Jeff Jacoby: Support In-State Tuition for Illegal Immigrants or Be Labeled “Unprincipled”
YOU’RE A sensible, principled conservative. You want America to be a land of boundless opportunity and freedom, where people are treated as individuals and judged on their merits. . . . But let someone mention “illegal immigrants,’’ and your principles fly out the window.
So when Governor Deval Patrick recommends allowing young illegal immigrants – residents of Massachusetts who have graduated from high school – to attend a public college and pay in-state tuition, you flip out. This is outrageous, you protest. It rewards people who broke the rules. It’s unfair to the taxpayers who subsidize public higher education. Why should an illegal immigrant get a valuable tuition break that Massachusetts wouldn’t give to a kid from Maine or New Hampshire?
If you think that, Jacoby says you’re unprincipled.
Feel free to “flip out” in the comments.
Here’s one reason. It is an exercise in futility. If they are illegal, then they are unable to get a job legally, so what is the point? i know, I know…they won’t be illegal for much longer if Barry and his merry band of outlaws get their way. Which also neatly solves the problem of healthcare for illegals. If he renders them all legal citizens, the problem is sorted at a stroke.
Gazzer (f4dafa) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:33 amit’s not like American citizenship is some kinda prize anymore
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:37 amHe forgot to mention that every spot taken by an illegal is one less spot given to an American.
Paul (6d0c48) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:37 amit’s not like going to one of the dirty socialist indoctrination camps what we quaintly call “Universities” in our little country is some kinda prize anymore.
Here is a typical pompous douchebag loser what forms the backbone of the American university system.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:43 amWe own a home in Arizona and pay taxes yet our daughter pays non-resident tuition for attending the university. So, I’m supposed to support illegals stepping ahead of us in line ?
Mike K (2cf494) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:44 amEven our little president man for a time found refuge from the demands of actually producing something by teaching at some squalid no-account little college of some sort.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:45 amJacoby is a mendoucheous twatwaffle.
JD (d0ee47) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:04 pmhere’s my new music for this week these ones are Australian ones but this song has a sort of Latin inflection much like I suspect many of the students what want the cheaper tuition have.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:06 pmIllegal aliens are from out-of-state and should pay the out-of-state tuition.
Michael Ejercito (6a1582) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:07 pmI reject Jacoby’s premise that to not give those who have broken our laws equal standing to those who have abided by the law is tantamount to throwing our principles out the window.
There are few things about contemporary politics you deplore more than the demonizing or scapegoating of entire groups (“white males,’’ “the rich,’’ “the Christian right,’’ “gun owners’’), as though every member of the group is interchangeable and indistinguishable, wholly defined by a single disparaging label.
Ironic as he makes this ssessment of conservatives and yet he himself does the same thing: he scapegoats conservatives as the problem, and then current immigration laws.
“If you’re illegally here, you’re illegally here,’’ Baker said last week. “The notion that we should treat illegal immigrants with the same benefits and opportunities that legal immigrants and legal citizens have doesn’t make any sense to me.’’
It is dispiriting to see Baker, a man of considerable intellectual heft, stoop to such shallow sloganeering. It is even more dispiriting to see conservatives assail immigrants instead of the insane immigration system that gave most of them no legal way to enter the United States.
That Jacoby easily reduces Baker’s truth of the matter to “shallow sloganing” shows a disappointing, if not dispiriting lack of understanding the frustrations of the vast majority of Americans with the ill consequences of our current border mess (ill effects of which can be clearly seen here in Cali and other border states).
While the immigration policies needs an overhaul, it must be a workable compromise, what we’ve been consistently offered and which Jacoby *seems* to be for, is nothing of the sort. Open borders does not constitute a smart and security driven policy.
Why would we want to punish them? Why would we want to punish their kids?
Finally, Jacoby chooses to see this as a negative which is the SOP of open borders people. I read this and see it as protecting the rights and standing of the citizen rather than punishment of anyone. To protect the citizen’s standing should always be the top priority of a nation.
