The “reality-based community” meets reality
[Posted by Karl]
Ron Brownstein writes about “Why Obama Can’t Satisfy The Left”:
As Democrats settle in to power, two distinct, and somewhat dissonant, lines of complaint are emerging from leaders on the left. One charges that Obama is deferring too much to Wall Street and its party allies in his response to the financial crisis…
The left’s other complaint is targeted at moderate-to-conservative Congressional Democrats resisting elements of Obama’s agenda. Obama’s budget has provided the initial flashpoint…
Brownstein’s discussion of the Left focuses on pundits, the nutroots, Big Labor and the Sorosphere, but the Congressional Progressive Caucus also has its collectivist nose out of joint.
As Brownstein notes, there is blue-on-blue sniping over the budget:
MoveOn.org and Americans United for Change, the labor-backed organization that serves as the White House’s chief third-party operation, began airing ads Wednesday urging moderate Democrats in both the House and the Senate to get on board with the president’s budget.
Among the targets of Americans United for Change is Sen. Mark Pryor (D-Ark.), who declared the ads “not very helpful.”
“The liberal groups need to understand that we are not elected to represent the president,” Pryor said. “We’re elected to represent our states, and we are trying to reflect the attitudes and values of the people who sent us to Washington.”
Sen. Evan Bayh (D-Ind.) is also unhappy with the friendly fire…
***
Leadership aides were grumbling about the liberal advertising campaigns.
Moreover, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) and Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus (D-MT) are quarreling over whether to try ramming a government heathcare scheme through Congress with only Democratic votes as part of budget reconciliation. (Some may think this is some clever “good cop, bad cop” approach, which ignores the Byrd rule.)
Brownstein is also correct to note the nutroots’ horror (The horror! The horror!) over the notion that Obama is not forcing employees of TARP fund recipients into indentured servitude (though the big banks were forced to take the TARP money, regardless of financial health). And indignation from the more honest proggs over Obama’s actual record on controversial war issues and his apparent “all in” approach on Afghanistan.
Thus does the self-proclaimed “reality-based community” attempt to come to grips with certain realities. Other nations have issues with US foreign policy, regardless of the person sitting in the White House. It is far easier to be united in opposition than it is in governing (though the GOP is fumbling that at the moment). The separation of powers creates some checks and balances, even when one party holds Congress and the White House. Voters will be merciless in punishing the party in power if the economy continues to lag. Stabilizing financial markets actually requires working with people experienced in financial markets, because demonizing them could cause the collapse of the entities into which the US has poured billions. The president may have to treat a war like a war, even if he names it something else. Governing is tough. Reality bites.
–Karl
As Glenn Reynolds would say, “Heh”
Maybe the next time the Left is on the outside they will remember Senator vandenberg’s words: “Politics stops at the water’s edge,”
You live by the rhetoric, you die by the rhetoric.
JSF (9d1bb3) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:02 amIf you’re able to recognize that there are liberals disagreeing with Obama at these early stages of his presidency, the common conservative refrain that Obama is leading a cult of personality has got to be discarded, hasn’t it? In less than three months, his party has already been more critical of him than the Republicans were of Bush during his 8 years in office.
Old Gary (863676) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:22 am“Why Obama Can’t Satisfy The Left”:
Karl – Trick question, right?
It’s like pleasing children or eating Chinese food?
Well, they act like children so it’s actually a good comparison. Give them something and pretty soon they want more. Eat some and pretty soon they’re hungry again.
Q.E.D.
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:24 amRacist! Foodist!
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R., (3752aa) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:33 am“If you’re able to recognize that there are liberals disagreeing with Obama at these early stages of his presidency, the common conservative refrain that Obama is leading a cult of personality has got to be discarded, hasn’t it?”
That is illogical.
Just because Jim Jones lost a few members along the way did not make it any less a cult.
“In less than three months, his party has already been more critical of him than the Republicans were of Bush during his 8 years in office.”
