L.A. Times Runs Lame Piece on Racial Profiling
As long as we’re having this frank discussion about race and everything, let me express something that really bugs me: the ability of some black people to turn literally any legitimate police stop into an example of “racial profiling.” The Henry Louis Gates arrest, in which a cop was merely following up on a legitimate report of black men breaking into Gates’s house, is but the latest example — but this goes on all the time. We constantly have to read stories about black men being allegedly oppressed by cops — yet once the facts are known, turns out that the officers are simply doing their jobs.
Take today’s L.A. Times article on racial profiling, titled Black males’ fear of racial profiling very real, regardless of class. Here’s the passage that caught my eye:
And yet [Lorenzo] Wyche is also gripped at times by the gnawing suspicion that his black skin makes him a target. He was recently driving in midtown Atlanta. In front of him, an attractive white woman walked across the road, catching his eye. Behind him, a white policeman turned on his lights and pulled Wyche over.
But there would be no fireworks. The officer warned Wyche about an expired tag on his Porsche, and drove away.
You might think this would be the point where Wyche says: “So that showed me that not every stop is necessarily racial profiling.” If that’s what you’d think, you’d think wrong.
“So that was my moment,” Wyche said, with a laugh. “Did he run my tag just because I stared at this white girl?”
Wyche figures he will never know whether he was profiled.
This is the point where many of us want to tear our hair out in frustration. Jesus Christ! His tag was expired — and the cop even had the courtesy of giving the guy a warning instead of a ticket! Nevertheless, the cop is suspected of racism. [UPDATE: Jack Dunphy adds in the comments: “[T]he officer didn’t need to run the tag to see that the Porsche’s registration had expired, all he had to do was look at it. I’ve long had the habit of scrutinizing the license plate of every single car I find myself behind. Should I be discouraged from doing so, out of fear of giving offense, when the car is driven by a black person?”]
Ironically, even the fact that he wasn’t issued a ticket can be spun as evidence of racism. For example:
Kwame Dunston says he has made the calculated choice to take it — repeatedly. The public school administrator says he has been pulled over more than 20 times in the last decade, but has rarely been issued a ticket. What factor other than race, he wondered, would account for all of those stops?
Gee, I dunno. Maybe Dunston did something wrong, and the cop was courteous and didn’t issue a ticket? Like Wyche, the guy with the expired tag who got off with a warning?
But what I find the most galling is when a black man commits a crime, and another black man who fits the description is stopped — and the man who got stopped blames the cop, rather than the black man who committed the crime. And Big Media always seems to join the chorus of condemnation for the cop.
Here are two examples from recent days. First, the Washington Post:
Coming out of another hotel, [Bob Johnson] was stopped by security — locked in a revolving door — because a black man had committed a mugging in the building and they were stopping all black men coming out of the building.
Wow. Looks like the mugger inconvenienced a lot of people. Was that the focus of the article? No. The responsibility of the criminal is never discussed — nor does it come up in a similar story in the Boston Globe:
[S. Allen] Counter has faced a similar situation himself. The well-known neuroscience professor, who is also black, was stopped by two Harvard police officers in 2004 after being mistaken for a robbery suspect as he crossed Harvard Yard. They threatened to arrest him when he could not produce identification.
“This is very disturbing that this could happen to anyone, and not just to a person of such distinction,” Counter said. “He was just shocked that this had happened, at 12:44 in the afternoon, in broad daylight. It brings up the question of whether black males are being targeted by Cambridge police for harassment.”
No, they’re being targeted by cops looking for a robbery suspect. Presumably Counter was mistaken for a robbery suspect because another black man with a similar description had robbed somebody. Perhaps even in broad daylight. The cops didn’t make the black robber commit the robbery — nor did they pick the time of day when it happened.
Again, who was doing something wrong? The cops doing their jobs? Or the guy who committed the crime?
In Big Media, the answer is always the same: the cops. Why does nobody ever bring up the fact that the actual criminal is actually to blame??
Wouldn’t making that simple point contribute to mutual understanding, and help ease those racial tensions Big Media claims to be so worried about?
Help ease racial tensions?
What would the left do then?
Nice post Patterico. A white female friend of mine was stopped years ago by the cops looking for a similar suspect.
She made no stink about it, but if she had I still think that the media would have ignored her. What kind of idiocy is the ultimate goal of this obtuse thinking? If there had been no crime committed, and the black men were stopped for no reason, then there’s a story there.
But this isn’t the case.
Apogee (e2dc9b) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:10 pmPat: you’re being sensible….please stop.
this has nothing to do with rational thinking or reason, so you’re not helping things.
remember: ‘Never try to teach a pig to sing: It wastes your time and annoys the pig.’
redc1c4 (fb8750) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:16 pmI think my last comment works more better here. brb.
happyfeet (c75712) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:21 pmThere must be plenty of people in the Los Angeles Times newsroom who got their jobs solely through racial profiling.
Official Internet Data Office (6ac5ad) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:22 pmIt’s weird that so many white people are willing, eager even, to look at a very a lot educated black guy and think it entirely likely and even probable that he would not have the faculties to cope with a fairly mundane encounter with a white police officer. That’s shamefully racist and I think a lot of people had thought we were past that.
happyfeet (c75712) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:23 pmThe left has no problem with the form of racial profiling known as affirmative action.
Mike LaRoche (d83224) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:25 pm[…] 2: Over at Patterico there is a new story regarding an LA Times story that will boggle your mind, here is an […]
Gazzer’s Gabfest » Perhaps OJ could teach a class on self-defense… (b98ad6) — 7/25/2009 @ 11:39 pmReport: Obama family leases a $20 million dollar farm for summer vacation
“President Obama and his family have rented a farm in Martha’s Vineyard for their summer vacation next month. They will start their vacation the last week of August, according to reports. According to the Vineyard Gazette, the Obamas have rented the Blue Heron Farm. The farm is located on 28.5-acres. No one is quite sure how much the rental is costing the Obamas, but similar properties rent for $35,000 to $50,000 a week.“
Official Internet Data Office (6ac5ad) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:05 amI hear, and I mostly agree. But I also know that if I was repeatedly pulled over and cited for things like a taillight being out, I’d think something a bit odd was going on. And this does happen.
Black men driving Porches may not have to worry, but a black guy driving a 10-year-old Chevy in rich neighborhoods is going to get pulled over now and then. Yes, this does trace back to crime statistics, but it is still profiling.
