberlin/Rauhauser crime family?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 2:41 pmtimb – Have you passed the bar exam yet?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 2:43 pmI read Akbar’s explanation.
If there really is contradictory information – and I mean stuff that has not been touched in any way by Kimberlin and his associates – I want to see it.
Otherwise, it might be a very good idea not to leap to a conclusion on a Sunday afternoon.
BTW, it would be hard for any problem to be very far in Ali Akbar’s past – I don’t believe he’s even passed his 30th birthday, yet.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 3:21 pm“I read Akbar’s explanation.”
Dianna – Where can you read it if you are not on Facebook without going to one of the Kimberlin/Rauhauser crime family sites?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 3:25 pmI’ve looked at both the Breitbart Unmasked site and the Liberal Grouch site, and what they’re saying about this Akbar character appears to be legit.
If it isn’t…the ownwers of those sites are in a world of hurt.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 3:43 pm“ownwers”???
One of these days I’m going to have to break down and buy a dictionary.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 3:43 pmDaley, I see that you like to kill the messenger, ie, me and over the years, I’ve understood that to be part of your team concept to politics…
but, like Surls pointed out, those are Court documents, thus, if they are faked, that is a pretty open and shut case of false light and slander.
Dave Surls and I agree on only two things: he doesn’t like me and I’m not fond of him and the Court documents prove Ali Akbar lied on his facebook page.
Now, if you want to go with Dustin’s rationale, Malkin is on the board and he trusts the people involved that’s fine, but stop acting like I’m evil because you think I’m on the wrong partisan side
timb (8f04c0) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:11 pm“Daley, I see that you like to kill the messenger, ie, me and over the years, I’ve understood that to be part of your team concept to politics…”
timb – It’s not a question of killing the messenger, dude. I love you, man. For a dishonest, hyperpartisan, stalkerish commenter you are a real treat.
Who could ask for more, really?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:26 pm“but, like Surls pointed out, those are Court documents, thus, if they are faked”
timb – You need to read more closely. I have not suggested anywhere that they are fakes, merely expressed a desire to read them somewhere not part of the Kimberlin/Rauhauser crime family.
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:29 pmtimb – If they are court documents, is there a reason people cannot provide a direct link to them? Were they purchased and embedded on those sites?
daleyrocks (bf33e9) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:32 pm“Dave Surls and I agree on only two things: he doesn’t like me and I’m not fond of him…”
Just to clarify: It’s your politics I don’t like.
You sound exactly like most of my friends who range from ultra-left Democrats to stone cold communists (I have right wing friends too, but the vast majority of my friends are far left).
My sweetheart, the mother of my children is a Green Party member, and an avowed socialist.
This is about politics…and, it’s not one bit personal.
At least for me.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:45 pmI googled his name and found an article that linked to Akbar’s Facebook page. The site was CFP – here’s the link: http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/47234
So I clicked the link and read the Facebook page, and have decided that if there’s more information, it’s not going to come out on Sunday evening. Is that fair, or have I done something that’s going to cause disapprobation?
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:47 pmIf only you would stop saying silly things about every single issue on this site, I’d find that a lot easier to credit and take seriously.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 4:49 pmI agree with Ace, the only thing that ends this is a prosecution and conviction. Kimberlin is such an attention whore, he does not care.
EBL (f71fce) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:00 pm#128
I have no intention of tailoring my remarks to suit the tastes of either Neanderthal Lefties or Neanderthal Righties.
I call ’em like I see ’em.
And, I want to see everything I can, before I start getting silly.
That’s why I went over to the Liberal Grouch and Breitbart Unmasked sites, and examined the information they were presenting.
Unlike super-smart, rocket scientists, like yourself, who prefer to hold forth from a state of blissful ignorance, I prefer to find out as much as I can, before I start talking.
Also, before I start giving out credit card nmbers.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:05 pmDave – you shouldn’t donate.
As for taking the word of Liberal Grouch, after what they posted about Yid the Lid, I wouldn’t take their word.
Ali is trying to help AW, Patterico, RSM, etal, no? That he was a shltbag in his early 20s is literally shocking to me.
JD (318f81) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:08 pm“As for taking the word of Liberal Grouch, after what they posted about Yid the Lid, I wouldn’t take their word.”
I wouldn’t take their word on anything. It’s the copies of court documents that impress me.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:20 pmFirst, fuck you. Imagine that said in the most pleasant of pleasant voices.