That is a pure fabrication with nothing to back it up.
Jimminy'cricket (637168) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:35 amOld Gary,
Did you miss the complaints about “Immigration Reform”, out-of-control spending, the surge in Iraq, and a host of other issues that President Bush was criticized on by the right? I think President Bush was a great President, but I definitely didn’t agree with a lot of his platforms. I think Cult of Personality is pretty descriptive of many President Obama supporters… the fact that some is wearing off because the administration’s actions don’t match the campaign promises is actually hopeful.
Stashiu3 (460dc1) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:39 am“In less than three months, his party has already been more critical of him than the Republicans were of Bush during his 8 years in office.”
Old Gary – How have those votes been working out for Obama in Congress do far on the Democrat side? Has he had any problems?
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:41 amYes, aside from:
Harriet Miers
Dubai Ports Deal
No Child Left Behind
Prescription Plan Expansion
FEMA Management
Creation of TSA
Lack of spending vetos
Iraq war management (especially during 2005-06)
There was nothing that factions broke rank inside the GOP and criticized Bush on. Nothing whatsoever
Techie (9c008e) — 3/27/2009 @ 11:41 amThey’ve given him more trouble than the Republicans ever gave Bush. There’s no Joe Lieberman types in the Republican minority.
Old Gary (863676) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:35 pmHahahah this guy has to be a parody.
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:37 pmI guess this guy was smoking too much pot to remember immigration reform.
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:40 pm“There’s no Joe Lieberman types in the Republican minority.”
Gary, go get some facts you dumb ass.
All your data is wrong and you are still spouting a hypothesis.
Let us start with the two knuckleheads in Maryland and Arlen Specter. We can also lump in the jerk from Nebraska and Grassley.
Jimminy'cricket (637168) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:40 pmIt is Teh Narrative, folks.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:41 pmKeep sticking to that despite all the comments showing you’re wrong… see if that works for ya.
Except for Collins, Specter, Snowe, etc… except Senator Lieberman has integrity.
Stashiu3 (460dc1) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:42 pmOld Gary,
When has any Democrat gone against another Democrat in power (excluding Primaries)?
They only went after Senator Liberman after he played the role of Senator Vandenberg for the Democrats. they aren’t going after Senator Dodd for his AIG hanky panky, and the democrats are not going after Rep. Frank for any of his brooks against the law.
They did not go after President Bill Clinton when the issue was perjury, and allow Gore to be elevated to be president.
What issues are the Democrats going after President Obama for?
He had 3 months smooth transistion to put in his team — why can’t he do it with a Congress that favors him?
JSF (9d1bb3) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:43 pmI think you guys are forgetting one of our biggest “Liebermans”, John freakin McCain.
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:44 pmComment by Mr. Pink — 3/27/2009 @ 12:44 pm
An inconvenient memory that we had hoped to erase.
AD - RtR/OS (0053b8) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:49 pmValleywag: Is the Los Angeles Times Cribbing from Wikipedia?
http://valleywag.gawker.com/5182618/is-the-los-angeles-times-cribbing-from-wikipedia
Trained Dog (34547a) — 3/27/2009 @ 12:59 pmMcCain is still a Republican? Shocka! 😉
Stashiu3 (460dc1) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:01 pmIt’s just like 1984.
‘Conservatives disagree with George Bush. Conservatives have always disagreed with George Bush.’
I saw what happened to the conservative movement under George Bush, and it sure wasn’t anything you could call scrutiny or criticism. There might have been the occasional murmur about something of earth-shattering importance like the Harriet Miers nomination, but for the most part you guys just thought what you were told to think, that George Bush was the next Reagan, that he was some sort of visionary strategist because he invaded Iraq, that his deficits were okay because the economy was growing, and on and on. The conservative movement spent the past 8 years demonizing liberals and dismissing everything as Bush Derangement Syndrome while the President was smashing the government.
