Is This a “Conservative” Lesson?
A black woman warned her son that he needed to be respectful to the police, but she feared he wasn’t getting the message. So she decided to drive it home a different way:
To put my words into application, I once asked a recent graduate from the police academy to help my eldest son understand that my worries were valid. He assured me he would teach him an unforgettable lesson. Several evenings later, my unsuspecting man-child was stopped by the graduate and was asked a slew of unimportant questions.
Where are you going tonight? Is this your car? Why are you out so late? What do your parents do?
The list was endless. The barrage of inquiries was intended to irritate and distract. As my son started to lose his composure and show his annoyance, the officer became more “aggressive” my son said later.
Consequently, he ended up on the hood of his SUV faced down and was told to address the officer as “Mr. Officer, sir”. After being given a fictional ticket and the fright of his life, he came home shaking with rage. As he tried to explain his terrorizing encounter he experienced, I continued the interrogation by asking about his actions that provoked the officer. I could hear the disbelief in his voice as he tried to repeat the sequence of events. I was not interested in the cop’s behavior but his responses to the cop. I saw the white hot anger on his face. I remind him that his exasperation was what others experienced daily.
A.C. Kleinheider sees the mother’s lesson as conservative:
Now, I’m not naive or obtuse. One of the reasons Holmes taught her son this lesson was because as a black male, police may be on “higher alert” around him. This is taken as given, a fact of life.
Holmes is not taking away anything from the injustice of the fact, but she is not crippled by it either. She moves forward.
This is the essence of conservatism. Certain things are intractable.
Kleinheider notes disagreement from conservatives, however, such as Bill Hobbs, who stated:
“[Holmes] deliberately set up a fake situation designed to teach her son to not trust police and to encourage her son to view police through the lens of race and to view himself as a target and a victim,”
What’s your view? Was the mother’s lesson “conservative”?
She may be moving forward, but she appears to be doing her best to make certain that her son never will.
brobin (c07c20) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:22 amWas the mother’s lesson “conservative”?
Hardly. The lesson she taught her son is that he is a second class citizen who may be bullied by someone with a gun and a badge.
A black woman warned her son that he needed to be respectful to the police, but she feared he wasn’t getting the message.
She may have warned him, but I don’t know that she taught him. It sounds to me like throwing a baby in the water to learn how to swim.
A good parent teaches his kids that the police work for them and protect them from bad guys. And to be civil, but not servile, to all people.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:23 am“You know, Alan, if you’d wanted to scare the kid, you could have just pulled a gun on him.”
– Jurassic Park
Techie (482700) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:24 amAnd “This is the essence of conservatism. Certain things are intractable.”? What the heck is he talking about? Is that really the essence of conservatism?
brobin (c07c20) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:25 amHow is this legal? Or can I hire police to harass my personal enemies too?
Techie (482700) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:25 am5, No, but you can hire a Hollywood private detective, Anthony Pellacano is in the jug right now. You’ll have to go with a lesser light.
PCD (02f8c1) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:30 amNo.
J. Raymond Wright (d83ab3) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:50 amTeaching someone to be frightened of police officers seems like something the loony left would do.
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (0ea407) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:58 amDitto #2. Also, the young man probably lost a lot of trust in his mother.
My own limited experience with teenage boys is you can almost bank on them getting the wrong message. The more elaborate the message, the more likely they are to perceive it in some bizarre way. We can’t really manipulate the attitudes and perceptions of others, no matter our love or good intentions.
jodetoad (059c35) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:08 amWas the mother’s lesson “conservative”?
If, by “conservative” you mean “Klan-like” then yes, although most conservatives would rightly view that as a blood-libel.
Otherwise, no. It was in fact felonious since someone was impersonating an officer and in that guise committing assault, if not kidnapping.
Leaving that detail aside, what Mother Dearest accomplished was to create a childhood trauma that will color her child’s view of police forevermore. And God help her if he finds out the truth — he will NOT be thankful.
Oh, add child abuse to the list.
