Patterico's Pontifications

10/8/2008

A Good Ad For Florida Came Out Of Last Night’s Debate — Obama’s Non-Answer on Iran Attacking Israel

Filed under: General — WLS @ 1:06 pm

Posted by WLS:

Obama, in my opinion, still has problems with Jewish voters and older voters with a favorable view of Israel. There also remain unanswered questions concerning his associations with various Pro-Palestinian and anti-Semitic groups.

So, this exchange last night really caught my attention. This question first went to McCain and then Obama was given a chance to answer. Note the specific language of the question, and the specific failure of Obama to answer it:

QUESTION: Senator, as a retired Navy chief, my thoughts are often with those who serve our country. I know both candidates, both of you, expressed support for Israel.

If, despite your best diplomatic efforts, Iran attacks Israel, would you be willing to commit U.S. troops in support and defense of Israel? Or would you wait on approval from the U.N. Security Council?

OBAMA: Well, Terry, first of all, we honor your service, and we’re grateful for it.

We cannot allow Iran to get a nuclear weapon. It would be a game-changer in the region. Not only would it threaten Israel, our strongest ally in the region and one of our strongest allies in the world, but it would also create a possibility of nuclear weapons falling into the hands of terrorists.

And so it’s unacceptable. And I will do everything that’s required to prevent it.

And we will never take military options off the table. And it is important that we don’t provide veto power to the United Nations or anyone else in acting in our interests.

It is important, though, for us to use all the tools at our disposal to prevent the scenario where we’ve got to make those kinds of choices.

And that’s why I have consistently said that, if we can work more effectively with other countries diplomatically to tighten sanctions on Iran, if we can reduce our energy consumption through alternative energy, so that Iran has less money, if we can impose the kinds of sanctions that, say, for example, Iran right now imports gasoline, even though it’s an oil-producer, because its oil infrastructure has broken down, if we can prevent them from importing the gasoline that they need and the refined petroleum products, that starts changing their cost-benefit analysis. That starts putting the squeeze on them.

Now, it is true, though, that I believe that we should have direct talks — not just with our friends, but also with our enemies — to deliver a tough, direct message to Iran that, if you don’t change your behavior, then there will be dire consequences.

If you do change your behavior, then it is possible for you to re-join the community of nations.

Now, it may not work. But one of the things we’ve learned is, is that when we take that approach, whether it’s in North Korea or in Iran, then we have a better chance at better outcomes.

When President Bush decided we’re not going to talk to Iran, we’re not going to talk to North Korea, you know what happened? Iran went from zero centrifuges to develop nuclear weapons to 4,000. North Korea quadrupled its nuclear capability.

We’ve got to try to have talks, understanding that we’re not taking military options off the table.

Is that a “NO” to the question — which concerned committing US combat troops to support Israel if it was attacked by Iran?

That scenario is pretty simple — Iran has been threatening it for years. Obama must have a formulated view of what he would do if that scenario played out. The best he offers is “we will never take military options off the table.”

I’m sure supporters of Israel are comforted by that.

51 Responses to “A Good Ad For Florida Came Out Of Last Night’s Debate — Obama’s Non-Answer on Iran Attacking Israel”

  1. Two of my frieds here grew up in Skokie, are Conservative jews (rather than Orthodox or Reformed), but they’re still voting for Obama, despite his idiotic statements regarding Israel and Palestine. Same as it ever was.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  2. “Two of my friends.”

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  3. It’s spelled “Israel”.

    aunursa (1b5bad)

  4. Aside from the fact that Israel’s new Prime Minister Tzipi Livni says Iran is not that big a threat I’d like someone to explain why Hannity has a Obama bashing guest on whose other claim to fame is his desire to “Exterminate Jew Power”.
    And Obama, that corrupt Chicago poll has a lot of big Jew backers. Jewish money!!!
    While Sarah Palin “pals around” with people who believe the deaths of Israelis in suicide bombings is God’s punishment for the jews not converting to christianity..

    So in fact there are a lot of reasons for Palestinians and their supporters to be worried about Omama.

    In my own words (563863)

  5. Two points.

    Americans, as a whole, are thoroughly sick of war. They, to this time, still support the Afghanistan war. But, they will never support an expanded use of force elswhere unless the USA itself is attacked.

    Two, American Jewry support for Israel is way down from what it once was. A generation ago, AIPAC was easily the most powerful lobbying group, with the possible exception of the NRA. It would be inconceivable that Nixon or Ford could get away with refusing Israel the latest war technology with the type of threat Iran now presents. Today? I have yet to read/hear a single protest from any American Jewish entity as to GWB’s refusal a few weeks ago to sell Israel enhanced missiles/bombs.

