Patterico's Pontifications

9/24/2008

Obama Makes A Grievous Tactical Error In Not Taking McCain Up On His Offer To Jointly Return To D.C. To Work On Financial Package

Filed under: General — WLS @ 2:44 pm



Posted by WLS:

The Obama campaign is once again listening to political operatives who want him to “fight” McCain on every front, and who have seemingly now advised him to not agree to suspend the campaign through the weekend in order to return to DC to work with their colleagues in Congress on a bipartisan financial rescue package.  Leaders in both parties have said that if any package is going to pass, the members of Congress are only going to find the political courage to vote for it if both Obama and McCain are onboard since one of the two is going to be responsible for making it work not just in theory, but in practice.

Here’s Obama’s justification in saying “no” to McCain’s offer:

“With respect to the debates, it’s my belief that this is exactly the time when the American people need to hear form the person who in 40 days will be responsible for dealing with this mess. . . . In my mind, actually it’s more important than ever that we present ourselves to the American people.”

I have a hard time imagining a more obvious example of being politically “tone deaf”.  This coming from a guy who has spent more time campaigning for his next office than serving in the one to which he was elected to four years ago. 

Rather than going to D.C. to put the nation’s financial markets at ease, Obama thinks voters really want to hear more canned responses from his stump speech, which both he and McCain are likely to spin into answers to any questions asked on Friday during the debate. 

I suspect that the VAST majority of Americans – even those planning on watching the debate on Friday – will not be heartbroken if it is postponed into next week, if by doing so it means that CONGRESS WILL DO SOMETHING TO FIX THE MESS THEY CREATED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Obama wants American to “hear from” him. 

The perfect example of a hack politician not knowing when to shut up.

McCain can now start running another ad next week — empahsizing that he would rather lose an election then standby while Americans endure the risk of losing their pensions or retirement savings accounts as financial institutions fold-up due to a lack of liquidity created by the credit crisis.   

McCain is currently holding the office of Senator from the State of Arizona, and the Senate has vital legislation now pending before it, and time is of the essence.  So McCain is going to do his job.

Obama is going to skip it and go onto his next job interview.

138 Responses to “Obama Makes A Grievous Tactical Error In Not Taking McCain Up On His Offer To Jointly Return To D.C. To Work On Financial Package”

  1. Yep… and I’m so glad I didn’t spend time blogging it, as you pretty much captured it. I will add just a few points:

    Tactically smart for JM because if BO had come to DC, it would have taken BO off the campaign trail and likely reduced his MSM coverage;

    BO can’t claim that JM is trying to dodge the debate, as it would open up BO’s avoidance of those Town Halls JM proposed;

    Obama is working hard to try to look bipartisan with his “joint statement” gambit.

    Karl (cbb1a2)

  2. The Anointed One is not worried about the economy, after all, he’s found a British private mint to make new gold coins with his image. Take that, USAian metal workers! Karl, how do you do it?

    htom (412a17)

  3. The only people more deranged than Obama are the poor, misguided souls who will vote for him.

    We may lose the election but by any measure John McCain is a stand-up guy.

    Philip (6846fb)

  4. htom,

    How do I do what? This is WLS’s post. 😉

    Karl (cbb1a2)

  5. Hey Obama – If you’re not part of the solution, you’re part of the problem.

    Right now you look like you’re part of the problem.

    How’s about displaying some of that famous bipartisanship you’ve never displayed before.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  6. Sorry, we cross-posted. Karl Rove was who I was referring to. I can see getting them set up (at an American firm) and even striking a handful of samples … but selling them AND handing them out BEFORE the election?

    htom (412a17)

  7. I have to say, I’m actually quite bullish on the economy suddenly. If McCain really thought things were going to hell in a handbasket, he wouldn’t be trying to “fix” it.

    I predict that Republicans are going to continue to make this the worst economic crisis that has ever been faced by mankind. And thanks to McCain’s selfless decision to “stop campaigning,” the credit crisis will, amazingly, not get any worse, and possibly even get a bit better, by election day.

    Phil (6d9f2f)

  8. This is another disruptive move by McCain, like the Palin choice, and we won’t know how it works until later. It does show that he is not a hack plugging along thinking only of politics. I think he might wait until tomorrow, then agree that they can have a debate but it should be on economics instead of foreign policy. Obama has been memorizing his briefing books on foreign policy and will be thrown back again by McCain’s switch. This will show that McCain doesn’t need to study; he knows this stuff, and he can turn on a dime to change topics. Once more, McCain is inside Obama’s decision loop.

    Nobody wants to hear foreign policy this week. Obama really doesn’t want to talk about the bailout so, let’s talk about it.

    Mike K (f89cb3)

  9. Clarification: by “Republicans are going to continue to make this the worst economic crisis that has ever been faced by mankind,” above, I meant they’re going to continue to SAY it’s the worst crisis — not actually MAKE things worse.

    Phil (6d9f2f)

  10. Obama’s superior judgment fails America again.

    Perfect Sense (9d1b08)

  11. WLS,

    I apologize for posting on top of you on the same topic. I have no defense except it’s a big story …

    DRJ (c953ab)

  12. This mess was caused by Democrats failing to allow a bill that would have corrected Fanny and Fredie. Dodd lead that group. that was in 2005. When the FBI does the investigation, the responsible people will pay their due. McCain sponsored that bill. Obama is lying about everything. If his lips are moving, he is lying. His poor half bro, George lives in a mud hut. Obama wants to help us when he will not even assist a family member. You believe if you wish. He is just a lie. Ayers/Obama 08

    Zelsdorf Ragshaft III (e18128)

  13. Senator Obama has not turned down McCain’s offer to go back to Washington together. Far from it. He has only turned down McCain’s last-ditch effort to postpone the debates. Indeed, he just said:

    “Obviously if it turns out that we need to be in Washington, we’ve both got big planes, we’ve painted our slogan on the side of them,” Obama also said. “They can get us from Washington to Mississippi pretty quickly.”

    tgirsch (7b1deb)

  14. It’s so confusing to me.

    Why in the hell is this entire bailout even necessary.

    And I thought the GOP ers believed in the invisible hand of the marketplace.

    I guess when it’s Wall Street billionaires who stand to lose it’s OK to open up the treasury for them.

    What a bunch of phonies the republican party has become.

    And the fools blaming this on the party who has held Congress for 1 year out of the past 14 years are nothing but pure partisan hacks.

    And your great President Bush who has been in charge for the past 8 years, really did a stupendous job too.

    Heckuva job! GOP.

    jharp (f4bed7)

  15. IMHO it’s too early to see how the tea leaves are going to shake out in regards to the presidential race. I think McCain did the right thing but am skeptical it will gain him much.

    I made the mistake of checking our IRA status this afternoon. Since January we’ve lost 25% of the value. A friend of ours who has been putting away for quite a bit longer is down more than 30K to date. Thank goodness I don’t plan on retiring for another 15 years, earliest.

    What I wish would happen is that Bush would come out guns blazing tonight. Lay out the history and name names. Remind citizens that it is their representatives that will make it happen and let the phone banks open. Press conference and Sunday talk show as a minimum. Simply take out all of the oxygen on the pres election until a solution/compromise/effort is agreed upon and enacted.

    voiceofreason2 (4df500)

  16. Mary Katharine Ham had the best response (paraphrased, but not LATimes-style, so it’s accurate):
    OK Mr. Obama, if people really need to hear from you and Sen. McCain on the important issues facing us, let’s switch the subject of Friday’s debate from foreign policy to the economy.
    (My additional comment)–and then you can explain why you felt it more important to campaign than to do the job we’re paying you to do.

    Kyle (9d9e73)

  17. jharp

    Wall Street billionaires are still going to lose millions.

    The question is whether banks and financial services firms that function on the basis of having credit avaialable to them will fail if credit is not extended.

    Availability of credit depends on assurance of repayment. People with money are unwilling to lend it now because the people that need it to operate cannot assure the lenders that they are solvent and will be able to pay it back.

    When those businesses needing credit to operate can’t get it — they go out of business.

    Lots of public pension plan money is invested in financial institutions and through investment houses. If the balance sheets of those businesses cause them to go belly up, those pension plans will simply be another creditor listed on the bankruptcy petitions.

    You up for that?

    And, contrary to you continual bleating, the record is quite clear that it was Dems on the Senate Banking Committee who voted on a party line basis to block the unchecked expansion of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in 2005 — growth which Alan Greenspan predicted at the time was laying the seeds of an eventual market meltdown if housing prices ever began to decline.

    Dems didn’t care so long as poor people were being loaned money — whether they could ever hope to pay it back or not.

    WLS (26b1e5)

  18. VOF — and anyone else whose retirement window is long-term.

    Market conditions like this are why the phrase “dollar-cost-averaging” was invented. You money buys you more value when the market is down. Unless you want to withdraw all the money from your plan tomorrow morning, what difference does it make what its value is at the close of the market today?

    WLS (26b1e5)

  19. Have y’all noticed the sudden optimism from Barney Frank this afternoon? Out of nowhere, following a another terribly contentious hearing (justifiably so), he is speaking of bill passage within a few days.

    What, pray tell, would lead him to this new tack?

    The grown-up Dems fully realize the peril BHO is now in. The grown-up GOP operatives who are independent of JSM’s campaign, need to trumpet immediately that it was JSM’s leadership that forced Frank’s hand.

    Ed (f35a20)

  20. what difference does it make what its value is at the close of the market today?

    WLS,

    I’m well aware of that but thanks for the reminder just the same. As I said, I’m just glad I am not facing retirement soon — I really feel for the people who are.
    We have put the max in my wife’s IRA for a long time now and about 2/3 of the max in mine. I’ll probably go ahead and increase the allotment to max mine out to take advantage of the lower share prices.

    voiceofreason2 (4df500)

  21. And your great President Bush who has been in charge for the past 8 years,

    STOP ATTEMPTING TO HIJACK THE THREAD. STAY ON TOPIC OR DESIST FROM POSTING.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  22. VOR2,

    Sorry about your portfolio. I’m sure ours is the same but I’ve avoided looking.

    I agree President Bush should try to help people understand what’s happening and why a bailout is a good solution but I’m doubtful he will be partisan. Bush seems to want to stay out of this election. In a way, it doesn’t surprise me since his father has always strictly adhered to the unwritten rule that former Presidents should stay out of politics. I suspect W feels he should honor that rule now but, to me, it only makes him a lame-r duck President.

    DRJ (c953ab)

  23. DRJ,
    Partisan no and good point about his Dad. But he should stay in the news until it gets resolved.

    AP or Ed have a good write up on what McCain may be trying to do.

    voiceofreason2 (4df500)

  24. Why doesn’t John Mccain announce already, that even he himself will be voting for Barrack Obama on Nov. 4th? Mccain already agree’s on everything Obama has already said his stance is on the bail out issue. And LOL at all you who think John Mccain is swooping into Washington in the wee of the night and saving America’s financial peril. LOL again. As if it rest soley on his shoulders.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  25. Everything else aside, fine job on McCain’s part outflanking Obama, especially considering Obama was the first to propose some sort of joint response.

    sierra (aa4594)

  26. I agree with Mike K and Kyle.
    Not sure what’s next but O’s been cramming for 1 big topic at a time. Love him or hate him, he’s just NOT been doing this for decades, a la McCain.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  27. Senator McCain has made the tactical error, as he just looks weak and afraid to debate Obama. If he can’t walk and chew gum at the same time—he has no business running for President of the United States.