Kevin Murphy (3c3db0) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:10 amIt doesn’t strike me as ‘conservative,’ no. I have heard of similar lessons, but I think that the ‘race card’ is just silly in this context.
As always when discussing civilian / police actions, a reminder that Chris Rock addressed this topic in a most entertaining and practical way years ago. Simple, common, sense.
carlitos (3b87c2) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:11 amOh. missed that he was actually a police officer. Scratch the “impersonation” and replace with “… under color of authority.” Then fire him.
Kevin Murphy (3c3db0) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:12 am[…] Vineyard Tarheeltalker: I Want to Have It Both Ways, Please Patterico’s Pontifications: Is This a “Conservative” Lesson? Gathering of Eagles: NY: Barack Obama Vacations While Economy Tanks The Powers That Be: Dickweed […]
Fancy This… Geraldo Runs Into Prof. Henry Gates at Martha’s Vineyard (video) « Frugal Café Blog Zone (a66042) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:13 amAnyone else having trouble reading the comments section?
Techie (482700) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:19 amMy teenage son just got his license. I have had similar (low impact) discussions with him, because I believe the police would be very hard indeed on a teenage boy – as opposed to a teenage girl, or just about anyone else. A polite, respectful, honest attitude is paramount.
However, I would not encourage anyone to submit to the violation of their rights, and whether this is labeled conservative or liberal is completely irrelevant to me.
Amphipolis (b120ce) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:24 amWhat folks are really dealing here is “upper class” versus lower class attitudes. Folks the “lower class” (as I was raised) are brought up to see police as being figures of authority that are not trifled with, for any reason. The whole “And what is your badge number?” never comes up.
So, black or white, I know several parents in the neighborhood where I grew up who treated their mouthy children (I don’t know if the kid in this story was mouthy, though) to this kind of lesson—so that the wouldn’t get beaten by batons or have worse happen.
Thus I don’t think that this is racial. And spare me the anti-authoritian commentary, please.
Worst I ever saw was a son of a police sergeant who was out drinking under age. His father put him in the drunk tank overnight. No charges were filed, nor needed to be. I don’t think his son drank again!
Is this kind of approach right? Nope. But it is a tough and unforgiving world out there, and the later the lesson, the higher the cost.
Eric Blair (a88004) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:25 amTypos and all, folks, just my opinion. And I don’t approve of the mother’s actions. I have just seen it, and I understand the sentiment behind it.
Eric Blair (a88004) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:27 amKleinheider appears to be yet another person who thinks he knows me better than I know myself. If I make the un-PC decision to label myself a ‘conservative’ – then attach all the baggage liberals feel that come with it.
I don’t condone the action this women took; although I do understand her motivation (not her reasoning – nor the degree to which the ‘Graduate’ took the situation). I do applaud her concern and desire to educate her child(ren). At least the desire to teach them to respect the police.
Corwin (ea9428) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:29 amThe correct outcome of the “lesson” should be don’t trust your mother. It’s a similar lesson to putting your child up on a table and telling them to jump, you’ll catch them. Then you don’t and tell them, don’t trust anybody, only yourself.
That is not a “conservative” lesson. It is an anti-societal lesson. The mother is moving her son forward in a direction that is anti-societal. A good beginning for a “revolutionary” type who wants to force change on America in a likely unlibertine manner. Probably describes most of the “czars” responsible for establishing policy in the current admin. Fortunately, their anti-societal view of the world is far from reality, so they are rapidly failing in their ridiculous attempts at “change”.
Ray (3c46ca) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:33 amNo it was not a conservative lesson, albeit it was a valuable one. I know that it is not a crime per se to be “driving while asshole” or to engage in “contempt of cop”.
But it is likely to get you a few bumps up side the head, or some handcuffs on the wrist, and maybe even a night or so in the Gray Bar Hotel.