I do not go to those sites because 1) they are proven liars – claiming, among other things, that our host was never SWAT-ted – and 2) my personal techie’s protective measures and my anti-virus and my Firefox alerts all begin indicating that they are very, very upset if I go visit.
So, I am not commenting from “blissful ignorance”, you sneering, pretentious, incompetent fool. I am pointing out that we can’t thrash this out on a Sunday evening.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:22 pmJD’s right that taking these goons’s word for anything is really stupid.
And they do forge documents. Who do most people think is behind the BU site?
And he has a conviction for … forgery, another for impersonation, another for perjury?
Ok.
I asked Ali if he would reply to this, and he said he understood why folks would take a smart, ‘trust but verify’ attitude.
Every possible defect in any Kimberlin critic will be played up to the max. They use these to sow discord. Ali admitted to committing a crime and said he was treated better than he deserved. Of course the goons will try to build a series of lies on this core truth that he made that mistake. It’s what they do. And those who say it seems legit, forgetting that everything else from these folks is a deception, are either trolls or fools.
Is there anyone who isn’t anonymous accusing Ali of anything? Keep that in mind.
In my opinion, we need to develop a habit of totally ignoring the trolls. And I would really appreciate it if folks did not promote the smear websites. That’s not a call for viewpoint censorship. If you want to make your own argument, do it, and back it up with evidence.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:49 pmYet more.
@Popehat
Long post coming tonight about another blogger threatened with jail for writing about Brett Kimberlin — and what it says about the system.
11:12 AM – 10 Jun 12 via web
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:53 pmKind of interesting that Patterico’s place had some “commenter issues” at the same time as Ace’s place.
But then, I am paranoid that way.
Simon Jester (17afc4) — 6/10/2012 @ 5:57 pmFTFY
Dustin (330eed) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:05 pmThe optics here are atrocious. I do not understand why Ali doesn’t step aside and allow someone else to handle the bloggers’ defense fund. How hard can it be?
And yes, I would do it if necessary, though I’m only a common commenter.
creeper (f1f686) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:09 pmhttp://youtu.be/Jmg86CRBBtw
Simon Jester (17afc4) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:11 pmSimon,
I’m glad you’ve popped in. We discussing my dad/Frances Collins, and I forgot to mention dad’s in an interesting position at the college: teh Science Dept hired new person to oversee the dept. Background in Womyns Studies & Science… Her first move after getting acquainted w/staff & faculty, was to let 4 faculty members teaching the hard sciences & the dept. chair go – the 5 were all male. They were replaced by 5 women with less science experience/educational resumes. A lawsuit is in the works. (Interestingly, Dad is the only male who didn’t receive word his contract wasn’t renewed – yet. He wonders if it’s because he’s so old!) It’ll be interesting to see what happens.
Dana (4eca6e) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:11 pmI’d like for Ali to address those alleged court documents on Breitbart Unmasked.
I encourage people to remember that they are huge liars over there. Until they say something that can be independently verified, you are a major sucker if you fall for any of their crap.
That said, I’d like to hear Ali address the issue.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:12 pmCreeper – in order to do so, you need to divulge everything you have done since age 13. In order to help AW or Patterico, you need to have committed less felonies than Barcky.
JD (318f81) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:13 pmYou’re on dangerous ground being “impressed” by anything they do, unless and until you get verification.
Until you do, I think it’s legitimate to see the copies as raising a potential question that Ali should consider addressing.
But anyone who says they are “impressed” by anything these people say without corroboration is either biased in a major way, or just doesn’t yet understand precisely how extraordinarily dishonest they are capable of being.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:15 pmHeck, it is foolish to even go to their sites. After what they did to Yid, that anyone would take them seriously is breath-taking.
JD (318f81) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:20 pmJD, does that include the ones I was never caught at?
Happily, there are no felonies lurking in my past unless you count the twenty years I was a registered Democrat.
creeper (f1f686) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:22 pmDana, I would be happy to chat with you. Patterico, stashiu3, and Bradley F. have my contacts.
As for the topic at hand, let me repeat: be careful out there.
Simon Jester (17afc4) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:25 pmCreeper – yes
JD (318f81) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:29 pm#141 – Patterico – So would I, but honestly, I did not expect a full, documented explanation on a Sunday night.