But yeah, better not acknowledge that. Just go all in again with Sarah Palin in 2012, and after two terms of her devastating the country, you can pretend like it wasn’t your fault.
Old Gary (863676) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:03 pmTeh Narrative will not be deterred. It matters not one little bit how you respond to this clown.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:07 pmI’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. I never voted for GWB in the primaries. GWB is a moderate and governed as a moderate. He even eschewed the Republicans in Congress when he ran for office in 2000, thus his very small coat-tails.
And if you haven’t figured it out yet, (R) =! Conservative.
John Hitchcock (fb941d) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:09 pm“that his deficits were okay because the economy was growing, and on and on”
If you didn’t notice the guy in office now is taking Bush’s deficits, multiplying them by 4, and tieing them to the ankles of our grandchildren. All during an economic downturn I might add. Your hatred of Bush keeps you warm at night though so you will be happy.
BTW wtf does this thread have to do with Bush anyway?
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:09 pmThe best thing that could happen to Obama is for the Republicans to take Congress next year. This is what saved Clinton. I read Obama as a narcissistic young man with no qualifications for his office. His election is a Black Swan (no pun) and he will destroy himself unless restrained. The country actually runs better with divided government. The Clinton years that are remembered are those after 1994. Few recall gays in the military, the travel office, etc.
If The GOP take the House next year, that will be the end of Obama budgets. The Democrats under Reagan used to delight in calling his budgets “dead on arrival.” In that case, we got deficits bigger than they should have been. Now, we will get a return of sense and the economy will recover on its own. Obama will take credit and be re-elected.
If the Democrats hold the Congress next year, the economy will not recover and he will get the blame in 2012. I wonder when that will occur to him ? He is in this for the adulation and glory. I don’t think he cares as much about socialism but it is all he knows.
MIke K (8df289) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:10 pmAnd Democrats never go after democrats.
Old Gary proved it. Game, set, match.
JSF (9d1bb3) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:10 pmJD is right, Gary please change your SN to TEH NARRATIVE.
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:11 pmWell, we got him to admit re Miers; now, we can start on the Dubai Ports deal – say, wasn’t there an influential, South-Florida radio personality who opined about this putting him on the opposite side from this “conservative” President?
AD - RtR/OS (0053b8) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:12 pmThe Dubai Ports deal? Sure. That’s something I never cared about, and only proves that conservative put their ethnocentrism even ahead of their blind party loyalty. It was pretty amazing watching you guys argue that we were liberating Arabs, that it was our mission to bring democracy and capitalism to the Arab, then get all pants-pooping hysterical when we started making deals with the part of the Arab world most similar to us.
TEH NARRATIVE (863676) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:24 pmWhat a disappoinment – Bush chooses Miers
FEMA uses fake reporters in California press conference
Examples of Obama’s Decency
Bush fails to act in L.A. Power Outage
OK, that last one is a joke 🙂 Anyway, resume rant, Gary!
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:24 pmI was for the Dubai ports deal. It was used by Democrat lawmakers as a sign that Bush=stupid and they were the ones that ginned up most of the outrage. Repubs jumped on that boat all too quickly but do not deny the culpability of both sides. Oh wait a second I forgot who I was talkin to it is all Bush’s fault.
Mr. Pink (eae12c) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:29 pmLet me get this straight. “Securing the ports” was one of the main talking points of the
George BushJohn Kerry Presidential campaign. Senator Barack Hussein Obama was on record opposing the deal. Ditto Carl Levin, Hillary Clinton and John Corzine.That deal is an example of how “conservative put their ethnocentrism even ahead of their blind party loyalty?”
You, sir, are beclowing yourself. Kudos on the new handle.
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:32 pmSo, when we did disagree with Bush, it was because we’re xenophobic racists………..?
Please, do go on.