Kevin Murphy (0b2493) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:19 amWhy is it that the police are guilty of racial profiling while blacks do not hold themselves guilty of racial stereo typing of police?
Somehow an examination of crime statistics in the US show blacks are responsible for crimes way out of proportion to their population size, but the police are guilty of profiling?
When preppy whites are in a black neighborhood what do you think they might be up to?
But is it wrong to think that blacks who look like gang bangers in the suburbs just happen to live there?
Our Fearless Leader managed to slime not only police but the medical profession in his incoherent rant the other night. Its going to be a long four years.
But Biden is sounding more and more sane every time the Fearless Leader is without his peerless teleprompter.
Thomas Jackson (8ffd46) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:27 amI also know that if I was repeatedly pulled over and cited for things like a taillight being out, I’d think something a bit odd was going on. And this does happen.
I think it’s illegal to have a taillight that’s out. So if you keep getting pulled over for that, maybe fix it.
Patterico (cc3b34) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:48 amDon’t you get it, Pat? The reason crime is committed by minorities is the shameful lack of equality of outcome in our school systems, and the paltry sums given for housing and healthcare to the oppressed!
So, if the underlying crime is understandable, why is it so difficult for you to get that it is unfair to hassle non-whites?
I swear, you are pre-racial! (I don’t even know what it means, but it sounds profound, eh?)
Ed from SFV (6162a9) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:49 amI was planning to address this L.A. Times story myself, but I’m just as pleased that our host answered the bell. I would only add, regarding one of the quotes cited above, that the officer didn’t need to run the tag to see that the Porsche’s registration had expired, all he had to do was look at it. I’ve long had the habit of scrutinizing the license plate of every single car I find myself behind. Should I be discouraged from doing so, out of fear of giving offense, when the car is driven by a black person?
I’ve addressed the subject of racial profiling a few times over the years, most recently here, on NRO. And Heather Mac Donald’s piece, The Myth of Racial Profiling, published in City Journal in 2001, still applies today.
Jack Dunphy (38fbdf) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:30 amAaaargh, when is this race shit going to stop?! Please God, make it stop! Jeeez every other country in the world has worse racial hatred than us, but why does the USA have to be the hot anvil that this crap gets forged upon?! I prayed and hoped that this horseshit was settled FIFTY FRICKIN YEARS AGO by Dr. MLK Jr, but the so-called scholars like shit-for-brains Gates just keep on provoking/resurrecting it. Now Gates and BHO can drink a beer with the cop, and stage their motherfarking Teachable Moment. Aaaaaarrggghhh!
gp (2502a8) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:31 amProfiling does seem to happen. Maybe not everywhere but in some places.
http://www.shreveporttimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/99999999/NEWS01/801200301
has a story with the following key points:
-A two-month investigation by The Times shows that in Shreveport and Bossier City black drivers are cited for traffic violations more than twice as often as whites
– The story was based on an analysis of 285,000 traffic tickets issued over a four year period
– In Shreveport, licensed white drivers outnumber black licensed drivers by about 25 percent; in Bossier City, they outnumber black licensed drivers by 75 percent, according to Louisiana Office of Motor Vehicles statistics.
– Black drivers in Shreveport were cited about 2.1 times more often or 119 percent more frequently than white drivers and about 2.25 times more often or 125 percent more frequently in Bossier City
-both police chiefs say that profiling doesn’t happen and the paper said more needs to be studied before absolute conclusions can be made
– Shreveport population consists of about 51% black and 48% white, Bossier City is about 60% white and 30% black (not in the story just local demographic info)
The Bossier police chief ascribes the disparity to the tourists who come here. that makes an assumption that either more black tourists visit the area or a large majority of black tourists commit traffic violations and that whites don’t generally commit traffic violations in significant numbers. He offers no studies or evidence to back up his claim.
The paper approached this in a good scientific way by looking at the databases. Something is going on to cause a disparity.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:58 amIn Chicago, 75% of murder victims are black, 20% are Hispanic, and less than 5% are white. We need to get those murderers to stop racial profiling.
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 4:25 amWhy would the name of the Savior need to profaned in the writing of your post? It really does detract from your professionalism, and offends as well. Jesus Christ gave His Holy life for you and me. His name is most worthy of our honor.
Paul Totten (9d6350) — 7/26/2009 @ 4:54 amWhen a black man is stopped by cops looking for a black perp, the issue of the (black) criminal is rarely mentioned.
Richard Aubrey (ac8698) — 7/26/2009 @ 5:23 amCould be because he’s black?
Just throwing that out there.
When the vast majority of crime comes from ‘certain’ groups, profiling is necessary. In a decent country it would be celebrated, not apologized for.
Jack (1a3562) — 7/26/2009 @ 5:28 amI was profiled(I’m White) by NYPD once when driving thru Harlem at night back in the 1980’s.
firefirefire (81ecb9) — 7/26/2009 @ 5:50 amI had just dropped a shipmate off at his home and was heading back down to lower Manhattan then on to bklyn.
I was stopped at a traffic light when a unmarked patrol car pulled up along side me and the guy in the passenger seat looked over and signaled me to roll down my window,when I had it rolled down he showed his gold shield and asked “just what the fuck I thought I was doing”? I’m waiting for the light to change. I responded.
“Well Don’t! unless you WANT to get murdered”
With a nod of the head I took off and did a rolling stop thru every light until I reached 97th st.
The detective in the passenger seat was black.
NYC during the crack epidemic was an interesting place to live.
I live in Atlanta. Four years ago I was busy and traveling a lot, I forgot about updating my registration and my tag expired. I was pulled over, I was very apologetic and cooperative. Still, I got a $200+ ticket and had to report to traffic court. Perhaps if I had darker skin I would have gotten just a warning.
Ray (3c46ca) — 7/26/2009 @ 5:58 amPatterico you have no idea what your’e talking about. None.
You’re an intelligent man, and obviously skille legally, but your knee-jerk dismisssal of what African-Americans have to put up with to this day is lamentable.
David Ehrenstein (2550d9) — 7/26/2009 @ 6:05 amIn many states, license tags (stickers) are color-coded, with the expiration month in large letters. Is that the case in California? If so, even the accusation that the police officer put some special effort into “run[ning]” the tag is bogus.
Jim (50c15d) — 7/26/2009 @ 6:09 am“Harry, this description of the bank robber matches that black guy in the red pickup in front of us!”