    Ed (8d1569)

  6. Interesting how he mentions Israel once, at the very beginning of his answer, and then never again. And his answer might as well have been NO, since he actually didn’t really answer it at all. He said “we will never take military options off the table,” and then proceeded to ignore the question.

    Icy Truth (1468e4)

  7. Chief, that’s what an alliance means. If you aren’t willing to stand up for your allies, the alliance isn’t worth much. Quoting my opponent, that would be “Just words.”

    Al (b624ac)

  8. The mis-spellings are really a sign of coded disrespect and evidence my latent anti-Semiticisticism.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  9. anti-Semiticisticism is my new favorite word.

    Icy Truth (1468e4)

  10. See Obama’s spokeshole bleating about Sean Hannity’s guests and asking Sean if he is an anti-Semite at Hot Air.

    The fool says that Walter Annenberg was a Republican as if he personally doled out the money to Ayers. I can’t believe he would he happy to know how they wasted that $50 millions that was supposed to improve the education system, that instead went to fund Ayers’ Marxist, socialist radicals, and build Obama’s personal political machine. Isn’t spending moneys entrusted to you for your own gain generally considered unethical, mucb less illegal?

    Then he says there were Republicans on the board with Ayers. So, they were all idiots. But only one of them is running for president.

    jeff (8c850e)

  11. Sorry, but you can’t take what the Prime Minister says on a given day as anything but a diversionary tactic. But you can bet your a– that the Mossad has already drawn up extensive plans to bomb their reactor sites at a moment’s notice. The previous Prime Minister had just made statements regarding his apparent lack of concern regarding Syrian intentions, before they immediately thereafter blasted their secret nuke site about 20 stories beneath the topsoil. Mark my words – if we don’t do anything about the Iranian nuke sites soon, they will – for better or for worse.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  12. Boy, neocons never get tired of hearing a president talk about how he’ll fight here, commit troops there, invade, etc.

    It’s like they’re always saying “talk dirty to me . . . tell me about how you’d kill people and blow stuff up. That’s the only way I’ll vote for ya.”

    Phil (6d9f2f)

  13. There is the Phil we all know and love.

    JD (f7900a)

  14. Let’s see . . . what was the question, again? Oh yeah. What will the US do if Iran attacks Israel?

    Well, Phil — what do YOU think the president should do?

    Icy Truth (1468e4)

  15. Well, it’s pretty easy, Phil; we now know that, if Iran attacks Israel, Obama won’t do anything but bloviate.

    Not that this surprises us; after all, Obama’s church gives awards and accolades to well-known pro-Jewish groups and people like Hamas and Louis Farrakhan.

    North Dallas Thirty (efe6ff)

  16. Phil once again demonstrating his extreme ignorance on yet another topic – earlier it was economics, now foreign policy.

    So go for the Hat Trick, Phil – let’s hear some brilliant memes on social policy. Can’t wait.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  17. Well, Phil — what do YOU think the president should do?

    Phil thinks that Obama should wave his finger at the mad Mullahs, and then threaten them with being sent to their rooms without dinner. And if that doesn’t work, he’ll threaten them with unconditional state to state discussions, at which point he’ll surrender en masse if they don’t comply immediately.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  18. OK, my last two comments were over – the – top regarding Phil. Please accept my apologies.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  19. To that question, I said to my husband, “They’d better both say ‘Abso-frickin’-lutely.'” I couldn’t believe Obama’s answer. And wasn’t it shortly thereafter that he gave the jaw-dropper about Pakistan? “If the Pakistani government is unable or unwilling to go after Osama bin Laden, then I will”? Then, a few moments later, “I will kill Osama bin Laden” without regard to Pakistan’s alliances, borders, or sovereignty? Who exactly is the hothead here?

    It’s infuriating to me that this empty-headed loose cannon is likely going to be our next President. But in that sad eventuality, the Left can be sure that the Right will not throw the tantrum that we’ve all come to expect when an anointed Democrat loses; we’ll just set our jaws and try to stanch the bleeding, and wait for 2012.

    Jamie (9eef18)

  20. Doesn’t matter. Tactics won’t help. The strategy is wrong.

    One question asked in that debate seems to have struck a chord with everyone: the “a pox on both your houses” question asking “why should we trust either party?”

    McCain attempted to answer by saying that he’s reached across the aisle, but that’s just a talking point and he needs to make that VERY central.