Techie (9c008e) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:35 pmTechie – we are xenophobic racist homophobes no matter what we do.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:53 pmcarlitos 1:32 PM, hammer, Old Gary/Teh Narrative, nail.
EBJ (2fd7f7) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:55 pmconservative movement spent the past 8 years demonizing liberals and dismissing everything as Bush Derangement Syndrome
Gary, how it works here is that when someone makes statements of supposed facts, they’re expected to back them up with actual supportable evidence. Barring that, you’re just another fart in the wind.
Dmac (49b16c) — 3/27/2009 @ 1:55 pmWell, at least the Democrats merely taxed the AIG bonuses away. Connecticut caught a company withholding bonuses and prosecuted them. You can’t win with the politicians.
But suppose you were an employer that was going through financial difficulties arising from the subprime mess and decided to avoid paying some commissions to salespeople involved with these mortgages — even if just for a short while. Under such circumstances, what would the State of Connecticut do then? Give you a free pass, particularly if those employees who got you into the mess may be the same employees to whom you owed wages?
Well, it turns out you don’t have to theorize about it . There continues to be a case that I first reported on in September 2007 about an employer who failed to pay some commissions due to executives and salespeople, a company named Mortgage Lenders Network
That case illustrates that, for much less money than was paid to the AIG employees, an employer could get into a heap of trouble. So much trouble, in fact, that the State might go beyond just requesting double damages for failure to pay wages, but might issue an arrest warrant to the company President for such a failure.
Well, Barney knows best, I guess.
MIke K (8df289) — 3/27/2009 @ 2:01 pmThey’ve given him more trouble than the Republicans ever gave Bush. There’s no Joe Lieberman types in the Republican minority.
Comment by Old Gary — 3/27/2009 @ 12:35 pm
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry… OG, there’s no Joe Lieberman types in the Democratic party either. In fact, all I currently see in the Democratic party are the Igor types: “Yes master (snort – snort) Yesssssss! (with apologies to Boris Karloff and Mary Shelly)
GM Roper (85dcd7) — 3/27/2009 @ 2:53 pmI just heard Obama talking about foreign policy. If he’s going to keep pronouncing it “Paw-kee-stawn” he should try to avoid referring to the bordering country right afterwards using the Americanized version. My Pashtu / Urdu is a little rusty, but i suspect that it’s probably closer to “Afgohnny-stawn” than the nasally American pronunciation.
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:05 pmI rather enjoy Cowboy Barcky’s unilateral war of aggression against Pockeeeeeestawn.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:14 pmThe Bush Obama administration wants access to your computer hard drive and mp3 player without a reason. What could go wrong?
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:23 pmIs this where the “reality based community” meets the community based reality?
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:25 pmas a conservative, i demand that all of Ear Leader’s proposals be enacted forthwith, without any editing. in fact, i propose they be expanded and loaded down with earmarks too.
the only way the st00pid among us are going to learn is with a lesson that is as long and painful as the Great Depression was, and the sooner we start, the sooner they can begin figuring out just how dumb they have been all their worthless lives.
“Let’s Roll!”
redc1c4 (9c4f4a) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:32 pmWell, speaking of the reality-based community.
Establishment- There is established the Commission to Study Reparation Proposals for African-Americans (hereinafter in this Act referred to as the `Commission’).
It is to have subpoena power. That should be entertaining.
Mike K (8df289) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:37 pmcarlitos #40
Yep.
EdWood (f45fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:39 pmnumber forty and forty four
fake report einstein.
Cisco (983921) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:50 pmMike, your link didn’t work. I think this is what you’re referring to.
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=Mzg5YmNhODVlNTdmY2MxZDYyOWQ1N2FmMWU2Zjk5YjM=
Dana (137151) — 3/27/2009 @ 3:55 pmWell, I’m glad if that’s a fake report. I wouldn’t have believed it, but since the IP treaty in question is “classified” for “national security” reasons, I’m more easily suspicious of President Transparency.