“O.K….Well, let’s stop the blonde broad in the convertible 1st, then see if we can catch up to the red truck….Can’t be profiling ya know!”
Duke DeLand (d5e2e6) — 7/26/2009 @ 7:00 amVoiceofreason2 says that “Profiling does seem to happen.”
Well, yes. Basic human nature and good police work are all based off of “profiling.”
I spent a lot of time with a black friend of mine. He’s an immigrant from Guyana, (which means that a number of “African-American” groups won’t let him join, which “profiles” him as “not black”) and has some other good stories about profiling. Except some don’t prove what he thinks they do.
But yes, sometimes “profiling”, to mean harassing blacks does occur. My friend’s brother was repeatedly harassed, pulled over and detained while his vehicle was searched. Same cop. His brother was driving a suburban with dark tinted windows and “gold” rims. Every time the police found nothing, even using a drug dog, it apparently reinforced his image that Joe was “getting away with it” and would be – eventually – caught. This continued until he sold the SUV and bought a cheap car. Was that profiling as VOR2 calls it? Yep. Can you understand it? Well, if the police are *sure* that Joe’s really a Caribbean drug smuggler and is just waiting to get a big bust.. sure. It’s understandable. “OK, you got away with it THIS TIME…” (But I bet you’ll get cocky and I’ll catch you next time!)
But then he also tells stories such as the one when he was employing his nephew. They stopped on the commute at a convenience store to gas up and get food. My friend Will came in from pumping gas to find a “off-duty” cop obviously watching Ian as he perused the snacks. Seeing Will come in – wearing the same uniform, the cop _immediately left Ian alone and went and sat down in a chair by the cash register_. Will uses this story to decry “profiling” – no matter how many times I point out that as soon as the profile changed, instead of early 20s young black male by himself turned into early 20s young black male with more adult supervision and apparent employment – the policeman stopped worrying Ian would be shoplifting.
Technically, that’s “profiling”, all right. But it wasn’t harassment – Ian never even realized the cop was watching him, and as the situation and profile changed, the policeman responded IMO correctly and immediately.
As to the traffic citation situation, let me point you at the New Jersey study that got buried after the conclusion was released… That supported the NJ troopers numbers of speeders they were pulling over. Or I would point you at it, if the DoJ and NJ hadn’t buried it. You can find it referenced in many places, including MacDonald’s work.
Unix-Jedi (455b8a) — 7/26/2009 @ 7:11 amThose sniveling about racial profiling should be required to watch a training video on this produced by Chris Rock entitled “How Not To Get Your Ass Kicked By The Police.” It is simple yet highly educational.
Tug Speedman (b2907a) — 7/26/2009 @ 7:49 amhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj0mtxXEGE8
It’s not racial profiling.
Black men in suits with conservative haircuts and stereos playing at low levels do not get hassled any more than white men in the same suits. Asian men with slicked back head hair, weird facial hair and driving rice rockets get hassled while Asian men without the gangster accoutrements do not. Big surprise.
Appearance profiling is the simple, proper and accurate use of statistical reasoning, as in “Many young black men with the hoodies and the hip hop ‘tude are criminal assholes, so I’d better be careful”.
Fred Z (f7d2b1) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:00 amwhen I was in my twenties, I had no car, and rode a bike to and from work ,13 miles. There was a serial rapist for a time who was suspected to be in his twenties, and rode a bike. All these rapes were in an area I rode through to get to work.
I was stopped three times in one day, and stopped several times in other parts of the area. The multiple stops were right in the area these were happening, and half the deputies in the area responded. . .with a bit of over lap. Third stop, the second responding officer pulled up, got out and said “Take his hat off, and you’ll see he is bald. . .” then to me” “Bad Day? Well by now everyone should know you are Okay” From then on, when the lights came on, I’d take my cap off and one deputy just turned his lights off and said over the PA “Sorry”, the others did a precautionary check but it was at most a minute or two.
Musta been racist cops. . . or not. . I am white, and so was the rapist, who was caught and a basic resemblance to me was there, except the thick curly hair he had, and my bald spot.
White
5’6″-5’9″
Brown hair
brown eyes
medium build
I mean how could someone confuse us with that description.
JP (7d78aa) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:06 amI was just looking back through the NRO archives and found two of my favorite columns on racial profiling here and here.
Jack Dunphy (38fbdf) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:08 amComment by firefirefire — 7/26/2009 @ 5:50 am
Happened to me too, at Lake and Pulaski, Chicago. But the police were very polite. I said “I’m sorry”, the driver said “Don’t be sorry, be safe”.
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:10 amHow could the cop know what he was looking at? Do black people have their eyes on the back of their heads!?
Patricia (48ec63) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:58 amVOR2,
Here’s another view on that Shreveport racial profiling article.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:10 amThe type of people that drive around with expired registration tags are the type of people who drive around with outstanding warrants.
Alta Bob (f89c1e) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:16 amI’m a white guy. I used to drive a primo “Guards Red” 911S Porsche. ( I miss that car) While driving home from the cop shop at 2 AM, I was stopped at the minimum, once a week by the Laguna Beach Police. I wasn’t speeding. I did not have loud pipes. I was really tired from my shift but I don’t think that is PC for a stop. When I moved closer to work, I used to frequently get stopped by the Seal Beach Police. They had no reason to pull me over other than the fact I was a white man in a Porsche. My point? Uh, I’m not sure but I sure was pulled over a lot in that car.
I was working in uniform one night & this black man pulled in to the 7-11 where I was parked. he was driving a beautiful red 911 Porsche. Intending to compliment him on his car and engage the gentleman in some Poesche talk, I innocently asked, “Is that your car?” The response I got was a very angry “What, black man cant drive a Porsche?” I was really tempted to play his game and answer “No, he can’t.” I had already been to Internal Affairs once that month so I thought better of it.
In my most sarcastic tone, I told him I was a Porsche owner too and I was intending to compliment him on his car. I got in my POS Chevy black & white and drive away.
There you have it, my experience with Porches and race relations.
Stan Switek (b2907a) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:18 amThanks, DRJ. I was about to post a comment asking if anybody had looked at conviction rates and maybe someone might try to assess the level of violation of traffic regulations by race.
Another issue has to do with clothing worn by kids being stopped. Several years ago, I read a piece about the change in fashions across the world, especially the US and England. The piece concluded that this was the first example in modern human history where upper class people had begun to imitate the fashions and behavior of lower classes. This included language, including obscenity, and seemed to be a repudiation of behavior standards set by previous generations.
