Crying Babies
[Guest post by DRJ]
There are probably as many ways to parent a child as there are children, but an English psychologist and childcare expert says not responding to a crying baby is a bad idea:
“Leaving a distressed baby to cry on a regular basis could be damaging to the developing brain, according to parenting guru Penelope Leach, whose new book will be seen as a head-on confrontation with the tough-love approach of baby experts such as Gina Ford, who say parents should “train” their infants by allowing them to cry themselves to sleep.
In the latest salvo in the baby wars, Leach brings science to her aid, which she says has progressed remarkably in recent years. Using saliva swab tests, scientists have been able to measure high levels of the stress hormone cortisol in distraught babies whose cries elicit no response from parent or carer. Neurobiologists say, according to Leach, that high cortisol levels are “toxic” to the developing brain.
“It is not an opinion but a fact that it’s potentially damaging to leave babies to cry. Now we know that, why risk it?” Leach says in her book, The Essential First Year – What Babies Need Parents to Know.
She is not, she tells the Guardian, saying it is bad for babies to cry. “All babies cry. Some cry more than others.” But crying, in the first year or so, is the only way a baby can get a response. Denying a response, she argues, can have long-term emotional consequences.”
One of the first decisions new parents make is when to feed and comfort their babies. Did Leach convince you?
— DRJ
Meh. She’s combined the words “opinion”, “fact”, and “potentially” in a way that makes me think she doesn’t really know a thing.
roy (0692a4) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:34 pmMaybe she has a point, maybe not. But I react negatively to the stupid, junk science use of the term “toxic”.
SPQR (26be8b) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:36 pmWhen she is the mother of my children, she can exercise/or not her opinions on her factually based, theories in how to properly detoxify how I raise my hypothetical, as yet undefined children.
It’s a science, that has recently been vaguely defined.
Douglas (2c3ce5) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:41 pmI agree. Don’t let a baby cry. First pick her up and cuddle her close. Then check her diaper. Then check her all over to see if anything else is making her uncomfortable. Presuming that she has been having nutrition and hydration properly.
Babies don’t know what is right in their world and what is not. They can put up with a lot “thinking” it’s natural. When they cry, something is wrong.
nk (db4a41) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:41 pmThere have always been two schools of thought on this. Back when I had my first baby, I read material from the *experts* on both sides of the spectrum and it got a bit overwhelming. As a result, I just went with my gut and I’m glad I did. Now that the youngest is now 20 years old, I look back and think how easy those needs were to meet. When they were upset and cried, we held them, rocked them, loved them. That was the simplest part of the long haul of parenting, and one of the most precious.
Meeting their needs just doesn’t get any easier than that. As a matter of fact, their needs only get more difficult to meet as they get older. It seems a lot of parents hit a rough patch with the older kids and think back to how easy it was when they were babies and holding them close made everything better.
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:44 pmOnce I thought I would be able to allow Madeline to cry herself to sleep. I was wrong. She had the ability to cry longer than I could bear to hear her cry.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:51 pmI recommend the Budweiser method. Grab a cold one and let your spouse deal with the crying baby.
(ducks flying Jimmy Choo)
daleyrocks (1d0d98) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:53 pmThat the Penelope Leach whose qualifications Penn & Teller described as formerly a nanny?
EW1(SG) (edc268) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:55 pmWhen my daughter was born she yelled “Wahh” and slapped the doctor. Honest. Then they put her into one of those glass french fry warmers. She was sleeping but she would shiver and kind of moan in her sleep. That was heartbreaking. All it took after that was for me to hold her as much I could. Football hold, close, although she was a little bit bigger than a football.
nk (db4a41) — 4/26/2010 @ 7:56 pm@daley, Oh. Heck. Yeah. Mister.
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:03 pmDid you hear about the preacher who had no kids and 4 principles for child-rearing? That was a number of years ago, now he has 4 kids and no prinicples.
Seriously, it’s a lot easier to know what is wrong to do than right. I’ve never heard of Leach or Ford, but I imagine they are carrying on the tradition of having “experts” and their devotees on two extremes; one wanting to be at the beck and call of every peep and frown, and the other that wants military academy to start at day 7.
Even if one thinks they’ve found what’s “just right”, another child comes along who doesn’t agree.
What is also very important is that the parents are able to work together, either by agreeing or being able to respect and work with each other.
I did hear of a fail-proof method for dealing with teething infants, however. Pour a shot of brandy or whatever your preference, stick a finger in it and apply to the baby’s gums, then drink the rest yourself.