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 4:14 pmDana – That’s beautiful! How is Conyers going to be able to find time away from finding ways to punish the war criminals from the Bush Administration to shepherd that bill through the House? Something like that can’t be allowed to languish. The Commission is just crying out for the talents of somebody like Randall Robinson. Plus Conyers recently requested a hearing into the activities of ACORN and was stuffed by Nadler and we shouldn’t let Conyers forget about his request there either. It would be racist of Conyers not to clear the good name of ACORN!
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/27/2009 @ 4:22 pmThe nutroots find out that they elected an empty suit? How hilarious.
SPQR (26be8b) — 3/27/2009 @ 5:01 pmCisco #45
EdWood (60c4cf) — 3/27/2009 @ 5:15 pmFake? No BusHitler-MaObama administration? Whew.
Need to go get the hook line and sinker out of my mouth now.
The link is to Thomas. Try again.
Mike K (2cf494) — 3/27/2009 @ 5:35 pmMore people are figuring O’Dumbo for the liar he is. 10 bills signed, not one posted for 5 days as promised many times.
He has doubled the U.S. debt of George (W) through George (B)in 60 days and told more lies than all to the presidents from George through George combined in the same time frame.
Scrapiron (4e0dda) — 3/27/2009 @ 5:47 pmMIke K, If I was still an employer I’d get the he** out of Dodge and the company out of the U.S. You’re as safe under Chavez as O’Dumbo and more safe under full communism.
Scrapiron (4e0dda) — 3/27/2009 @ 5:51 pmI hope Bill Self is attacked by a rhinoceros on the way to the court.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:10 pmLouisville is good.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:13 pmJD – You’re just still pissed off at Self for bailing out on Illinpis two days after he said he wouldn’t.
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:28 pmThe One has discovered there is a point where the rhetoric actually meets the road. Quick, get him on with Letterman or Stewart, or something. Anywhere but Washington!
Chris (a24890) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:31 pmIllinois – out in first round of NCAA
Northwestern, Illinois State – first round victims in NIT
DePaul wins first conference game in conference tournament
Maybe next year, they can send all of the Illinois teams to that “CIT” dot-com thingie so we can win something.
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:34 pmYes, you are correct, daley. To give you an idea of the level of my disgust for that cretinous cretin, I dislike him more than I dislike Baracky, a dislike more intense than the heat of seven suns.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:38 pmCarlitos – The Illini overachieved this year. Their next 2 recruiting classes are sensational, and we will be legitimate Final Four contenders in the near future.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:41 pmAnecdotally anyway, the lefties in my world spent all 8 years ignoring me being pissed off at Bush for the deficits, the regulation, the stupid budgets, growing government and never flipping fighting back. They would always call him “YOUR president”.
It’s tempting to behave the same way back, at the very least in mockery, just to give them a good taste of their own medicine.
Vivian Louise (c0f830) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:45 pmDoes this have anything to do with our trolls ?
Mike K (2cf494) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:48 pmVL, I thought that the most self-centered manifestation of this was the T-shirt with the sinister B/W image of Bush with the caption “Not My President.” I can’t even describe what I think such a shirt says about its wearer.
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:49 pmcarlitos – I suspect your description of an assbandit like that would vary only by the number of curse words utilized.
JD (454fb4) — 3/27/2009 @ 6:53 pmIt is stunning to see the left demonize people like Limbaugh or now Justice Roberts. Are they desperate, or just poor politicians? They must sense the coalition is disintegrating–and of course they’re right because you can’t please every niche every time–but this is happening within 3 months of winning!
Patricia (2183bb) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:03 pmDoes this have anything to do with our trolls ?
Vindictiveness and bad relationship skills lead to underemployment? Send in the community organizers!
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (0ea407) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:05 pmOoops, I made a derogatory reference to the underemployed . . . I denounce myself as a classist!