My patience is not infinite, but can stretch for a solid 48 hours on this.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 6:40 pmIf you’re in a position that makes them want to smear you, they will do so. Sometimes, that smear will revolve around a truth… smart con men do that, of course. Sometimes, the smear will be a complete fabrication.
Raising defense funds for those engaged by Brett’s lawfare is crucial. And we have to get real: Brett’s an excellent liar. He can weave enough of a tale to get a man arrested for blogging. Ali’s got a vulnerable aspect to him with his mistake. I found his post about it inspiring, but at the same time, I know that it makes Brett’s goal of undermining our efforts easier.
Adapting to that is not always fair, but I think it’s smart.
I’d like to see the National Bloggers Club post a website listing information about the organization, the board of directors, and assigning someone responsible for this fund who is unassailable. Ali stood up to Kimberlin, and that earns him a lot of respect in my book. What I’m envisioning is a partner, not a replacement.
And none of this view is based on what that unmasked site posted, which I assume is deceptive in many ways.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:03 pmAli stepped up to the plate. Who else did?
That’s why he is undergoing this colonoscopy.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:05 pmAnd when I mean stepped up, I mean to provide a legal defense fund.
Which was needed.
Lots of people stepped up. But nobody else in this particular way.
Aaron, in particular, can use the help.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:14 pmAgain, if they’re a 501(c), they can contact the Foundation Center. They can help with a website, and with what makes a transparent structure.
Dianna (f12db5) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:16 pmYeah. He put himself in the line of fire to help someone who really needed that help.
He has earned a lot of respect for this.
Dustin (330eed) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:17 pmWell, Patrick, I offered.
The truth is, I’m an old broad and there’s not much left of my life they can mess up. The prospect of having my children and grandchildren threatened isn’t appetizing but we’re a pretty tough bunch. We’re also on good terms with both the local constabulary and judiciary.
The offer stands. Holler if I can help.
creeper (f1f686) — 6/10/2012 @ 7:53 pmHappily, there are no felonies lurking in my past unless you count the twenty years I was a registered Democrat.
Comment by creeper — 6/10/2012 @ 6:22 pm
— A capital crime against reason & accountability, to be sure.
Icy (380bb8) — 6/10/2012 @ 8:52 pm“But anyone who says they are “impressed” by anything these people say without corroboration is either biased in a major way, or just doesn’t yet understand precisely how extraordinarily dishonest they are capable of being.”
If the records are fakes, they’re damned good fakes…only I don’t think they are.
But, if they are, then Akbar has a slam dunk libel case against the authors of this material.
“Aaron, in particular, can use the help.”
I’ll help Aaron out with a $100 donation…but I want a PO Box I can send a check to, and I’m sending it directly to Aaron…otherwise no dice.
No online transactions. No credit card numbers.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 9:15 pmAnd those authors are?
Whom should he sue, Dave?
These people are LIARS and they cannot be sued because they are ANONYMOUS. They stand behind nothing and their word MEANS nothing.
To most of us, that is.
Patterico (feda6b) — 6/10/2012 @ 9:18 pm“And those authors are?”
If Brett Kimberlin can find out who people are, then Ali Akbar ought to be able to do it too. If they’re not telling the truth, then he can use the court system and find out who they are, in the process of pursuing a defamation claim.
“These people are LIARS…”
If what’s on those websites isn’t true, then why isn’t Akbar denying it?
I haven’t heard a peep out of him, or anyone else, saying that it’s all made up.
The only thing I’ve seen is some song and dance allegedly posted on some facebook page, that basically said it’s all some tragic misunderstanding…which I ain’t buying.
You know what I think? I think the Lefties are telling the truth (for once).
And, I also think that anyone who puts a convicted felon/thief in charge of a fundraising operation is coocoo for cocoa puffs, especially a group that’s been screaming bloody murder about Brett Kimberlin’s criminal past, for lo these many months.
Whoever is managing this whole effort (assuming there is someone managing things) ought to kick this guy to the curb, pronto.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 10:13 pmUm, what sort of hurt, exactly?
Remember that Kimberlin already owes Mrs DeLong $1.6M of which he has no intention of ever paying a penny. And AW is suing him for $66M, of which he’s IMHO likely to get a final award of six figures, and zero actual cash. Also remember that so far they’ve got away with far worse than lying about court documents, with no consequences at all. So why do you imagine they would cavil at “false light and slander”? It would be the least of their offenses.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/10/2012 @ 10:42 pmI don’t understand why you’re willing to go to Liberal Grouch and Not Breitbart, but not to Facebook. What exactly do you fear Facebook will do to your computer if you visit a page there? (I don’t think you need to be logged in to FB to see Ali’s explanation, but I haven’t actually tried it.) Have you never read any of Sarah Palin’s FB posts?