The Victorians were reacting to a rather licentious previous generation and the opposite seems to be happening now. Those baggy pants hanging half way down boys’ buttocks are an imitation of prison garb where belts are taken away. I don’t know where it began but there seems to be fashion movement to look criminal, especially in young black males. Maybe we should have a study about the rate in which such people are “profiled.”
By the way, if I were that Cambridge policeman, I would be very reluctant to show up at that “teaching moment” with two angry and self important black males.
Mike K (2cf494) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:32 amThe Democratic Party and their subsidiary, the lapdog media, need overwhelming percentages of the African American vote to win elections. They must continue to provoke racial discord and especially black distrust of whites. They will do so.
Ken Hahn (203140) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:33 amWhen I was in college, Stan, the guy in the next apartment in “the Jungle”, the crappy old rooming house where we lived (It was fashionable), had a Mercedes 300SLR. I don’t remember the color. He told me he was stopped almost every day by a cop “checking” his registration. One guy finally admitted that he stopped him just to see the car. He didn’t mind and thought it was funny.
By the way, in those days (1958), the car cost $12,000 new.
Mike K (2cf494) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:36 amI think it’s illegal to have a taillight that’s out. So if you keep getting pulled over for that, maybe fix it.
Kevin Murphy (0b2493) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:44 amPatterico, that’s a silly statement, and you know it. I’m willing to bet that you’ve had a taillight out for weeks or months before you ever noticed it (not an easy thing), yet you have never been cited for it.
Another Republican website, another website featuring white people complaining about black people.
Glad to know that in this crazy, crazy world, some things stay the same.
marco (767790) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:48 amDRJ,
I read the posting and don’t see much to dispute what the Times reported. The Times did state that no hard conclusions could be made from the statistics.
voiceforeason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 9:57 amNot sure I follow your point.
Black males’ fear of racial profiling very real, regardless of class.
And the important qualifier is that such males come from a part of American society in which an absurdly high percentage of it (surveys indicate at least 80-plus%—one poll awhile ago showed 95% of blacks disapproved of George Bush), because it is of the left, is prone to being neurotic, flaky and foolish about human nature and reality.
I don’t trust the way that “lefties” (white, black, Latino, Asian, European, African, Eskimo-an, Hindu, Jew, Gentile, secular/atheist, gay, straight, bisexual, young or old—particularly old or older) judge and perceive situations and people — involving themselves and others. “Progressives” have a way of observing reality and getting it ass-backwards, time and time again.
Nothing better illustrates this than the ultra-“lefty” we chose to place in the White House.
Mark (411533) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:23 amVOR2,
I believe my link raises specific questions and problems about the Shreveport Times’ data that were not addressed in the article. For instance, the link points out that the article omits information about “the conviction rates of the offenses cited” and “the race of the citing and/or arresting officer,” both of which could impact the racial profiling argument. The link also suggests the Times makes a common statistical mistake of “treating association as if it were causation.” There certainly may be racial profiling in Shreveport and Bossier City but, as a law enforcement source in the article stated, there is a difference between criminal profiling (allowed) and racial profiling (not allowed). I’m not sure the Times makes that distinction.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:34 amcursed by the supercache thing again — can’t see a thing after comment #38
voiceforeason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:35 amProblems with the old comment software in Firefox. This thread continues to show 23 comments, although in IE7 there are currently 42.
Phil Smith (4e586c) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:41 amI have the same problem, and I noticed it got worse after I updated Firefox with the new release a few days ago.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:43 amComment by DRJ — 7/26/2009 @ 10:34 am
Okay got it. Not sure why the conviction rate is relevant to the study. Point is that they were stopped and cited. I can see where the race of the officer would be relevant.
In both cities there are significantly more registered white drivers than black drivers.
Do I think that a coordinated effort is in play with the local Police? Not really. But I do think it is an interesting discussion worth pursuing.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:54 amWouldn’t the conviction rate provide some basis to decide whether it was a legitimate stop or a pretext?
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:57 amA few years ago the LA Times ran a story about a young black woman and her feelings about race and the police. The gist of her comments was that everytime she saw a policeman she was afraid. She admitted that she had had no encounters with police that would justify that reaction. I immediately recognized her problem for I had the same reaction for years. Although liberals are quick to classify me as a “minority,” I define myself simply as American. Whenever I spotted a policeman I reacted with fear. But I reacted the same way with teachers and school principals and nuns and priests. I finally realized that what I feared was authority and my relationship with my alcoholic father was the source. I have never had a bad encounter with police and neither has any of my three sons. I am convinced that the haphazard upbringing of many black youths causes them to react “awkwardly” to authority- Gates reflexively acted that way toward officer Crowley. Any national “conversation” about race must steer away from only blaming whites and look as well to the dysfunctional upbringing of many black children. Focusing on lowering the illegitimacy rate would be a good start.
mhr (32f26a) — 7/26/2009 @ 10:59 amThat study that was cited needs context before conclusion.
Seems to me the data is incomplete for the purposes of conclusions without violent crime statistics by race.
My personal opinion is that a small to moderate group of young African Americans is screwing it up for the rest. The African American community on a macro level publicly still in a protect and defend mode towards a criminal element within.
On the micro level, predominantly black juries in predominantly black communities convict violent black criminals and vote for tough sentences every day.
A good national dialogue on race and crime would be helpful.
Simply put, would the Jordan Downs housing project (is it still there?) residents be better off if every black male who is currently serving time for a violent crime in their neighborhood was released tomorrow back into the area?.
No.
What can we do to help young African American males get from 4 yrs old to 18 without having them fall victim to older violent criminal gang members as long as the community shelters them together? The kids wind up influenced and coerced by/into gangs, dragged behind in school by gang nonsense within the schools, shot, stabbed, beaten, robbed by older gang memebrs and “affiliates” (whatever that means)
True change can only come from within.
I thought of another time I was racially profiled.
I was young and sort of ran off and took a freight train out to Wyoming and back. On the way back I came into LA on the southern route and hit the railroad yard in East LA which was adjacent to some pretty tough neighborhoods.
The railroad cops lit me up when I stuck my head up to see where I was at. Those guys used to catch you, beat your ass a little, take your bedroll, trash your stuff and still turn you over to the local PD for trespassing and for stealing transport. I forget the exact charge, but it used to be some sort of theft of services and usually its a fine, but since being young and indigent rarely equals liquidity you get kicked loose with a warning not to loiter about the place… anyway I have to bail off a moving freight in the yard, roll onto my backpack to take the impact in the gravel RR bed hoping I don’t land on some spike or something get my wind back and sprint for a hole in the fence and into a neighborhood.