It’s been my observation that my most liberal friends and relatives have a great deal of anger against the world in them; while the more conservative types are willing to go with the flow of things as is. Getting angry and wanting to duke it out verbally or physically when you are confronted with a man with a gun and a badge may do wonders for your sense of justice–and maybe even your self esteem. But every pleasure has its price, and the price for that particular pleasure is usually more than it’s worth.
Mike Myers (674050) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:36 amBetter yet, she could have just showed him Chris Rock’s video of “How to NOT get your ass kicked by the Po-lice”.
Dr. K (eca563) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:36 amTechie, yeah, there is something about this blog that does not play well with cookies and refreshing the comment section correctly. I usually just disable cookies when visiting Patterico and everything works fine.
Ray (3c46ca) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:40 amI am white. When I was a teen-ager and even later on during my twenties and thirties, I was often stopped by the police. I worked in a dinner until midnight and would walk home from work either by myself or with several other teen-age co-workers.
In my twenties and thirties, I would take long walks at night to unwind after a hard day at the office. (One of the many reasons I chose Longwalker as my tag)
Therefore, I was an reasonable object of suspicion to the police. These “stops” began in the 1950’s in New York City where the police were having trouble with the “fighting gangs.”
My father was a policeman and explained, before I spent the first day on the job, what to expect and why the police would act as they did. I took his words to heart and, when stopped, I was polite and answered the policeman’s questions in a respectful manner.
These “stops’were fairly frequent but never lasted long. Once satisfied, the police would let me go on my way.
One of my younger brothers treated these stops ala Amphipolis and barely missed, in more than one instance, a “Chris Rock” special or worse due to his attitude.
He was in his forties before he understood that a police stop was not a violation of his rights but a normal and necessary exercise of the police power.
I would have to agree that the mother’s lesson was not “conservative” but a very poor teaching choice.
Longwalker (1fe7c2) — 8/25/2009 @ 8:51 amWhy couldn’t the mother have suggested her son participate in a ride – along with the policeman instead? Seems like a much better way to help the kid understand what a cop goes through on a daily basis, and why it can be such a tough undertaking when dealing with the public – at – large. A few conversations during the ride about teenagers and cops would also be quite pertinent, I think.
Dmac (e6d1c2) — 8/25/2009 @ 9:02 amMy son has ridden along and gained a tremendous insight as to how to behave around Police Officers.
pitchforksntorches (d996b6) — 8/25/2009 @ 9:11 amThis mothers goal was a pragmatic one. Not Liberal or Conservative. She just wants her son to be able to check the inherent cockiness that a lot of young men have when dealing with the police.
The ride along is a lot more acceptable in my view however.
I’m with Dr. K (#21). I actually _have_ shown the Chris Rock video to a few of my kids when they were teenagers. They were a bit startled at first, but they also got the message. ..bruce..
bfwebster (cad2d5) — 8/25/2009 @ 9:28 amThis was in fact a liberal lesson. The boy son was lied to by his mother, improperly dealt with by the policeman, who acted illegally by asking questions he had no right to ask and, who lied about the situation and treated the son inappropriately.
The entire ‘lesson’ was based upon lies and a perfect example of “the ends justifying the means”.
A conservative lesson would have been to let the boy stay in jail overnight if he had been arrested by the police for a legitimate reason. A conservative lesson would have been a ride along.
jack (e383ed) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:13 amGoing to have to agree with Kleinheider.
A more conservative- common sense- approach would be for the officer to take the young man down to the police station- not as a hostile or as someone being harassed “because of their skin color”, but as an ally. Show him what the officers go through day by day. Show him, also, what the people in jail go through. Show him videos of traffic stops. Let him get to know the other officers- and not in a patronizing, senior to junior way, but equal to equal.
Fear of the police isn’t respect. To quote a certain little green man, fear will lead the to hatred and anger. But understanding leads to true respect.
Jewels (dec12d) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:17 amWhen half the people involved in the encounter are uniformed and armed, it is best that the unarmed half stay polite.
That is conservative in that it involves a common sense response and not an emotional response.
And what is this thing about seeing “the white hot anger on his face.” Is that a racist remark? I guess it would be in Britain now. A real black mark for mom.
quasimodo (4af144) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:18 amAre we assuming that the cop was white?
