Patterico's Pontifications

11/21/2011

A Very Special Message from Occupy Wall Street Hero Jesse LaGreca

Filed under: Brett Kimberlin,General,Velvet Revolution — Patterico @ 12:01 am

Famously Articulate Folk Hero Jesse LaGreca talks about his Very Sincere Opposition to Criminality, and how he Proudly Stands with an organization co-founded by a convicted bomber who blew off a man’s leg, leading him to commit suicide:

OK, so, my name’s Jesse LaGreca and I’m really proud to be here speaking out about Occupy Accountability, about the rule of law. I am standing with Velvet Revolution, I’m standing with a lot of honorable people who care about this country, and I firmly believe that without accountability, we are only faced with criminality. So if we want to be the people who move this country forward, who have an honest conversation about our future, we can’t look back on the past. We can’t say the past is behind us and we have to look forward. We have to do both. We have to make sure that justices are handed out [sic] for criminality in the past. We have to make a plan that goes forward, so that we have a viable future for the majority of people in this country. So I’d like to say thank you to everybody at Occupy Accountability, at Occupy Wall Street, and at Velvet Revolution, because it’s an honor to speak out along with you, and I think together we can get this done.

Who is behind Velvet Revolution, the organization that Jesse LaGreca is so proud to stand with? According to TIME Magazine, the organization was founded by a group including convicted bomber Brett Kimberlin:

Brett Kimberlin was convicted in 1981 of a series of bombings in Indiana. By his own account, he dealt “many, many tons” of marijuana in the 1970s. Most famously, he is the man who from his prison cell alleged that as a law student Dan Quayle bought marijuana from him. Quayle repeatedly denied the charge, and it was never substantiated. In e-mails and Web postings from Kimberlin’s two organizations, Justice Through Music and Velvet Revolution, he intersperses occasionally useful pieces of information about the problems of e-voting with a hefty portion of bunk, repeatedly asserting as fact things that are not true.

Fox News explains that the bombings were not politically motivated, but were theorized to have been a distraction from a murder investigation in which Kimberlin was a suspect. And one of the bombs blew a man’s leg off and eventually led to his suicide:

Kimberlin grew up in a suburb of Indianapolis where, just out of high school, he ran a large-scale marijuana operation as well as a health food store and a vegetarian restaurant. According to accounts at the time and public records, he became involved with an underage girl whose grandmother objected to the relationship and tried to take her away. When the grandmother was found shot to death in her garage, police began focusing on Kimberlin, who — possibly to divert attention — began an eight-day bombing campaign in Speedway, Ind.

That bombing spree did more than cause widespread terror in Speedway; it severely injured a man who had to have his leg amputated and who, unable to cope with the pain, later committed suicide. His widow sued Kimberlin and was awarded a $1.6 million civil judgment.

In the book Citizen K, by Mark Singer, it is revealed that Kimberlin declared his intent never to pay that judgment. He was reportedly thrilled when he learned about an Indiana law that supposedly made a civil judgment uncollectable if not enforced within a specific period of time. If the book is accurate, Kimberlin evaded the rule of law long enough to avoid paying the victims of his violent actions.

An observation in 1995 (1995!) by the Washington Times remains true today:

[T]hose who have befriended and promoted Kimberlin should be ashamed. Kimberlin committed a truly monstrous crime. He planted a bomb in a high school parking lot on game day -an act that was random, brutal and targeted at children. It is a testament to the viciousness of Washington politics that such a man has been embraced by some in the firmament of the Democratic establishment.

Indeed.

Will someone ask Famously Articulate Folk Hero Jesse LaGreca about his support for the organization co-founded by convicted bomber Brett Kimberlin? Will Jesse LaGreca demand “justices” for Kimberlin’s past criminality?

P.S. It looks like the folks behind Velvet Revolution’s Occupy Accountability web site are none too happy with Yours Truly. Apparently I am listed as one of the “Media Mouthpieces” who are responsible for the “destruction of the American way of life.”

Dude.

So you know I gotta be a pretty bad guy. Fair warning.

186 Responses to “A Very Special Message from Occupy Wall Street Hero Jesse LaGreca”

  1. Dude.

    What would James Reid have to say about that?

    koam @wittier (ddc76c)

  2. SWEET! Now you can get free drinks and women across the country! Did somebody say “Rooooaaaad Triiiiip”?

    Enoch_Root (86d0f5)

  3. I tend to judge the quality of the speaker by whether when wearing a Civil War forge cap he is doing so because he thinks it makes him look patriotic or is standing in line at Disneyland and is excited to get on the canoes.

    Pat Patterson (adef21)

  4. A city that is erecting a monument to the Victims of a Terror Bombing is host to a group of terrorists celebrating a bomber

    EricPWJohnson (2a58f7)

  5. feets …im quittin’.
    i may come back, ive quit before, who can say?

    promise you will think of me sometimes.

    wheeler's cat (834485)

  6. So, why isn’t La Greca, outside the Justice Department and the SEC’s offices, rhetorical question, really.

    narciso (ef1619)

  7. [...] Read more here: A Very Special Message from Occupy Wall Street Hero Jesse LaGreca [...]

    A Very Special Message from Occupy Wall Street Hero Jesse LaGreca | Liberal Whoppers (02efd1)

  8. #8: there is always crazeE-Harmony.

    Simon Jester (5309ee)

  9. Followed the link after the “P.S.” to the Occupy for Accountability website. Their categories for “Those We Hold Accountable for the destruction of The American way of life” are an object-lesson in stupidity. Case in point is the category entitled “Corporate shells.” I’m pretty sure they meant “shills”…but maybe they did actually meant “shell corporations.” Or maybe they meant the “Shell Oil.” With this crowd you can’t be sure.

    And regarding the placement of David and Charles Koch in this category, perhaps they don’t know the difference between someone who shills for a corporation and someone who founds and/or operates them–and highly profitably at that.

    sdh (2ebb4c)

  10. [...] Who? Kimberlin grew up in a suburb of Indianapolis where, just out of high school, he ran a large-scale marijuana operation as well as a health food store and a vegetarian restaurant. According to accounts at the time and public records, he became involved with an underage girl whose grandmother objected to the relationship and tried to take her away. When the grandmother was found shot to death in her garage, police began focusing on Kimberlin, who — possibly to divert attention — began an eight-day bombing campaign in Speedway, Ind. [...]

    ‘A very special message from Occupy Wall Street hero Jesse LaGreca’ | Five Feet of Fury (f8f8be)

  11. Famously Articulate Folk Hero Jesse LaGreca

    Well, okay. But let’s agree that the bar has been set relatively low.

    Dana (4eca6e)

  12. “We have to make sure that justices are handed out [sic] for criminality in the past.”

    Riiiiiight. And a convicted bomber is just the guy to lead that effort and to go get behind.

    The irony is just too much. C’mon, are these people *serious*? Am I living in a parallel universe? You’ve got a whole cast of lunatic characters obsessing over you, me and Stack for months, openly proclaiming to be doing so on Kimberlin’s behalf (or Weiner’s, depending upon what day it is). They’re demanding truth and justice while at the same time bragging about replicating “the Kimberlin template” to create a “lawsuit assembly line” to shut down anyone “out there gunning for #OWS.”

    But YOU are responsible for the “destruction of the American way of life,” Pat – you remember that! Good lord.

    Kneel Rauhauser tweets that LaGreca was his roommate. Seems they’re ALL starstruck by convicted perjurers and bombers, including their porn blogger friend with the flair for fiction and desire for drama. Hey, this is a revoloooooootion, maaan!

    Liberty Chick (230f2f)

  13. Worst Person in the World on Olbermann is next.

    About as many people pay attention!

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  14. The shame………..The shame

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  15. And oh yeah, “Occupy for Accountability” is no *real* #OWS endeavor, btw.

    Here’s their IP (see final destination IP):
    http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/tracert/?tool_id=68&token=&toolhandler_redirect=0&ip=OCCUPYFORACCOUNTABILITY.ORG

    Here are the hosts on that IP:
    http://www.ip-adress.com/reverse_ip/208.109.218.125

    Can you say co-opt? Not so sure that Jesse here really is even a mildly smart man on Wall Street…let alone the smartest.

    Seems propaganda is a real nifty fund-raising tool these days.

    Liberty Chick (230f2f)

  16. I really don’t want to click on the link. Do they come up with even one clearly defined example of how Clarence Thomas is responsible for “the destruction of the American way of life”?

    Icy (4105dd)

  17. Nishi is off to join the Velvet Revolution?

    Aww, sorry, feets! Guess she preferred Slash over you.

    [What do you mean, "That's the wrong Velvet Rev group"? Dammit, let's have some clarity around here!]

    Icy (4105dd)

  18. How cool that if you click on “James Patrick Frey” it takes you right back to this headline! Seems very cooperative on their part to provide a link to the truth of who they are and what they’re all about.

    Icy (4105dd)

  19. It has something to do with a ‘laser’ I think;

    http://riverdaughter.wordpress.com/2011/11/20/2000-year-old-mystery-solved/

    narciso (ef1619)

  20. Personally, I like the Civil War hat.

    I mean, ya gotta admire the skill level of anyone that can so perfectly mold and apply black spray paint to tin foil.