Bunch of Mexican gangsters having a bbq in the dead end.
Perfect.
After some small talk/intimidation I asked one of the old guys if it was OK for me to walk through their area. He said OK so I houled ass out to the Blvd and started hoofing it from light to light, changing sides of the street when I saw crowds of guys outside the liquor stores
Some cops stopped me. One Asian and a Hispanic
They asked what a white kid was doing here and I said leaving as fast as possible.
They put me in the back and dropped me off at a bus stop.
The bus driver (Hispanic) came and was shocked. I told him I had zero money and he let me ride for free and set me up with transfers and route info.
Maybe it was my whiteness.
SteveG (97b6b9) — 7/26/2009 @ 11:08 amI know the Mexican gang bangers would have probably beat on a black who showed up in their bbq through a hole in the fence.
It’s not about “only” blaming whites. it’s about whites accepting any responsibility whatsoever for racism in this country.
The “hey look over there!” of “the dysfunctional upbringing of many black children” is pro forma.
I wonder what “dysfunctional upbringing” led the to C street whorehouse in D.C. run by and for a “family” of lily-white “Christians.”
David Ehrenstein (2550d9) — 7/26/2009 @ 11:12 amthat the officer didn’t need to run the tag to see that the Porsche’s registration had expired, all he had to do was look at it.
That’s what I thought of, too. Plus…it’s a Porsche. Of course the cop is going to look at it.
I am paranoid every time I see a police car behind me. “What am I doing wrong that he might notice?”, I wonder. Tag expired? Tail light out? Didn’t pull into first legal lane? Driving too fast? I think worrying you might get pulled over is kind of normal, not racial.
Around here, the sheriffs hang out near 4-way stops and pull people over for rolling stops. My husband got caught, and it taught me to make sure to be very careful at that corner. It would be easy for someone to assume he is being pulled over for racial reasons because it is such a minor violation. But we all get this delicious treatment.
MayBee (3ea00e) — 7/26/2009 @ 11:15 amMy daughter got cited for exactly that a few months ago in Tucson. Of course, her car has CA plates and that is real profiling in Arizona. I was going to reregister her car in AZ just because of this (My wife got stopped in her CA tagged car for having the light over her license plate out), until I learned the difference in car insurance. AZ insurance is about twice Orange County CA insurance. My daughter (another one) reregistered her car in South Pasadena and her insurance doubled.
Tucson cops are zealous in enforcing the law but it doesn’t touch insurance rates.
Mike K (2cf494) — 7/26/2009 @ 11:44 amThere are a lot of variables that could be looked at but which one do you stop at?
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:10 pmfor example if the conviction rate were higher does this really indicate guilt or a lack of money to defend oneself?
There are a lot of variables. That’s my point.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:43 pmfor example if the conviction rate were higher does this really indicate guilt or a lack of money to defend oneself? Comment by voiceofreason2
You may have some reason in your voice, but you need to ramp up the amount of common sense in your brain.
I’ll mention this again: there is a large number (meaning not everyone, of course, but a high percentage) of truly liberal, truly “progressive,” truly non-bigoted, truly tolerant, truly permissive people — particularly white, but also so-called limousine-liberal black, who avoid looking for apartments or houses—and whose real-estate agents do the same thing — in predominantly black neighborhoods of their respective metropolitan area.
It is foolish and disingenuous to believe there isn’t something legitimate — although sad or otherwise — behind this dynamic.
And identifying and rooting out the causes of socio-economic dysfunction are much, much harder to do when too many people in a community or society are foolish, disingenuous and, in particular, wrapped up in “progressive” or “lefty” politics, where common sense often is in short supply.
Mark (411533) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:45 pmKevin Murphy said:
“I also know that if I was repeatedly pulled over and cited for things like a taillight being out, I’d think something a bit odd was going on. And this does happen.”
I said:
“I think it’s illegal to have a taillight that’s out. So if you keep getting pulled over for that, maybe fix it.”
Kevin Murphy said:
“Patterico, that’s a silly statement, and you know it. I’m willing to bet that you’ve had a taillight out for weeks or months before you ever noticed it (not an easy thing), yet you have never been cited for it.”
I say:
It’s not a silly statement at all. What’s a silly statement is your initial one: “I also know that if I was repeatedly pulled over and cited for things like a taillight being out, I’d think something a bit odd was going on.” Yeah, you’re not fixing your damn taillight. I believe a cop told me once that my taillight was out, although he had pulled me over for another reason. Guess what? I fixed it.
If I got repeatedly pulled over for it, and failed to fix it in between the multiple warnings, and blamed my skin color for the stops, I would be the kind of racially whiny person I am criticizing in my post. Don’t criticize the cops for legitimate stops. Boy who cried wolf and all that.
Patterico (cc3b34) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:49 pmI am paranoid every time I see a police car behind me. “What am I doing wrong that he might notice?”, I wonder. Tag expired? Tail light out? Didn’t pull into first legal lane? Driving too fast? I think worrying you might get pulled over is kind of normal, not racial.
Around here, the sheriffs hang out near 4-way stops and pull people over for rolling stops. My husband got caught, and it taught me to make sure to be very careful at that corner. It would be easy for someone to assume he is being pulled over for racial reasons because it is such a minor violation. But we all get this delicious treatment.
Yeah, here in PV there’s this one area where the hill slopes down and the speed limit is 35 and it’s natural to go 50. Especially if you’re in a hurry. Millions of people get tickets. I got one for it in June (going faster than normal because I was cutting it close to be on time for a murder case). Now I get to do traffic school — any recommendations, by the way?
I’m SURE it’s because I’m black.
Patterico (cc3b34) — 7/26/2009 @ 12:51 pmI fully intend to insert “The Swedes, again” into my commonly used phrases…
Scott Jacobs (d027b8) — 7/26/2009 @ 1:13 pmPatterico, the reason that you are finding a disconnect with a few people regarding the “tail light repair” issue is that a “narrative” exists.
1. Police pull people over to harass them.
2. Police are racist.
The implication from the fellow you are debating with suggests a long line of police cars that repeatedly and sequentially pull a fellow over for not fixing a broken tail light. The facts are different: get a citation or warning for a broken tail light. Don’t fix it for months. Get multiple citations.