Brother Bradley J. Fikes, C.O.R. (0ea407) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:09 pmPatricia, I heard Rush (I assumed we are allowed to say his name since Patterico is on hiatus!) say today that he thinks the left is beginning to hard press Roberts and Scalia to get them to vote more moderately… hence Harry Reid’s lie about Roberts, and Barney Frank’s denigration of Scalia.
Three months within winning… Apparently some people are more gracious in victory than others…
Dana (137151) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:13 pmComment by Mike K — 3/27/2009 @ 6:48 pm
“The best revenge is to outlive your enemies!”
AD - RtR/OS (0053b8) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:23 pmDana,
I doubt it’s a pressure move on Roberts and Scalia, as neither (esp Scalia) strikes me as the sort who cares about the cocktail party crowd.
It’s more likely establishing Teh Narrative for when Ginsberg or Stevens retires. POTUS will nominate a “moderate” (just to the right of Bill Ayers) and Teh Narrative will be about balancing out the Wingnut Bloc on the Court.
Karl (3bf5f8) — 3/27/2009 @ 7:24 pmIt’s more likely establishing Teh Narrative for when Ginsberg or Stevens retires.
Which in the end is silly anyway, because everyone who isn’t in a coma knows Obama is going to nominate a hardcore leftist in the Ginsberg mold.
A lot of us wondered what the left would do with themselves once Bush was out of office and they couldn’t get hysterical at everything he said or did anymore. Turns out, the method didn’t really change, just the target, but because people like Limbaugh aren’t permanent fixtures in the media cycle, and because no one really cares about the Supreme Court unless a really big case comes up, the Democrats are coming across as a flailing pack of Heathers.
I think this is why a lot of the Republicans aren’t putting their faces out there in a highly visible manner right now. After 8 years of watching Bush get bitched at for everything from Iraq to the way he sprinkled salt on his food, they probably figure it’s just not worth the hassle. Why get in an argument over issues when your opponents treat you like the enemy and arent’ going to have a discussion in good faith anyway? Better to sit back and hope the tantrum eventually stops.
Of course, as we’ve learned over the last 90 years, it never really does.
Another Chris (a3bb8f) — 3/27/2009 @ 9:00 pm#68 – AD – RtR/OS
I used to think that, a long time ago … and then I learned that living well and enjoying Life up in the face of one’s enemy is significantly better … with much less wasted effort …
Alasdair (6b086e) — 3/28/2009 @ 1:54 amThe Left isn’t disagreeing, they are just saying that Obama isn’t being stupid enough.
Joe C. (835efb) — 3/28/2009 @ 4:13 amthe Democrats are coming across as a flailing pack of Heathers.
LMAO!!!
If the matter wasn’t deadly serious, I would be enjoying the cannibalism and insanity of the CHINESE telling us we’d gone too far left. HA!
Vivian Louise (c0f830) — 3/28/2009 @ 4:31 amNot to mention the Germans, the French – hell, all of Europe believes we’ve lost our collective marbles in the economic sense. Wait till they get a load of Hillary and Teh One’s real MO regarding foreign policy – cravenness will be among the more subtle denunciations they’ll be coming up with after viewing this Chamberlain tag – team.
but this is happening within 3 months of winning!
My friends are not hardcore lefties, but all reliably voted for Obama – but I’ve mentioned to them more than once that I’ve never witnessed a more sorer bunch of winners in my lifetime. Good Lord, can you even imagine what they’d be like if McCain had pulled if off? “We’ve got a senile warmonger in the WH now, they denied a black man his rightful place and are all wacists! Palin’s a hick that doesn’t know when to stop breeding, and her mongoloid child is the spawn of Satan and the Pope!” etc. These expressions would be seen on T – shirts with the facsimile of Che’, of course.
Dmac (49b16c) — 3/28/2009 @ 6:26 amVivian – What time does Breakfast Club start?