Fritz (782019) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:23 amI think it was a libertarian message 😉
1: It is none of your business what you/we think of her actions. She can teach as she pleases.
2: POntificators need not apply.
3: Maybe we don’t know the whole story behind her reasoning. Is it possible the young lad was an impetuous little prick? Who needed a square peg–round hole lesson taught to him? Possibly.
4: Armchair quarterbacks are funny.
Why teach a kid not to stick a knife in a light socket when the light socket can teach him far better. Same thing applies here.
There is no conservative/lib lesson here. It is pragmatic/reality. It is what it is and learning to deal with it in the best possible manner is wiser than being an idiot laid out as Bubba’s beotch.
mmkay.
Navtechie (6478a6) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:28 amEver seen one of those “welcome to bootcamp” or “you’re in the Marines now” shows? Especially where they get the kids out of the bus at the very beginning?
His reaction was anger and frustration, when it should have been “Yes, sir” and “No, sir”.
When you’re on the receiving end of authority it always feels arbitrary and overreaching. The mother demonstrated what overreaching and arbitrary really looked like so that her son could in the future tell the difference.
Fritz (782019) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:31 amthis reminds me of the lessons episode from Arrested Development. How is it even legal again?
jamie (ecc9d3) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:36 amWhat she taught him was that overreaching and arbitrary are okay to use if you “mean well”. She’s stupid and the “police academy graduate” was even stupider for playing along. Send him back to the academy, he’s not ready.
Stashiu3 (ed6467) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:41 amNope.
Mother’s concern was to protect son by teaching him to control his rage, but the rage remains and both son & mother seem to accept it.
Conservative lesson would have been to teach son to respect the officer, for his position if not his behavior during this particular stop.
Even white people run across a disrespectful authoritarian cop once in awhile. Not everything is about race.
ManlyDad (22e85d) — 8/25/2009 @ 10:59 amI’ve read the linked article, and I don’t think that it is a “conservative” lesson.
Perhaps it was a lesson about how we ALL will have to act when dealing with the HUGE INCREASE in government functionaries we are likely to experience if Obama and the rest of the Dems get their way.
I would like to see a transcript of the encounter between the police academy graduate and the woman’s son. Perhaps the son should be congratulated for controlling his rage for as long as he did!
Ira (28a423) — 8/25/2009 @ 11:34 amHeck, a “ridealong” is almost always the best solution to this attitude that the police are some awful fascistic enterprise.
Good call, Dmac and others who suggested it.
Eric Blair (0b61b2) — 8/25/2009 @ 11:39 amI like this post because it encourages people to talk about what a conservative is.
This seems conservative if you think conservative means “enforce social order” “Keep minorities as 2nd class citizens.” Or “teach young people to be respectful or authority” If those are your guiding principles than yes a mild aversion lesson is appropriate. This action seems to boil down to “you will respect authority whether you are right or wrong.”
This doesn’t seem conservative if you think conservative means “respect personal liberty” “Distrust the power of the state.” “follow the rule of law.” Or “treat people in a color/class blind manner.”
Either way it was pretty short sighted. If things had escalated and someone been hurt it would have been an entirely avoidable tragedy.
I will say that “be nice to the cops or bad things will happen and there’s nothing you can do about it” is if not a conservative message than one that has been voiced here in the recent past.
time123 (03e182) — 8/25/2009 @ 11:50 amThere are people who are afraid of the police, and people the police are afraid of. In my little village, our police know who can take away their $63,000/year salary and their $63,000/year pension, and their health and life insurance. And who cannot. Be in the later group. But you need to “act white”.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 11:52 amYikes! *Be in the first group.*
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 11:56 amTo put my words into application, I once asked a recent graduate from the police academy to help my eldest son understand that my worries were valid. He assured me he would teach him an unforgettable lesson.