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:07 pmI have a friend from Kenya. He (a microbiologist) and his wife (a university professor in Kenya) waited six years to come to the United States.
Now they have to live with a sponsoring family for one year before they can even get their own apartment or house. They have to put their children (born in Kenya) in public schools because they are denied putting their kids in a Christian school (we must make sure even immigrants are indoctrinated, ya’ know). The hoops that this poor couple have had to jump through while the left supports those who enter illegally, is an absolute disgrace.
And what have they found since they came here from Kenya? They are shunned by their own race because they live with a white family. Their kids are teased in public schools because they don’t dress “black” and don’t talk “black”. The last time I spoke with them, they were considering going back to Kenya because they are being harrassed by African-Americans for not supporting Obama (Isaiah is from the rival tribe of the Lao’s, Obama’s father’s tribe).
It is all too sad as they are a great couple with fabulous children and could really contribute to our society.
But nooooooooo, let’s let in any grade school drop out from a country with a Hispanic name instead. Then let’s fast track them to citizenship while others, like my friends, wait 6 years to be able to come here on a temporary work visa (yeah, they had to prove they had jobs before they were allowed entry)as well as proving they would not be a burden to the American society.
Our immigration policy is broken alright. It allows for the trash to come in and good people have to spend almost a decade trying to get here.
Jeff Jacoby, and his ilk, soooo piss me off.
retire05 (6d2925) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:15 pmI would submit that Mr. Jacoby is right but that also Dana is right so this is the time on sprockets when we compromise to where I think there should be some educationings that are available to these hapless immigrant chilrens… community colleges and vocational schools should be available for sure. And then you know what else I think? I think anyone what makes a 1250 or better on the SAT should get automatic citizenships! Under this system there will be greater fairnesses achieved I think.
If you have any other intractable social problems what are troubling you please to not be hesitate to approach me.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:17 pmQuite honestly,they should be deported with whomever brought them here or came here illegally before they were born. Instead we will probably soon give them free tuition and invite any members of their families that aren’t yet in America to “come on down”. After that, we’ll say they don’t have to actually come to America, just state that they wish to before we give them every right Americans have. Don’t get me started….
dfbaskwill (2c7f7f) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:26 pmI think the “empty sloganeering” comment translates to “the criticism is correct and I have no way to refute other than be attacking the person of the critic.”
Eric Blair (bc43a4) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:31 pmJEFF JACOBY is a sensible, principled Jew. Jews want America to be a land of boundless opportunity and freedom, where people are treated as individuals and judged on their merits. . . . But let Muslims come to Temple services and his principles fly out the window.
ropelight (502cb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:39 pmI would like to deport both the illegals, and the politicans who support them.
Don Meaker (9ceac6) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:39 pmJeff Jacoby is down with breaking the law when it comes to immigration, I wonder if he’d be down with me breaking the law by stealing his car? I mean come on Jeff you’re a principled kinda guy!
chaos (9c54c6) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:39 pmIllegal immigrants what want to be here and learn and achieve are more better than lots and lots of Americans I think cause Americans are predominately a shiftless amoral and profligate people what think they can vote themselves magical prosperity by stealing the monies of the minority of Americans what aren’t shiftless dirty socialist welfare queen losers.
I don’t think we’d be any worse off to have more people here what honest to God want to make something of themselves. It’s definitely worth however you want to quantify the risk I think.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:42 pmHer classmates can attend the University of Massachusetts, paying $9,704 a year in tuition, the price tag for Massachusetts residents. She can attend only if she pays the out-of-state rate of $22,157; if that’s more than she can afford, she’s out of luck.
How about instead of seeing her as Out of Luck, why not see the real options she has – she can go to a community college for the fraction of the price and get her general ed out of the way and then transfer to a state college afterward, where the tuition rate is lower? Where does it say she *has* to graduate out of a university?