    Joan Wilder (0c61d9)

  28. John McCain’s Remarks on the Economic Crisis
    New York, NY
    Wednesday, September 24, 2008

    America this week faces an historic crisis in our financial system. We must pass legislation to address this crisis. If we do not, credit will dry up, with devastating consequences for our economy. People will no longer be able to buy homes and their life savings will be at stake. Businesses will not have enough money to pay their employees. If we do not act, ever corner of our country will be impacted. We cannot allow this to happen.

    Last Friday, I laid out my proposal and I have since discussed my priorities and concerns with the bill the Administration has put forward. Senator Obama has expressed his priorities and concerns. This morning, I met with a group of economic advisers to talk about the proposal on the table and the steps that we should take going forward. I have also spoken with members of Congress to hear their perspective.

    It has become clear that no consensus has developed to support the Administration’s proposal. I do not believe that the plan on the table will pass as it currently stands, and we are running out of time.

    Tomorrow morning, I will suspend my campaign and return to Washington after speaking at the Clinton Global Initiative. I have spoken to Senator Obama and informed him of my decision and have asked him to join me.

    I am calling on the President to convene a meeting with the leadership from both houses of Congress, including Senator Obama and myself. It is time for both parties to come together to solve this problem.

    We must meet as Americans, not as Democrats or Republicans, and we must meet until this crisis is resolved. I am directing my campaign to work with the Obama campaign and the commission on presidential debates to delay Friday night’s debate until we have taken action to address this crisis.

    I am confident that before the markets open on Monday we can achieve consensus on legislation that will stabilize our financial markets, protect taxpayers and homeowners, and earn the confidence of the American people. All we must do to achieve this is temporarily set politics aside, and I am committed to doing so.

    Following September 11th, our national leaders came together at a time of crisis. We must show that kind of patriotism now. Americans across our country lament the fact that partisan divisions in Washington have prevented us from addressing our national challenges. Now is our chance to come together to prove that Washington is once again capable of leading this country.

    from the McCain-Palin newsletter….

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  29. McCain should go to Washington and help deal with the crisis. But, that’s no reason to postpone the debate. Send Sarah Palin to run rings around Obama.

    I’d love to see Super Sarah walk out on stage with a basketball and just let it sit on her podium, wait for the moderator to ask why it’s there. Her answer is that after she puts Obama in the popcorn machine she’s going to the gym looking for a workout.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  30. I just heard Larry Elder and he brings up a good point: as far as the election goes, this move won’t bode well for McCain – not that it isn’t the prudent thing to do and not that he doesn’t have the country’s best interest at heart by turning his complete focus to the fiasco at hand but it will look bad because the MSM will play it up that way. He will be portrayed as weak, afraid to debate, unsure of himself as a candidate, blah, blah, blah…and judging from #27’s comment, those wheels have apparently already been set in motion.

    What a shame statesman-like behavior is no longer relevant or recognizable.

    Dana (4d3ea0)

  31. Mccain Suspension: “I am confident that before the markets open on Monday we can achieve consensus on legislation that will stabilize our financial markets,”

    Mccain’s going to Washington in reguards to this bail out to remind the senate that, “The fundamentals of our economy are strong”? Seriously, right now, all of America is actually thinking just what is it you think your going to be able to do by this move knowing that you already don’t know what your doing when it comes to the economy as he has said in his own words. Its all a stunt and a ploy.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  32. Obama is still his same ole egomanic self….
    What a piece of ###%^^&** he is….Wake up America.

    glenda (2e5430)

  33. “Its all a stunt and a ploy.”

    Sam – No, rly? Thank you for coming here to share your wisdom with us rubes.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  34. daleyrocks. Your welcome. But you shouldn’t insult yourself like that. Your not rubes here. And I’m a republican christian conservative for the record.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  35. Another photo shot, publicity gimick especially when congress has said McCain hasn’t talked to any of them yet about this crisis. They do not want this crisis turning into a political gimic but here goes McCain. He the deregulator now thinks he will appear as the hero for the camera’s.

    Normal people can recognize a publicity stunt especially when Congress has told him no to show up there.

    CarolO MI (24b981)

  36. Sam:

    daleyrocks. Your welcome. But you shouldn’t insult yourself like that. Your not rubes here. And I’m a republican christian conservative for the record.

    Just a hint for the next time you make this claim:

    We capitalize Republican and Christian. And don’t ever go for the trifecta and claim to be home-schooled. Every home-schooled person I know understands the difference between your and you’re.

    DRJ (c953ab)

  37. Now is our chance to come together to prove that Washington is once again capable of leading this country.

    ROTFL. The proof of the pudding is the eating. “Capable of leading the country,” sure. To hell in a handbasket, is where.

    cboldt (3d73dd)

  38. Dana – but it will look bad because the MSM will play it up that way.

    The MSM would play it negatively no matter what McCain does.

    The MSM is a campaign organization for Obama. Their opinion is becoming completely irrelevant.

    As for Sam – And I’m a republican christian conservative for the record.
    Very doubtful, as this is not a ‘club’, and the posters and commenters here represent various political and religious affiliations. Your photocopied ‘badge’ is phony, as we don’t need no stinkin’ badges here.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  39. Normal people can recognize a publicity stunt especially when Congress has told him no to show up there.
    .
    Harry Reid is the “genius” who said that Senators should stay away from their jobs, it wasn’t “Congress” who suggested McCain stay away.
    .
    Isn’t the Senate a big debate society anyway? I suggest McCain and Obama debate the economy and prescriptive legislation where it counts, from the floor of the Senate. C-SPAN2 carries it live. The MSM could edit it to favor Obama, per usual practice.
    .
    P.S. Democrats aren’t “normal people.”

    cboldt (3d73dd)

  40. SurveyUSA has just completed a snap poll on response to John McCain’s request to cancel or postpone the presidential debate.

    Several questions. But two key ones.

    What to do about debates?

    Hold as Scheduled 50%
    Hold with Econ Focus 36%
    Postpone 10%

    Suspend Campaigns?

    Suspend 14%
    Continue 31%
    Refocus on Fin. Crisis 48%

    Would canceling the debates be good for America? 14% say yes.

    Readnek (105b91)

  41. Who does mccain think he is, the almighty saviour that is needed to save america,the bill will pass with out him,let him get on with the debate and vote on the bill when he is called upon,if he is allowed to cheat this way ,he will later try to take credit for passing the bill.

    evans joesephe (2968d9)

  42. evans joesephe:

    Who does mccain think he is, the almighty saviour …

    Obama has already been cast in that role by the media and his supporters.

    DRJ (c953ab)

  43. #36 – DRJ

    We capitalize Republican and Christian. And don’t ever go for the trifecta and claim to be home-schooled. Every home-schooled person I know understands the difference between your and you’re.

    — Good call. We also write McCain instead of Mccain, and bailout instead of bail out, and Senate instead of senate, and we put the apostrophe in it’s when it’s appropriate.

    Icy Truth (630deb)

  44. Obama like Nero can fiddle around on the campaign trail, running his mouth and showing voters how irrelevant he truly is, while responsible adults come together to see the nation’s financial house doesn’t burn down.

    14% in the polls? We don’t need no stinkin’ polls. McCain walks the walk, while Obama talks and talks and talks.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  45. this is Republican media manipulation bullshit at its best and Obama should grow a pair and call McCain out on it.

    If it is the worst calamity in U.S. history as you republican wingnuts sell it…then stand up and take credit for causing it with your neo-reagan financial policies. The suits on wall street are losing their second and third homes and BMW’s and we have to save their asses…again.

    Get a clue and realize that this is not armageddon….i for one would love to see some of those wall street geniuses in bread lines.

    Scott B (a93cf7)

  46. You’ve heard of the KISS Army? Meet the Kos Army:

    evans joesephe, Sam, CarolO MI (another Olbertard), Joan Wilder;

    tards, all

    Icy Truth (630deb)

  47. #45, you forgot to call McCain a Rethuglican. I get a bit uneasy if too much time goes by without getting a fix of Lefty hate mongering.

    BTW, it was your boy, the one with the big ears, who lined his pockets with dirty money from Fannie May’s boss. You know, the one who was once a trusted economic advisor, but now has a new set of tread marks on his backside.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  48. Despite the political bashing that’s been going on…as a pissed off (undecided) Independent I completely agree with Senator Obama’s statement that the American public needs to see who will be inheriting this mess.

    Lets Cut the CRAP and admit Both men are Not economic professionals and do not have the answer. I applaud Mcain’s service, and spirit that this is a priority but if he had really cared about the situation, he would’ve done his “campaign pause” oh say much earlier as this debacle unfolded. Wouldn’t you say the timing is suspicious?? BL: Neither one has the answers, I belive Mcains reasons are political only as we all know …. to Let the Experts fix the problem.

    Proud Military Joe (9242fe)

  49. You can call this lots of things, but “neo-Reagan” is a bit much. The crony capitalism and self-dealing at Fannie and Freddie is straight Clintonism, by way of Bush (hardly a Reagan man).

    If you want to lay much of this at Bush’s feet, fine — lots of roadkill there already — but Reagan is the one that got this economy going; it took Clinton and Bush Jr to find new ways to loot it. Easy to loot, hard to build.

    Kevin Murphy (805c5b)

  50. Scott B —

    this is Republican media manipulation bullshit at its best and Obama should grow a pair and call McCain out on it.
    — WHO has been manipulated, and in WHAT fashion?

    If it is the worst calamity in U.S. history as you republican wingnuts sell it
    — WHO is saying this? I was under the impression that all sides were saying that it’s bad, and that the argument is over how to deal with it.

    i for one would love to see some of those wall street geniuses in bread lines.
    — Why would you want to see anybody in a bread line? Are you really filled with that much hate?

    Icy Truth (630deb)

  51. McGimmick tries another one. Too bad nobody’s buying.

    http://www.surveyusa.com/index.php/2008/09/24/americas-first-reaction-fridays-mccain-obama-debate-should-still-be-held-on-friday-but-perhaps-with-new-focus/

    You cultists keep telling yourselves this was a brilliant move though.

    Josh (86f13d)

  52. J. McCain is a hero again. LOL.
    What does he know about economy? how can he possibly help?
    The longer he stays away from any decision making position the better. I think his move is an excuse to avoid meeting Obama when it is becoming more obvious how the Republican fat cats screwed us up.
    Profit on stock bubble, then profit on war they started on borrowed money, then move money to real estate bubble, then to the oil bubble, and once that bubble burst, and before their guy left the WH, spread the debt on the rest of us. Brilliant. The last (hopefully) present from Bush to American people: the $700.000.000.000 tab. Don’t worry, this is only about $2,500 per head. Think you got mugged on the pay day, you will make to the next somehow.