Who is responsible there?
Those darned cops.
Once again, no ownership for getting the tail light fixed.
When I was in graduate school, a friend of mine would bike to work. One day, he ran a stop sign on his bike, and a campus officer wrote him a ticket. My friend was furious: the officer didn’t like his long hair. There was no one around. It was 7 AM and there was no traffic. Etc.
I said: but you ran the stop sign, right?
He would blink and get back to the narrative.
Sigh.
Eric Blair (204104) — 7/26/2009 @ 1:21 pmFor the discussion between DRJ and vor2. You may find the New Jersey turnpike study instructive. The New Jersey police were found to be pulling over black people and citing them at a higher rate than white people. It was made a political issue and the police were put on notice for it. Afterwards the police still continued to ticket black people at a higher rate. Racial profiling right? Wrong. The NJ DA set out to study speeding habits on the turnpike, and found out that black people were speeding twice as often as white people were. Link to a nypost article here.
bonhomme (8b73ba) — 7/26/2009 @ 1:39 pmbonhomme – It things like that New Jersey study that Obama used in his crusade to get anti-profiling legislation passed in Illinois. It didn’t matter if crime statistics supported the police activity, if the police activity was out of whack with population statistics, Obama considered it profiling.
daleyrocks (718861) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:05 pmNow I get to do traffic school — any recommendations, by the way?
I’m SURE it’s because I’m black.
Comment by Patterico — 7/26/2009 @ 12:51 pm
No supervision, a nominal fine and court costs, down there, for a first offense? Or did you just skip court appearance and just checked the second box on the return envelope?
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:22 pmVOR2,
Chicago is 42% white, 37% black, and 26% “Hispanic”. So how come murder victims are 75% black, 20% “Hispanic”, and 5% white? Are our murderers racially profiling?
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:25 pmI don’t think I am lacking in common sense. I am talking about one area specifically. I am not saying it is “racially” motivated in the sense that it is a department policy. The NJ example is interesting but doesn’t necessarily mean that was the case here.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:26 pmI am saying that if the expectation/hope is that some blacks will cut it out with the “I’m a victim mentality” it will require some whites to at the very least consider the disparities in things like this.
And what you miss in the Shreveport-Bossier example is the idea that bias only applies to whites and blacks. There are many Asians and Hispanics who will tell you how they are expected to tacitly take sides, depending on which boorish black or white person happens to be opining on their view of the world and matters of race. My wife lives that at work. I sort of doubt that anyone living outside of this area has been approached by the Klan at a school function and sounded out for a possible invite to the “Sons of the Confederates” meeting. That happened in 2001 not 1901.
I can tell you how my child (who looks very white) experienced some of this boorishness on election eve and inaugral day when several blacks were going on and on about the “glorious day” – just waiting for her to make some comment. This was at a state agency where these topics are supposed to be left at the door but supervisors are afraid of saying anything for fear of being called a racist.
So, yes I get quite a bit and can see both sides. In order to change things open minds are a must. One would think that further examination of the traffic stats would be welcome so that the truth would come out.
When we get past the idea that everything is racist or that we must take offense when idiots suggest that it is, we may actually see the glimmer of progress.
Murders and traffic violations are two very different things. Murders tend to happen amongst the same demographic groups. Spend two hours on any major thoroughfare and I think you would be hard pressed to pick up a pattern base on race for speeding.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:31 pmVOR2 try driving in Chicago on the south bound Dan Ryan some day.
MIke K (2cf494) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:38 pmMurders tend to happen amongst the same demographic groups.
I wish I could say that the race of murder victims corresponded with the race of the murderers, but with only a 60% clearance race, it is only a suspicion.
My point is only the same as DRJ’s. The study was half done. There needed to be something like you said — an independent study, no police involved, about the driving habits of black people vs. white people in those two towns. Insurance companies are pretty good at those kinds of statistics, BTW. Did anyone check to see claims by race or, if those are not kept, by zip code?
nk who had to take two years of statistics (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:39 pmIt’s funny that people are completely unable to perceive the non-racial aspects of the Henry Louis Gates incident. True, Prof. Gates over-reacted foolishly, damaging his own credibility with respect to racial matters.
However, Americans seem to have no understanding as to why the police are generally prohibited from entering anyone’s home, or stopping anyone, regardless of race, absent probable cause. YThe 4th amendment says police can’t come into your house — period. The only exceptions to this rule are clearly specified in our law.
But police in the United States routinely ignore our constitutional rights. Sgt. Crowley is obviously not a bad cop, but what he considered to be standard police procedure is nothing other than a standard police violation of our 4th amendment rights.
For a legal analysis of the arrest, see the post on my blog at RedGenesBlueGenes.com
Guillermo Jimenez (292265) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:42 pmGuillermo,
Have you heard of something called Terry v. Ohio?
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:46 pmAnd my point is that if more whites and blacks expressed an interest in seeing it done properly it might have happened. Perhaps people are happier making the assumption that it must be due to a or b.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:47 pmHowever, the idea that in Bossier one in four registered drivers are black but they get twice as many tickets as whites should at least raise eyebrows in my opinion.
However, the idea that in Bossier one in four registered drivers are black but they get twice as many tickets as whites should at least raise eyebrows in my opinion.
Comment by voiceofreason2 — 7/26/2009 @ 2:47 pm
Could be because only one in four driving schools are black.
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 2:57 pmI think you are trying to goad me for sport.
voiceofreason2 (03b161) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:00 pmI think you are trying to goad me for sport.
Comment by voiceofreason2 — 7/26/2009 @ 3:00 pm
No, I am trying to point out to you that raw data, without controls, is not a study.
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:11 pmThe classic example in one of my Criminology classes was the perfect correlation between ice cream sales and rape. Please guess. Does ice cream cause rape?
nk (a0200f) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:15 pmif you eat too much ice cream it makes it harder to find willing sexual partners I think
happyfeet (c75712) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:26 pmI am talking about one area specifically.
Comment by voiceofreason2
Does that area include a person’s innate ideological biases? The characteristics that make a person lean to the left or lean to the right? (I won’t saying anything about “centrism,” since that can be too nebulous a quality, or far more nebulous than “liberal” or “conservative.”)
And when it comes to the case of Gates, Crowley and Obama, I observe and immediately think of a bunch of “progressives,” far, far more than I observe and immediately think of a bunch of whites and blacks, or cops and non-cops, or whatever.