How is that a rational public policy? How is Massachusetts improved by making it impossible for an accomplished high-school graduate, a lifelong resident of the state, to gain a university degree? Who benefits when her education – along with the higher earning potential it would lead to – is cut short? She doesn’t. You don’t. Massachusetts taxpayers certainly don’t.
Who says she *has* to be able to access a degree that giver her higher earning potential? If we’re going to play “let’s be fair”, then what about the American citizen who cannot afford the tuition (in-state), should there be a reduction in his tuition cost because that would be fair – because who benefits when the citizen who cannot afford the in-state tuition is beyond reach, along with the higher earning potential it would lead to, is cut short?
Dana (e9ba20) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:47 pmYou Americans think you’re so special but you losers can’t even run a car factory without subsidizing your loser car factories and giving out car welfare on top of that.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:47 pmThankfully, that C-list conservative makes no claim to speak for Libertarians.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (0ea407) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:48 pmAt least he isn’t advocating that we pay their way into the country.
Yet.
kaf (e41bba) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:51 pmAs an FFL, my first question to ANYONE who comes to me to buy a firearm is:
AD - RtR/OS! (e3cbb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:52 pmAre you a Citizen of the United States?
If the answer is No!, I politely suggest that they take their business elsewhere, for I only sell to citizens, and don’t wish to put up with the additional regulations regarding sales to Resident Non-citizens (plus, the law specifically forbids the sale of firearms to illegal-aliens).
It is unfortunate that the gatekeepers of higher-education feel that they need to use the funds taken from the American Taxpayer under color of law (and force) to support those that spit on our laws.
Por favor. You Americans overwhelmingly vote for a little president man who thinks nothing of subsidizing fat-ass illiterate shiftless UAW thugs but then you people want to draw the line at helping the Pablo and the Marisol who are eager to achieve great learnings?
Who are you people?
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 12:55 pmI apologize to Michael Savage. I used to think he was being hyperbolic when he said liberalism is a mental disorder.
Terry Gain (1664b9) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:01 pmJeff Jacoby is down with breaking the law when it comes to immigration, I wonder if he’d be down with me breaking the law by stealing his car? I mean come on Jeff you’re a principled kinda guy!
Go for it. You wouldn’t steal Jacoby’s car unless you needed it more than he does. He wouldn’t call the police unless he’s a heartless conservative posing as a liberal.
Terry Gain (1664b9) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:09 pmIf Jeff really wants them to get educations so they can get better jobs, he better hope they don’t become journalism or English majors.
Huey (b957d9) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:14 pmWho’s this troll? I hate inept trolls.
chaos (9c54c6) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:23 pm“So when Governor Deval Patrick recommends allowing young illegal immigrants – residents of Massachusetts who have graduated from high school – to attend a public college and pay in-state tuition, you flip out.”
Well, I wouldn’t flip out. I live in California. None of my business if people in Massachusetts want to have a moron for governor.
Dave Surls (3f3306) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:27 pmJeff Jacoby’s employer, the Boston Globe, will lose an estimated $85 million this year, and maybe $100 million next year.
Official Internet Data Office (b3941f) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:29 pmYou American ones used to be bigger than this is all. We must deny the educationings to teh illegal immigrants!! Did you never watch Giant? Giant cause of how big the America was in fact and spirit. It’s the pettiest things what set you people off these days.
You have become a very small people.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:30 pmMost newspaper opinion columnists are overrated. They get so full of themselves because they’re paid to spout off, with a remarkably low standard for fact-checking.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (0ea407) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:33 pmMr. Jacoby, you don’t seem to understand the meaning of the word “illegal.” I’d suggest suing your alma mater for educational malpractice.
M. Scott Eiland (c552ec) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:39 pm‘There are few things about contemporary politics you deplore more than the demonizing or scapegoating of entire groups (“white males,’’ “the rich,’’ “the Christian right,’’ “gun owners’’), as though every member of the group is interchangeable and indistinguishable, wholly defined by a single disparaging label.’
Actually, I rather enjoy lumping all the lefties togeher and demonizing them ’til the cows come home.
When you demonize them, they get all indignant and puff up like little pink blowfish.