    Blueneck (7cace0)

  53. LOL. DRJ – I had a tea spill incident on my keyboard today and my c , v and number 0 key stopped working. In a temporary fix I remapped my keyboard so that I could assign those key commands to different keys till I get to the computer store tomorrow for a new keyboard. ;-). That shows your probably one of my fellow Repubicans. When you can’t make a point on the issue, then point out their hair, color of shoes, or what type of wrist watch they’re wearing. So for now I can’t type a capitol letter “c” or “v”. But if you read my post you could know this by seeing how I spelled Mccain with no capitol c’s? LOL. And I thought not capitolizing Republican would of looked better instead of typing it “Republican christian conservative.” I did it on purpose so it looked more aesthetic for readers. And your or you’re doesn’t do a job of debunking a persons valid thought. Just telling you that, so you can debate people better in the future. Not that I came for a debate.

    Apogee- Wrong, put your teeth away. That wasn’t a comment to attack the whole board or the people on it, but I was addressing one particular poster and a word he used in representing who he was. On that comment I made to him you could of A, B or c’ed, your way out of it. I don’t wear badge’s, just stated three titles that fit what I am for the guy. A registered republican, A christian, and conservative views. I’m hoping for the time when my fellow Republican’s will learn to put their teeth away and learn how to make sense on the issues once again. Rush Limbaugh types need help, paranoid that the entire world and their television’s and newspaper’s are all out to get them.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  54. then stand up and take credit for causing it with your neo-reagan financial policies.

    You mean the Clinton-backed RCA that allowed 5 financial institutions to go FAR beyond the 21-1 Equity ratio?

    Guess what 5.

    You mean in 2005 when Dodd actively killed in committee an attempt by McCain (backed by Bush) to increase oversight of Fannie and Freddie, the two institutions that helped cause this?

    You mean when the Fed Chair said “We see no reason” for F&F’s books?

    Yeah, no way the Republicans ever tried to do anything about this.

    Dope.

    Scott Jacobs (d3a6ec)

  55. I am getting really sick of the Republicans taking advantage of a bad situation. But that’s what they do best, isn’t it? McCain looks like a saint for slithering away from the debates like a scared little girl. I think DC can get by without you, John McCain. Meanwhile, Obama looks bad to do something as frivilous as have this scheduled debate for oh, just the leader of the free world that everyone has been dyin to see as Obama will kick ass.
    Shame Shame Shame!

    And how they took Hillary’s misfortune and had to trump it with what could be the final nail in the USA’s coffin: Sarah Palin

    How they can sleep at night is beyond me. Be a patriot. Vote Democrat or you are really against the salvation of this great place…….

    Tim (8d90a0)

  56. Mccain already agree’s on everything

    Nice grammar there, bunky – nice brain as well.

    Obama should grow a pair

    Yeah, he should get tough, and get in his face and tell him off real good, huh? Brilliant, except the Messiah’s the gonadless wonder of all time, so the most he can do is stomp his little feet and keep talking. Sounds like you two are a match made in heaven.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  57. daleyrocks. Your welcome. But you shouldn’t insult yourself like that. Your not rubes here. And I’m a republican christian conservative for the record.

    Interesting variation on the astroturfing campaign — waiting until the SECOND comment to assert their “republican christian conservative” bonafides.

    Rob Crawford (b5d1c2)

  58. Icy Truth – And you prove my other protest against my own Republican Affliliates, that when even when someone in your own political party thinks in opposition than the mass, then we must bully them to an ousting to make them conform. Those fellow Republican’s need to really grow real ones. LOL

    Sam (7e6f35)

  59. You Obama supporters realize Congress has a role to play here, don’t you? I know it’s popular to claim Bush is a dictator but, from the sound of it, you all must think he really is one.

    DRJ (c953ab)

  60. Obama supporters have been touting Obama’s empty slogan about “Judgment to Lead”.

    Today, Obama showed that that slogan is not merely empty but a flat out lie.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  61. I think DC can get by without you, John McCain.

    You tell ’em, Timmah!

    Shame Shame Shame!

    Boolah, boolah, boolah, TIMMAH!

    That shows your probably one of my fellow Repubicans.

    So your spelling is terrible because your keyboard is…what, exactly? Jeebus, now the ‘tards can’t even get their stories straight.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  62. Its funny to see no one tried challenging the issue I presented, but the grammar. LOL. You all proved my points. This is not a trick. I am a registered Republican, with a broken c, v, and 0 key. You look ridiculous. LOL

    Sam (7e6f35)

  63. Obama wears ladies undies and shoplifts lipstick and eye shadow. He eats polyesters raw and spends his nights with Andrew Sullivan.

    His wife outweighs him and he tells whoppers. He’s got bad breath and forgets to eat his veggies. He’s unfit to lead a troop of girl scouts.

    Sarah Palin is a better basketball player, she was the starting point guard on a state championship team, while Obama was a nothing more than bench warmer. Palin can hit the open man on the give-and-go, but Obama can’t hit his own rear end with both hands.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  64. Dmac – You try remapping your fingers to type letters that are now in different places at your normal typing speed and see how well you do. LOL. This is turning funny.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  65. against my own Republican Affliliates,

    What the hell kind of language is “affiliates?” This reads like something out of the L. Ron Hubbard vocabularly – Dianetics – Change Your Life!

    Those fellow Republican’s need to really grow real ones. LOL

    If what you mean by “real ones” refers to actual cognitive functions, then you should spend less time worrying about us, and more time worrying about how you’re not going to end up under the bridge sometime in the near future.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  66. I am a registered Republican,

    And this proves – what, exactly? As if we already don’t know what’s coming next.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  67. Proud Military Joe —

    Despite the political bashing that’s been going on…as a pissed off (undecided) Independent I completely agree with Senator Obama’s statement that the American public needs to see who will be inheriting this mess.
    — Yeah, we’ve barely had a chance to get to know these guys over the — what is the amount of time that Obama cites EVERY SINGLE DAY again? Oh yeah, 19 months.

    Lets Cut the CRAP and admit Both men are Not economic professionals and do not have the answer.
    — WHO said that they do? They are 2 of the 535 members of Congress, ALL of whom are responsible for enacting legislation that addresses economic crises.

    I applaud Mcain’s service, and spirit that this is a priority but if he had really cared about the situation, he would’ve done his “campaign pause” oh say much earlier as this debacle unfolded.
    — So it’s bad that he is suspending his campaign, AND he should have done it sooner? I would applaud if you would stop mangling his name, as well as making up your mind.

    Wouldn’t you say the timing is suspicious??
    — Yeah! I think W manufactured this situation just so that McCain could ride in on a white horse and save the day. In which case, we can stop worrying because it’s all been worked out.

    Neither one has the answers, I belive Mcains reasons are political only as we all know …. to Let the Experts fix the problem.
    — A politician who acts like a leader? How political. And these experts are WHO?

    Icy Truth (d2ca3b)

  68. Dmac – I am worried about that. Real worried homie! And why would I be worried about you or “us” as you put it? I’m not in a fight.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  69. I had a tea spill incident on my keyboard today…

    Caught you Sam, Real Rethuglicans don’t drink tea.

    Old Coot (2f3a50)

  70. “Availability of credit depends on assurance of repayment. People with money are unwilling to lend it now because the people that need it to operate cannot assure the lenders that they are solvent and will be able to pay it back.”

    There is no shortage of money to lend. Period.

    Go try.

    “When those businesses needing credit to operate can’t get it — they go out of business.”

    Cry me a river. How about savings. You ever think about that.

    “Lots of public pension plan money is invested in financial institutions and through investment houses. If the balance sheets of those businesses cause them to go belly up, those pension plans will simply be another creditor listed on the bankruptcy petitions.”

    They gambled and lost and now want me to bail them out. I’ll pass. Next time be a little more careful who you trust with your money.

    Hint. No one.

    You up for that?

    Yes. Bring it on.

    jharp (f4bed7)

  71. Its funny to see no one tried challenging the issue I presented
    .
    Because you’re just a liar (claiming to be a “registered Republican”) spewing a series of Democratic Party propaganda points.
    .

    Mccain’s going to Washington in reguards to this bail out to remind the senate that, “The fundamentals of our economy are strong”? Seriously, right now, all of America is actually thinking just what is it you think your going to be able to do by this move knowing that you already don’t know what your doing when it comes to the economy as he has said in his own words. Its all a stunt and a ploy.

    .
    But even if McCain’s suspension and trip to DC is just a stunt and a ploy, it’s a stunt and ploy that Candidate (nee Senator) Obama is stuck dealing with. Like it or not, their actions and reactions are now points of comparison. Talk is cheap, get in the Senate, debate statutory language, and vote. If Obama’s so darn smart, he’ll shine in that venue.

    cboldt (3d73dd)

  72. Dmac – I am a registered Republican,

    “And this proves – what, exactly? As if we already don’t know what’s coming next.”

    Read post before you response. As I said, it was towards a particular poster’s response about what he was. Not to randomly blab out a badge. Thanks for your participation though.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  73. Old coot – LOL. Now that’s a good laugh. LOL. Thank you for that. LOL.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  74. DRJ – Where are all of these asshat trolls linking from?

    JD (a248f3)

  75. So, now BHO is agreeing with the man who is responsible for all of this, namely GW Bush, that BHO should come to the White House?

    Are you serious? BHO is taking direction from W? In what universe is this not the height of hypocrisy and duplicity?

    Read this again….BHO is going to the White House at the behest of the man he personally blames for nearly every ill of the past eight years.

    But, he wouldn’t acknowledge the wisdom of such a meeting from a Senator who was genuinely a part of the reform movement to reign in FM and FM?

    BHO is a national disgrace.

    Ed (f35a20)

  76. Scott B:
    It was Clinton and special legislation that allowed unqualified buyers the means to buy homes. Poor people. Living beyond their means. That’s the Democratic dream. We’re paying for it. This is it.

    And did you know: one of Obama’s biggest groups for campaign money and backing is Wall Street? Their money you so despise is being bundled to get this prop in office.

    Obama will always have Tony Rezko to thank for his comfy home. Tony also raised a quarter of a million dollars to start Obama on his political career. And the great Emil Jones should get his due credit: “I’m gonna make me a U.S. Senator.”

    Don’t forget Obama-buddy William Ayers — who would probably advise both candidates to bomb the whole damn thing and be done with it. Wait till that whack job gets a Cabinet position, huh ?

    Frankly, Barack Hussein Obama needs a map to get to the Senate. He hardly knows the place. The absolute truth.

    “I’m gonna make me a U.S. Senator!”