Sgt. Crowley is obviously not a bad cop
Comment by Guillermo Jimenez
In light of Crowley apparently being a liberal (since he’s said he’s “110%” in support of the ultra-“lefty” Obama), I don’t know if your description of him is less accurate, or more accurate. However, since I believe a large majority of “progressives” tend to be deficient in common sense, and since the guy Crowley was dealing with also was a big “lefty,” there’s a greater possibility that down-to-earth behavior was in short supply on both sides.
However, the liberal Crowley, since he was observed by his fellow officers (who in a town like Cambridge, Massachusetts, probably are “leftys” too, or certainly are influenced by the do-gooder liberalism that’s all around them), and since they describe Gates as acting like a nut, I’ll give the leeway to the left-leaning Crowley.
Mark (411533) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:35 pmThis was at a state agency where these topics are supposed to be left at the door but supervisors are afraid of saying anything for fear of being called a racist.
Maybe people like your wife, instead of caring about the exterior qualities of the person they’re addressing (ie, black, Latino or whatever) should ask “why are you so goddamn liberal?!”
She should also say:
“Does your embrace of “lefty” ideas and politicians — of the Democrat Party — make you a better, more stable, more humane, more caring human being?!! Does your love of leftism make you more sensible, more practical-minded?”
And if she has to insert race into the matter, she can ask: “The black community has been dominated by leftist sentiment for decades and decades. Has that made the community more stable, more prosperous, more happy, more well-adjusted, more decent, more humane?!”
“Is the culture of, say, rap music, and all the foul-mouthed banter about ‘your mother this, your mother that,’ a manifestation of all the do-gooder liberalism that had dominated black American life for decades and decades?!”
Mark (411533) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:46 pmOnly if you refuse to accept the possibility that black drivers violate the law more than white drivers…
Scott Jacobs (d027b8) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:53 pmVOR2,
I support state or local studies that look into racial profiling. This Minnesota report comments on how to design such a study, while this RAND study took it a step further and compared daylight and nighttime stops. It assumes that a driver’s racial status is harder to identify at night before a stop. The RAND study interests me because, in general, I view the officer’s decision to stop a vehicle as more difficult to evaluate than his or her post-stop decisions.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 3:56 pmMark,
VOR2 is a nice guy and I’m sure his wife is, too. I commend her for leaving her politics, whatever they are, at the office door.
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 4:04 pmStrange when I heard Obama I didn’t see the LA Times cite him for racial profiling. Guess we all know how it works in the MSM.
Thomas Jackson (8ffd46) — 7/26/2009 @ 4:32 pmI commend her for leaving her politics, whatever they are, at the office door.
I would say that is proper office etiquette. But VOR2 referred to situations where certain people in a workplace are spouting off about some socio-political matter, and that others in the same office, in order to not look racist (or “racist”), have to keep their mouth closed.
My point was that if they feel they’ve got to censor themselves, they should deem it due to their not wanting to look conservative or rightwing, not because of their wanting to not look racist (or “racist”).
And so if they do believe some of their colleagues will look aghast at them for being of the right instead of the left, even though some of those same people will have the gall to happily mouth off in public about their “lefty” politics (ie, “Obama is the love of my life!! He’s my hero! Thank God Bush and the Republicans are a thing of the past!!”), they deserve to be rebutted.
Mark (411533) — 7/26/2009 @ 4:35 pm“No supervision, a nominal fine and court costs, down there, for a first offense? Or did you just skip court appearance and just checked the second box on the return envelope?”
Not sure what you mean. I think if I don’t challenge the ticket (yes, I was probably doing 50) then I just sign the return envelope, pay the “bail,” and take traffic school.
Patterico (639ec0) — 7/26/2009 @ 5:14 pmI’m straying off-topic but this Doug Ross post on the role of the family reminded me of mhr #47’s thoughtful comment:
DRJ (6f3f43) — 7/26/2009 @ 6:37 pmPatterico, “a taillight was out” is simply an example of the kind of stop that usually doesn’t happen. A concrete metaphor. What is silly is that you are focusing on the metaphor rather than the issue. Which is that people who are “out of place” in a neighborhood get stopped and cited for whatever, so the cop can have a closer look.
This cop behavior — finding an infraction they usually don’t cite in order to provide probable cause — is not uncommon. Nor is it unique to blacks. It is used all the time for sobriety checkpoints, for example.
I can show you places in LA where the cops set up their sobriety checkpoints that are GUARANTEED to produce ample probable cause for the stop. Usually places where there’s a stop sign that NO ONE fully stops at, and at which the checkpoint is invisible to the driver until they roll the right turn. Now, yes, they should stop. It is illegal not to stop. Yet no one stops, and the cops know that and use it.
And if they want to find a reason to stop a black guy driving a primer-coat ’96 Chevy through Beverly Hills, they will find one. It is absurd to argue they won’t or can’t or, worse, “it was illegal, wasn’t it?”
Kevin Murphy (0b2493) — 7/26/2009 @ 6:45 pm(by the way, I don’t mind the checkpoint, as I don’t drink, but I do mind the $300 ticket that they use to cover the stop.)
Kevin Murphy (0b2493) — 7/26/2009 @ 6:46 pm“No supervision, a nominal fine and court costs, down there, for a first offense? Or did you just skip court appearance and just checked the second box on the return envelope?”
Not sure what you mean. I think if I don’t challenge the ticket (yes, I was probably doing 50) then I just sign the return envelope, pay the “bail,” and take traffic school.
Comment by Patterico — 7/26/2009 @ 5:14 pm
Even if it’s quasi-criminal you are still allowed to
nk (5e5670) — 7/26/2009 @ 7:36 pmplead not guilty without being guilty of perjuryput the prosecution to its proof. But I cannot tell you to do in California what I would do in Illinois. Although what I would do here, would be to ask for a hearing and show up, file a written appearance to put me at the front of the call with the other attorneys, pretry the case with the city attorney, agree to non-reporting supervision (30 days here) and fine and costs and be out of there in about seven minutes.When I want to read some stero typing I can’t wait to hear the MSM describe Palin supporters; conservatives; people who dwell in rural areas (outside of major urban centers); religious people; people who oppose abortion; or people who believe that their right to own a gun is guaranteed to them in the Constitution.
Strange how the MSM can stereo type with the best of them and remain so blissfully ignorant about it.