MD in Philly (0f793a) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:10 pmMy Mom always consulted the latest tome by Dr.Spock when a question arose re child rearing, and then did the opposite.
And Dana, keep throwing those shoes, the second-hand store needs more stock.
AD - RtR/OS! (69f893) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:12 pmJane Goodall wrote in one of her chimp books that she modeled some of her infant son’s care after watching a mother chimp called Flo, who gave constant attention to her infants. Her daughter, Fifi, also earned a place in chimp motherhood.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (9eb641) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:15 pmAD, the Jimmy Choos are too special for the thrift store. I’m gonna start chucking the hiking boots now.
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:15 pmPour a shot of brandy or whatever your preference, stick a finger in it and apply to the baby’s gums, then drink the rest yourself.
Uh-uh. Ouzo. The anise is a mild topical anesthetic.
nk (db4a41) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:16 pmOur second child once was “finally” found asleep- with one eyelid still held open by his index finger.
MD in Philly (0f793a) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:16 pmA child’s cry is one of the most heart-breaking sounds I can imagine. I pick her up and attempt to comfort her every single time. Unless she is crying over something completely unreasonable, I cannot find a reason to not try to comfort her. But, that is at age 2. Certainly that changes as they get older.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:17 pmI hope daley’s reactions are good, those things sting!
AD - RtR/OS! (69f893) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:17 pmAny tears and crying between midnight and 6 AM are my responsibility, as Better Half needs all of the beauty sleep she can get.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:19 pmI bet there have been at least 50 nights in the last 2 years that we/I were up all night long.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:24 pmO/T: Speaking of crying babies. . .
Circulation at the Los Angeles Times fell 14.7% to 616,606 on weekdays and 7.6% to 941,914 on Sundays.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (9eb641) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:25 pmMDinPhilly…
AD - RtR/OS! (69f893) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:28 pmIn the pre-Controlled Substance days, mothers of colicy babies would go down to the soda-shop, and get a small bottle of CocaCola pre-mix syrup, just for doing what you describe, for the effect of the small amount of cocaine in the formula.
Some of them probably also picked up a bottle of Laudanum for themselves.
Unless she is crying over something completely unreasonable…
Be prepared: in 10 or 12 years, this pretty much sums up alot of what the crying will be about!
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:28 pmPenelope Leach is the UK Dr. Spock. Her comments carry enormous authority there because of everyone’s familiarity with her from using her book to raise their children or being raised by the book’s precepts.
DOuglas2 (18c86b) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:32 pmJD, we spent years going through those sleepless nights because our kids were spaced somewhat far apart. When the first cry of the night erupted, we would each pretend to be asleep and hope the other one gave in first! Usually, my husband was generous and thoughtful and would get the baby bring them to bed. After they finished nursing, it was just easier to keep them snuggled in with us. Anything, anything at all to get some sleep and my husband loved the closeness since he was at work during the day, missing the fun. They all survived nicely, no one got rolled over on, and we look back fondly on those days, sleep deprivation and all. Of course the youngest is now 20, so the exhaustion and feeling that we’d never, ever sleep a full night again is long past. Hang in there!
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:34 pmThanks, Dana. Her recent surgeries seem to have helped. She has been healthy for 2 straight weeks, which is the longest stretch of health for her since birth. YEAH! I still wake up every time she makes a noise.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:38 pmI don’t remember exactly when I started the “let them cry” philosophy but it was before Laura turned two. Brain damage? She graduated high school at 16, torched the ASVAB, was team trainer at KFC (working 40 hours per week) at 16.
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:41 pmSomeone gave us one of those books on how to be more effective parents, and I burned it in the fireplace after like the 3rd chapter, when it became abundantly clear that I would not leave a dead goldfish in the author’s care for more than an hour.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:44 pm“Be prepared: in 10 or 12 years, this pretty much sums up alot of what the crying will be about!”
Dana – My oldest figured out that if he put masking tape over the ball sensors in the door jamb for the burglar alarm, the chime would not sound when the door was opened. We didn’t figure that one out for a long time. We could be unreasonable all day long and he didn’t care because once we were in bed he was scot free.
daleyrocks (1d0d98) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:47 pmMy own philosophy is nobody raises their kids right but most parents raise their children well enough. Mistakes abound throughout the child-raising years but the kids are rather difficult to break.
John Hitchcock (9e8ad9) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:49 pmLiberals believe in Darwinism and Evolution when it suits them — like to disparage religion. When you use it to cull the herd as it has been culled over centuries — they hate it.