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  77. cboldt – LOL. I’m am in no means interested in Democratic Propaganda. LOL. And I actually have nothing in common with Barrack Obama accept that my mom’s white and my dad’s black too. LOL.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  78. Politically tone deaf? This is yet another smoke and mirrors tactic out of the right. McCain’s behavior in the last weeks has proven that he is unfit for office. I suspect he is trying to buy time to create some other unrelated-to-the-issues noise to keep the American people sufficiently distracted thereby keeping their attention on tabloid politics rather than scrutinizing the ticket.

    Face it. The republican machine has come off the skids. Trick-down economics is now undeniably proven not to be a failure and has instead turned out to be trickle-down welfare; let’s call it what it is.

    McCain and Palin both appear to be unprepared to lead and unable to articulate ideas sufficiently to not look stupid; forget about earning a vote from an American who actually pays attention to the meat of the matters. McCain is simply a dangerous choice given this nation’s challenges. Nevermind the fact that M-P advisors are the Bush advisors. I’m unclear how anyone thinks a vote for M-P could possibly be a good decision. McCain’s behind-the-eightball and I’m-lost-in-the-woods performances locked it – the whining is incredibly annoying to boot.

    jonathan (ba6106)

  79. SPQR – Thanks for posting that link. Pelosi is a tard and I wish she could be replaced.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  80. “I’m unclear how anyone thinks a vote for M-P could possibly be a good decision.”
    I’m unclear how someone can type such a vapid load of political talking points and baseless assertions backed with so little facts or substance to support any aforementioned packaged statements. Is this some kind of junior high school writing assignment or are you getting marching orders from someone with a piece of paper ordering you, “type!”?

    Jack Klompus (b0e238)

  81. Does anyone think that this is anything other than a cynical ploy to attract the media spotlight away from McCain’s numerous fumbles on the economy from last week? McCain, self-described ignoramus on the economy, suddenly is flying to Washington to compel the congress, who is moving deliberately and carefully forward on one of the most important legislative decision of this last 8 years, to hammer out an agreement by FRIDAY? This is both cynical and irresponsible. Much like a McCain presidency would be. Mr. McCain goes back to Washington – cynical move to focus the news coverage on McCain’s “character” and not on the fact that it is Republican economic policies, particularly towards deregulation and the so-called “ownership society” championed by George Bush and others (which McCain has consistently championed his entire career) that have led us to this economic precipice in the first place.

    McCain going to DC to “help” is like having the guy who set fire to your house on the Fire Brigade.

    How many of his own principles does this guy have to disgrace inorder for every one to wake up and smell the B.S.?

    Jish (55cc30)

  82. #55 – Tim

    I am getting really sick of the Republicans taking advantage of a bad situation. But that’s what they do best, isn’t it? McCain looks like a saint for slithering away from the debates like a scared little girl.
    — That’s a pretty good trick: being a saint and a scared little girl simultaneously. Oh, but the great unwashed only sees the former, not the latter; right? Only those in the know — like you — are aware of the whole story.

    I think DC can get by without you, John McCain. Meanwhile, Obama looks bad to do something as frivilous as have this scheduled debate for oh, just the leader of the free world that everyone has been dyin to see as Obama will kick ass. Shame Shame Shame!
    — Obama could follow McCain’s lead. He might as well get used to it now . . . soon enough it will be an everyday thing.

    And how they took Hillary’s misfortune and had to trump it with what could be the final nail in the USA’s coffin: Sarah Palin
    — The final nail in the USA’s coffin. I thought that was Cheney . . . or Quayle . . . or that evil former CIA Director.

    How they can sleep at night is beyond me. Be a patriot. Vote Democrat or you are really against the salvation of this great place.
    — In order to be patriotic we must vote Democrat? Yuck Fou.

    Icy Truth (225b9d)

  83. keep the fox away from the henhouse! mccain keating five…..they dont need a crook to help fix the mess he was involved in!

    karen (46aac6)

  84. In order to be patriotic we must vote Democrat?
    .
    That’s only part of it. You also need to pay higher taxes and volunteer more of your time to government-approved charity work (n.b., church work does not count, see separation of church and state)
    .
    If you don’t do that, you’re not only unpatriotic, you’re racist.

    cboldt (3d73dd)

  85. You there. Above. Barack Obama and his media treated Hillary horribly. He treated Bill Clinton like shit with that racist nonsense souffle he whipped up to guilt out a bunch of votes. It worked. Someone’s ridiculous mention above about po’ Hillary’ s mistreatment is LUDICROUS. The media and the DNC should be ashamed. I’m thoroughly enjoying Bill’s media rounds this week because that poor, poor Obama. Payback’s a bitch.

    Why do people on this board vote for McCain Palin? What you say is bad is 1 trillion times superior to the dreck sitting on the Dem ticket. Obama is dangerous. Look at his past. Look at his associates. His actions; his method to climb the ladder. He is political scum, making others look angelic in comparison.

    He is NOT a uniter. He is a proven racist black radical without the trademark fro. Take that to the bank should this clown break in to the Oval Office in November.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  86. Scott B:

    “It was Clinton and special legislation that allowed unqualified buyers the means to buy homes. Poor people. Living beyond their means. That’s the Democratic dream. We’re paying for it. This is it.” – I agree with you on this point!!!!! Totally true.

    “And did you know: one of Obama’s biggest groups for campaign money and backing is Wall Street? Their money you so despise is being bundled to get this prop in office.” Not so much on this point.

    “Obama will always have Tony Rezko to thank for his comfy home. Tony also raised a quarter of a million dollars to start Obama on his political career. And the great Emil Jones should get his due credit: “I’m gonna make me a U.S. Senator.” Not so much on this point either, including that every politician is in office because of their relationships with business folks with money and connections. Every Politician!

    “Don’t forget Obama-buddy William Ayers — who would probably advise both candidates to bomb the whole damn thing and be done with it. Wait till that whack job gets a Cabinet position, huh ? ” Agree here too. The economy crashing only works out for Obama’s advantage, so I feel he’d prefer it happen to guarantee his win. This whole issue though still shows Washington’s love of passing the buck and blame and who else should do what besides me.

    “Frankly, Barack Hussein Obama needs a map to get to the Senate. He hardly knows the place. The absolute truth.” Disliking a person is not a reason to mispronounce his name. LOL

    This is amazing, how a National situation is being based on the Presidential candidates running for office. No one wants to move until Obama and Mccain move. Unbelievable. Will Washington just do what’s right for American’s and stop thinking about votes. — Stating this after just listening to George Bush speak.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  87. So, Sam, if your daddy is black and your mom is white, well, son, you’re qualified to run for President on the Democrat ticket. Call Bill Ayres and tell him you’ve got the right stuff.

    BTW, do you have any experience as a “community organizer?” It’s not a deal breaker, but it does count for points toward an all expense paid trip to Harvard Law School.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  88. #52 – BlueShrek

    J. McCain is a hero again. LOL.
    — Can we agree that nothing is funny about this?

    What does he know about economy? how can he possibly help?
    — And by extension, the entire Congress. They should ALL stay out of it; right?

    The longer he stays away from any decision making position the better.
    — Yeah, it isn’t like he ever has to make a decision in the position he’s in now . . . like voting, and drafting legislation, and hammering out bills in committee, and telling you what a tard you are. [One of those might be a decision I made.]

    I think his move is an excuse to avoid meeting Obama when it is becoming more obvious how the Republican fat cats screwed us up.
    — Excuses are the provence of the other side.

    Icy Truth (225b9d)

  89. Ropelight – LOL. Is that all it takes to qualify? Does the job entail me doing any actual work? LOL. What if my daddy was a Texas oil man or a Mass. liquor bootlegger like Kennedy? Or if I star in some Hollywood Western movies like Regan, can I qualify then too? LOL.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  90. McSame is a joke! If elected president, will he continue to pull these stunts? It’s very likely McCain will want to suspend the presidency each time a crisis arises because McSame cannot multitask. He’s unpredictable and very scary. I don’t trust him. Obama is genuine and cares about all Americans. McCain cares only about the wealthy and lobbyists. NONE of my friends or coworkers in conservative Texas are voting for McCain. We can see through his lies.

    Obama/Biden ’08! The Intelligent choice.

    No Palin for Me! (eaedce)

  91. Not so much on this point.”

    Well, it’s a common campaign fact. They’re there for Obama. One of the core groups is Wall Street. It’s essentially here nor there, except when you all moan about money, wealth and fairness, right before clicking over to HuffPo where that woman and her circle of Dem cronies are absolutely over-the-top loaded filthy rich.

    Wealth IS NOT PARTY SPECIFIC. The DNC wants to rule through numbers, not help the poor. Numbers equal votes. The GOP wants you to achieve and live a better life with more financial growth, a means to do it your way. You are less a ‘dependent’ on the government with the Republican ticket creating business incentives. Unfortunately, the GOP wants that cheap labor – – as does the Democratic party.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  92. I love Obama. I am voting for him because unlike McCain he has demonstrated superior leadership skills. Palin is the biggest idiot to run on either ticket. Palin’s foreign policy experience is “I can see Russia from Alaska”.
    Let’s unite against the crooked lobbyists that run the McCain camp and take our country back by electing Obama/Biden ’08!

    McCain is evil (eaedce)

  93. I love Obama. I am voting for him because unlike McCain he has demonstrated superior leadership skills. Palin is the biggest idiot to run on either ticket. Palin’s foreign policy experience is “I can see Russia from Alaska”.
    Let’s unite against the crooked lobbyists that run the McCain camp and take our country back by electing Obama/Biden ’08!

    Say NO to McBush! (eaedce)

  94. Emil Jones should get his due credit: “I’m gonna make me a U.S. Senator.” Not so much on this point either,

    Read the link. On Emil Jones. And the legislation he stole from others to hand to Obama. Jones announced on a morning radio show his now-famous quote. Click it (@ 5:53pm).

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  95. Sam – I don’t wear badge’s, just stated three titles that fit what I am for the guy.

    Don’t try to distract from the subject by talking about keyboards or feigning hurt feelings from my ‘teeth’.

    Your statement of ‘titles that fit’ what you are is insulting to commenters on this blog, and that is because as I already stated, the religious and political affiliations of commenters are not important to those who post, comment and read here. The Non-Trolls, anyway.

    Anyone who puts forth arguments on this blog in a thoughtful, civil and interesting manner has been engaged with respect in return.

    None of the commenters or posters here would qualify someone based on useless superficial and contrived groupings. This is a place of ideas, not of identity.

    People do not believe you because your approach has been to make excuses and attempt to forge bonds by phony identifiers. You are quite lacking in ideas. Yet identity is strangely relevant to you, as though it says something.

    As for your ‘statement':

    …all of America is actually thinking just what is it you think your going to be able to do by this move knowing that you already don’t know what your doing when it comes to the economy…

    Simple Obama talking point. You highlight McCain and ridicule his abilities, seemingly in a vaccuum. Even those on this blog who dislike McCain and are honest will admit that Barack Obama possesses no leadership qualities whatsoever. They will also admit that McCain is part of a very small grouping of politicians who tried to advance more regulation in 2005. Barack Obama did no such thing.

    Yet, strange enough, you’re not interested in faulting Obama.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  96. #93 & #94 could not possibly be from an organized cut and paste political hack operation.