It’s kinda cute.
Dave Surls (3f3306) — 11/22/2009 @ 1:47 pmMy question has always been… If an illegal immigrant gets a full HS / college degree–how are they going to work in the US? They still do not have “papers”.
BfC (5209ec) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:03 pmThis anti-immigrant jihad is just a symptom of a profound sense of alienation what you Americans are experiencing I think. A profound feeling of alienation from your own little country. This is understandable cause your little country is boisterously anal raping you.
I blame your dirty socialist NPR Newsweek Jeffy Immelt media mostly, but your Soros toadying little president man and your neo-fascist dirty socialist Congress aren’t blameless.
It kind of sucks to be you, days are.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:05 pmYou Americans are about to celebrate your Thanksgiving.
This should be a hoot.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:09 pmwhat is so “principled” about rewarding illegal activity?
the important part of “illegal immigrant” is “illegal’: they broke the law to get here, and now we are supposed to reward them? that’s akin to buying burglars a van, so they don’t have to w*rk so hard hauling the stuff away from your house, just because they had the nerve to break in to begin with.
redc1c4 (fb8750) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:16 pmbad trolls is bads. americans are waiting for a leader who isnt a moron to emerge.
Chaos (7c068a) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:21 pmYeah Jacoby is way off the path here.
It sounds like he’s trying to get some ‘new-found respect’ from the MSM by using illegal immigration as his brave principled stand against the extremist right-wing bad guys.
I could be wrong, but that what this looks like to me.
KingShamus (fb8597) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:23 pmyou are big and illegal immigrants, they are very very little
used to be, anyways
the times they are a hope n changing
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:25 pmExcellent. And while we are at it, let’s give illegals a free ride on the health insurance penalty too.
Jim,MtnViewCA,USA (01624a) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:29 pmhttp://keithhennessey.com/2009/11/21/penalty-tax-inequity/
So how are “illegal” students able to attend and graduate from high school? If they have been able to do that, I’m surprised they are even questioned about their status when registering for college.
Jeff Jacoby used to be quite conservative. I wonder what has happened to change him into the almost-liberal he has become. Perhaps he idolizes our “little president man”.
PatAZ (9d1bb3) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:31 pmomg … it’s hordes of them
get the kids inside Helen
they just keep coming oh my god what do they want?
education… they’re making straight for the colleges. To learn about … god only knows what
They’re like locusts it’s horrifying.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:34 pm“…how are “illegal” students able to attend and graduate from high school…”
SCOTUS decision on a case from TX over 20-years ago as I recall.
AD - RtR/OS! (e3cbb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:36 pmIn the meantime, the students in the University of California system are revolting — pun intended — because their tuition has gone up. The poor dears, sons and daughters, I suppose, of people who voted against Proposition 1A, seem to think that Californians who work as cashiers at convenience stores, who work collecting the garbage, who are stuck in the depressed areas of the cities, and who will never have a realistic chance at going to college themselves, and whose children will be lucky if they even finish high school, ought to have to shell out more so that they can have the privilege of going to Berkeley or Davis or UCLA at more highly subsidized tuition rates.
Y’all are worried about the illegals; I’m just plain disgusted with some of the good, native born American citizens we have whining that the state isn’t giving them enough.
The former Californian Dana (474dfc) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:43 pm“In the meantime, the students in the University of California system are revolting — pun intended — because their tuition has gone up.”
Good pun, but, I suspect that they’d be revolting even if the tuition was totally eliminated.
Dave Surls (3f3306) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:50 pmBfC wrote:
Perhaps you’ve never seen the “papers” required to get a job. An employer must fill out an ICE Form I-9, indicating that he has seen the proper documents (which are normally copied and kept with the I-9) to establish eligibility to be employed. Many of those documents are easily forged, and there is a black market industry dedicated to producing such forged documents. Employers are not required to verify those documents beyond simple visual inspection. Because the stage of producing the documents is normally not reached until a decision to hire has already been taken, the employer has an interest in not looking at the documents too closely, as they pertain to someone he already wants to hire. Then, once all of the paperwork is completed, the Form I-9 is not sent to ICE, but is supposed to be kept in the employee’s personnel file at the employer’s office, to be available for ICE inspection if an ICE inspector should ever decide to stop by and check on them — something I have never, ever seen happen.