Thomas Jackson (8ffd46) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:07 pmBTW, in Illinois quasi-criminal means you cannot go to jail or pay more than a $500.00 fine but you are entitled to a lawyer or a jury either.
nk (d7a872) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:11 pmyou are *not* entitled
nk (d7a872) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:12 pmDRJ,
Thanks for the kind words as well as the link to the studies you pointed out.
The people who speak like that around her are white not black. “If god meant for interracial couples to be birds would cross breed”… and other beauts like that are what she hears. They would be quite shocked if my wife were to deliver your suggested speech as most call themselves christian conservatives.
The people who spoke around my daughter are black not white. They would be quite irritated if my daughter told them her first Presidential vote was for a Republican and she was still okay with Booosh.
The cops who pull my Hispanic/Arabic looking son out of crowds of white friends at the Boardwalk for no reason except to ask his business are black and white.
The workplace is not the appropriate venue for political/religious discussions. And all of my kids have had the “how to respond to a cop” speech. Step 1 be polite, step 2 don’t argue, step 3 call them officer/sir/ma’am, step 4, be honest, and step 5 can the attitude and don’t blow off steam till you get home.
I’m very proud of all of them for holding their heads up and maintaining their cool. They have chosen to believe it is less about “overt racism” than very narrow minded folks that look silly.
voiceofreason2 (77f52e) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:31 pmWe didn’t see this kind of behavior when we lived in Omaha some years ago — we definitely see it quite a bit here.
Seeing this through your loved one’s eyes does give one a different perspective.
It’s interesting to me that no one seems to mention the writing of Theodore Dalrymple who has published a number of essays and books about the social pathology of the British midlands cities where the behavior of young people, men and women, mirrors the behavior of black inner city Americans yet the British are white. The key factor that links them seems to me to be absent family supervision and crappy education. I’m frankly surprised that the comparison never seems to appear and even Dalrymple doesn’t make the connection. I’d suggest a couple of his books, LIfe at the Bottom and Our culture: What’s Left of It.
The similarity of pathology is startling to me.
Mike K (2cf494) — 7/26/2009 @ 8:53 pmVoR2 at 89 – Bird species do cross breed. Have her check out the phenomena between Juncos and White-throated Sparrows. And in Warblers cross breeding is so often seen that the more common crosses are usually shown in field guides.
Have Blue (854a6e) — 7/26/2009 @ 11:15 pmThe people who speak like that around her are white not black. “If god meant for interracial couples to be birds would cross breed”… and other beauts like that are what she hears. They would be quite shocked if my wife were to deliver your suggested speech as most call themselves christian conservatives.
I guess when you mentioned your wife dealing with boorish Asians and Latinos, apparently along with boorish (or whatever) black and whites, I envisioned a workplace that’s typical in today’s era of self-censoring political correctness, which in the context of 2009 means most people erring on the side of feel-good leftist sentiment.
As for white co-workers mouthing off such overtly racist opinions, and assuming they label themselves as rightwingers (if not ultra-rightists), they deserve a contemptuous reply of “well, you believe in meritocracy, don’t you. You believe our society has moved away from judging people on the quality from within instead of the superficial BS from without, don’t you?
“You believe people should be judged for something that’s grown less and less common in our feel-good, do-your-own-thang culture, don’t you? I’m referring to people who are decent, honest, hard-working, self-reliant, level-headed?”
I’d say the only good thing about the election of Obama is it makes people like the bigots you describe even more loony and livid. Knuckleheads deserve to have the highest blood pressure possible, and all the health consquences that go with that.
The cops who pull my Hispanic/Arabic looking son out of crowds of white friends at the Boardwalk for no reason except to ask his business are black and white.
I’m guessing that means your wife is white/Caucasian and you’re Latino or black, or Middle Eastern? If so, that makes the crap spouted off to her by a racist co-worker (or co-workers) even more pathetic and disgusting.
BTW, overt anti-miscegenation sentiment has become more pervasive throughout the black community over the past 40 years. And if the people who express such views also are generally of the left — blindly loyal to the Democrat Party — then they really are worthless. That’s because I’d say the only good stereotype associated with liberals is their being supposedly more open-minded, tolerant and big-hearted about legitimate diversity. So if they don’t have even that to their credit, and since they’re likely also deficient in common sense, they’re 0 and 2. A big fat zero, coming and going.
We didn’t see this kind of behavior when we lived in Omaha some years ago — we definitely see it quite a bit here.
Context definitely is everything. Certainly when the flip side I’m more familiar with is the uber-“lefty” parts of America where, if anything, one has to be homosexual (or bisexual) and openly involved in promoting same-sex marriage to look hip and sane. Or one has to promote the legalization of pot while also sneering at the existence of tobacco and cigarette smokers. Or one has to run around in a Che Guevara T-shirt while talking dreamily about Gore’s plans for ending global warming.
The citadels of sloppy leftism and asshole rightism throughout America deserve one another.
Mark (411533) — 7/27/2009 @ 12:16 amPatterico, “a taillight was out” is simply an example of the kind of stop that usually doesn’t happen
I don’t know where you live, but in Chicago (where the police have their hands full dealing with more serious problems), you’re still guaranteed to get stopped if your tailight is out, period – every time. It’s not about profiling or assumptions, it’s all about the revenue. So at least in my neck of the woods, your theories have no basis in reality.
Dmac (e6d1c2) — 7/27/2009 @ 6:45 amTry to strike a balance in this post. Racial profiling does happen to some black people. There are a lot of white cops out there who still harbor racial prejudice against minorities. They are out there. Lets not lose sight of that fact as we try to paint a picture of a perfect union.
The Emperor (1b037c) — 7/27/2009 @ 7:53 amOnly in backwards places like Chicago.
Michael Ejercito (833607) — 7/27/2009 @ 11:35 amThis is the point where many of us want to tear our hair out in frustration. Jesus Christ! His tag was expired — and the cop even had the courtesy of giving the guy a warning instead of a ticket! Nevertheless, the cop is suspected of racism.
National conversation on race, ACTIVATED!
JohnW (e549f2) — 7/27/2009 @ 12:09 pm[…] the paper portrays good police work as racism. A great example can be found here, where editors complained about numerous examples of black men being stopped by police because other black men had committed crimes. Whose fault is […]
Patterico's Pontifications » Patterico’s Los Angeles Dog Trainer Year in Review 2009 (e4ab32) — 1/1/2010 @ 10:32 am