    Democrat strategy – Don’t think, just repeat and smear.

    You sure are proud of your ‘intelligence’.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  97. I’ll be honest with ALL of you KOZ visitors: We should be putting Obama on trial for attempting to stall the troops for his presidential goals. Unforgivable. And just to come back here to ‘ rally the troops’ online with the fake promise that his is an honest and fair campiagn. Lying scum. Sack of shit. Treason. Karma.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  98. Obama is genuine and cares about all Americans.”

    Sheep before slaughter.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  99. Jish: McCain going to DC to “help” is like having the guy who set fire to your house on the Fire Brigade.

    Your comment pretty much sums up my feelings on McCain seeking to cancel the debate.

    No reason McCain and Obama can’t be in Washington for a couple of days and then debate on Friday night, is there? Obviously that’s a bit too much for McCain to handle.

    Peter (e70d1c)

  100. “Wealth IS NOT PARTY SPECIFIC. The DNC wants to rule through numbers, not help the poor. Numbers equal votes. The GOP wants you to achieve and live a better life with more financial growth, a means to do it your way. You are less a ‘dependent’ on the government with the Republican ticket creating business incentives. Unfortunately, the GOP wants that cheap labor – – as does the Democratic party.”

    Kudos!! That’s exactly one of the reasons why I’m Republican. Democracts cripple the poor, thinking they are helping them. I think they want poor people to be dependent on the government, and not self reliant. That way they seem as saviors and feel noble. I do think as well though, that in some Republican tickets, they forget how a poor person starts a business. It takes money to start a business, which is something poor people don’t have easy access to. In order for a poor person to become more self reliant, he needs to either fall into found money, or the economy needs to be strong enough that he or she can save his pennies towards their start up or put into savings, all while still supporting themselves and their families. When the economy is not good, thats a very hard thing to do. George Bush’s trickle down theory was not a logical idea. In a perfect world, yeah. But if he would of asked every common working man or woman they would of told him, bosses and companies don’t operate on ethics and their not interested in paying employee’s more wages than they have to, even if profits are up. The people at the top of the heap are always going to grab as much as they can at the moment. If you balance the system in their way, the remnants are not going to trickle down. But what we need now in America is job growth. it’s been too many years (90’s) of more jobs being taken away than created, and for that I say we need a new idea on how to create these jobs and where there going to come from. We need a fresh take on the idea. Nothing against John Mccain in this area, but I do think he’s too old to come up with fresh ideas on this matter. He’s not too old to be President though.

    And I’m going to bed.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  101. Here’s one for Obama supporters. Luke Russert told us on TV you’re all exceptionally bright.

    Why did Obama have a complete meltdown when Palin hit the scene? Isn’t he supposed to be especially proud of his judgement and intelligence? Do you feel he was jittery in the face of a small- potatoes situation (new voice, stole his thunder, threatened his ego)… Does this worry you, should he meet Iran, Venezuela, China, No. Korea and other countries that have more political balls than Obama will ever have ? You may have a problem with his claims as opposed to his actual skills. It’s something to think about.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  102. No reason McCain and Obama can’t be in Washington for a couple of days and then debate on Friday night, is there? Obviously that’s a bit too much for McCain to handle.

    I suspect the senate would be in session past 9pm Eastern.

    Scott Jacobs (d3a6ec)

  103. Apogee – Apogee. Get a clue. Your even clueless in my explaination. And since you haven’t been paying attention…. In my time here today I have criticized Obama, Pelosi, Kennedy, Bush, Regan, the Democratic Party and pointed out the things I dislike about my own Republican Party and all of Washington D.c. And I didn’t ridicule Mccains abilities and never said that I disliked Mccain, which proves that you approach political discussions with your teeth out and LOL no they don’t hurt me or bother me. Never said I dislike Mccain or attacked him. Take a chill pill homie.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  104. Sam at #90, you qualify, no question about it. Belly up, boy, embrace your destiny. Together we can rule the unemployed. You have nothing to lose but your home and mortgage.

    Anyway, I’m sure the devil made you do all those mean-spirited and somewhat “irregular” youthful indiscretions, or as I prefer to say, “misunderstandings” that plague your rap sheet. But, don’t worry, be happy. I’ve got your back.

    Ropelight (f4b89a)

  105. Sam, drop the Republican nonsense. People here learned to read oh, back before flash cards had letters instead of sex positions.

    Vermont Neighbor (a066ed)

  106. Sam – I thought you went to bed, homie. Exactly like many other lefty commenters who troll under different names.

    Shove off to bed, or run-away. Your ‘stealth’ lefty talking points are asinine. For example –
    The people at the top of the heap are always going to grab as much as they can at the moment.

    Spoken like a true conservative, if by ‘conservative’ you mean Karl Marx.

    What your stupidity proves to anyone reading this blog is that Obama’s supporters have nothing but ridiculous platitudes about ‘fresh ideas’ that are as pathetic as the idiots in the focus groups that originated them.

    That is why they have to lie and pretend to be conservatives. They are that naive.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  107. McCain and Palin both appear to be unprepared to lead and unable to articulate ideas sufficiently to not look stupid;

    Do these Trolls even read what they post anymore? The term oxymoron has never been more apt when applied here.

    Dmac (e639cc)

  108. Sam —

    Why doesn’t John Mccain [sic] announce already, that even he himself will be voting for Barrack [sic] Obama on Nov. 4th?
    — Because, unlike you, he doesn’t lie.

    Mccain already agree’s [sic] on everything Obama has already said his stance is on the bail out [sic] issue.
    — McCain also said that he has no clearly defined stance? That’s a little hard to credit.

    And LOL at all you who think John Mccain is swooping into Washington in the wee of the night and saving America’s financial peril. LOL again. As if it rest soley [sic] on his shoulders.
    — Nobody here said that. NOBODY.

    Mccain’s going to Washington in reguards [sic] to this bail out to remind the senate [sic] that, “The fundamentals of our economy are strong”?
    — He’s going there to do his job . . . something that his opponent would do well to remember.

    Seriously, right now, all of America is actually thinking just what is it you think your [sic] going to be able to do by this move knowing that you already don’t know what your doing when it comes to the economy as he has said in his own words.
    — Something that he never said, BTW. And if he isn’t going to be able to do anything about it, none of them are.

    Its all a stunt and a ploy.
    — You’re all a punk and a goy.

    And I’m a republican christian conservative for the record.
    — And a shaky example of all three in one package. Heckuva job, Sammy.

    LOL. DRJ – I had a tea spill incident on my keyboard today and my c , v and number 0 key stopped working. In a temporary fix I remapped my keyboard so that I could assign those key commands to different keys till I get to the computer store tomorrow for a new keyboard. 😉
    — What a terrible coincidence! (>_~) By all means, come back when you have your replacement keyboard. Your posts promise to be twice as enjoyable then.

    That shows your probably one of my fellow Repubicans [sic]. When you can’t make a point on the issue, then point out their hair, color of shoes, or what type of wrist watch they’re wearing.
    — You’re a self-hating Republican, are you?

    So for now I can’t type a capitol letter “c” or “v”. But if you read my post you could know this by seeing how I spelled Mccain with no capitol c’s? LOL. And I thought not capitolizing [sic – what’s the excuse for this one?] Republican would of looked better instead of typing it “Republican christian conservative.” I did it on purpose so it looked more aesthetic for readers.
    — Give it up already! Oh, and I fixed your emoticon above, for aesthetic reasons.

    And your or you’re doesn’t do a job of debunking a persons [sic] valid thought.
    — No, your thoughts debunk themselves; the mangled spelling just ups the migraine factor associated with reading them.

    Just telling you that, so you can debate people better in the future. Not that I came for a debate.
    — Schooling DRJ, are we? Ay carumba! As for not coming here to debate — trust me, you will be thought of in a better light if you do engage in debate, as opposed to being a drop-and-run tard.

    I’m hoping for the time when my fellow Republican’s [sic] will learn to put their teeth away and learn how to make sense on the issues once again. Rush Limbaugh types need help, paranoid that the entire world and their television’s [sic] and newspaper’s [sic] are all out to get them
    — You’re just one of those “I didn’t abandon the party, the party abandoned me” types? Prove it. Announce who you are voting for.

    Icy Truth – And you prove my other protest against my own Republican Affliliates [sic], that when even when someone in your own political party thinks in opposition than the mass, then we must bully them to an ousting to make them conform.
    — I’m not a Republican, and I’m not trying to bully you or anybody else into “conforming”. I’m just pointing out where you’re wrong.

    Those fellow Republican’s need to really grow real ones. LOL
    — So grow them already.

    LOL. I’m am in no means interested in Democratic Propaganda.
    It seems to be interested in you.

    LOL. And I actually have nothing in common with Barrack Obama
    — For instance, he knows how to spell his name.

    accept [sic] that my mom’s white and my dad’s black too. LOL.
    — Is your Sunday suit really made out of sack?

    Icy Truth (ab2f41)

  109. I agree that if BO is not part of the solution he is part of the problem. Apparently this horrific economic crisis is not important to him. Wow…what a great leader he will make.

    Shame on Obama Marin County, CA (ee912f)

  110. Is anyone else wishing that the L and O keys had broken on his keyboard?

    Icy Truth (ab2f41)

  111. #100 –
    No reason McCain and Obama can’t be in Washington for a couple of days and then debate on Friday night, is there? Obviously that’s a bit too much for McCain to handle.

    Peter: I’ll handle it, Lois. I read a book about this sort of thing once.
    Brian: Are you sure it was a book? Are you sure it wasn’t nothing?
    Peter: Oh yeah.

    Icy Truth (ab2f41)

  112. McCain will be at the debate. Stop freaking out everyone. I’m all for the bailout, as long as each of the 305,252,000 legal US citizens gets back $231,000 via either interest-free loan from these companies or a big fat check within 3 years — this is our taxpayer stake in the company bailout. So what happens if these companies still go under despite the bailout? I don’t trust them at all.

    Laura (9f2ee3)

  113. Okay….how many members of congress will be ‘working’ on this bill at 9pm on Friday night? Pushing off the debate is insane. Replacing the 1st debate with the VP debate is pathetic. Let Sara Palin…attempt to speak. Maybe throw in the letter ‘g’ on the end of her words. She does not seem to be a fan of that letter.

    Anyway….if congress was not scheduled to go on vacation…for the rest of the year…there would be no need to suspend anything…well except our belief that McCain is trying to gain in the polls and take a time out from the downward spiral he has found himself in.

    God bless America…when our presidential candidtate thinks we are so incredible gullible that we cannot see through this latest stunt. Transparency Senator McCain…is that not what you have been speaking of?

    Stay away from the debate McCain and kiss Mississippi goodbye.

    Why not just send congress your thoughts from you blackberry?

    This is such a joke. McCain is going to come to Washington on his white horse (or one of his 13 cars) and save the day. How stupid do you take us for? There has been no communication from McCain (well except for many different positions) and now he will make this happen.