    Icy (4105dd)

  21. Just answered my own question in #17

    NO

    Icy (4105dd)

  22. you take care you

    happyfeet (3c92a1)

  23. :(

    happyfeet (3c92a1)

  24. So much hate in the hearts of everyone Brett manages to con.

    It’s their defining characteristic. Of course, some of these bozos are in on it, but some are just so hateful they are hungry for the nastiest allegations, ready to share a little money with the guy who caters to that in just the right way.

    As LC said, propaganda is a nifty way to make a buck.

    That’s why some try so hard to provoke as much nastiness as possible. They only succeed when folks are furious.

    Jesse is exhibit A on why you shouldn’t do drugs, kids.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  25. [T]hose who have befriended and promoted Kimberlin should be ashamed. Kimberlin committed a truly monstrous crime. He planted a bomb in a high school parking lot on game day -an act that was random, brutal and targeted at children. It is a testament to the viciousness of Washington politics that such a man has been embraced by some in the firmament of the Democratic establishment.

    Nice quote!

    Recently one of these goons was saying:

    “[...] all the talk about Kimberlin. Dude did his time, so why keep rehashing his crimes – it’s pointless.”

    That’s just sick, given he is actively involved with activism and deserves criticism, let alone is unrepentant to the point where his shills rotate from ‘he was exonerated and innocent’ to ‘leave him alone, it was a long time ago.’

    In this case, it’s [redacted] who said that. Doesn’t even really matter. There are a lot of creeps who want people to leave poor Kimberlin alone.

    And all of them, I mean 100% of them, have the same shtick where they promote insane conspiracy theories, troll, smear, and when you criticize them, begin the legal threats.

    It’s like they have a playbook.

    [The person whom Dustin identified as a “goon,” [redacted], wrote me today to insist that she be credited as “Qritiq.” Here is her legalistic email in its entirety:

    Hi Pat -

    You are publicly displaying work from the “Qritiq” blog, which clearly
    displays this notice: Qritiq by Qritiq is licensed under a Creative
    Commons Attribution 3.0 United States License.

    The license clearly specifies that work from the Qritiq blog, is to be
    attributed to the indicated pseudonym: “Qritiq”

    Please make the correction:

    http://patterico.com/2011/11/21/a-very-special-message-from-occupy-wall-street-hero-jesse-lagreca/#comment-871414

    Alleged goon [redacted]/Qritiq did not provide the link to her “work” and I am not going surfing around her site to find it, but if the alleged goon wishes to provide the link, I am happy to do so. I do not thereby acknowledge that I believe I have any legal responsibility to do so, but what the hell, I don’t mind.

    – Ed.]

    [Here is that link from Qritiq. What Dustin used was fair use, so this isn’t legally required, but publishing [redacted]‘s legalistic letter amused me, so there you go. By the way, she also claims Dustin’s comment is taken out of context or something. Doesn’t look that way to me. If she wants to talk about any of this on the phone, that’s fine — but she already made it pretty clear that’s not going to happen. So, back to ignore. — Ed.]

    Dustin (cb3719)

  26. LaGreca should ask Kimberlin about the justices the family got when Kimberlin skipped out on paying his judgment.

    It seems LaGreca is just envious, as Bret Kimberlin took action, something Jesse would never be able to do himself.

    JD (b5260c)

  27. “…a Civil War forge cap…”

    IIRC, that is a “forager cap”.

    AD-RtR/OS! (db1e05)

  28. Less then a month ago Jesse LaGreca made an unintentional appearance on my bloglet.

    If his tweets to me are an example of “famously articulate” then I must be the next Sir Patrick Stewart.

    ENGAGE,
    R

    Render (2912d6)

  29. An aside, sort of.
    I’ve never spent time reading anything about Kimberlin, because I still have a pre-2000 HD and RAM in my brain, and I figure Patterico is in the right in any public PR/internet war.

    But, I want to make sure I got this straight: Kimberlin carried out a series of bombings to draw interest away from his possible involvment with a murder… (scratches head, does a “Columbo” puzzled look, waves cigar in the air, scratches head again.) Whatever happened to the murder investigation, BTW?

    Stream of consciousness… the EU has made a law in regards to whether or not advertisers can say that water eases dehydration- lawyers…and they complained about philosophers debating how many angels could dance on the head of a pin…

    More stream of consciousness here on PP- oldest son on the beat in West Philly being promoted to detective training. Mixed feelings- he is a good cop on the street that the community likes, those are needed, but for him personally this is a good thing.

    I now leave you to your regularly scheduled blogging. That is all…

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  30. Why do the left love Kimberlin?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  31. LaGreca tried to deny joooooooo-hate amongst the Occupations by invoking Jesse Hymietown Jackson. Priceless.

    JD (b5260c)

  32. :roll: Figures.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  33. LaGreca come out against criminality by stand wi a criminal. A pattern is developing.

    JD (b5260c)

  34. MD,

    Its a money thing, as pat can attest, kimberlin’s involvement in a possible murder is obvious – but it takes dollars, manpower and Law enforcement especially in the 70′s and 80′s were on the short end of the stick.

    they only have “x” amount of money to spend on crimes – but as a scientist you have to ask yourself this:

    If it asnt an obvious robbery, it wasnt a sex crime, then who would want to kill this old Lady?

    EricPWJohnson (2a58f7)

  35. But, I want to make sure I got this straight: Kimberlin carried out a series of bombings to draw interest away from his possible involvment with a murder… (scratches head, does a “Columbo” puzzled look, waves cigar in the air, scratches head again.) Whatever happened to the murder investigation, BTW?

    There was only one witness to the murder of Julia Scyphers, and that man died (of illness) soon after. I think the investigators fell short, partly because of the cleverness of those responsible.

    The motive element was not presented to the Speedway Bomber jury either.

    Very sordid mess.

    And remember, Brett was involved with organized crime in some form as he distributed drugs, hence the smear of Dan Quayle. When you take into account the disguises and fake IDs used to collect bomb materials, the deployment of bombs in such locations as ABC is quoted saying above, it paints a pretty wild picture.

    When Brett got out of prison, he made his way to the Ukraine. Then when he returned, his online efforts involved all these weird Russian voices like Jason Leopold and Larissa Alexandrova and Ron Brynaert. Basically the left was presented with hysterical conspiracies.

    I can’t remember the exact figures, but it’s lucrative. Isn’t that amazing?

    Anyway, they all seem to really need to stoke those fires of hatred. You can see that from Jesse, you see it from Neal Rauhauser’s games, and it seems to me like a consistent tactic of those who peddle myths is to keep the paranoid sect of the left very angry. I guess in this case they are mad at Clarence Thomas and Patterico.

    Patterico should feel flattered to be on that list, now that I think about it.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  36. EPWJ-
    If a jurisdiction doesn’t have the funds to investigate a murder…, I don’t know what to say.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  37. MD in Philly,

    The murder investigation apparently ended when the only witness — Fred Scyphers, the victim’s husband, who was only able to identify a suspect after being hypnotized — died 2 weeks after he IDed William Bowman as the suspected murderer. Bowman had recently been arrested in Texas with Kimberlin and 7 others in a marijuana smuggling case. Read this October 2010 Indianapolis Star article (Part 2, “Building the Case Against Brett Kimberlin) for the details, as well as the “Related Links” in the left sidebar. The police and/or prosecutors quite reasonably decided to pursue the much stronger bombing case against Kimberlin, rather than whether he hired or directed Bowman to murder Mrs. Scyphers.

    There are also more details in this earlier IndyStar article by Joseph Gelarden.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  38. You really need to read the 2010 IndyStar article, MD. It’s the first link in my last comment.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  39. #OccupyForAssholes.org and super genius folk hero Jesse LaGreca just need the fat fake cash rewards on that website to help complete the Velvet Revolution template.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  40. Most famously, he [Brett Kimberlin] is the man who from his prison cell alleged that as a law student Dan Quayle bought marijuana from him.

    He did that, not in 1988, but only in 1992. It took him (or somebody else) time to think of the idea. It hadn’t been thought of yet in 1988, when Quayle first ran for election as Vice President.

    Gary Trudeau, who draws the Doonesbury comic, persisted in taking the accusation seriously.

    Comment by MD in Philly — 11/21/2011 @ 9:21 am

    I want to make sure I got this straight: Kimberlin carried out a series of bombings to draw interest away from his possible involvment with a murder… (scratches head, does a “Columbo” puzzled look, waves cigar in the air, scratches head again.) Whatever happened to the murder investigation, BTW?

    Fox News may be describing this somewhat clumsily and using the wrong words..

    Those words apparently come from “authorities”

    http://patterico.com/2010/10/11/brad-friedmans-partner-and-buddy-a-convicted-bomber-perjurer-and-drug-smuggler-suspected-murderer-and-election-integrity-hero/

    “Authorities suspected Kimberlin did the bombings as a distraction from a murder investigation”

    Further deponent sayeth not. You have to guess.

    I would like more detail, but it seems to imply something like this:

    Once the detectives who were on the take presented the DA with an already solved bombing case that would send Brett Kimberlin to jail for a life sentence – that actually later on turned out to be a lot less than a life sentence but that only became apparent later – interest in the murder investigation dropped, and it was a lot easier to stall or botch the murder investigation

    The DA probably had a habit of never prosecuting someone for two identically serious but quite different crimes but only picked the the one with the longer jail sentence or more certain conviction so that the other crimes never got on the record.

    And besides that way you avoid double jeopardy.