Milhouse (312124) — 6/10/2012 @ 11:06 pm“Um, what sort of hurt, exactly?”
The kind of hurt you feel when you get sued for libel, for starters.
Except I don’t think that’s going to happen, because I suspect the Lefties actually dug up real dirt.
I reckon we’ll find out if there’s any truth to my suspicions in the days to come.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 11:12 pm“What exactly do you fear Facebook will do to your computer…”
Nothing. I just don’t want to sign up.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/10/2012 @ 11:19 pmWhat hurt is that? How would that actually hurt them?
Milhouse (312124) — 6/10/2012 @ 11:45 pm“Whom should he sue, Dave?”
One of the Lefty bloggers posting information about Ali Akbar makes no attempt to hide who he is.
I found out everything you would want to know about the guy in about ten minutes of work.
So, if Ali Akbar wants to sue for defamation, he should have no trouble finding his target…only, I don’t think he’s going to, because I suspect the Blogger is telling the truth.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/11/2012 @ 12:03 am“How would that actually hurt them?”
Dang. I hope I don’t have to explain the negative consequences of being sued.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/11/2012 @ 12:11 amYes, you do. Did you not read what I wrote in the comment you quoted from earlier? The one that contained the line “Um, what sort of hurt, exactly”? If you want to claim that being sued would hurt, you have to address the argument I gave for why it wouldn’t.
And that blogger will simply say that he was forwarded these so-called documents and believed them to be genuine. Or merely that Kimberlin or one of his associates told him that the documents existed, and he believed it. Akbar is a public figure for this purpose.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 1:31 am“And that blogger will simply say that he was forwarded these so-called documents and believed them to be genuine.”
So?
Send the guy an e-mail stating that the documents are false, demand that the documents be removed from his site, and that he quit making accusations of criminal acts by Ali…and then if he won’t, sue him. Like I said, it’s easy enough to find out who he is. I did it in minutes.
Only, I don’t think that’s going to happen, because I think the documents and accusations are true.
Of course, I have been wrong a time or two in the past about this sort of thing.
Not very often, though.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/11/2012 @ 1:58 amAnd he says he doesn’t believe you. Akbar is a public figure. Sullivan applies. If the blogger has any basis for believing that the documents might be genuine, he’s protected. He doesn’t even have to believe they actually are genuine, just that they might be.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 2:04 am#167
Reckless disregard for the truth, my friend.
But, hey if it’s too much bother sending him a demand letter/e-mail and possibly initiating a lawsuit, then let him get away with it.
Makes no nevermind to me.
Only…I think the documents are true, as are Liberal Grouch’s accusations about Ali Akbar, so I doubt if I’m going to see a demand letter or defamation lawsuit.
Though I could be wrong.
Wouldn’t be the first time.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/11/2012 @ 2:17 amI suggested:
Oh, how could I forget? Ken Starr for AG!
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 9:08 amSurls, reckless disregard for the truth means saying something without any basis for believing that it might be true. “Someone forwarded them to me” is enough basis to successfully refute malice.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 9:10 amMilhouse, I’m pretty sure Ali Akbar, a guy no one ‘cept Michelle Malkin, ever heard of, is not a public figure for the sake of the law.
You seem to believe every person discussed on a blog is a “public person.”
Besides, if you are a practitioner of the dark arts (the law, that is), then you can get on Westlaw/Lexus and look up the criminal convictions/pleadings.
timb (449046) — 6/11/2012 @ 9:54 am(I don’t think you need to be logged in to FB to see Ali’s explanation, but I haven’t actually tried it.)
That’s right, you don’t. It reads like a half truth though – like there is a fuller explanation, and he cut out the worst parts.
Why was he so sick to his stomach when he found out his friend had attempted to use an ATM card that did not belong to him to withdraw money from an ATM? Probably not moral revulsion.
How did the detectives know to go to him?
Why exactly should he wind up being considered an accomplice?
What were the proposed charges?