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/28/2009 @ 6:48 amKarl: Stabilizing financial markets actually requires working with people experienced in financial markets, because demonizing them could cause the collapse of the entities into which the US has poured billions.
Loathe to admit it, but it’s true. These are the folks with the tacit institutional knowledge that are necessary to get the system functioning again. It’s a bit how Bush 1 was smart enough to leave a lot of the Eastern bloc bureauocrats who ran basic services and law enforcement and the military in place after the Berlin wall fell. At least the infrastructure stayed more or less cohesive and how Bush #2 and his butt buddies Cheney and Rumsfeld did not follow that diplomatic rule when they “liberated” Iraq (“Mission accomplished” etc..) and threw it into the chaos and ruin that fueled the insurgency and the ethnic-cleansing catastrophe and the IED deadly landscape that claimed the lives of and maimed so many American soldiers.
I say leave those hoodlums and con-artists and greedy bastards where they are for now, get the financial markets back on a more steady footing and then prosecute like crazy, with an eye towards those who have shown no remorse and remained incompetent, self-indulgent, spoiled, greedy parasites who think the “free-market” is theirs and theirs alone, and this time let their bonuses be truly dependent on performance with the actual reward being not millions in taxpayer and 401k money from the middle and working-classes, but less, or no jail time after their conviction.
Peter (e70d1c) — 3/28/2009 @ 9:13 amStabilizing financial markets actually requires working with people experienced in financial markets
When the leadership is convinced of its rectitude, and owns overwhelming majorities in both houses of Congress, it happily finds itself in the position of Lenin after the Russian Revolution and civil war. ‘We won’.
The Bolsheviks did experiment with the running of industries and public utilities by their pre-revolutionary, experienced managers, with coaching by Party officials pointing the way to the desired goals. But the demands on those managers exceeded the resources they were given to accomplish the goals, whereupon they found themselves on trial for sabotage, and shortly thereafter shot. Henceforward, the Party bosses ran the shows, and the country sank rapidly into poverty as they achieved total submission from the (surviving) population, but even worse performance by the economy.
We shall see how far the Obama administration advances in such a direction. Unlikely that shootings will be employed, but an increase in political direction of industries is almost a certainty, and even worse performance by the economy.
Insufficiently Sensitive (aa4142) — 3/28/2009 @ 9:20 amWell, you can’t blame Obama too much Even the most efective salesman occasionally gets tongue tied.
Seriously, I don’t think he can keep this going for long when even the LA Times thinks he slipping.
Mike K (2cf494) — 3/28/2009 @ 10:11 amLenin’s (and the Comintern’s) great advantage is that there was no history of political freedom (or gun ownership) within the vast peasantry of Russia, so that he and the CP had a free hand in implementing and carrying out their self-destructive policies – particularly after the White Army and its’ supporters had been destroyed/exiled.
AD - RtR/OS (545a5d) — 3/28/2009 @ 10:35 amFor the Democratic Party to impose draconian controls on private business (particularly owner-operated business) would result in significant political push-back, with the support of the Rights enunciated in the the BoR always prominant in the electorates thrust. Unpopular policies have been implemented before, and “rebellions” have arisen only to be put down, but policies were changed and/or modified due to those efforts.
It is not unthinkable that “rebellions” cannot occur again.
I’ve never witnessed a more sorer bunch of winners in my lifetime
That’s hardly surprising…
Mark (411533) — 3/28/2009 @ 10:37 am…more thoughts on Economic Controls:
AD - RtR/OS (545a5d) — 3/28/2009 @ 10:44 amThe imposition of Sarbannes-Oxley and it’s onerous requirements and penalties for CEOs and Directors has led to the the increasing phenomena of “public” companies being taken “private” to escape those rules.
Geithner’s attempts to insert the Federal Government into the management suite of financial entities, and the vague threat of doing the same with businesses that are “too vital” to not be subject to government control, will see many more companies “taken private” or off-shore, to escape the clutches of the like of Harry Reid, Nancy Pelosi, Henry Waxman, or Barney Frank.