My point, oh shut the f-up already. Babies have been crying for centuries and we somehow got here. They will continue crying for centuries. Parents make decisions about when and how to placate the child. For someone to try to use bad science to guilt parents into doing something the way they want — uggg.
I have a study, when you sue the Gov.t to steal from one to give other people free crap it creates lots of emotional distress and turns the brain cells of those parasites into larvae.
When do I get the study showing how evil Welfare, Handouts and Entitlements are?
HeavenSent (a9126d) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:50 pmWe did it ALL WRONG with our firstborn and let him cry! He was so TWISTED and DAMAGED that he JOINED UP and became a BLOGGER in Iraq (Teflon Don)!
Teflon Dad (287a17) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:53 pmAD – RtR/OS!-
Cocaine is still used as a topical anesthetic for mucous membranes by the ENT folk, so I bet it did help.
Back in the last millenium when I was in residency I had a rotation in the ER of St. Christopher’s Hosp. for Children in Philly. Displayed on one of the shelves behind the nursing desk was a bottle of “Gripe Water” from somewhere in the West Indies. It listed as the active ingredient the extract of the juniper berry. Under the “inactive” ingredients was a hefty percentage of ethanol!
After son #2 came along (#1 was about 20 months), my wife and I developed “selective hearing” at night. I never heard the younger one fuss at night, which was fine as I was not equipped to attend to him (breast feeding), and my wife would never hear the older get up.
MD in Philly (0f793a) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:55 pmDid Dr. Spock already screw up everyone enough?
Alta Bob (e8af2b) — 4/26/2010 @ 8:58 pmThe title of this post is clearly an underhand jab at Keif Olbergasm.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:00 pmI think it depends on the kid. Some like to be cuddled and some need space. The hard part is figuring out which is which. But if Teflon Dad is right, I have to vote for letting them cry. We could use more Teflon Dons.
DRJ (09fa6c) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:02 pmJD, I thought most of your comments were pretty thoughtful, except for the last half of #19 regarding your better half. Never, ever say that your wife REALLY needs her beauty sleep!
Mrs. Patterico (c218bd) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:12 pmIt’s funny that the Penelope Leach’s and Gina Fords of the world, who roll out their theories every few years or so, seem to think they’ve made earth shattering discoveries that we’ve all been waiting for. It seems to me that most of their infancy time (which is the period the post referenced), it’s hit and miss with parents just muddling their way through. It’s messy, exhausting, and sublimely unique to each family.
Dana (1e5ad4) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:15 pmMrs Patterico – Mr Patterico can attest to the fact that I am nothing, if not thoughtless.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:22 pmGoodnight, racists.
JD (37e9a1) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:31 pmso imdw is your sock?
😀
redc1c4 (fb8750) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:38 pmThe most astonishing thing happened in my house:
We did everything completely wrong based on the experts. By that I mean, when our kids cried, sometimes we went to see if they were OK. Sometimes, we rolled over and went back to sleep.
A whole lot of times, we would wake up in the morning with two happy campers, with pillows and blankets, next to our bed. Along with a couple of extremely sleepy dogs.
Somehow or another, the older child has managed to cop a scholarship or two for college in the fall. The younger one seems to be following the same track, but she has two years to go.
Who knows how they will turn out. That’s the joy of parenting: You just don’t know.
Ag80 (f67beb) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:40 pmi’m lucky: my chilrens have never once cried at night, nor have they done so in the day time…
redc1c4 (fb8750) — 4/26/2010 @ 9:57 pmGreat, just great. Another liberal study that gives all the liberals another liberal excuse for whatever they screw up and won’t take responsibility for.
SiliconDoc (7ba52b) — 4/26/2010 @ 11:45 pm” But, but but but… I cried a lot as a young baby, and, my welfare mamma was ahh… ”
Plus, the fascist social workers can now go on a rampage if they hear the baby crying while they are running their tri-weekly inquisition telephone call.
The funny thing is, I can also picture the touchy-feely libtards in marriage (or their modern living in sin with each other between stepping out family structures) having their cows:
” The baby is crying, don’t you want our daughter to have an education and a life ?!?! *shrieking*
” You’re turning her into a %$%^ @#$#$^% retard while you’re just laying there ! ”
” I swear to god if our daughter has a reading disability, it’s all your fault ! ”
—
Yes, the libs have done it once again. A gigantic guilt trip, brain damage, child abuse, the nanny state book sales, the “single mothers” lecture circuit, and likely soon to come some government sponsored timer and decibel meter to gauge the babies “toxic distress level” and theoretically then keep the poor dear from screwing up the government public education achievement level stats.