    It was a difficult murder investigation:

    the sole eyewitness to the murder identified one of Kimberlin’s confederates as the man who killed Jessica’s grandmother. But the witness soon died of cancer, and no charges were ever brought against Kimberlin for the murder.

    I guess the idea is commit other crimes, and maybe they’ll prosecute you for these other easily solvable crimes and forget about all the rest. Was there a potential death poenalty in the murder case?

    I still have a pre-2000 HD

    Two gigabytes? Most of my material on Vincent Foster and some other things dates from when I had less storage, but you don’t need all that much storage for this sort of thing.. You can also back it up on floippy drives and Zip drives.

    oldest son on the beat in West Philly being promoted to detective training. Mixed feelings- he is a good cop on the street that the community likes, those are needed, but for him personally this is a good thing.

    Good for the community too, unless theer are no replacements and he’s not good at his new job. This is actually a more important job.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  41. DRJ, that makes sense. I shouldn’t say the investigators fell short because that implies I know they could have done a better job.

    If Brett’s willing to blow up police cars, it might be hard to beat him within the system on every crime. I can only imagine the crimes he’s committed that we’ll never know about.

    Brett being involved with drug operations reminds me that there are probably a few new Bretts with new guns, courtesy of Eric Holder and Fast and Furious. What a messy world.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  42. MD,

    I think your son’s promotion is great, and I’m sure he will continue to do good works helping people who need it. Please thank him for me, and pat yourself on the back for raising such a fine son.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  43. MD – what DRJ said, not what epwj made up.

    JD (b5260c)

  44. EPWJ made something up?

    SHOCKA!!!

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  45. “Once the detectives who were on the take”

    Sammy – Case?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  46. porcine

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  47. i may come back, ive quit before, who can say?

    Why would you announce this crap in a blog comment section? Jeesh, just get over yourself. And you’ll be back. It’s the only place where you can feel superior without really having to demonstrate it.

    OccupyCeilingCat (721840)

  48. No, the primary reason the murder wasn’t solved was due to the death of the key witness. You can read up on the whole story of the murder angle in the IndyStar series. This is the key article (in PDF). The rest of the series is online here. I suggest reading multiple sources – each have their own extra little pieces of information & areas of focus.

    There are also court documents that are very, very interesting to read. The appeals offer a lot of detail not necessarily covered in media pieces. You can retrieve some of them here in Justia. Also search the Maryland courts for some of the later appeals, one of which discusses the parole revocation: non-payment to the Scyphers family, his inheretance and the payment from Singer’s book – you can read that one here at Leagle. I have many documents in my research files, if anyone needs additional suggestions.

    Liberty Chick (230f2f)

  49. Sammy Finkelman #41,

    Just before the 1988 election, Kimberlin did allege to several reporters that he had sold drugs to Quayle, but Kimberlin was in prison and Bureau of Prison authorities prevented him from holding his planned press conference. See this Chicago Tribune article.

    In addition, the Indianapolis Star reported that Kimberlin was suspected by the police of planting bombs in order to distract their investigation of Julia Scypher’s murder:

    The bomb that maimed Carl DeLong on Sept. 6, 1978 turned out to be the last one, but residents of Speedway didn’t know that. Each day people wondered when and where the Speedway Bomber would strike again. As far as the public knew, investigators had no idea who was behind it.

    But local police, assisted by federal marshals, did have their eye on a suspect; someone they theorized might even have set the bombs to distract attention from another crime — a murder.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  50. Oh, you mean if you’re is prison you can’t hold press conferences?

    Huh. Too bad staying out of prison is just so difficult to manage. Oh wait, no, it’s the easiest thing in the world.

    LC, thanks for the Justia link. I never thought of that.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  51. if you’re is prison

    I work here is done.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  52. If you’re is prison.

    Is that english?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  53. Anyways the left are hypocrites in regards to Prop 8 and everything else.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  54. Thanks for the info DRJ, Dustin, JD, Liberty Chick, Sammy, EPWJ-

    So….in addition to the (presumably natural) death of the star witness, just as a dead murderer is dead, whether the crime was racially motivated or not, a criminal in for life is in for life…except dead is dead and life can be parolled.

    Sammy, my pre-2000 hardware was in reference to the built-in between my ears. Not as easily upgraded, hence prioritization of info is necessary.

    And thanks for the good wishes towards my oldest. My comments were based on the fact that being an officer on the beat is a relatively thankless task with accusations of being abusive. Those kind of conditions usually make it hard to keep good people.
    (An aside, his girlfriend does not much like the idea of what police officers do, so she claims that “he sits around and eats donuts all day with the other police, never anything more exciting or dangerous than that, no, never.”)

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  55. Is that english?

    Comment by DohBiden —

    I meant “in” instead of “is”.

    Sorry!

    MD, congrats on your son’s promotion, like DRJ said.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  56. “…his girlfriend…”

    Doc, it’s her method of coping with the danger that he exposes himself to.
    That famous river in Egypt, and all.

    AD-RtR/OS! (db1e05)

  57. Thanks, Dustin.

    Exactly, AD. We just think it is kind of funny because she knows exactly what she is doing, where “denial” in the standard sense is a subconscious/unconscious activity. (She is acting like good old Sgt. Schultz on Hogan’s Heros- “I see nothing!”)

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  58. LC – Great link on the resentencing for the parole violation. It really illustrates what a mendacious, time-wasting, process abusing, scumbag, progressive hero Brett Kimberlin is for all to see.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  59. If he were this successful as a conservative activist, his would be a household name. It would be proof the right is crazy and violent.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  60. So what did he say?

    No factories so we can have no pollution.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  61. Congratulations and best of luck to your son, MD in Philly. In Chicago, detective is an “exempt” position which means the candidate caught the eye of superiors willing to stick their necks out for him, i.e. a good cop.

    Hiya, DRJ.

    nk (889634)

  62. Comment by DRJ — 11/21/2011 @ 11:03 am

    Just before the 1988 election, Kimberlin did allege to several reporters that he had sold drugs to Quayle, but Kimberlin was in prison and Bureau of Prison authorities prevented him from holding his planned press conference. See this Chicago Tribune article.

    Oh, yes, now I remeber the story was that he had wanted to say this in 1988, but that – he wanted people to think – influence by the Adminstration had prevented him from holding that press conference and warning people. But the question was, did he really intend to allege that in 1988?

    While, the October 04, 1996 Chicago Tribune article does say he “gained national attention with prison claims of having sold drugs to Dan Quayle long before he was elected to Congress” But it doesn’t say he gained national attention in 1988. He gained national attention in 1992.

    The article doesn’t say that he actually made this claim of having sold drugs to Dan Quayle to anyone in 1988.

    In addition, the Indianapolis Star reported that Kimberlin was suspected by the police of planting bombs in order to distract their investigation of Julia Scypher’s murder:

    http://www.indystar.com/assets/pdf/BG164276919.PDF

    Seems like one bo,mbing waas a coverup for the other bombings!

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  63. nk….Kay Passah?

    AD-RtR/OS! (db1e05)

  64. MD

    Manpower is finite, in a crime wave, less evidence leads to more manpower – which equals time – and with time – successful resolution of cases diminishes.

    EricPWJohnson (2a58f7)

  65. Kimberlin reminds me of the Al Qaeda sympatizer caught just now. He was an Islamic terrorism.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  66. Dems want to cut Medicaid and Medicare not the Repubs.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  67. Mr. nk!!

    hello to you!

    happyfeet (a55ba0)

  68. Run nk Run, they are crazier than ever ;)

    Oh and welcome back!

    EricPWJohnson (2a58f7)

  69. He was sympathetic to terrorists I mean.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  70. Hello nk.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  71. Comment by daleyrocks — 11/21/2011 @ 10:50 am

    Once the detectives who were on the take”

    Sammy – Case?

    That was just part of the speculative scenario.

    It’s one thing for one case to take priority, but if the real reaosn for committing a serious crime
    is to take attention from a murder investigation, it would seem like someone would need inside ionformation to do that.

    Actually he might have wanted, at all costs, to avoid going to jail for smuggling marijuana, because in that case his co-conspirators might want to kill him against the possibility he would turn state’s evidence.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  72. Found in my archives in something I saved August 5, 1999 (about the train deaths in Arkansas)

    In 1992, Clinton operative Cody Shearer unearthed convicted bomber Brett Kimberlin, who claimed Indiana prison authorities were preventing him from airing his accusation that he’d sold Vice President Dan Quayle a marijuana cigarette while Quayle was in college.

    The press descended like a swarm of locusts, making Kimberlin an overnight media darling. Only years later would reporters acknowledge that Kimberlin likely fabricated the charge.

    Though it’s been in the public domain since at least 1996, Sharline Wilson’s far more credible allegation has been ignored by journalists, some of whom now demand to know whether George W. Bush has ever used cocaine.

    Wilson has encouraged friends to contact Gov. Huckabee on her behalf. The email address given in Tuesday’s report was incorrect.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  73. Sorry for the O/T

    But who is Obama fooling when he accuses repubs of siding with the wealthy over the working class when he has extremely wealthy cronys?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  74. Actually, Kimberlin DID make the Quayle claim in 1988. And it WAS reported on, and denied, at the time. It was REVIVED in 1992 by Trudeau.