    So, a modest suggestion: McCain buys 15 minutes of ad time across the board 1 week before the election. In this broadcast he announces the following:

    I. If elected, his first act as President will be to resign from the Republican Party. He will govern as an Independant ans will not seek re-election as a Republican.

    II. He will form a Cabinet of National Unity, comprised of people who are more interested in getting things right than in partisan games.

    III. He then names several people (Lieberman, Romney, whoever) who have agreed to join him and promises to name more democrats later “once the election is decided and they have a freer hand.”

    IV. He says that “excessively partisan government prevents common sense solutions — everything needs to be looked at through red or blue glasses. We cannot go on like this, so let’s give the hopeless partisans a “time out.'”

    Etc. It’s what people realy want. They are tired of US and THEM. Let’s give it a rest and solve some problems.

    Kevin Murphy (eb4d6c)

  21. “We’ve got to try to have talks”

    I’m not interetsted in negotiating with the mad mullahs any more than I’m interested in negotiating with Al Qaida. I wish to see them destroyed.

    If you support negotiating with them, then you are my political enemy.

    End of discussion on that issue.

    Dave Surls (8e0258)

  22. “If you support negotiating with them, then you are my political enemy.”

    You don’t know a god damned thing except you like the sound of your own anger. Do you know what SAVAK was? Who Mossadegh was?
    The “Mad Mullahs” as you call them, are political realists and quite sane, though Yazdi and his protege Ahmadinejad are a bit nuts. But then they don’t rule the roost, though we do our best to strengthen their hand.
    And you and yours go just gaga over the Saudis. “Bandar Bush.”
    [Google it]
    The Israelis give tacit support the Saudi monarchy in defense of the corrupt status quo. Kind of like Avraham Stern (The Stern Gang) wanting to work with the Nazis in return for help with the founding of Israel, or communication between Elijah Mohammed and George Lincoln Rockwell. Jews aren’t allowed in Saudi Arabia but there are still 25,000 in Iran, who don’t want to leave.
    It’s all pretty messy, and I don’t support the Iranian leadership any more than most Iranians do, but the ignorance of loud mouth idiots just pisses me off.
    And Obama and Biden are full on Zionists, which is why they’ll get the vast majority of the Jewish vote, as democrats always do.
    The neocon’s days are over, at least.

    Stop wasting my time (a273a1)

  23. The Mad Mullahs and their followers have attacked American embassies, and murdered American citizens and now I intend to do everything in my power to wipe their regime off the face of the earth.

    No negotiations. No deals. Same attitude the liberal Democrats had towards the German and Japanese regimes in WWII: You dared to attack us, now it’s war to the knife

    Once the government of the mad mullahs is destroyed, then we can start negotiating with Iran.

    IMO, Obama’s attitude towards Iran just shows what a craven coward and appeaser he is. Anyone who believes that this POS is serious about going after Al Qaida and other terrorists and state sponsors of terrorism is living in a dream world. The only reason he and his lefty friends mention Al Qaida is because they see it as a way to attack Bush and the Republicans. They obviously couldn’t care less about America or terrorist attacks against Americans.

    If Obama and friends get into power they’re going to do the same thing that Bill Clinton did in regard to terrorism, which is little or nothing.

    Dave Surls (8e0258)

  24. And Obama and Biden are full on Zionists, which is why they’ll get the vast majority of the Jewish vote, as democrats always do.
    The neocon’s days are over, at least.

    My eyes starting glazing over, but I think you forgot AIPAC, Pearle, and the rest of the cabal.

    JD (f7900a)

  25. I wonder how Rashid Khalidi liked what Obama had to say about Iran last night.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  26. We conspired in the overthrow of the elected government of Iran and the installation of a despot: Reza Pahlavi. His regime, with our support tortured and killed. That was in the past of course, but you have no knowledge of the past beyond your wounded… what? pride? ego? I dunno.

    Most foreign policy experts, even in the US, know that we have to deal with Iran, in the sense of taking them seriously. You’re a ranting idiot. People like you in this country scare me more than the leaders of Iran. And no, I’m not talking about Ahmadinejad. He’s a moralizing fundamentalist jackass, just like you. Khamenei is a player, and players are rational actors. I wish I could say the same for you, Mr Frey, and Mr McCain. I have no idea what any of you stand for except the pretense of absolute moral superiority. Based on what?

    It’s not a moral world it’s a dangerous one. This country has been led by spoiled children of the rich voted in by illiterate peasantry. Time for the adults to run the place for awhile. True enough it’s not the adults I would prefer, but beggars can’t be choosers. It’s the revenge of civil society.