This all depends on the age of the child. It would be insane to ignore a crying newborn, although treating any baby’s cry like the world is going to end is not helpful.
A six-month old? Now that’s different. At some point the child needs to learn patience, that he/she is not the center of the universe, and that there are more appropriate ways to express a need.
It is a balance, and I think most parents instinctively get it about right, without ignorant experts who pursue their pet theory to the exclusion of all else.
Amphipolis (b120ce) — 4/27/2010 @ 6:28 amWe taught Madeline to sign. When she is being polite, she will say peeez. When she really wants something she will say peeez, and do the sign for please. When she really really really wants something, she will say peeez, and do the sign for please bilaterally, and repeatedly.
JD (cc3aa7) — 4/27/2010 @ 6:35 amCome to think of it, this country seems to have a lot of big babies who still cry due to the stress of the real world, like when they are told that there is no free ride.
The poor dears cry and cry until they get their way.
Amphipolis (b120ce) — 4/27/2010 @ 6:46 amGeeze — it’s not rocket science.
If a kid is crying check to see why. Doesn’t matter the age. Check. If it is an infant crying there is something wrong. Wet, cold, hot, something. Maybe hurt, maybe feeling bad. If the infant is scared or upset, calm it down.
What always worked for me was to put said infant on my shoulder, preferably in a rocking chair, and speak in a confident tone. (Kids, even infants, can sense uncertainty, and that upsets them. Has to be instinctual — if the big adult is nervous, there must be a reason for me to be also.) Generally I recited poetry — something with rhythm and rhyme. Kipling, Byron and Walter Scott seemed to work best. Always worked with my kids — and seemed to work with others’, even strangers.
Once I was sitting next to a crying baby on a cross-country airline flight. Mom could not get the child quiet, so after 30 minutes of squalling, I asked for a chance. Mom, desperate, gave me the child. Had her (child . . . well, mom, too) quiet and happy in ten minutes. Gave baby back to mom, and kid was quiet for rest of flight.
For older kid — check why they are crying. Fix problem. If they are crying because they got told “no” about something — that’s when you tell them “no” again and leave them to finish cry. (They generally do once they figure out they cannot play you.) But that’s about the only time you “just leave them to cry.”
Mark L (3fc310) — 4/27/2010 @ 7:59 amI’m just as glad that Leach gives mothers permission to tell “don’t touch that baby” freaks, and/or their mothers-in-law, to step back.
IIRC, back in the day, Leach actually did have good in-law advice, or rather, “helper relative” advice – in her own experience, she realized that it was a reversal of the right order of things for grammy to come and take over care of the infant so mommy could get the dishwashing and floor-scrubbing and laundry done.
SarahW (af7312) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:23 amMark L.
I agree with you, for most kids most of the time. There are outliers who when told “no” don’t just cry, but go out of control trying to destroy things, etc., and those infants who seem to “just want to be held”, that after quieted down in 10 minutes will start up again as soon as put back down in the crib or whatever.
Are there times when mistakes in parenting contribute to that? Absolutely. Are there times when a child has a predisposition to a temperment like that, or “hard-wired” problems going to sleep, etc.? Absolutely.
It’s important to get an idea whether one should be doing something “better” in parenting and when the child is exceptional in having a problem. A parent struggling with guilt is of no help to a child with a problem, and a parent who says, “He’s just a crier” will never stop to think what they could be better at.
(Kids, even infants, can sense uncertainty, and that upsets them. Has to be instinctual — if the big adult is nervous, there must be a reason for me to be also.) – Absolutely agree, and one area to think about is whether there is stress between mom and dad with differences on how to handle parenting.
MD in Philly (0f793a) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:26 amI have the best mother in law in the world. Among other reasons, because she lives eight thousand miles east of me. She came to help when my daughter was born and she helped greatly while I was working until 10:00 p.m. and my wife was recovering from an infected C-Section. But still, I was jealous and even resentful for her holding my baby instead of me holding my baby.
Let my baby cry? I’ll kill whoever makes cry.
nk (db4a41) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:29 am*makes her cry*
nk (db4a41) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:29 amUp until a certain age, I am not sure it is possible to hold your child enough, to love on them too much, or to care for their wants and needs too closely.
JD (cc3aa7) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:36 amI knew there was a reason I like you, JD, and not just because you bought me pizza.
nk (db4a41) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:44 amAt about age two, in our case, you have to teach them, and respect, their bodily autonomy. You don’t grab them unless you’re sure they want you to grab them. At age eight, my daughter still gets a kick out of dad’s tickle monster (she stopped saying “daddy”).
nk (db4a41) — 4/27/2010 @ 8:55 am#53 nk:
Wait, he bought you pizza?