    The DEA had investigated another unnamed Indiana drug dealer’s 1982 claims, and found them to be false. When Kimberlin made his claim in 1988, the DEA and others again confirmed the claim was untrue.

    Which reminds me…another interesting character in the story to peek at that I never had time to write about: Bill Clinton’s friend (and Kimberlin’s “guardian angel”), Cody Shearer. Read about him and Kimberlin here and here.

    I had to set aside the Shearer piece of the research after wading into what I thought was tin-foil territory:

    “Shearer’s efforts as a free-lance political fixer have not been limited to domestic affairs. Much to the embarrassment of his brother-in-law and the consternation of others in the State Department, details have recently emerged about Shearer’s efforts, in 1996 and 1997, to arrange for Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic to surrender to the International War Crimes Tribunal in the Hague. According to his lawyer, Shearer took less than $25,000 from an associate of Karadzic’s in France in the fall of 1997. Accounts vary as to what happened next, but it appears that Shearer was either duped by the Serbs or double-crossed by them. Karadzic, as the saying goes, is still at large.”

    Turned out, it wasn’t so tin-foil after all. If you’ve read ‘Citizen K,’ you may be wondering what I was.

    Suddenly all those ‘Falcon & the Snowman’ Russian spy videos and weird links to maps of Serbia that one of our recent harassers (Kneel) kept sending to us seems almost funnier now…

    Liberty Chick (230f2f)

  75. Sammy – Are you deliberately not trying to make sense?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  76. nk,

    It’s wonderful to hear from you again. I’ve missed you.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  77. nk,

    I have missed you too! It’s great to see you. What’s going on?

    Patterico (f724ca)

  78. Sammy #64,

    The media knew about Kimberlin’s claims in 1988 and you don’t have to take my word for it. Here is an excerpt from the U.S. Court of Appeals, D.C. Circuit opinion in Kimberlin’s lawsuit against prison officials who he claimed “conspired to violate and in fact violated Kimberlin’s rights under the first and fifth amendments to the United States Constitution by denying him, respectively, access to the press and due process of law”:

    The circumstances giving rise to Kimberlin’s claims are largely undisputed. Sometime before the November 8, 1988 presidential election, while incarcerated at the El Reno Federal Correctional Institution (El Reno) in El Reno, Oklahoma, [FN]3 Kimberlin announced to members of the news media that he had sold marijuana to Dan Quayle, the Republican candidate for Vice President, when Quayle was a law student in the early 1970s. On November 3, the Thursday before the election, NBC News contacted El Reno authorities and requested an interview with Kimberlin. The Bureau’s Central Office in Washington, under pressure from NBC News, directed that the interview be expedited in order to occur before the election. Accordingly, the interview was conducted on Friday November 4. [FN]4 On either Thursday or Friday, an official at the Bush/Quayle Campaign, having learned of the situation from other sources, telephoned the Bureau “for additional information” and was informed of the interview. Memorandum from Quinlan to Francis A. Keating, II, Associate Attorney General (Keating Memorandum) at 4. [FN]5

    The Court’s footnotes for the above paragraph:

    Footnote 3 — Kimberlin is serving a fifty-one year sentence for drug- and explosives-related charges.

    Footnote 4 — NBC News ultimately declined to broadcast the story.

    Footnote 5 — The exact date of the call is unclear as Quinlan placed it on “Friday, November 3rd,” misidentifying either the day of the week or the date. Keating Memorandum at 4.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  79. Daleyrocks are you deliberately trying to project?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  80. Run nk Run, they are crazier than ever
    Comment by EricPWJohnson — 11/21/2011 @ 1:53 pm

    – Well said. Why, some of them even falsely accuse Herman Cain of committing rape and releasing ads that label fellow Republicans as “klansmen”! Can you imagine?

    Icy (4105dd)

  81. Sammy – Are you deliberately not trying to make sense?
    Comment by daleyrocks — 11/21/2011 @ 4:25 pm

    – Hear, hear!!!

    Icy (4105dd)

  82. Sorry for the O/T
    – You always are.

    Daleyrocks are you deliberately trying to project?
    – Dude, if YOU understand Sammy’s barely coherent rambles, then perhaps you have found a kindred spirit at last.

    Is that english?
    – Ahh, the knave hath found his signature line at last!

    Icy (4105dd)

  83. Comment by daleyrocks — 11/21/2011 @ 4:25 pm

    Sammy – Are you deliberately not trying to make sense?

    No, but I was writing before I get things clear and getting some things wrong, because I didn’t read the background, so that what I say doesn’t wind up making any sense given some facts.

    I am also assuming knowledge and leaving out a lot of things.

    I found out now:

    Brett Kimberlin did go to jail for marijuana smuggling, so the Speedway (name of a city apparently) Indiana bombings were not an attempt to find another crime to go to jail for instead.

    Also the bombings were done at the same time the murder investigation was going on. The murder of Julia Schyphers took place on Saturday, July 29, 1978, and the bombings took place from September 1 to September 6, 1978.

    The thought that they were a diversion, is attributed already back to that time (1978) in an undated but probably 1981 Indianapolis Star article linked to here by Liberty Chick. (the article implies it was written about a week or so after his conviction for the bombings)

    Some people thought the bombings were a diversion. The bombings would attract a lot of police attention – but on the other hand it was a less serious crime.

    The newspaper article says:

    …the blasts seemed to be set in areas where they would cause damage but not injury..

    They were probably intended NOT to be extremely serious crimes. And they didn’t stop the murder investigation, if that was the idea. You know, I don’t see how he became a suspect. Something is missing in this story, like an informant.

    My speculation that Kimberlin had some inside information is borne out by the article, because there is speculation in that article:

    “We think it [a Mercedes belonging to Brett Kimberlin that he took to Dayton, Ohio on Sept 13, 1978] was at the home of a Kimberlin girlfriend, [for some days before Sept 13] said a source. “At the time she was a law clerk for U.S. Magistrate Thomas Faulconer. Faulconer’s office is next door to the office occupied by the federal prosecutors. The closeness caused some worry that sensitive information might be leaked to Kimberlin. No leak was ever detected.

    Sammy Finkelman (2d0c86)

  84. That’s my man Patterico! Preserving civilization and the rule of law by day since 12/13/1993! And destroying them both hand over fist by night on his blog since 2/27/2003! Huzzah!

    Beldar (c3ab0d)

  85. DohBiden – Are you the commenter formerly known as HeavenSent, ObamaUberAlles, etc.?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  86. “Daleyrocks are you deliberately trying to project?”

    DohBiden – No, that’s your gig.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  87. Now let me try to say something that makes a little more sense. (Just trying to make sense of what I read so far)

    Kimberlin had an in, into federal law enforcement – which he might logically have a need for in order to go on with his marijuana business for so long – but he had no penetration into local law enforcement.

    The bombings were intended to take the whole investigation and maybe prosecution of Brett Kimberlin away from local law enforcement and into the control of federal law enforcement, where he would use his contacts to let himself off easy.

    Only things didn’t quite work out as intended.

    While he maybe did get the local murder investigation de-prioritized, Kimberlin got heavily prosecuted by he Feds – all because of one Bernard L. (Buddy) Pylitt.

    [http://www.katzkorin.com/attorneysPylitt.aspx

    This part of his life in missing from this profile, but according to the 1981 Indianapolis Star article he was the first assistant U.S. Attorney who co-ordinated the prosecution. The 1981 (?) Indianapolis Str article described him as a former first assistant U.S. Attorney but doesn’t say when he left.

    He seems to have some integrity in 2011:

    http://www.ogdenonpolitics.com/2011/06/election-recount-commission-unanimously.htmlb

    In jail, Brett Kimberlin attempted to get someone to murder Bernard Pylitt, and if not that, get him into bed with a girl and videotape it.

    At an early stage, maybe Kimberlin did influence or control the investigation:

    About two weeks after he was arrested [in late 1978, after he was connected to the bombings] Kimberlin was released from jail. The charges were dropped because state and federal prosecutors wanted to dig deeper into his background and decide whether he should be charged on state or federal charges

    It certainly doesn’t make any sense left that way, without comment. Maybe the idea was the Feds would take over with an ultimately weak case.

    As I said, if so, Bernard Pylitt ruined the whole plot. That, and maybe some bad luck in Texas in February 1979.

    Sammy Finkelman (2d0c86)

  88. And here are some things on Burger Chef murders, Friday, November 17, 1978. Brett Kimberlin (or his gang) was suspected of being linked to that.

    http://www.indystar.com/article/99999999/NEWS06/80817006/StarFiles-Burger-Chef-murders

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-48748.html

    Sammy Finkelman (2d0c86)

  89. Comment by DohBiden — 11/21/2011 @ 2:52 pm

    But who is Obama fooling when he accuses repubs of siding with the wealthy over the working class when he has extremely wealthy cronys?

    Some of the people, some of the time – and besides he accuses the Republicans of siding with ALL wealthy people, as a group, in principle.

    Sammy Finkelman (2d0c86)

  90. Wow now i’am an Obama voter?

    Are you gonna accuse me of being Eric Holders fat jewish cousin you insufferable Romneybot?

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  91. “Dude, if YOU understand Sammy’s barely coherent rambles, then perhaps you have found a kindred spirit at last.”

    Icy – Thanks a lot!

    I think if somebody manages to decipher Sammy’s stream of consciousness ramblings, 360 degree base covering, that it’s Sammy who has found a kindred spirit. But YMMV.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  92. I walk into a bar.