    Thanks but no thanks…Senator McCain.

    gina (8786d5)

  114. Icy Truth – You’re just one of those “I didn’t abandon the party, the party abandoned me” types? Prove it. Announce who you are voting for.

    Nope, I’m not that type. LOL. But actually John Mccain was in 2001 – 2006. As for who I’m voting for? Mostly likely Obama, but that’s based on issues, not personality or party bases. I would actually prefer if John Mccain step aside, and let Sarah Palin take a run for the Presidency and I hope that in the next four years, Sarah Palin can run. But pin me as trader or whatever for now. I voted Bush in both his terms. In this primary, I was actually supporting MItt Romney and my second choice was Rudy. Even though I love Huckabee there are so many other things to factor in when thinking who should be President. Sorry, I just don’t think Mccain is what we need at the present time. And I think its un-American to support a candidate just cause he’s of a certain sector. I’m thankful we live in a system that has new elections every few years!

    And now, I’m going to the Apple store to get a new keyboard. LOL. God bless.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  115. But pin me as trader or whatever for now

    It helps it you actually know how to spell the words you are attempting to use …

    JD (41e64f)

  116. It is inconceivable that one could support, in your words, George Bush, Mitt Romney, Rudy Giuliani, and Huckabee, and at the same time, think Baracky is a better choice than McCain.

    JD (41e64f)

  117. I’m wondering..considering last week McCain was for and against bailouts, that he want to fire then force a man to resign (since that position cannot be fired) as the fall guy...that he didn’t know the SPIC from the SIPC and that he champions both deregulation and more regulation.. That the economy was fundamentally strong later changed to that we faced the worse financial crisis since WWII—That in the end, he decided the chairman of the FEC should go instead of the chairman of the SEC–

    what does such a brainiac lend to any negotiations in Washington? Brief time outs for laughing or crying?

    queenbeethatsme9 (e5f100)

  118. JD- As the Clinton’s have been saying, “it’s the economy stupid!” If Romney had won the nominee he would be getting my full vote.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  119. I’m thinking it would be a great idea for Palin to show up at her debate holding Trig, wearing moose antlers on her head and a pageant sash across her chest. Trifecta. Faux tolerant intellectual elite lefty heads explode. Bidem’s teeth fall out along with his hair plugs.

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  120. I wish people would actually print what is going on rather than their opinion of the events. BO did not say he wasn’t going to Washington or that he was not going to deal with the issue he is stating “hey I can do that and still have the debate”. We mothers are always juggling 3-4 things at a time…. Finally a man who is willing to try and do the same. And those oposing his candidacy ready to jump and point. “Hey he isn’t doing what we think he should do”. “Lets let the world know and confuse them and add some rhetoric in there about his non cooperation”. Stop wasting our time with your views and give us the facts. Let us use our brains and judgement. We Americans do have those you know..

    lupe (d60ef3)

  121. I spent two hours reading all these comments and I’m so sick of all the things being said about both men. At the end of the day we all will go in and vote for who we want. I believe Obama will win and all that negative some of you have said will have to be eaten by you. This “color thing” is the bottom line and why we as a country can’t get where we should be. This is America made up of immigrants’. To be world leaders we let it go. If Obama had looked more like his mother there would be no issue. Look beyond color America, we have to be better than that.

    mamaC (0478b4)

  122. gina —

    God bless America…when our presidential candidtate thinks we are so incredible gullible that we cannot see through this latest stunt.
    — Official liberal buzzword of the day: stunt.

    Doing HIS JOB is a stunt.

    Stay away from the debate McCain and kiss Mississippi goodbye.
    — You ARE kidding; right? Most recent DailyKos poll: McCain 52% Obama 39%. Over the past two months McCain’s lead has increased from 6 to 13 points. If you can’t trust DailyKos, who can you trust?

    McCain is going to come to Washington on his white horse (or one of his 13 cars) and save the day. How stupid do you take us for?
    — Well, if you thought I was being serious rather than sarcastic with that “white horse” comment, then you can probably answer your own question.

    Icy Truth (3a3033)

  123. #121 – loopy (aka queenbeethatsme9)

    Stop wasting our time with your views and give us the facts. Let us use our brains and judgement. We Americans do have those you know..
    — This isn’t a news site. Do you need someone to define “pontifications” for you?

    Icy Truth (3a3033)

  124. mamaC —

    If Obama had looked more like his mother there would be no issue. Look beyond color America, we have to be better than that.
    — You’re preaching to the wrong crowd here. If you want America to look beyond color, start with the race-card-playing-at-the-drop-of-a-hat Democratic Party.

    Icy Truth (3a3033)

  125. I have to hand it to the republicans they are so good at manipulating these situations. Do i buy it? No, its total BS and is another attempt to distract the American people from the real issues. But I have to say Republicans are so much better at running these campaigns than democrats. That is why they were victorious in 2000, 2004 and will be again. The Democrats have way too much faith in the American people’s ability to see through this nonsense.

    mg1 (ce4221)

  126. I have to agree.

    If he makes a misstatement, he will not have any misstatements from McCain to hide behind.

    Michael Ejercito (a757fd)

  127. Sam –

    Nope, I’m not that type. LOL. But actually John Mccain was in 2001 – 2006.
    — With all due respect, that’s two-dimensional thinking. Either he’s with the party or he’s against it?

    As for who I’m voting for? Mostly likely Obama, but that’s based on issues, not personality or party bases.
    — If you are voting for that Socialist based on issues, then compared to McCain you are miles away from the GOP platform as well as conservatism.

    I would actually prefer if John Mccain step aside, and let Sarah Palin take a run for the Presidency and I hope that in the next four years, Sarah Palin can run.
    — And she’s even MORE diametrically opposed to Obama. With each sentence you write, you more clearly ID yourself as a Moby.

    But pin me as trader or whatever for now.
    — What did you trade against, the proper use of the word “traitor”? [Gonna try the broken keyboard defense on this one too?]

    I voted Bush in both his terms. In this primary, I was actually supporting MItt Romney and my second choice was Rudy. Even though I love Huckabee there are so many other things to factor in when thinking who should be President.
    — Who is closer to any of them in political philosophy and stance on the issues: McCain or Obama? Be honest with yourself (we’ll work on you being honest with us later).

    Sorry, I just don’t think Mccain is what we need at the present time.
    — You couldn’t possibly be more wrong.

    And I think its un-American to support a candidate just cause he’s of a certain sector.
    — The “sector” being where they are on the political compass? Sorry, but most of us tend to vote for the person who comes closest to sharing our belief in what is the best way for us to live and interact.

    I’m thankful we live in a system that has new elections every few years!
    — As are we all.

    And now, I’m going to the Apple store to get a new keyboard. LOL. God bless.
    — If you’re actually a Mac user there’s a glimmer of hope for you. Your mission, if you choose to accept it: cut out all of the LOLs, at least half of which you use at inappropriate times.

    Icy Truth (3a3033)

  128. mg1 —

    its total BS and is another attempt to distract the American people from the real issues.

    — WHY is this bailout situation not a real issue? Go!

    Icy Truth (3a3033)

  129. Icy Truth – And, LOL, again.

    “Nope, I’m not that type. LOL. But actually John Mccain was in 2001 – 2006.
    – With all due respect, that’s two-dimensional thinking. Either he’s with the party or he’s against it”

    When McCain lost the nominee to Bush in 2001, he just about left the Republican Party and wanted and in some ways tried to switch to the Democrats. In 2004, McCain was on the platform supporting Kerry. That was until it was convinced to him that it would be political suicide and then he started tossing his support behind Bush. Look that fact up. McCain really didn’t start backing Bush much until it was time for the Primary’s to come around again.

    “– Who is closer to any of them in political philosophy and stance on the issues: McCain or Obama? Be honest with yourself (we’ll work on you being honest with us later).”

    Umm let’s see.. There’s really only three issues that are swaying my vote.

    So lets count:
    1.) Mitt Romney has supported a Iraq time table withdrawl. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDKCDdevWnk)

    2.) On the issues of taxation, I know Mitt knows his business. In consideration to the candidates left, McCain knows less. And Mitt’s idea on the economy and taxation was about stimulating it and job creation, which is what Obama say’s his tax and economy plans are about. And I trust Obama on more than McCain. Simply cause McCain knows nothing about finance or the economy so he has no clue on weither or not bills he’s signing help or hurt matters. I do feel Obama approached his economy plan with job growth in mind, but not so much McCain.

    3.) Energy: To which, although, Mitt and Obama have different approaches to the matter, they are both closer to the same page at the why and what end result is, Mitt more than Obama. But note that I don’t agree 100% with any candidate or politician on the matter, cause its my opinion that hydrogen is the auto gas of the future, not natural gas, bio fuels or whatever else, and the investments need to start being made now in that before Germany takes total dominance. I don’t think any candidate has a total right idea on the matter, but Obama has the idea of reaching what the end result should be now, rather than thinking decades from now as McCain does. Mitt and Obama understand that oil dependence starts with lowering oil being our bloodline to our industry, and how a new energy source infrastructure will play a major role in new job growth. McCain says he wants car emissions to be lowered 60% by the year 2050. For me thats unacceptable. By then all BMW’s made in Germany will be hydrogen engines and they will be putting the pressure on America to convert our systems to support hydrogen cars, and the rest of the modern world will have seen how much better it is and how better it is in comparison to plug-in’s. If that happens, America plays follow the leader, rather than being the leader. This also will put America back on the map as the leader in Auto Industry. Do you know we only have one true American auto maker left? Our new energy infrastructure starts with cars, and since Obama at least has the idea to have that be so in the few years to come with the auto industry, I chose him over McCain. Obama wants to remap our Auto Industry now, while McCain doesn’t see it yet.

    On the issue of voting for someone who’s closer to my beliefs? Well thats where it gets sticky for me. I approach my presidential vote on a whole different platform than I do my state and local votes. On the state and local vote, no question I go with the candidate closer to my beliefs, such as abortion, crime, ect. But on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  130. When McCain lost the nominee to Bush in 2001, he just about left the Republican Party and wanted and in some ways tried to switch to the Democrats.
    — That’s an urban legend; not true at all.

    In 2004, McCain was on the platform supporting Kerry. That was until it was convinced to him that it would be political suicide and then he started tossing his support behind Bush. Look that fact up.
    — That’s not a fact; it’s another myth.

    McCain really didn’t start backing Bush much until it was time for the Primary’s [sic – your new keyboard is broken] to come around again.
    — So? Was he not still “voting with the President” 80-90% of the time? twice as often as Obama EVER has?

    On the issues of taxation, I know Mitt knows his business. In consideration to the candidates left, McCain knows less.
    — Knows less than who? less than Obama? Here’s an LOL for you!

    And Mitt’s idea on the economy and taxation was about stimulating it and job creation, which is what Obama say’s his tax and economy plans are about.
    — And you believe him WHY? just because he said it? He’s going to significantly increase taxes on the people who provide the jobs at the same time that he puts a little bit more money in the pockets of those who spend; what do YOU think that will do for job creation?