There have been many cases of social security numbers having been duplicated, as illegals come up with fake social security cards for their employers. When the IRS and Social Security Administration get the tax money withheld for these duplicated or bogus numbers, they just keep the money; no effort is ever made to ascertain why a number is being used by someone to whom it is not assigned. First, I think it’s illegal to use the data for that purpose, but even if it isn’t the government would rather just take in that money.
The government wants illegal aliens to work, because they provide production and pay taxes; arguments that some of them cost more in taxes than they pay in tend to fall on ears so plugged up with nasty yellow wax as to be deaf.
The employer Dana (474dfc) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:56 pmAlas! Mr Surls, I cannot claim to be the originator of said pun. While I’m sure that he stole it as well, I will attribute it to the late, great Al Capp, creator of the L’il Abner cartoon, and the group SWINE: Students Wildly Indignant about Nearly Everything.
The sarcastic Dana (474dfc) — 11/22/2009 @ 2:59 pmIf you just take care to have a not dirty socialist little country and you stop electing the Chicago street trash and you don’t demonize the capitalism and you just say no to adopting a third world neo-fascist health care system then your illegal immigrants won’t really be all that much of a bother I don’t think.
You really do bring a lot of these problems on yourselves.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:03 pmReal unemployment is above 20% and getting worse. Americans have to work in order to keep their homes and families together, yet millions of illegals are here taking jobs that citizens want and need. It’s past time to get this country back on track.
ropelight (502cb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:09 pmoh. Right. It’s the illegal immigrants what knocked your once great country off track.
Nope. You losers did it all by yourselves. There’s no little country in all of history what’s pissed away so much so fast.
And now you want to blame Pablo and Marisol.
Kinda pathetic.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:12 pmthat makes no sense
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:22 pmPatrick Frey?
Ouch
I’m assuming that Mr. Frey will recover his identity soon.
SteveG (97b6b9) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:28 pmSteve G.,
CLEAN UP REQUESTED ON THIS THREAD!!! (0ea407) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:32 pmThis is a troll.
Pursuit of the truth should be the goal of every public servant, including newspaper editors who hold a responsibility to not feed falshood to their consumers…
MD in Philly (227f9c) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:52 pmWonder which previously banned troll that was ?
JD (f1aec1) — 11/22/2009 @ 3:59 pmMay I first flip out over the children of illegals getting a free education before college? Why are the taxpayers of this nation paying for these children in primary and secondary school? Forget about college, stop allowing them to attend school in the first place. Then we solve the in-state tuition problem before it begins.
Liberty Belle (b09c07) — 11/22/2009 @ 4:19 pmThat’s good as far as it goes but if they’ve already been to school and gotten free taxpayer educations we should lobotomize them I think.
That’ll learn em.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 4:24 pmIf they wanted an education they shoulda stayed in Mexico. We don’t want their kind here.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 4:31 pmMaybe the meaning of the word “illegal” should be changed, as it doesn’t seem to mean what the dictionary says.
Fair enough, AD, but I feel it still isn’t right. I live near the border. And I will stop there; the stories would go on forever.
PatAZ (9d1bb3) — 11/22/2009 @ 4:34 pmHere is why. From Wiki..
On September 10, 2008 Slim announced that he had purchased a 6.4 percent common-stock stake in The New York Times Company, making him the largest shareholder not related to the company’s owners, the Sulzberger family.[10]
Then, on January 19, 2009, the financially-troubled Times Company announced that it had accepted a $250 million loan from Slim.[11] While the loan will help ease the company’s cash flow problems, it does not come close to eliminating the Times Company’s $1.1 billion debt.[11] The company’s continuing financial problems and Slim’s ongoing interest in its work, as evidenced by his two interventions in the course of five months, has led to speculation that he might be contemplating an outright takeover of the Times Company
Hazy (996c34) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:05 pmTrouble is, opportunity is not “boundless.” Someone has to pay for it, and we cannot afford to give goodies to every person who lands on our shores.