    The bartender says “We don’t serve your typo around here”.

    It’s interesting how many people are pretty well informed on Brett Kimberlin. My impression is that he’s much better known than he was not long ago, and his ‘exonorated’ myth is no longer working. Only guy I know actively defending Brett anymore is that Ron nut.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  93. Sammy doesn’t make good use of the quote function, but otherwise I have no problem with his comments. He’s always nice to people.

    Sad to see him being attacked just to get a few digs in on an already easy target.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  94. That’s true, Dustin.

    Sammy, thanks for the Burger Chef link. I had never seen that before. It’s a very, very sad story.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  95. It’s a bizarre story, made more so by the fact it is true, the part that he tricked the Supreme Court
    into reducing his sentence, that he was rehabilitated with the Olive family inheritance, and that he would spin out bizarre theories about
    electronic voter tampering, out of McCarry’s ‘Better Angels’ and the ‘roman view of politics’ with the business about Connell, passes credulity.

    narciso (ef1619)

  96. Sammy is a good guy Daleymoron.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  97. And isn’t it ironic that the dems target the Catholic Church for their stance on BC although the cathloic church teaches about Birth Control.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  98. it’s an incrediburgable story

    happyfeet (3c92a1)

  99. How cute. OWS is making an enemies list.

    It’s always a good thing to be forewarned though. You never know when frustrated revolutionary posers such as OWS might resort to terrorism.

    Brad (b9b5bf)

  100. Brad, that’s right.

    Still remember driving by the Governor’s mansion and realizing they had just burned it down. Soon later, they were throwing bricks at bus loads of GOP convention goers. Some idiot just took some shots at the White House.

    Crazy times we’re in.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  101. Catholic*

    Wow brad that is surreal and in a bad way.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  102. “Sammy is a good guy Daleymoron.”

    “Sad to see him being attacked just to get a few digs in on an already easy target.”

    DohBiden, Dustin – Lighten up, he already went back and admitted he wasn’t making sense because he had not read the material or put the chronology together.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  103. “Wow now i’am an Obama voter?”

    DohBiden – Didn’t answer the question potty mouth.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  104. :roll:

    I will veto any compromise-Barack Obama.

    I want taxes raised after I extended the bush era tax cuts.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  105. That is obama’s mindset.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  106. Dustin – Lighten up,

    Good advice. Maybe you should lighten up too?

    Dustin (cb3719)

  107. Dustin lighten up

    Someone forgot to turn off the irony.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  108. Anyway

    Dustin (cb3719)

  109. Dustin lighten up.

    Period added.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  110. DRJ–the Burger Chef murders, the Scyphers killing, the bombings. There sure was a lot of murder and mayhem within just a few short months (5) in Speedway, a small town of only about 12,000 population.

    elissa (b9c190)

  111. Elissa, and it all stopped like that (imagine I snapped my fingers) when Kimberlin was caught.

    In retrospect, I have to appreciate the logic DRJ expressed (where they pursued a case where they could really prove the charges).

    They just wanted to stop this man.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  112. Thanks, nk.
    In Philly there is a test to take. The results of that get combined with a few other factors like seniority and such. Then the rank list comes out, and you wait until they call. The test was many months ago, the rank list not quite as many months ago; today comes the call to interview tomorrow, which is more confirmatory than an evaluation, then training next week or following.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  113. I have a hard time taking someone serious that is wearing a Civil War hat. I cannot be the only one.

    JD (318f81)

  114. Comment by MD in Philly — 11/21/2011 @ 8:40 pm

    late to the party but congrats to your son! Terrific news.

    and speaking of awesome:

    nk! Nice to see you around.

    no one you know (3e92e3)

  115. Thanks, noyk.

    Hm, a puzzlement just overtook me. If you call yourself “no one you know”, should I refer to you as “no one I know” (“noik”)? “no one we know” nowk?

    Once saw a cute thing on America’s Funniest Home Videos. Some mom was telling her daughter, maybe 3, that they were going to visit “Miami”, when the child referred to where they were going, she said “Your-ami”.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  116. I’m not sure that DohBiden deliberately tries to project.

    It’s more of a spontaneous-combustion type of deal.

    Icy (4105dd)

  117. Sammy is okay; I just strongly disagree with his opinion on the Dariano vs Morgan Hill School District case.

    Icy (4105dd)

  118. Icy your right Sammy is a nice guy.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  119. MD, how do you know that this isn’t simply his given name?
    (Who’s on first? What’s on second? No one you know; third base!)

    Then again, maybe he gets up each day, looks at himself in the mirror (go to the mirror, boy!) and sings:
    Don’t pretend that you know me,
    ’cause I don’t even know myself

    Icy (4105dd)

  120. OR . . . maybe he just forgot the comma and question mark:

    no one, you know?

    Icy (61f618)

  121. MD goes into Denny’s and orders Moons Over YOUR Hammy.

    Icy (61f618)

  122. Once saw a cute thing on America’s Funniest Home Videos. Some mom was telling her daughter, maybe 3, that they were going to visit “Miami”, when the child referred to where they were going, she said “Your-ami”.

    Comment by MD in Philly — 11/21/2011 @ 9:00 pm

    Adorable. Reminds me of that John Updike poem about one of the sadnesses of children growing up.

    no one you know (3e92e3)


  123. OR . . . maybe he just forgot the comma and question mark:

    no one, you know?

    Comment by Icy — 11/21/2011 @ 10:56 pm

    hadn’t known when I started posting here that I’d be around so long, so maybe should do a Princess Bride tribute and change the nick to “nooc”(Princess Bride fans will get it, and non fans should see the movie; the whole thing’s great and you won’t regret it)

    no one you know (3e92e3)

  124. All thru’ the day,
    You your yours, you your yours, you your yours;
    All thru’ the night,
    You your yours, you your yours, you your yours.

    [Okay, I'm done now]

    Icy (61f618)

  125. Glad you stayed around, noyk.

    JD (62da1e)

  126. Way off topic … I finished http://www.toughmudder.com this weekend.

    JD (62da1e)

  127. congrats JD!

    EricPWJohnson (4380b4)

  128. JD – You are one tough mudder!

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  129. Wow JD – congrats; saw the trailer @ the link and that is one tough course. Just one appalled question: “electroshock therapy”???

    no one you know (325a59)

  130. Congratulations, JD. Does your ortho doc know this is your idea of rehab?

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  131. Noyk – there were 2 electroshock obstacles, the one you saw, and one where you had to low crawl under barbed wire thru ice water, and the live wires hung from the barbed wire. Alas, even that did not cure me.

    DRJ – I think I would be classified as non-compliant. ;-)

    JD (62da1e)

  132. Wow, JD, that’s pretty impressive. Love that more than 2 million has been raised for Wounded Warrior project.

    Dana (4eca6e)

  133. Thanks for the “welcome back”s, everybody.

    I have been lurking for a while.

    To make a long story short, I fell backwards on my own stairs. I have frontal cortical and cerebellar lesions and five damaged vertebrae, with the attendant balance problems and some cognitive, memory and speech impediments.

    But unlike JD, I was the star pupil at PT/OT. ;)

    nk (889634)

  134. nk – Sorry to hear about the accident.

    Hope you are on the mend and that your daughter is doing well.

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  135. JD – How many other people apart from you were completing the course in kilts?

    daleyrocks (bf33e9)

  136. Daley – 2

    Nk – ouch. Hope your recovery goes well.

    Dana – a guy from WW did the course as a double amputee. It was humbling, and inspirational.

    JD (62da1e)

  137. a guy from WW did the course as a double amputee. It was humbling, and inspirational.

    …what an amazingly blunt reminder this Thanksgiving week that we have an obligation to live in thankfulness for what we have, including our good health. I imagine it was a humbling experience.

    Dana (4eca6e)

  138. Hope nk is doing well.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  139. get better mister

    happyfeet (3c92a1)

  140. O/T-But I love how the left insist that Medicare and SS will be automatically cut in 2013 when it won’t.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  141. For those interested, the best way to hurdle the learning curve would be to read Citizen K.

    The “underage” female in question was actually a preteen, but I am not sure what the timeline of her relationship with Kimberlin was in regards to the actual specifics of the relationship. She was Julia Scyphers’ granddaughter and the daughter of Kimberlin’s friend Sandra or something Barton.

    Julia’s husband Fred identified an associate of Kimberlin as the gunman. I believe his name was William Bowman. Fred died of cancer, and the police no longer had a witness.

    On the Dan Quayle thing- There was a federal list of politicians and other public figures suspected of drug use or various things. Dan Quayle was on the list. The theory is that Kimberlin somehow found this out and concocted his sold pot to Dan Quayle myth.

    In last week’s court session while acting as my own attorney (no I am not an attorney), I got to cross-examine Kimberlin. He denied setting the bombs. He perhaps also said he was exonerated, but that part of the agreement states that details are to remain confidential. I say perhaps because I don’t want to go by memory. Once folks like Liberty Chick and Patterico parse through that proceeding, they are going to have a lot of juicy things to write about which transcend myself as an individual.

    This will probably sound pompous, but I put on a clinic. It was as if Vincent Gambini channeled himself through me.

    The Burger Chef murders in all likelihood had nothing to do with any of it. Imho, it is a deadend and waste of time to research.