It sounds like maybe he was already charged in an earlier incident, where in fact he might have known what was about to happen, or maybe what successfully happened, but the case was dismissed on condition he stayed out of trouble for six months or something like that. Getting ensnared in what looked like a repetition would make him sick to his stomach.
Sammy Finkelman (71b058) — 6/11/2012 @ 10:15 amHe is in connection with this story, even if he isn’t in general.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 11:48 amA story no one, but right wing blogs have heard of?
Next time you Wikipedia “public figure” you should think analytically about what you find?
timb (8f04c0) — 6/11/2012 @ 5:28 pmI guess we are seeing here what an application to be a “made man” in the BK crime family looks like.
SPQR (9d1457) — 6/11/2012 @ 5:58 pmI think it is very important to vilify a person whose current sin is to try to help AW and Patterico.
JD (318f81) — 6/11/2012 @ 6:34 pmYou and Dave Surls share an ignorance of defamation law. Yes, for the purpose of this story Akbar is a public figure. Any defamation action he were to bring based on this story would be subject to Sullivan
Milhouse (312124) — 6/11/2012 @ 7:01 pmTimb – Just because you have never heard of someone doesn’t mean they aren’t considered a “public figure”. Running a group as Ali does, he surely qualifies…
Scott Jacobs (d027b8) — 6/11/2012 @ 7:09 pm“Surls, reckless disregard for the truth means saying something without any basis for believing that it might be true…”
That is not correct.
Dave Surls (e97413) — 6/12/2012 @ 12:07 amUm, yes, it is exactly correct. But I’ll bite. What does “reckless disregard for the truth” mean in SurlsWorld?
Milhouse (312124) — 6/12/2012 @ 11:40 pmFor extra points, please explain the verdict in Sharon v Time
Milhouse (312124) — 6/12/2012 @ 11:41 pm“What does “reckless disregard for the truth” mean in SurlsWorld?”
It means that you go ahead and print something when you have good reason to believe that what you’re printing is false.
Per the SCOTUS.
Masson v. New Yorker Magazine, Inc. – 501 U.S. 496
“The First Amendment limits California’s libel law in various respects. When, as here, the plaintiff is a public figure, he cannot recover unless he proves by clear and convincing evidence that the defendant published the defamatory statement with actual malice, i.e., with “knowledge that it was false or with reckless disregard of whether it was false or not.” New York Times Co. v. Sullivan, 376 U. S. 254, 376 U. S. 279-280 (1964). Mere negligence does not suffice. Rather, the plaintiff must demonstrate that the author “in fact entertained serious doubts as to the truth of his publication,” St. Amant v. Thompson, 390 U. S. 727, 390 U. S. 731 (1968), or acted with a “high degree of awareness of . . . probable falsity,” Garrison v. Louisiana, 379 U. S. 64, 379 U. S. 74 (1964).”
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/14/2012 @ 3:26 am“Um, yes, it is exactly correct.”
No.
It isn’t.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/14/2012 @ 3:29 amWhich means you have no basis for believing that it might be true.
In other words you as good as knew it was false. Which takes us right back to the beginning of this whole argument, which was your claim that Kimberlin’s associates would not post false documents for fear of being sued by Akbar. I wrote that not only is that a ludicrous claim, considering Kimberlin’s history (when is he going to pay that $1.6M he owes?), but the suit would be dismissed because they’d claim they were forwarded the documents and therefore believe them to be true, and they don’t believe Akbar’s denials. You claimed that this would be reckless disregard for the truth, but the standard you just cited proves you wrong.
Remember, Time magazine got away with its libel of Arik Sharon, because the tip had come from an unnamed source that it claimed had proved reliable in the past. It didn’t have to prove this, which would have meant identifying the source.
Milhouse (312124) — 6/14/2012 @ 10:40 amIts pretty much absolute comedy to watch Surls play with concepts he does not understand.
SPQR (26be8b) — 6/14/2012 @ 10:43 am“Which means you have no basis for believing that it might be true.”
No, that’s not correct.
You can have SOME basis for believing a statement is true, but if you have strong doubts that it is true, and you make the statement anyway (and it isn’t true)…it’s defamation (assuming it meets the other requirements for defamation).
Just like it says in the cases cited.
“Its pretty much absolute comedy to watch Surls play with concepts he does not understand.”
This from an alleged lawyer who can’t even paraphrase Sullivan correctly.
Dave Surls (46b08c) — 6/14/2012 @ 11:40 am