I also know people who waited patiently in line. Dont’t they count?
Besides, if an illegal immigrant is not enterprising enough to get fake legal ID ($250 behind the DMV) why would we want him? 🙂
Patricia (b05e7f) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:09 pmThere is no such thing as an illegal immigrant, that is just the political correct term for a known unpunished criminal. When people grow up and have a family and find their children can’t get an education because all the slots are filled with criminals they can then flip out. If we give $40-50 K per year to known criminals why do we punish a shop lifter for stealing a $5 item, or a burglar for stealing your TV? Either apply the law or forget it and become a third world country overnight. Maybe we can take up piracy on the high seas.
Scrapiron (996c34) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:16 pmRopelight wrote:
No, the illegals came here and took the jobs that good American citizens didn’t want and wouldn’t do.
The non-lawyer Dana (474dfc) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:18 pmI like to think I’d have what it takes to be an illegal immigrant if I were born in Mexico.
Mexico sucks what? Ass.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:21 pmThere was a time a few years ago when the President of Mexico said “hey, guess what, folks. We suck. If you want to run off and get in that country up north illegally, we’ll tell ya how to do it. Good luck, folks. (And send money back.)” Or something like that.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:30 pmI think I know how to make the Left go crazy.
Step #1: Make a policy statement that we will treat illegal immigrants precisely as Mexico treats their own illegal immigrants.
Step #2: When the Left announces that we should be “better” than that, we immediately accuse them of being racist imperialists.
Step #3: Watch their heads explode, like in “Scanners.”
Eric Blair (0b61b2) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:30 pmHappyfeet needs to start taking his meds again.
Just thought I should remind him.
KingShamus (fb8597) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:32 pmJacoby got a lot of abuse from the left for a recent anti-gay-marriage column, so now he’s trying to show how balanced he is. Ridiculous.
Mitch (e40959) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:33 pmNah, I don’t want footsie on meds. I like him just the way he is, a little “tetched” in the head.
John Hitchcock (3fd153) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:33 pmThank you Mr. Hitchcock.
Mr. Jacoby is a startling and radical thinker with his thoughts on educating young people yet I’m reluctant to conclude that he is to be considered not of the mainstream.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 5:41 pmIts a quandry that we would subsidize taxpayer a over taxpayer b concerning a federal issue c.
A resident of the state is a resident of a state – the federal issue of immigration is an ongoing and ever evolving one.
If a child grows up in the state educational system then their parents had established some kind of taxpaying residency.
Its not up to college admissions officers to enforce federal citizenship issues – asking people for birth certificates wherever they go is getting tedious at best
Furthermore – college is not a right and a state resident has NO MORE RIGHT to MY tax money than an resident who is residing here illegally
NO ONE – should be getting a subsidized education – thats rediculous – I just moved to tennessee and my children are going to get a 60% discount on tuition and the state I left after paying 250,000 dollars in taxes would see their tuition double
Its a stupid thing to even argue about – fighting over entitlements is not what conservatives should be focusing on – they should be focusing on removing them – let the kids be more serious about college and making a strong career by getting a large loan and applying themselves
EricPWJohnson (403cb1) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:21 pmMr. Johnson is making a tremendous amount of sense up there I think.
happyfeet (b919e7) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:35 pmHappyfeet
It was a sudden blow to the head
EricPWJohnson (403cb1) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:40 pm#65, Dana said, “…the illegals came here and took the jobs that good American citizens didn’t want and wouldn’t do.”
I’ve often heard that in the past, and I never found it universally persuasive, although I will acknowledge there may once have been a good bit of truth in it.
However, economic conditions have changed dramatically since then. Today, there are millions of Americans out of work who absolutely will take nearly any job they can get.