    It appears Kimberlin was able to get an easier sentence because the use of hynosis played a role in the trial. Nonetheless, the evidence that he set the bombs was overwhelming.

    Dustin makes a very good point, that very recently not many people knew this story. This stuff happened before the internet truly took off. Yeah, there are some court documents and other whatnot available. But that is scarce. One thing I noticed when first becoming fascinated with this years ago was how little info there was concerning the fact Brett Kimberlin was a primary suspect for the murder of Julia Scyphers.

    There are the obvious liberal leaning folks who supported him back in the day like Trudeau and Shearer. There was also a respected retired judge with plenty o’gravitas who befriended Kimberlin.

    The reason why myself, Goatsred, Patterico, and Liberty Chick are attacked is simple. The main target is Breitbart. I think the key to understanding this mess goes beyond left-right politics. It appears donations have leveled off or dropped substantially due to information exposed these last few years.

    I was targeted because I definitely figured out how to play the search engine game. I humbly add that my schtick was original and covered connections no one else has. I ultimately “won” my case because the stuff I blogged on was from open sources and transcended who I am in ‘real life’. I am to this day being attacked because it fits into the anti-Breitbart schtick. Cybersmearing is being used as a tool to intimidate me into keeping my yapper shut.

    Prepostericity (caabef)

  142. I’m very sorry to hear about your injuries, nk.

    Great to see you around, though, like everyone else said.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  143. prayers going up, nk

    no one you know (325a59)

  144. _________________________________________________

    OK, so, my name’s Jesse LaGreca and I’m really proud to be here speaking out about Occupy Accountability, about the rule of law. I am standing with Velvet Revolution,

    You’re a fool then, LaGreca, because Kimberlin is — surprise, surprise — of the left. When I read Patterico’s brief description of Kimberlin — of someone who sounded like a real murderous scumbag — I wasn’t sure what Kimerline’s political slant was like. My first assumption was that he perhaps was the type who bombed abortion clinics and gunned down its owners, meaning an ultra-rightist.

    I know that when one peers below a dark, sleazy surface, that on occasion a rightist will pop up. But on so many other occasions, scratch below the surface and it will be a leftist who merges from the shadows and waves “hi.”

    Foxnews.mobi:

    Using two popular leftist blogs, [Brett Kimberlin] the 56-year-old from Bethesda, Md., has raised hundreds of thousands of dollars from the public and left-leaning foundations by promising to put conservatives he disagrees with in jail, often with offers of large rewards. So far — without success — he has called for the arrest of Karl Rove, Andrew Breitbart, Chamber of Commerce head Tom Donohue, Massey Energy Chairman Don Blankenship and other high-profile public figures.

    A review of tax filings for Kimberlin’s blogs, “Velvet Revolution” and “Justice Through Music,” raises troubling questions about whether his “nonprofit” operations are dedicated to public activism — or are just a new facade for a longtime con artist.

    Though neither website publicly reveals Kimberlins role, tax and corporate documents show that he is one of four directors who incorporated the Velvet Revolution, and that he is the registered agent for the tax-exempt, non-stock company, which is registered at his mother’s house in Bethesda.

    Kimberlin is also one of two incorporators of Justice Through Music, as well as a $19,500-a-year employee of the non-profit, whose purpose is to shed light on some of the injustices of the world through music and which took in more than $550,000 in contributions in 2008.

    Along with leftists like Kimberlin to always be aware of, another figurehead who best sums up all the propaganda and publicity swirling around the Occupy Wall Street crowd is that of Bernie Madoff. He not only is one of the biggest SOB swindlers of them all, he was a liberal Democrat.

    The irony of what liberal biases do to the human mind — and society — never ceases to amaze and sicken.

    Mark (411533)

  145. Comment by Liberty Chick — 11/21/2011 @ 3:31 pm

    Actually, Kimberlin DID make the Quayle claim in 1988. And it WAS reported on, and denied, at the time. It was REVIVED in 1992 by Trudeau.

    I’m seeing that it was made in 1988. I thought the claim that he inteneded to make that charge in 1988 was just anmother lie by Brett Kimberlin, designed to enhance the credibility of hsi claim in 1992..

    One of your references is a Los Angeles Times article dated November 07, 1991. It says:

    On two separate occasions in the last three years, Times reporters have examined and found no truth to allegations that Vice President Dan Quayle bought drugs as a law student and later as a senator…..The first allegation was made just before the 1988 presidential election. An Indiana man serving 50 years in prison for drug smuggling and a series of bombings claimed to have sold marijuana to Quayle in the early 1970s when Quayle was a student at Indiana University Law School. Reporters were unable to find anyone who could support the allegation.

    This article also says:

    The allegations–similar to charges contained in Doonesbury comic strips that are scheduled to run for two weeks, starting Monday–were originally made by convicted drug dealers, and reporters were unable to find any credible corroboration. As a result, the decision was made in both instances not to write a story about the allegations.

    The next reference dated Saturday, June 21, 2008

    In 1988, it was a man known simply as the Speedway Bomber, who grabbed national media attention when he made drug allegations against George H.W. Bush’s vice-presidential running mate, Indiana’s own Dan Quayle.

    Noiw I think I can testify that it did NOT gain national attention in 1988. And as the 1991 article states, the Los Angeles Times did not write about them at all then. Almost nobody but a few reporters and, I suppose, the Bush campaign heard about them – and in 1992 I don’t remember any detailed claim about having been told this.

    For some reason the idea that this gained national attention in 1988 seems to have become the new truth, possibly because maybe they did come to the attention of Dan Quayle – and when he wrote his book he might have been using a ghostwriter.

    In his book, “Standing Firm”, Quayle described his disdain for the inordinate amount of attention the mainstream media afforded to the Speedway Bomber’s allegations just weeks before the critical 1988 presidential election.

    But they DIDN’T give it any attention in 1988!

    Quayle writes:

    [T]he press felt there had to be some drug story about the first boomer candidate, and in the last weeks of the campaign a convicted felon bent on exploiting the system cooked up just the story some of them wanted. Brett Kimberlin was a perjurer doing a fifty-one year federal prison sentence for terrorizing the town of Speedway, Indiana, by planting eight bombs in seven days. The explosions maimed several people, including a Vietnam veteran, the father of two young children, who lost his leg. Suddenly, just before the election, he was claiming to have regularly sold me marijuana. He said he wanted to show how “hypocritical” my anti-drug positions were.

    There was not a shred of truth to his bizarre accusation, nor a single witness to back it up, and if anyone could have less credibility I have a hard time imagining who it would be. (CBS’s “60 Minutes” would eventually spend two years looking into this story before deciding that there was nothing there.) But the media in the frantic final days of the campaign didn’t care about facts and ran with the story anyway. On the Friday before the election Kimberlin scheduled a press conference. Before he could manage to hold it, the Federal Bureau of Prisons put him into administrative detention. He was in and out of solitary for the next ten days, partly for violating prison rules and partly, according to the bureau director, out of concern for his personal safety. There was a controversy, inevitably, over whether the Reagan administration or the Bush campaign pulled some strings to keep him quiet until the election was over. Whether they did overact and exert pressure, I don’t know, but Kimberlin’s story was so ridiculous that it should never have made its way into the mainstream media. Even assuming the worst, I’ll let Larry Sabato have the last even-handed word about this incident. In “Feeding Frenzy” he says that “the responsible federal officials, if not the Bush/Quayle campaign itself, have only themselves to blame for elevating Kimberlin to martyr status. But there is also a pitiful quality to the way in which the press let itself be manipulated by an apparently publicity-hungry federal prisoner guilty of heinous crimes.”

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  146. Newspaper search:

    http://news.google.com/newspapers

    use http://aa.usno.navy.mil/data/docs/JulianDate.php

    tp get teh Julian date.

    then do a search like:

    Brett kimberlin daterange:2443742-2445566

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  147. nk,

    I’m sorry to hear about your accident. You obviously suffered very serious injuries, but I’m glad you’re here again and I’m praying for you. (It would also be great to exchange emails if you feel like it.)

    I used to think that serious spine and neurological injuries were like broken bones, where recovery is steady and predictable, but I don’t think that’s how it works. But it will happen so hang in there and let us help if we can, because you know when you’re here you’re with friends.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  148. I hadn’t realized or remembered that that the Doonesbury columns (at least the first time Gary Trudeau raised this, and I only read about them some time later since I wqasn’t regularly reading them) was nearly a year before the November 1992 election.

    The first mention in the Google News archive (which is now closed, but it was a place newspapers could upload the text of their back issues and which is not now easy to find) is a New York Times story dated December 20, 1988.

    This is the link:

    http://www.nytimes.com/1988/12/20/us/solitary-for-quayle-s-accuser.html

    The Justice Department said today that four days before last month’s election, its senior prison official ordered solitary confinement for an inmate who tried to call news conferences to assert that he once sold marijuana to Dan Quayle.

    No evidence has surfaced to document the charges by the inmate, Brett Kimberlin, who is in the Federal Correctional Facility at El Reno, Okla., serving a 51-year sentence on drug- and explosives-related charges. Vice President-elect Quayle has denied using drugs.

    Loye Miller, the director of the Justice Department’s public affairs office, confirmed an account of the episode today in The Legal Times, a Washington newspaper. He said Mr. Kimberlin was twice placed in administrative detention on the order of J. Michael Quinlan, head of the Federal Bureau of Prisons.