    And I trust Obama on more than McCain.
    — That’s your first mistake.

    Simply cause [sic] McCain knows nothing about finance or the economy so he has no clue on weither [sic] or not bills he’s signing help or hurt matters.
    — That’s right. TWENTY-SIX YEARS in Congress voting on finance and taxation bills, and he knows nothing. However, your learning curve for parroting the non-Republican non-conservative talking points has been much smoother.

    I do feel Obama approached his economy plan with job growth in mind, but not so much McCain.
    — With every sentence you give a little more away. There is this http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/jobsforamerica/ I wonder if it has anything to do with job growth?

    I don’t agree 100% with any candidate or politician on the matter
    — We aren’t voting to convey sainthood upon someone. We’re looking for GOOD, not PERFECTION.

    I don’t think any candidate has a total right idea on the matter, but Obama has the idea of reaching what the end result should be now, rather than thinking decades from now as McCain does.
    — Obama is promising a quick fix for a long-term problem.

    Do you know we only have one true American auto maker left?
    — Did Ford and GM merge?

    Obama wants to remap our Auto Industry now
    — True. He does want to tell them what to do . . . a solid conservative principle, that.

    On the issue of voting for someone who’s closer to my beliefs? Well thats where it gets sticky for me. I approach my presidential vote on a whole different platform than I do my state and local votes.
    — You put your beliefs on hold? on the back burner? in a Hope Chest?

    On the state and local vote, no question I go with the candidate closer to my beliefs, such as abortion, crime, ect. [sic]
    — I would venture to say that MOST voters do exactly the reverse.

    But on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.
    — Yeah, it’s a trippy scene, man. Why you would think that a candidate who DOES NOT represent your beliefs would be better for the nation is a little fuzzy. Are you questioning John McCain’s stance on the issues? or your own?

    Icy Truth (2c3adb)

  131. When McCain lost the nominee to Bush in 2001, he just about left the Republican Party and wanted and in some ways tried to switch to the Democrats.
    — That’s an urban legend; not true at all.

    In 2004, McCain was on the platform supporting Kerry. That was until it was convinced to him that it would be political suicide and then he started tossing his support behind Bush. Look that fact up.
    — That’s not a fact; it’s another myth.

    McCain really didn’t start backing Bush much until it was time for the Primary’s [sic – your new keyboard is broken] to come around again.
    — So? Was he not still “voting with the President” 80-90% of the time? twice as often as Obama EVER has?

    On the issues of taxation, I know Mitt knows his business. In consideration to the candidates left, McCain knows less.
    — Knows less than who? less than Obama? Here’s an LOL for you!

    And Mitt’s idea on the economy and taxation was about stimulating it and job creation, which is what Obama say’s his tax and economy plans are about.
    — And you believe him WHY? just because he said it? He’s going to significantly increase taxes on the people who provide the jobs at the same time that he puts a little bit more money in the pockets of those who spend; what do YOU think that will do for job creation?

    And I trust Obama on more than McCain.
    — That’s your first mistake.

    Simply cause [sic] McCain knows nothing about finance or the economy so he has no clue on weither [sic] or not bills he’s signing help or hurt matters.
    — That’s right. TWENTY-SIX YEARS in Congress voting on finance and taxation bills, and he knows nothing. However, your learning curve for parroting the non-Republican non-conservative talking points has been much smoother.

    I do feel Obama approached his economy plan with job growth in mind, but not so much McCain.
    — With every sentence you give a little more away. There is this page at John McCain’s website: (johnmccain.com/Issues/jobsforamerica/) I wonder if it has anything to do with job growth?

    I don’t agree 100% with any candidate or politician on the matter
    — We aren’t voting to convey sainthood upon someone. We’re looking for GOOD, not PERFECTION.

    I don’t think any candidate has a total right idea on the matter, but Obama has the idea of reaching what the end result should be now, rather than thinking decades from now as McCain does.
    — Obama is promising a quick fix for a long-term problem.

    Do you know we only have one true American auto maker left?
    — Did Ford and GM merge?

    Obama wants to remap our Auto Industry now
    — True. He does want to tell them what to do . . . a solid conservative principle, that.

    On the issue of voting for someone who’s closer to my beliefs? Well thats where it gets sticky for me. I approach my presidential vote on a whole different platform than I do my state and local votes.
    — You put your beliefs on hold? on the back burner? in a Hope Chest?

    On the state and local vote, no question I go with the candidate closer to my beliefs, such as abortion, crime, ect. [sic]
    — I would venture to say that MOST voters do exactly the reverse.

    But on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.
    — Yeah, it’s a trippy scene, man. Why you would think that a candidate who DOES NOT represent your beliefs would be better for the nation is a little fuzzy. Are you questioning John McCain’s stance on the issues? or your own?

    Icy Truth (2c3adb)

  132. I really don’t give these out and never intended this turning into a dissertation.

    “When McCain lost the nominee to Bush in 2001, he just about left the Republican Party and wanted and in some ways tried to switch to the Democrats.

    – That’s an urban legend; not true at all.

    In 2004, McCain was on the platform supporting Kerry. That was until it was convinced to him that it would be political suicide and then he started tossing his support behind Bush. Look that fact up.
    
– That’s not a fact; it’s another myth.

    McCain really didn’t start backing Bush much until it was time for the Primary’s [sic – your new keyboard is broken] to come around again.

    – So? Was he not still “voting with the President” 80-90% of the time? twice as often as Obama EVER has?

    On the issues of taxation, I know Mitt knows his business. In consideration to the candidates left, McCain knows less.

    – Knows less than who? less than Obama? Here’s an LOL for you!”

    These should answer all those rhetoric rants.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7m3jPijnI8 – Mitt Romney on all the questions you pose.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkcVXIhssCI&feature=related – McCain, fill in the blanks.

    “And I trust Obama on more than McCain.
    
– That’s your first mistake.”
    You can’t deny that hardly anyone trust McCain, even the vast of Republicans. It’s why most conservatives thought of not voting this year. LOL. So I’m not on a “Alone Boat” here. The Democrats in congress probably trust McCain more then Republicans.

    “That’s right. TWENTY-SIX YEARS in Congress voting on finance and taxation bills, and he knows nothing. However, your learning curve for parroting the non-Republican non-conservative talking points has been much smoother.”
    And after two decades, John McCain says, “the fundamentals of our economy are still strong.” So, what has his “TWENTY-SIX YEARS in Congress voting on finance and taxation bills,” taught him? Sorry, but his experience in reference to now doesn’t instill any confidence in him for me. But I’m sure he’ll disappoint, while trying to shine the knob of the conservative base. The point, in a democracy is you have to lend a chance to non-conservatives if the solutions we’ve tried haven’t worked. This is where I fall into bad standings with my Republican mates. To think one party has all the answers is very shallow. I mean, America did pretty well as a country leading up to 1854′. But I’m sure you’ll argue with me on just what the definition of democracy is.

    “– With every sentence you give a little more away. There is this page at John McCain’s website: (johnmccain.com/Issues/jobsforamerica/) I wonder if it has anything to do with job growth?”
    If I already can’t trust McCain on understanding the state of the economy right now, you think I would believe his understanding on job growth and weither or not he can approach an economic plan with a strong understanding of it in mind?

    “– We aren’t voting to convey sainthood upon someone. We’re looking for GOOD, not PERFECTION.”
    Exactly, That’s why on energy my vote is towards one who will put a urgency on it, not one that is interested in doing exactly with energy what my belief is, ie. Hyrdogen cars, which is what your answer was in response to. Energy.

    “– Obama is promising a quick fix for a long-term problem.”
    LOL, Nope. Just as Mitt Romney has said, and so many others have said we need to do…. approach it with the urgency the energy matter needs. In contrast, McCain is thinking “QUICK FIX” by suggesting more drilling, but our cars be lowered in emissions 60% in 40 yrs. Drilling more is his quick fix, and doing less in the more efficient category is not approaching the matter seriously. Your doing a good job of trying to reach here, but even Mitt Romney said we need to approach our energy matter with a “Manhatten Project” and “We’re going to put a man on the moon” mentality.

    “We need to initiate a bold, far-reaching research initiative – an energy revolution – that will be our generation’s equivalent of the Manhattan Project or the mission to the moon. It will be a mission to create new, economical sources of clean energy and clean ways to use the sources we have now. … It will be good for our national defense, it will be good for our foreign policy, and it will be good for our economy.”
    Romney, Gov. Mitt, “Rising To A New Generation Of Global Challenges,” Foreign Affairs (July/August 2007)

    “– Did Ford and GM merge?”
    The majority of Ford’s engineers and high level job employees are Swedish or foreigners, even its CEO up till a few years ago, while it still lets American workers go. Only thing left for them to do is turn over their shares, which I see shortly happening, unless our Auto Industry gets its change. Ford already can’t compete.

    “– True. He does want to tell them what to do . . . a solid conservative principle, that.”
    LOL. Please. GM is already asking and has been asking the government for money for how many years now, and to the toll of how much? The point here is to give GM an alloted amount of money and work together in developing alternative engines in a industry retooling. The same principle Mr. Romney wanted to invite.
    Mitt Romney- “in my first 100 days, I will roll up my sleeves, and I will personally bring together industry, labor, Congressional and state leaders to develop a plan to rebuild America’s automotive leadership.” http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/14/romney-addresses-a-car-industry-that-has-changed/

    “On the issue of voting for someone who’s closer to my beliefs? Well thats where it gets sticky for me. I approach my presidential vote on a whole different platform than I do my state and local votes.
    
– You put your beliefs on hold? on the back burner? in a Hope Chest?”
    on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.

    If your going to try doing that.. try using the whole remark in its entire meaning. Thanks. :-)

    “On the state and local vote, no question I go with the candidate closer to my beliefs, such as abortion, crime, ect. [sic]

    – I would venture to say that MOST voters do exactly the reverse.”
    So you too put your beliefs on the back burner? And your also saying you only want a Republican President, but Democrats are okay to be Mayors and Governors. LOL! I guess this makes you brighter than me. Next time I take a trip to the twilight zone I’ll come to that understanding. I guess.

    “Are you questioning John McCain’s stance on the issues? or your own?”
    I think it’s time YOU start to question McCains stance on the issues. It also sounds like you need to revisit where you yourself stand on the issues as well.

    I supported Romney, but I think for myself. And just because Romney put his support behind McCain, didn’t mean I was going to. If you want me to make that journey, try convincing me.

    Sam (7e6f35)

  133. You can’t deny that hardly anyone trust McCain, even the vast of Republicans.
    — Yes we I can.

    It’s why most conservatives thought of not voting this year.
    — Untrue.

    LOL. So I’m not on a “Alone Boat” here. The Democrats in congress probably trust McCain more then Republicans.
    — Not true. Refer to the parrot “jharp” (“McCain voted withBush 90% of the time”; repeat ad nauseum).

    I’m sure he’ll disappoint, while trying to shine the knob of the conservative base.
    — Now is that something that a good Christian conservative Republican would say? You’re drifting off-script.