    Stop wasting my time (a273a1)

  27. SWMT – Mr. Frey didn’t write the post. Take off your ideological blinders idiot.

    I’d like to let John Bolton deal with the mullahs, but you pussies in the Democratic party have hissy fits when his name gets mentioned.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  28. “I wonder how Rashid Khalidi liked what Obama had to say about Iran last night.”

    He’s hoping for the best, as I am, but he doesn’t expect much.
    And neither do I.

    stop... (a273a1)

  29. I like how the Left is still fighting this anti-CIA war of the ouster of Mossadegh. You would think that after 50+ years they would give it a rest? But, NO!
    One of their little socialist darlings was put to flight by the evil spooks of the “company”, and like Guatamala, and Chili, and gawd knows where else, they will keep bringing up these little facts like a shrew-wife who won’t let you forget how you left your skivvies on the bedroom floor.

    Earth to SWMT….That was then, this is now.
    The Mullahs are not Mossadegh.
    The Mullahs like to stone women for not wearing a burkah.
    The Mullahs like to execute homosexuals just because of their homosexuality.
    The Mullahs want their people to live in the 7th Century.
    The Mullahs want to turn Israel into a Nuclear Waste Dump.
    Don’t you get it yet?
    Are you incapable of real thought?

    AOracle (db2f44)

  30. First we have this:

    It’s the revenge of civil society.

    And then this:

    You’re a ranting idiot.

    And this as well:

    He’s a moralizing fundamentalist jackass, just like you.

    Sounds like a bad case of bi – polar disorder; or perhaps he missed his meds this morning.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  31. “We conspired in the overthrow of the elected government of Iran…”

    Blah, blah.

    Thanks I’ve heard the left wing fairy tale version of what took place in Iran in the 1950s many times, and I’m really not intereted in hearing left wing traitors spew boilerplate hogwash so they can justify to themselves why its o.k. for despotic foreign states and terror groups to attack American embassies and blow up American peacekeeping forces in Lebanon, and why we have no right to defend ourselves when they do.

    Any candidate for office who wishes to commence immediate military operations designed to drive the mad mullahs out of power in Iran will have my support (on that issue anyway). Any candidate who wishes to “negotiate” and crawl on their bellies and appease will not.

    Dave Surls (8e0258)

  32. “Any candidate for office who wishes to commence immediate military operations designed to drive the mad mullahs out of power in Iran will have my support”
    That’s not gonna win you any elections, kiddo.

    “The Mullahs want their people to live in the 7th Century.”
    Actually no. There’s a large student population 60% female at the university level, and the science regimen is fully up-to-date.

    “and blow up American peacekeeping forces ”
    It doesn’t get described this way in the States but we picked sides in a civil war and quite literally fired first. The attack on the marine barracks was a military assault against belligerents.

    This is boring (a273a1)

  33. There’s a large student population 60% female at the university level, and the science regimen is fully up-to-date.

    That must explain why Iran has to send out most of their native oil to other countries in order to have it refined properly. It also may explain why they’ve had to import scientists from countries like North Korea in order to start their nuke – building processes.

    Because of their awesome scientific power!

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  34. The attack on the marine barracks was a military assault against belligerents.

    Didn’t take long for The Troll to bring out the always – popular meme that it’s completely the US’s fault. Time for some new material, Trolly.

    Dmac (cc81d9)

  35. Brave Sir Phil ran away?

    Icy Truth (1468e4)

  36. No one was talking about the general population, because it is meaningless when it comes to political power in Iran.
    We’re talking about the Mullahs at the center of power!
    The ones who send the Modesty Police out into the streets to whip women who are “immodestly” dressed.

    Another Drew (db2f44)

  37. He heard your footsteps, Icy!

    Another Drew (db2f44)

  38. We’ve conspired to overthrow the last 3 covernments of Iran: Reza’s father during WW2 (for trying to join with the Nazis); Mossedegh (the commie); and Jimmy Carter’s disasterous undermining of the Shah (a Progressive dictator).

    It could be argued that modern Islamic extremism began with Khomeini’s rise to power. That’s Carter’s fault.

    And we will probably help overthow this one, too. It seems that as long as the world economy runs on oil, we will have interests there.

    Kevin (805c5b)

  39. I love how the Leftist can blame America for absolutely anything.

    JD (f7900a)

  40. Actually, the action back in WW-2, was a joint affair between the Brits and the Soviets. I think they threw out Shah Reza Pahlavi’s grand-father?