    Mr. Miller said he knew of no evidence to suggest that Mr. Kimberlin was confined to avoid any damage his statements might cause the Bush-Quayle campaign. He said the inmate had been interviewed by at least three national news organizations before he was placed in solitary confinement, adding, ”It wasn’t exactly as if he was kept under a rock.”

    The next article in the archive (that mentions both Brett Kimberlin and Dan Quayle) is from
    the Miami Herald – March 12, 1990 – page 9A FRONT

    http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_product=MH&s_site=miami&p_multi=MH&p_theme=realcities&p_action=search&p_maxdocs=200&p_topdoc=1&p_text_direct-0=0EB33FE5E0397E88&p_field_direct-0=document_id&p_perpage=10&p_sort=YMD_date:D&s_trackval=GooglePM

    INMATE CHARGES PLOT TO SILENCE HIS CLAIM HE SOLD POT TO QUAYLE

    A convicted drug smuggler who claims he sold marijuana to Vice President Dan Quayle in the early 1970s has charged prison officials with harassing him to keep him quiet during the 1988 presidential campaign. In an administrative complaint filed Dec. 14 [1989] with the Federal Bureau of Prisons, Brett Kimberlin claims he was thrown into solitary confinement without justification after he called a news conference to announce his claim. Officials canceled the news conference at the…

    Purchase complete article, of 301 words

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  149. I found a 1991 New York Times article that allegations about Dan Quayle and marijuana were first raised in 1982 (by a different drug dealer)

    http://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/07/us/allegations-of-drug-use-by-quayle-were-held-groundless-by-agency.html

    Two former heads of the drug agency said in interviews today that they remembered the inquiry, and one said that the accuser, then a prisoner in Indiana, had recanted the accusation after being confronted with evidence that it was false.

    The same report was later brought to 60 Minutes in 1990, and Morley Safer was present at two lie detector tests. Don Hewitt (who was sometimes very political, affecting two elections both of them probably of interest to The Outfit – he made Nixon look bad on TV in the 1960 debate and he gave Bill Clinton that softball interview in 1992 – fair warning about his general honesty. This is a guy who wanted to buy CBS News in 1986 and rename it Potamkin News – inside joke I guess. Potemkin News get it?)

    Don Hewitt, as I was saying, told the New York Times about that other drug dealer: “The guy not only flunks the test, but then he breaks down and cries in front of Morley and says, ‘I made it up, trying to get out of jail.’ ”

    The second accusation against the Vice President, on which much of Mr. Trudeau’s strips are based, was made on the eve of the 1988 Presidential election by Brett Kimberlin, a 37-year-old inmate then serving a 51-year term in a Federal prison in Oklahoma for drug-smuggling and bombing offenses.

    In interviews from his prison cell with reporters from the national press shortly before the 1988 election, Mr. Kimberlin said he had regularly sold marijuana to Mr. Quayle in the 1970′s, when he was a law student. Mr. Quayle has denied the accusations, which are not substantiated, and has said he never met Mr. Kimberlin.

    As rumors of the allegations spread, [among reporters?] Mr. Kimberlin scheduled a news conference on Nov. 4, 1988. But that day, prison officials placed him in solitary confinement on orders for the Bureau of Prisons headquarters in Washington. Except for a 36-hour respite, he remained there until Nov. 14, six days after Mr. Quayle’s election.

    Mr. Trudeau’s strip depicts a fictional interview with Mr. Kimberlin in which the inmate says he was placed in solitary confinement to keep him from talking about Mr. Quayle’s “file” at the drug agency.

    In an actual telephone interview today from the prison where he is now being held, in Tennessee, Mr. Kimberlin said that he had planned to assert at the news conference both that he had sold Mr. Quayle drugs and that “there was a D.E.A. investigative file put together on Quayle and his alleged use or involvement in cocaine.”

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  150. Prepostericity,

    That’s a really nasty individual you have led the way on exposing. You should be proud of that. If I were in your shoes, I would think it was worth the ridiculous hassle and smears you’ve dealt with.

    Dustin (cb3719)

  151. nk, glad you’re recovering well.

    But, that opens up the obligatory lawyer joke…
    How did they know you had suffered neurological damage?

    AD-RtR/OS! (031141)

  152. I swear these people are patsys for the Obama admin.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  153. Here is a link to the court decision in Kimberlin’s 1985 appeal

    http://openjurist.org/776/f2d/1344/united-states-v-c-kimberlin

    Kennard P. Foster was still on the case.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  154. nk, best wishes for your prompt recovery.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  155. This will probably sound pompous, but I put on a clinic. It was as if Vincent Gambini channeled himself through me.

    When channeling Vincent Gambini, always remember this quote:

    Everything that guy just said is bullshit.

    I imagine it’s a good quote to use when speaking right after Brett Kimberlin.

    Patterico (f724ca)

  156. nk,

    I am very sorry to hear about your fall and your serious injuries. I am glad you seem to be doing OK and thrilled to see you once again commenting on the blog.

    Patterico (f724ca)

  157. nk,
    sorry to hear of your misfortune.
    honored, I am, that congrats to my oldest was the occasion that brought you out of lurkerdom

    noik, I love the Princess Bride, but I don’t get the reference…

    JD, awe inspiring.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  158. Patterico, it was surreal. You won’t believe what he said in response to my questions or some of the stuff he asked me. I’d love to share what I think I remember. I suspect you’re going to be doing a bit of rewinding to make sure you heard what you thought you did. Maybe you can get a hold of some fancy technology to borrow to turn it into a transcript. What I’m unsure of is the agreement that gets signed when one obtains it, whether it can be reprinted. It’s clearly illegal to rebroadcast it, and the agreement says it can only be used to verify testimony.

    Prepostericity (caabef)

  159. Like I think he said I wrote Jews are the scourge of the Earth. But that makes no sense. He had no proof of anything. Maybe he said I posted he and Brad call Jews the scourge of the Earth. But I think it was the former. When asked for proof of all these strange claims, he had nothing. It turns out I’m actually not a multi-personality troll! It came down to what you said with your recent title concerning the showdown. I wrote as Prepostericity at DU, DKos, and I guess here, and as socrates on my blog. Oh well, it might have gone the full three hours. I don’t even remember that. Time sure did fly. It was a unique experience.

    Prepostericity (caabef)

  160. Surprised Kos let you criticize Kimberlin.

    DohBiden (ef98f0)

  161. The only connection between Moulitsas and Kimberlin, imho, is they each have generated income playing off of the lefty brand. If you look at who attacked me while at Daily Kos, it was Larisa Alexandrovna (and MajorFlaw). She is the direct link.

    Prepostericity (caabef)

  162. noik, I love the Princess Bride, but I don’t get the reference…
    Comment by MD in Philly — 11/22/2011 @ 6:45 pm

    sorry, MD. “nooc” = “no one of consequence”

    no one you know (3e92e3)

  163. Lookit me – I can sandbag Michelle Bachmann on national TV and save the apology for Twitter!

    ….What? The lying-ass b**** doesn’t deserve more than 140 characters anyway, amirite?

    Jimmy Fallon (325a59)

  164. Um, “jimmy fallon” please self identify. Don’t worry, we all do it now and then. I indeed, it is only my superpowers as a contributor that keeps me from doing it.

    Aaron Worthing (e7d72e)

  165. Um, “jimmy fallon” please self identify. Don’t worry, we all do it now and then. I indeed, it is only my superpowers as a contributor that keeps me from doing it.

    Comment by Aaron Worthing — 11/23/2011 @ 7:02 am

    My bad — meant to post on Sockpuppet Wed thread (and just did). As for the ID, remember your Rule # 1 of Sockpuppet Friday last week?

    Jimmy Fallon, apparently in HD stereo (325a59)

  166. Comment by DRJ — 11/21/2011 @ 6:58 pm

    Sammy, thanks for the Burger Chef link. I had never seen that before. It’s a very, very sad story.

    The Burger Chef murders are mentioned in that Indianapolis Star article Liberty Chick directed me to. I looked it up.

    I found another good site:

    http://www.thebawdycloister.com/reliquary/2005/08/speedway_burger.html

    This is part of a huge website called the The Burger Chef Reliquary – all about the Burger Chef chain, which was started in Indianapolis and at one point second in size to McDonald’s.

    This is about a WISH-TV, Indianapolis, Indiana TV special on it that aired on November 3, 2003. All the links to WISH are gone, but the comments remain on this website. It gave me an idea.

    One criminal lied to another and said that Jayne Friedt had custody of a lot of money or drugs and they went there to force the information out of her. Except, of course, she knew nothing.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  167. noik-
    thank you. one could also use nottw (“no one to triffle with”)

    I heard bachmann say that fallon personally was very apologetic and she did not think he was responsible
    Also, the bachmann and Co. had paid for the rights to use Petty’s “American Girl” as theme music, but he heard about it and nixed it. Some may say that Petty was petty.