Could be misreading it but this sounds like: “my son didn’t believe my words that police officers would harrass him on an average day so I decided to deceive him and find someone who would artificially harrass him — all so he’d trust my words better.” Good job, Mom!
Also, no one’s mentioned the “Kobayashi Maru factor” yet. That deceptive cop was going to come at the kid until his rage took over. What happened to the bedrock conservative principle “my taking personal responsibility of my actions can greatly influence any situation for the better, no matter what anyone around me is doing?”
No, this was not a conservative lesson, mostly because deception and instillation of victim mentality were both at the foundation of it.
no one you know (7a9144) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:03 pmtime123, being nice to people in general, whether they are passersby, postal worker, death panelists, or cops, does tend to reduce the likelihood of misfortune.
I think being nice is just a good basic virtue. This lesson was a clumsy way to get that lesson across. I teach my kids to be nice… by being nice.
And while I am sure someone mentioned ‘being nice to cops is smart’ on here, I think regarding Gates/Crowley the argument was more like ‘don’t be a crazy screaming weirdo’.
Juan (bd4b30) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:05 pmHaving just remembered that “recent graduates from the police academy” also known as “rookies” do not get to patrol alone, I call bullshit on the whole story and call mama “Rigoberta” also known as “lying ho”.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:33 pmHaving just remembered that “recent graduates from the police academy” also known as “rookies” do not get to patrol alone, I call bullshit on the whole story and call mama “Rigoberta” also known as “lying ho”.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:33 pmWithout having read the article, I don’t know if the fake-cop test was fair. As in, could the boy have ‘won’ if he kept his head long enough in the face of escalating unfair aggression.
Which leads to a different point of a different nature. At what point is it permissible to defend yourself against the police? At what point, or clue, would one have to have to come to the conclusion that either this is not a cop or that this cop is in fact ignoring the law and going to kill you where it is convenient?
Very difficult question. (Even more difficult considering that criminals are known to dress up like cops and flash badges to get an advantage.)
luagha (5cbe06) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:33 pmI don’t think he would have been on an official shift and behaving this way. It was probably off-duty and outside the view of the department. Doesn’t mean it actually happened, but rookies not patrolling alone doesn’t necessarily prove it’s fake.
Stashiu3 (ed6467) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:40 pmSo he was in a squad car, in uniform, off-duty? Was this in Mayberry?
And if he was alone and on duty or off duty in uniform or out of uniform in a squad car — his car has all kinds of little thingies that let his supervisor know where it is at all times. He has to call in a bathroom stop or he’s in trouble, for crying out loud. I call the whole thing fiction.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 12:55 pmI agree that it has that “parable illustrating a higher truth” feel to it. I just wouldn’t call it proven false. I think you’re probably right though.
Stashiu3 (ed6467) — 8/25/2009 @ 1:03 pmIt’s quite something to get to 50 comments and still not see your own point of view recommended (although the ridealong idea comes very close).
What mom missed to make it a *conservative* lesson was to teach her son to say, “Thank you, sir.” to the police officer.
THAT is what Gates was missing when a policeman bravely walked into his house not knowing who owned it or who was in it but willing to risk his life to protect that anonymous person’s property. Gates ought to have said, “Officer, I am the homeowner, and I am SO thankful that you came so quickly. Let me get my I.D. so that you can be put at ease, and let’s get to know one another just a bit. I’m very thankful for the people who keep all my junk from getting stolen every time I fly off to China.”
Gesundheit (47b0b8) — 8/25/2009 @ 1:04 pmoh yeah… “every time I fly off to China leaving my house with a busted front door and hoping like crazy that nobody will rob me blind.”
Gesundheit (47b0b8) — 8/25/2009 @ 1:05 pmacting like a for real mom and not like a bff is inherently conservative I think
happyfeet (71f55e) — 8/25/2009 @ 1:26 pmIt’s not a conservative lesson.
Larry Reilly (45c8f2) — 8/25/2009 @ 3:14 pmIt looks to me like the making of an urban legend.
Unless, of course, the recent police academy graduate is dumber than dirt. And indeed he is if he put all that training and ambition in jeopardy by doing something that could cost him his new job.