    Another Drew (db2f44)

  41. Brain dead, the lot of them!

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  42. JD & daley…
    They all forget what FDR said in describing some tin-hat dictator somewhere:
    He may be a son-of-a-bitch; but he’s our SOB!

    Another Drew (db2f44)

  43. “It doesn’t get described this way in the States but we picked sides in a civil war and quite literally fired first. The attack on the marine barracks was a military assault against belligerents.”

    That’s total crap.

    Anyway, ignoring the lying, leftoid propaganda, the issue here isn’t what do we do if the mad mullahs attack Israel?

    The issue is why won’t our government do something about the attacks that have already been made agaisnt our nation by the Khomeniists?

    Is our policy going to be that we’ll “negotiate” as long as they limit themselves to attacking U.S. embassies and killing our marines in Lebanon?

    Dave Surls (c9acd3)

  44. Dave – The left’s pin the tail on the real Iranian leader is pretty funny. Talk to him, why, he’s not the real power? Who is the real power? Uh, uh, one of those guys, but, but they got 60,000 free science students at universities. Huh? Tight, who they brutally repress when they get out of line.

    I think all these chowderheads read Juan Cole and think he’s God. There were good reasons he didn’t get offered a job at Yale and they weren’t related to his political views.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  45. I love how the Leftist can blame America for absolutely anything.

    And the right will defend to the end (and condemn the criticism of) even U.S. soldiers killing and raping women and children.

    But that’s not as bad as blaming America.

    Phil (3b1633)

  46. I don’t understand why America-hating pukes like phil don’t relocate to Iran, N. KOrea, Cuba or Zimbabwe.
    You take a few cretins like the soldiers wreaking havoc in that Baghdad prison, who are prosecuted and convicted or a very few terrorists made to undergo waterboarding and the leftist scum goes ballistic. What were there- over fifty front page NY Timesd stories about the Iraq prison were no one even died under American hands?
    Liberals worry more about the rights of terrorists and the pondscum at Guanatanamo receiving proper amenities and culturally sensitive meals and such than they do about any of their victims. Abort babies and protest death sentences for killers. How many liberal mutants would be only too happy to emulate geniuses like Rachel Corrie and lament her demise by the evil Joooos? Oh yeah, let’s protest Caterpillar for providing bulldozers.
    Oh yeah, convicted murderers should be spared and the death penalty off the table except for innocents in the womb, but wouldn’t it bge ever so grand if we could string up war criminals Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld. Hang them upside down from lamp posts in the fashion of Mussolini.

    Bend over for Nobama.

    madmax333 (0c6cfc)

  47. #46, that’s the bile I normally see when people point out festering problems in America. It’s almost like you like these sorts of abuses, want them to continue, and are mad when people point them out and say “stop, that’s wrong.”

    The neocon line is “don’t like the bad things Americans do? Don’t try fix them — just leave America and let us keep doing them!”

    Phil (6d9f2f)

  48. Actually, the problem is when folks who rail against one political side are silent about the abuses of their own side. Or try to make unequal issues equivalent.

    Such as Ayres connection to Obama (about which CNN openly stated he lied) versus Palin’s debunked association with AIP.

    There is nothing wrong with trying to find change. But as the Bible says, before your remove the splinter in your neighbor’s eye, remove the log that is in your own.

    Good advice for everyone.

    That being said, there is a LOT of astroturfing style trollery here of late. By trollery, I mean insulting nonsense, spreading stories that have been debunked long ago, and making equivalent things that are certainly not.

    99% of it from the Left. I wonder why?

    My Leftist friends may get this President they think they want. But they will soon see, if so, that Barack Obama has no philosophy at all, other than his own sense of certitude and entitlement. Count on it.

    Eric Blair (e60b98)

  49. Hey, Dmac….

    This “Phil” person sure sounds and posts like someone we both know. Do you think….?

    Eric Blair (e60b98)

  50. “And the right will defend to the end (and condemn the criticism of) even U.S. soldiers killing and raping women and children.”

    LOL. The My Lai massacre took place when America was led by an ultra-left wing Democrat president and a Congress basically owned by the Dems.

    Liberal dolts should blame themselves for that one.

    As an ultra-right winger, I don’t defend much of ANYTHING the libby-wibbys do, much less defend a massacre that took place in a war they got us into and that happened when they had total control of the government.

    And, anyway, what’s that have to do with Iran?

    Dave Surls (e2ab3b)

  51. Phil – You really are a cretin.

    JD (f7900a)


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