    MD in Philly (3d3f72)

  168. nk – i’m sorry to hear of your injury, and i hope you are doing well.

    aphrael (807c84)

  169. Re: The Burger Chef murders:

    http://books.google.com/books?id=Vlcc-Ru-uaQC&pg=PA322&dq=cop+talk+outfit+knives&hl=en&ei=MmTOTs3rIsbe0QHLhs0d&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CFYQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q&f=false

    #

    #
    What cops know: cops talk about what they do, how they do it, and … by Connie Fletcher – 1992- Page 322

    [about Outfit murders]

    They seem to be going more for the knife. Most hits now have gone to throat slashing. I’d say the last half a dozen — whether they’re shot or beaten or anything else — they also cut their throats from ear to ear to make sure. …

    This was earlier.

    They had guns but didn’t want to use them. (Like O.J. Simpson who picked up this tip)

    They used a knife but the handle broke. This was 1978 not 1990.

    The next person they tried beating to death and in the end choked him, but it was hard work, so they used the guns they didn’t want to use on the other two.

    Sammy Finkelman (2d0c86)

  170. Sammy,

    One of the original investigators in the Burger Chef case believes he knows who murdered the four victims — three or four men in the Speedway area. Nevertheless, it sounds like the case is unlikely to be solved since the crime scene was cleaned before evidence could be processed. The four victims’ Indiana State crime victim bios state: “The Indiana State Police have focused this investigation on a group of individuals that were committing restaurant robberies at the time.” At the first link, the investigator also said two suspects have died, and he apparently thinks it’s possible the surviving suspect(s) had something to do with their deaths.

    DRJ (a83b8b)

  171. Comment by DRJ — 11/24/2011 @ 10:07 am

    One of the original investigators in the Burger Chef case believes he knows who murdered the four victims — three or four men in the Speedway area. Nevertheless, it sounds like the case is unlikely to be solved since the crime scene was cleaned before evidence could be processed.

    That’s an irrelevancy. They didn’t even have DNA in 1978. They had fingerprints, and that would have helped, provided that they actually checked the fingerprints, but it isd hardly unsolvable without it.

    One comment somewhere said they know what gun the bullets that were fired came from (does that mean they found the gun?) and they know who was supposed to own it. But this is being withheld.

    On Websleuths http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-48748.html

    keystothekiller writes,, and I don’t know if he’s right, in his first comment on 10-06-2011, at 04:24 PM

    Yes, the crime scene was contaminated or should I say decontaminated ,so what! Let a jury decide if there’s enough evidence. I know they have some evidence, including the gun used in this crime and the name of the persons who had possession of it during the time of this crime ( that has never been made public.) The police stated that they tried to get them to sign a confession but they refused.

    I don’t know if he’s got his facts mixed up here, but it makes a lot of sense that they ahve the gun.

    The three different methods of killing are expolained this way:

    The killers knew that the gun could be traced, if ever found anyway. they had gunsd to intimidate people but they didn’t want to use them.

    They intended from the start to kill all witnessses. Now, not for $600. Not for the car, which was 5 years old. No, someone had told them that Jayne Friedt, who may have been seen together with someone in the drug field at a party – maybe whom one of them had seen personally together wioth someone else for a few minutes – had custody of a lot of money or drugs or knew who had them.

    The person who told them was not the person they wanted money or drugs from but someone he arranged that he should tell. Disinformation.

    So they intended to torture or threaten the information out of her, and then kill her so that she would not have achancve to phone her boyfriend or supposed boyfriend and tell him to move the money or drugs. That is, the killers thought taht would happen – in reality she knew nothing, not even that there was money or drugs somebody was looking for. The bearded man had grown a beard so it would no longer match his mug shot. Probably only one person entered the store, then the one left behind in the car used a CB radio to contasct two others. something like that.

    Now they pretty much identified who they were or where they were coming from (that is identified themselves to someone who was really in the drug business) They were not hoping to conceal their identifies that much. They were just hoping to kill the person they got the information out of and give themselves enough lead time to get the drugs or money.

    Now they didn’t intend to leave any clues. The guns were only for show. Mark Flemmonds one of teh cooks may have resisted a but so they beat them. They probably tied them up. And tehy kidnapped them. They couldn’t stay there very long.

    Far away they started torturing them. Giving up at some point, because they’d told too much about themselves in the questioning, they decided to kill them, which had been the plan all along but this was without getting any information, which they may have become convinced they didn’t have any, but that didn’t change their intentions.

    One started stabbing Jayne Friedt, the most important pewrson of the four. But in the second try the knife broke off inside of her.

    Now they tried beating and choking someone to death while he was unconscious. That worked but was hard work.

    They finally decuided to use the guns after all.


    The four victims’ Indiana State crime victim bios state: “The Indiana State Police have focused this investigation on a group of individuals that were committing restaurant robberies at the time.” At the first link, the investigator also said two suspects have died, and he apparently thinks it’s possible the surviving suspect(s) had something to do with their deaths.

    Very likely a red herring. There were also outright false confessions.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  172. I’ve come to accept that some of the very best stuff on the internet has emerged from off-topic banter.

    That being said, I will repeat my opinion that this has nothing to do with any part of the main story.

    I’m not judging you guys. Just saying it might be better to add info from things like the Scyphers murder investigation or other facts and tidbits that are not well-known that can be perhaps be more realistically tied into the original article.

    Prepostericity (ef4333)

  173. Jessie LaGreca looks like a wookie.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  174. Did you all see thrusters directed at Patterico in his twitter feed? LaGreca and his people are trying to intimidate Patrick.

    JD (14475a)

  175. Did you all see the hatred directed at Patterico in his twitter feed? LaGreca and his people are trying to intimidate Patrick.

    JD (14475a)

  176. Kind of like a stuffed Matt Damon, in my view.

    narciso (ef1619)

  177. Goddamn OWSers support the greedy Michael Moore.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  178. Occupy for Accountability is nothing but a front group for Brett Kimberlin, convicted bomber never exonerated, designed to attack anyone that dare challeng his deceit.

    JD (14475a)

  179. Exactly.

    Why not call it occupy Kimberlin’s rectum.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  180. And nice to know KKK members are willing to shack it up with socialists and communists which I thought they opposed.

    Dohbiden (ef98f0)

  181. LaGreca supports domestic terrorists, and drug smugglers. Just like imdw, Chris Hooten, Brad Freidman, and their fellow violent leftists.

    JD (14475a)

  182. Two more Burger Chef murder links:

    http://www.wthr.com/Global/story.asp?s=1522446&

    (WTHR story from 2003. The report quoted on the WebSleuths page http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-48748.html

    was cut (snipped) on May 1, 2011 for copyright reasons leaving out the key facts about how fast food robbers were connected to this – or that the bearded man was identified and is now dead – a heart attack but yet his death and that of another labeled a suicide is suspicious.

    http://www.tchowe.com/MessageBoards/GeneralDiscussion/879765903244

    Thomas Carr Howe High School or Howe Academy of Indianapolis Alumni website. Although none of the people killed were from that school, there is soem discussion of that and other crimes. Some people mix up a few facts like the name of the city in Peake County where four members of a family were shotgunned to death. Apparently there is something about two separate crimes somewhere beinmg connected.

    This is a direct link to the second page of the discussion http://www.tchowe.com/MessageBoards/GeneralDiscussion/879765903244?b_start:int=20

    In reading this and other things I was reminded of or learned a few things.

    1) The District Attorney of Marion County from 1979 (shortly after the murders – he also prosecuted Kimberlin was Stephen (“Steve”) Goldsmith, the same Stephen Goldsmith http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Goldsmith
    who was a former mayor of Indianaplis – I hadn’t even realized that when reading about Congressional districts and Congressmen. he was the former Mayor of Indianapolis (kind of strange anyway, a former mayor agrees to be a deputy mayor of another city) who was appointed by Mayor Bloomberg as Deputy Mayor of New York City for Operations. He is the one who didn’t manage the stormstorm last December or rather said everything was OK and he was in Washington the whole time. He was fired by Bloomberg in August and Bloomberg kept the reason secret for several weeks. People thought he’d finally realized he was incompetent but actually he and his (second?) wife had had avery bad argument in which she said I should have killed you long ago and he was arrested but she withdrew her claims. This Stephen Goldsmith was Marion County Prosecutor from 1979 to 1991 and then the 3rd repoublican Mayor in a row of Indianapolis. Richard Lugar had consolidtaed the city and county except apparently for Speedway and as a result Speedway is completely surrounded by Indianapolis. Goldsmith developed a reputation for efficiency by privatizing most things besides police and fire. It may have been easy there. He later on became and advisor to geiorge W Bush and was considered for secretary of Labor perhaps and faith based organizations adviser but he got nothing.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)

  183. Comment by Prepostericity — 11/25/2011 @ 12:54 pm

    I’ve come to accept that some of the very best stuff on the internet has emerged from off-topic banter.

    That being said, I will repeat my opinion that this has nothing to do with any part of the main story.

    I’m not judging you guys. Just saying it might be better to add info from things like the Scyphers murder investigation or other facts and tidbits that are not well-known that can be perhaps be more realistically tied into the original article.

    Where would you want it.

    Two more facts: It was at a Burger Chef parking lot that Brett Kimberlin claimed he had sold marijuana to Dan Quayle (source Google in a book also WBAI radio interview 1988) It could be that Brett Kimberlin had a real connection to some Burger Chef. It looks also he was a suspect in thede murders so taht coulkd be a reason.

    2) Jim Jones was from Indiana – this also added to his sharing the headlines with the Berger CVhef murders. It probably gave it more attention that day in Indiana and lkess attention everywhere else.

    Sammy Finkelman (d3daeb)


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