Oh, nevermind. IIRC, I was laid up at the time getting the very best health care in the world that the megacorpaglomerates or whatever could pay for.
Carry on. The thought you two racist haters having little chilrens to corrupt just warms the cockles of my cold & stony capitalist heart.
EW1(SG) (edc268) — 4/27/2010 @ 9:16 amEW1(SG)-
Being uncaring conservatives who let children go to bed hungry, I bet they ate it all themselves, too.
MD in Philly (0f793a) — 4/27/2010 @ 10:52 amFunny think regarding sleeping and crying: When one of my daughters (I have 5 children – mostly grown and out) was around 3 she was crying in her room. I went in to give her some reassurance since she had been lately plagues with nightmares. I later heard her crying again. I just laid there for a while, but it did not stop. So I tromped over to her room and there she was laying on her bed saying “Oh bother! Don’t you know your crying is keeping us awake? Settle down, shut those eyes and zip the lip Monkey Face!” She was scolding herself and talking herself back to sleep. At first I thought it was funny – then I realized how my snappy comments effected my little chipmunk. Poor girl – our experimental child.
She has turned out to be a pretty terrific woman. I credit her self scolding nature. She walks her own line.
The rest of the kids we treated according to their personality. Easy criers got put off more and those slow to cry got a quicker response.
Zee (611d84) — 4/27/2010 @ 12:03 pmWith our first daughter, we lucked into the realisation that babies experiment, yet have very short attention spans … so we left her to cry for at least a couple of minutes when she started … if she continued crying, she was either hungry or needed changed … when she was experimenting, the cry’s tonal nature often shifted, and then would trail off into other noises …
(Daddy had to stop using his ‘evil laugh’ – after we noticed it had become #1’s ‘happy laugh’)
We didn’t realise she was throwing a tantrum the first couple of times she tried – so she stopped trying to throw tantrums until she saw it work for other kids in pre-school … by then, we has seen how it worked in othr families, and when she tried, we ignored her attempts – and she stopped trying, with us, again … well, at least until she turned teenager (grin) …
Alasdair (205079) — 4/27/2010 @ 12:03 pmOh – sleeping through the night …
Check with your pediatrician – and then try feeding your new kid double-strength formula (if you use formula) for the last evening feeding … compensate for that during the day by giving a bottle of water … (so it balances out, calorie wise) … kid will sleep until his/her little tummy is empty again – 6/8/10 hours …
All you need to watch out for is that for some kids, that mix can be TOO rich … for all 4 of ours, it worked like a charm …
(All due to serendipity – I’m a mainframe computer geek – and we read instructions only when we are desperate, right ? So I was left with #1, and a can of (liquid) formula, and a clean bottle, and insgtructions as to when to give her her last feed of the evening (wife was going to be stuck at medical school til about 2 AM) … so, at the appointed hour, I opened the can of formula (noticing how rich and creamy it looked), and put 8 ounces into the bottle … piece of cake, right ?
Fed #1 at about 22:00, she took about 7 ounces (as expected/predicted), burped her, she settled off to sleep, put her in crib, settled myself down, then headed to bed) … wife got home, went to sleep at about 02:30, then started tossing and turning at about 03:30, expecting to be woken up to breast feed hungry kid … she got up at 5 AM, looked in on kid who is sleeping blissfully … same at 06:30 … at 8 AM kid wakes up … wife breast feeds …
I wake up (it’s a weekend), wife asks what I did … I’m all innocence, see, I followed instructions, here’s the can, here’s the bottle, look she drank 7 ounces … pause … “Didn’t you dilute the formula concentrate ?” … “Ohh !” … (grin) …
So – the following evening, we tried it, purposefully, intentionally … and it worked, again, like a charm …
And worked for all 4 of ’em, over the years …)
I’m only a Dr by marriage … YMMV … it is a sanity saver, however …
Alasdair (205079) — 4/27/2010 @ 12:16 pm“…Generally I recited poetry — something with rhythm and rhyme…”
Do those “marching limericks” we all learned in Boot Camp qualify?
AD - RtR/OS! (2ebc1d) — 4/27/2010 @ 12:32 pmblech. More “the universe revolves around kids” nonsense.
jpe (55dab0) — 4/27/2010 @ 4:24 pmjpe,
If you intended that seriously ….
nk (db4a41) — 4/27/2010 @ 4:48 pmjpe – Do you have a heart?
JD (c1a2b8) — 4/27/2010 @ 6:25 pm