Citizens should damn well get first crack at any job that comes available. Citizens are our first priority, illegals have no right to work here, they don’t even have permission to be here, much less take a job that should go to one of our own.
ropelight (502cb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:53 pmropelight
not making statements on illegal immigration here but lets say a border state like tennessee – should virginia companies allow cheap tennessee laborers in to take jobs from virginians?
Should states have to give preference to in-state contractors for public works?
Who is giving the business owner or the taxpayers the best return for their money?
Or are conservative/capitalist principals dialable and selectable?
EricPWJohnson (403cb1) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:58 pmIn line with Rip Off Je$$ie Jack$on’s comment that you can’t vote against the largest rip off in history and call yourself a black man. You can’t support the Abortion/Murder in the bill and call yourself a christian. Tell me again what church Je$$ie is a member of. MLK would have the black democrats of today boiled in oil.
Scrapiron (996c34) — 11/22/2009 @ 6:59 pmokay crossed of umass from my kids common application. thanks for the info
drone (b020db) — 11/22/2009 @ 7:31 pm#77, EPWJ, my comment was about millions of illegal aliens living and working in the USA when our own citizens want and need jobs. It was in response to Dana’s comment at #65, you can follow it back from there.
ropelight (502cb2) — 11/22/2009 @ 9:25 pmI do dozens of little things to save water here in arid California. I drain the first two quarts of water from the hot water line in the morning into a pitcher instead pouring it down the drain. I use that to flush the toilet. I have been doing this for over a decade to save water. During that time the governments of the US and the government of Mexico have allowed MILLIONS of illegal aliens to move into my state. Illegal aliens are responsible for tremendous problems in our state and in our country. Unfortunately, there has been precious little open public debate on the cost of providing services to these millions of illegal aliens and their families. We are just expected to pay up and shut up.
tyree (124934) — 11/22/2009 @ 10:08 pmRopelight
I understand, however – I think most of those lower tier illegal immigrant jobs are not going to cross over to the millions of out of work Americans – I dont think anyone realistically is seeing that scenario – down the line – it could happen – but I think if unemployment gets any worse then a seismic shift in political thinking is going to occur
EricPWJohnson (403cb1) — 11/22/2009 @ 11:39 pmA meat proccesing plant in the Carolinas was raided and most of the illegals working there were arrested. Locals lined up around the block to apply for jobs. And this was several years ago before the post 2006 Democratic congress mess we are currently in.
That said at the large corporate headquarters where I currently work the cleaning staff is 100% Central American and West Indian. Staff is non-unionized but well payed. Insurance and other benefits. A lady recently returned from vacation back to Peru that lasted seven weeks. I imagine not all of that was paid but her job was kept for her while she was gone. The company that runs the service has ads in the papers every day but can not get locals to sign up. (And if you want to see unhinged ethnic hatred just put two guys from the wrong two islands togther on a crew.)
Have Blue (854a6e) — 11/23/2009 @ 12:45 amOkay, should have said Central and South American. As I pointed out several ladies are from Peru, and a couple of others are from Columbia and Ecuador. (Didn’t want any one pointing out Peru is not in Central America.)
Have Blue (854a6e) — 11/23/2009 @ 12:49 am“No, the illegals came here and took the jobs that good American citizens didn’t want and wouldn’t do.”
..at the below market wages illegals are paid.
There FIFY
Mike Giles (39c34b) — 11/23/2009 @ 4:56 am“…plant in the Carolinas was raided and most of the illegals working there were arrested…”
Same thing happened – within the last year IIRC – at a major-name meat plant on the Great Plains. Locals were lined up around the block to apply for those jobs (probably a few for the HR slots that opened up with their previous occupants in the hoose-gow, too).
AD - RtR/OS! (222944) — 11/23/2009 @ 11:47 amIf we get rid of the word ” illegal” we are just talking about other peoples money. Zero be loving OPM.
highpockets (9044e7) — 11/23/2009 @ 5:29 pm