That’s why I think this anecdote is a tall tale.
But do enjoy it, please, and nurture it. It will make you feel good.
Rather than asking if this is a conservative or liberal message, how about asking if it’s a good idea and see who (if anyone) says yes and who says no?
tim maguire (4a98f0) — 8/25/2009 @ 3:22 pmI don’t think it was a particularly conservative lesson, nor an especially helpful one. It is the kind of lesson, I suspect, which could get one a hefty, well-deserved settlement in the local courts.
I got yelled at quite a bit by a cop who got a match by running a partial plate on my car once. I tried, several times, to change his aggressive behavior before I realized that I was being unhelpful and doing things which could have been misinterpreted by someone who might have been on edge about me, too.
There is a useful lesson to be taught here, for all parents. However, it’s probably too late to address this one after graduation.
mj (c826f0) — 8/25/2009 @ 3:35 pmDon’t be a douche, Larry person. It may not be conservative per se but it’s for reals Rumsfeldian to lay down a little shock and awe and trust the shocked and awed to unnerstand how the cow ate the cabbage.
Not everything occasions a condescending pseudo-intellectual response.
No, really.
happyfeet (71f55e) — 8/25/2009 @ 3:48 pmI cannot decide which is the more stupid of the two: the mother for subjecting her son to such treatment, or the moron cop that agreed to do it and then actually carried it out.
Marty Farty (cb1d38) — 8/25/2009 @ 3:56 pmBut do enjoy it, please, and nurture it. It will make you feel good.
Comment by Larry Reilly — 8/25/2009 @ 3:14 pm
Who you talking to, little picklebiter? Who here nurtured it and enjoyed it? You are one creepy little worm, Larry. Do you really believe that you have any credibility?
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 4:02 pmAnd I don’t think that it ever happened outside Genma Holmes’s imagination. My comment on her blog will never pass moderation, but maybe Patterico (and others who give a #$%^) could send an email to her about it.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 4:05 pmI don’t think it was a conservative lesson. I also don’t think it matters if the teenage boy is black or white because most teenage boys are made up of pretty much the same stuff to overcome: rebellion, selfishness, bravado and stupidity. They all need to learn to respect authority figures but this should be ongoing lessons over the growing up years.
This however, was a dishonest attempt to teach a lesson that others have already commented could have been more effectively and honestly accomplished by a ride-along and straight talk from the cop. This was nothing more than a lie and ruse. How is that conservative?
From the mother’s linked post, one can assume she is a single mother with teenage sons, so it’s very easy to understand her good intentions. Except when dealing with teenagers it’s generally a really good idea not to lie to them because eventually they will find out and it just becomes another weapon in their little arsenal with which to point out their parent’s hypocrisy and lose respect for them. Why add to their effort? It’s rarely worth the price.
Dana (0f0b2e) — 8/25/2009 @ 5:13 pmBTW, what her “recent graduate from the police academy” did is punishable by a mandatory minimum 12 years in prison. As a co-conspirator, she also faces the same sentence. The lady is not only a liar, she is an idiot.
nk (b17d90) — 8/25/2009 @ 6:27 pmBrotha got scared straight and there’s lots what never was what oughta been and people got hurt cause of it. Hurt bad.
happyfeet (6b707a) — 8/25/2009 @ 6:34 pm______________________________________
A.C. Kleinheider sees the mother’s lesson as conservative:
I’d buy the argument that the mother was instinctively conservative — and common-sense oriented — if she also were candid, up-front, no-punches-pulled about the dysfunction that roils far too much of black America. The type of dysfunction implied in the remarks made by Jesse Jackson several years ago, who said that when he walked down a public sidewalk and noticed strangers moving in his direction were not young black males, he’d find himself becoming less nervous.
However, if the young man’s mother instead remained quiet about the rowdy, flaky, “bitches and hos” behavior evident in an uncomfortably large portion of the black community, and did nothing to disabuse him from the notion that angst towards blacks was 100% racist, 100% unfair, 100% irrational, then that actually would be garden-variety liberalism far, far more than it would be conservatism.