These prospective distortions to the business scene will cause economic hardships that will make 2008 seem like a pimple on an elephant’s ass.
I haven’t looked for the story yet, but was listening to a report on Beck about the food safety/farmer’s market rules being imposed. The rules are so impertinent and burdensome that the administration will effectively kill small farmers, farmers markets and the artisan food producers, leaving only big corporations to provide food.
Asshattery. Bastards are going to do away with the best cheese this country has made in a century and we will be left with insipid tomatoes and watery produce. Bastards.
Also, the hippies with be mad when they figure it out.
Vivian Louise (c0f830) — 3/28/2009 @ 10:59 amVivian Louise, the 2 bills are H.R. 875 and S. 425. They are not good bills for small producers. After reading up on them a bit it sounds like some of the stuff the EU did that wiped out traditional cheeses and meats due to ‘bad’ bacteria being present.
Here is an op-ed post on how this bill will destroy small farms and farmers markets. In the Orwellian mold, the bill is titled “Tracing and Recalling Agricultural Contamination Everywhere Act of 2009.” Yes, Contamination Everywhere! The bill redefines all kinds of farming practices as contributing to seed contamination. It requires onerous recordkeeping about what food item was held where and for how long, and where did it go next, and you farmers have to keep records and be open to inspection for as long as Vilsack tells you to, etc. This bill does appear to wipe out the “farmer’s market” as there is no one who would want to be responsible for all of the tracking and record keeping.
It really sounds like these bills are corporate agriculture’s (big farma?) attempts to destroy small, organic farming. Here is another lefty op-ed about how Monsanto is rushing this through Congress at warp speed. I guess it isn’t just the wingnuts who noticed Obama’s promise breaking. A snippet:
This seems like a perfect common-sense topic for those on both sides of the aisle to rally. Nobody seems to want to give the FDA more power, nor should they. As the author of the opinion pieces I linked put it:
carlitos (cfbec1) — 3/28/2009 @ 12:28 pmI find the push – back on this effort to be immediate and strenuous – how can Michelle laud the efforts of Alice Waters and local organic farmers on one hand, then allow the same farmers to be hamstrung to death?
Dmac (49b16c) — 3/28/2009 @ 2:02 pmDavey Crockett Would Be Horrified at what has become of today’s Congress in regards to the Constitution.
John Hitchcock (fb941d) — 3/28/2009 @ 2:18 pmCarlitos, thank you so much for doing the research!
Yup, Dmac, it’s the epitome of stupidity. Michelle took an awful fashion risk to plant a garden that her husband won’t even allow her to eat.
Vivian Louise (c0f830) — 3/28/2009 @ 4:38 pmComment by John Hitchcock — 3/28/2009 @ 2:18 pm
Yes, but at least he had the ability to go to a foreign country
AD - RtR/OS (545a5d) — 3/28/2009 @ 5:07 pm(Texas – which to many, is still a foreign country),
and as his parting salutation predicted, the Congress has “Gone to Hell!”.
“Michelle took an awful fashion risk to plant a garden that her husband won’t even allow her to eat.”
Vivian – But it helped her keep those marvelous arms toned up!
daleyrocks (5d22c0) — 3/28/2009 @ 5:21 pmLMAO! daleyrocks, just LMAO!
Carlitos, Thanks again. I just posted my rant on this issue on my blog and gave you a shout out.
Vivian Louise (c0f830) — 3/28/2009 @ 6:33 pmThere has never been a time in this country when it was more important to look at what they are doing and not listen to what they are saying.
Time to buy some ammo.
MIke K (2cf494) — 3/29/2009 @ 10:05 pmGood luck finding ammo, Mike, everyone else has beaten you to it.
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wrxzjszy (137d76) — 4/26/2009 @ 11:41 am