Mark (411533) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:46 pmThis was absolutely a conservative lesson.
The term conservative means to conserve the status quo. When innocently encountering the police, or a government functionary, a conservative wishes to act out on the Hippocratic oath – “first do no harm.” Or, preserve my health and liberty, at the least.
Wrong or right, the only correct response to a cop questioning you (assuming your innocence) is to demonstrate in words AND in body language, that you respect his/her full authority over you. It is that simple.
Whether this kid “got it” in the moment is irrelevant. The point was made – he lipped off and he got manhandled. A conservative fully understands the world is inherently unfair and that force will, from time to time, come against you. Unless one is prepared for major damage, one should placate said force. In other words, is this a battle worth fighting?
In this situation, a conservative recognizes it would be foolhardy to act on emotion (the number one way liberals “think” and act) and decides to do what is needed to live to fight another day.
Now, if the mom took her little angel’s side after this incident, then no, this was not a conservative lesson.
Ed from SFV (c4544e) — 8/25/2009 @ 7:49 pmI don’t lie, decieve or play head games on friends or family members to get them to do what I think they ought to do.
Period.
Having read this woman’s article, I find her to be an utterly repugnant human being.
Dave Surls (47c712) — 8/26/2009 @ 3:26 amAlso, BTW, Mrs. Holmes drove by my site and left a comment threatening to get Google to out me. I hope she tries. I would love to depose her and her “recent graduate”, who violated her son’s civil rights while armed with a firearm, and send copies of the transcript to her local state and federal law enforcement.
[note: fished from spam filter]
nk (b17d90) — 8/26/2009 @ 7:35 amIt looks like the you-know-what ate my previous comment so I’ll try this one without you-know-whats.
Mrs. Holmes thinks she can bully me, the way she allegedly bullied her son. She drove by my site and left a comment threatening to get Google to out me. Not that she would do it herself. Google would do it for her. The way her “recent graduate” allegedly did her dirty work for her with her son. This is a lady with welfare, entitlement mentality, relying on the meanness of strangers.
nk (b17d90) — 8/26/2009 @ 8:09 amIf any federal criminal law practitioners are lurking, what is the statute of limitations for violation of civil rights while armed with a handgun?
nk (b17d90) — 8/26/2009 @ 8:16 amThe woman’s lesson was sensible, i.e. conservative. Black, white, yellow, or chartreuse, the sensible thing is to do is expect a hassle from, and avoid pissing off, someone who can ruin your day. This applies to the airline ticket counter, DMV, college admissions office, and especially to a cop with a billy club, taser, pistol, a set of handcuffs, and a screened off back seat of a car.
Keep cool and treat it as another splinter in the posterior as you slide down the banister of life.
Person of Choler (e3a43f) — 8/26/2009 @ 3:51 pmOr you could help them become cellmates to someone named Bubba.
A perjuriously-obtained warrant was served on some clients on mine. My clients were quiet as mice and let the police search to their hearts’ content. Among other things, they “seized” a roll of stamps and a MagnaLite. Some of the guns never showed up on the inventory list.
My clients’ case was dismissed. The sergeant is serving life in a federal prison. The detective got ten years.
nk (b17d90) — 8/26/2009 @ 6:30 pmSeems to me the woman was already a failure as a parent. My reasoning for this is simple. A properly raised child would already know to be respectful and polite to authority figures, his elders and to women. If he already acted in this manor, then there would have been no need for the “lesson”.
I understand that society doesn’t work this way by default anymore, but I know quite a lot of teen and young adults who were raised to be respectful and polite even in this corrupt day and age. It is not impossible, just very time consuming and requires a commitment by the parents to actually be parents.
No, I do not believe that this was a conservative act. I believe it was a stupid act and just created another young person with a hatred of police and authority figures.
Jay Curtis (8f6541) — 8/26/2009 @ 10:22 pm