    The point, in a democracy is you have to lend a chance to non-conservatives if the solutions we’ve tried haven’t worked.
    — We “have to”? Sorry, no.

    To think one party has all the answers is very shallow.
    — Not “all” the answers; better ones.

    I mean, America did pretty well as a country leading up to 1854′. But I’m sure you’ll argue with me on just what the definition of democracy is.
    — The point being that prior to the formation of the modern Republican Party there were no political conservatives? Silly.

    If I already can’t trust McCain on understanding the state of the economy right now, you think I would believe his understanding on job growth[?]
    — In other words, you did not read his plan (perhaps you’ve never visited his website, not even once?). Ya know, if you actually do some research you might acquire a working knowledge of what the candidates want to do.

    In contrast, McCain is thinking “QUICK FIX” by suggesting more drilling
    — Straight out of Harry Reid’s speech at the Democratic National Convention. It was a lie when he said it; guess what it is now?

    The majority of Ford’s engineers and high level job employees are Swedish or foreigners,
    — Swedish people aren’t foreigners? Oh, and their presence might have something to do with the fact that Ford owns Volvo.

    GM is already asking and has been asking the government for money for how many years now, and to the toll of how much?
    — Just because they ask doesn’t mean the govt has to oblige them.

    The same principle Mr. Romney wanted to invite.
    — Romney’s campaign promise to offer a preemptive bailout to the auto industry was roundly criticized.

    on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.
    — That’s an incredibly fluid interpretation and vision of presidential duties.

    If your going to try doing that.. try using the whole remark in its entire meaning. Thanks.
    — I don’t tell you what quote to use, or when to use an apostrophe (that would be the broken key on your new keyboard). Oh, wait . . .

    So you too put your beliefs on the back burner?
    — Dogma on core issues; pragmatism on others. What’s the point of choosing a local legislator based on their position on abortion or foreign policy when more than likely they will NEVER have to deal with any bills that involve those subjects? On the national level, however — where foreign policy and the selection of federal judges is made — I want someone who shares my core beliefs.

    And your also saying you only want a Republican President, but Democrats are okay to be Mayors and Governors. LOL!
    — Not necessarily. I live in Arizona, proud home of John McCain and, shamefully, also the home of Phoenix Mayor Phil “sanctuary city” Gordon and Governor Janet “I turned a surplus into a $1 BILLION deficit” Napolitano.

    I think it’s time YOU start to question McCains stance on the issues. It also sounds like you need to revisit where you yourself stand on the issues as well.
    — Yeah . . . uh, ya see, I asked you a question. Responding with a couple of non sequiters doesn’t really get us anywhere.

    I supported Romney, but I think for myself. And just because Romney put his support behind McCain, didn’t mean I was going to. If you want me to make that journey, try convincing me.
    — Why? I’m not supporting McCain because of Romney’s endorsement.

    Icy Truth (a38535)

  134. You can’t deny that hardly anyone trust McCain, even the vast of Republicans.
    – Yes we I can.
    That’s an obvious answer. It’s why the statement was meant to address your better nature. Its obvious you live on denial lane on a lot of things.

    It’s why most conservatives thought of not voting this year.
    – Untrue
    Like this lane.

    LOL. So I’m not on a “Alone Boat” here. The Democrats in congress probably trust McCain more then Republicans.
    – Not true. Refer to the parrot “jharp” (”McCain voted withBush 90% of the time”; repeat ad nauseum).
    Look at his record from 2001. He’s ran with Democrats more than Republicans. Your right this is nauseous when you mishandle the context.

    I’m sure he’ll disappoint, while trying to shine the knob of the conservative base.
    – Now is that something that a good Christian conservative Republican would say? You’re drifting off-script.
    LOL. Now your bantering. Bush has said what kind of fowl curse words and middle finger gestures on mic and video in the past 7yrs? So, your point here is Christians don’t use words like….?

    The point, in a democracy is you have to lend a chance to non-conservatives if the solutions we’ve tried haven’t worked.
    – We “have to”? Sorry, no.
    So, how long does one keep doing the same thing as it continues to not work out? – Wait, please don’t answer that.

    To think one party has all the answers is very shallow.
    – Not “all” the answers; better ones.
    So you’d like to add, “vain” to also being shallow? And most Non-Republicans don’t like us because of……?

    I mean, America did pretty well as a country leading up to 1854′. But I’m sure you’ll argue with me on just what the definition of democracy is.
    – The point being that prior to the formation of the modern Republican Party there were no political conservatives? Silly.
    Bump.

    If I already can’t trust McCain on understanding the state of the economy right now, you think I would believe his understanding on job growth[?]
    – In other words, you did not read his plan (perhaps you’ve never visited his website, not even once?). Ya know, if you actually do some research you might acquire a working knowledge of what the candidates want to do.
    Very nice try. LOL. Yeah, I supported Romney, then hop scotched right over McCain to support Barrack Obama. That sounds like a classic move. Hey maybe I’ll go read McCain’s website now, seeing Romney has been out of the race since February. LOL. Naw, I’ve NEVER researched John McCain. Now why didn’t I think of that brilliant idea?

    In contrast, McCain is thinking “QUICK FIX” by suggesting more drilling
    – Straight out of Harry Reid’s speech at the Democratic National Convention. It was a lie when he said it; guess what it is now?
    It’s still a quick fix, and McCains quick fix. Even T. Boone Pickens says that. Its not a full solution to a bigger problem.

    The majority of Ford’s engineers and high level job employees are Swedish or foreigners,
    – Swedish people aren’t foreigners? Oh, and their presence might have something to do with the fact that Ford owns Volvo.
    No. Swedish people aren’t foreigners. I thought everyone knew that (my bad attempt at sarcasm)? Oh yeah, I vaguely remember Ford buying Volvo. Right before I stopped working for a Volvo dealership back in 2000′.

    GM is already asking and has been asking the government for money for how many years now, and to the toll of how much?
    – Just because they ask doesn’t mean the govt has to oblige them
    Agree. As well as just because they ask, doesn’t mean they should get it. But since GM has not yet (some what recently) got on the ball with new fueled engines, and given the economy right now, I don’t think its a bad idea to say, “hey GM we will help you with the cars of the future, so America can become the leaders and not the followers.” Who do you think in places like NY, or Philly, or the likes are going to be able to use a GM Volt? Everyone there parks on the street, not cozy garages. I’m hoping as the initiative for the new engines is going forward in the next few years, someone gets the nerve to speak up about Hydrogen. They are cars everyone can drive.

    on the Presidential scene I can’t help but think broader on which candidate fits best in the present time and duties as a nation and in the global scene.
    – That’s an incredibly fluid interpretation and vision of presidential duties.
    Yes, I do know they go much deeper than that, as well (former statements). Whew, your right, this does get tedious.

    If your going to try doing that.. try using the whole remark in its entire meaning. Thanks.
    – I don’t tell you what quote to use, or when to use an apostrophe (that would be the broken key on your new keyboard). Oh, wait . . .
    Oh, yeah. Cause you know us Republicans dot every, “T”, and cross every, “I”. Like knowing for certain a country has weapons of mass destruction before we go in to invade it. (Yeah, yeah, I know… spoken like a true Democrat, or Republican. However you would critique it, LOL)..(Opps, I shouldn’t of typed LOL.)

    – Dogma on core issues; pragmatism on others. What’s the point of choosing a local legislator based on their position on abortion or foreign policy when more than likely they will NEVER have to deal with any bills that involve those subjects? On the national level, however — where foreign policy and the selection of federal judges is made — I want someone who shares my core beliefs.
    Now there, we couldn’t agree more. And I’m not so happy with some of the choices Bush made of people to put on the bench. Sadly, I know this year I’m giving up that stance. I can hope Obama doesn’t disappointment too much, since at Saddleback he didn’t disappointment much. If so, I guess I’ll have to live with it. As you said, “we’re looking for GOOD not PERFECTION.”

    – Not necessarily. I live in Arizona, proud home of John McCain and, shamefully, also the home of Phoenix Mayor Phil “sanctuary city” Gordon and Governor Janet “I turned a surplus into a $1 BILLION deficit” Napolitano.
    Indeed. I can feel your pain. I live in Philadelphia and its hard to find a Republican voter any where (LOL, thats an exaggeration of course). So you can only guess how our state and city is run. Blah! I can’t wait till me and wife pack up and head for South Carolina in the near future.

    – Yeah . . . uh, ya see, I asked you a question. Responding with a couple of non sequiters doesn’t really get us anywhere.
    Makes perfect sense, but then your stuck on your side of the box. This is why I hardly get involved in debates, especially over the web. But you just seemed too special to pass up.

    – Why? I’m not supporting McCain because of Romney’s endorsement.
    Because you seemed to have a problem with me supporting Obama with the response that no one who says they are a Republican Christian Conservative would do such a thing. And for that you joined the ones that wanted to try and triumph to the notion that I couldn’t be. Which is what started this whole going back and forth in the first place. And four days after the fact…

    Sam (7e6f35)

  135. That’s an obvious answer. It’s why the statement was meant to address your better nature. Its obvious you live on denial lane on a lot of things.
    — When you assert that a majority of Republicans don’t trust McCain, it looks silly. Polls consistently show that “trust” is the number one factor voters consider when making their decision; McCain did win a few primaries this year; the people who have voted for him did so because they trust him.

    Like this lane.
    — When you throw out a non sequiter like “most conservatives thought of not voting this year,” you should expect a negative reaction. You have no proof whatsoever that what you said is actually the case. A few loudmouth idiots on the Internet is NOT representative of the party as a whole.

    Look at his record from 2001. He’s ran with Democrats more than Republicans. Your right this is nauseous when you mishandle the context.
    — That statement simply IS NOT TRUE; either prove it or retract it.

    Bush has said what kind of fowl [sic] curse words and middle finger gestures on mic and video in the past 7yrs?
    — And you approve of him doing that?

    So, how long does one keep doing the same thing as it continues to not work out? – Wait, please don’t answer that.
    — Too late; you already stuck that question mark on the end. Although, I understand why you tried to retract your inane “McCain is 4 more years of Bush” repetition.

    So you’d like to add, “vain” to also being shallow?
    — No. Republicans have their share of problems, but vanity usually isn’t one of them.

    And most Non-Republicans don’t like us because of……?
    — I don’t know. You’re the Republican here. I’m an independent; remember?

    Yeah, I supported Romney, then hop scotched right over McCain to support Barrack Obama. That sounds like a classic move.
    — If there is one thing I give Obama supporters credit for, it is the ability to correctly spell his name.

    Hey maybe I’ll go read McCain’s website now, seeing Romney has been out of the race since February. LOL.
    — It is time for you to stop slacking.

    Naw, I’ve NEVER researched John McCain. Now why didn’t I think of that brilliant idea?
    — Well then, why did you say that McCain has NO plan for job creation when he actually has a detailed plan in plain sight on his website?

    It’s still a quick fix, and McCains quick fix. Even T. Boone Pickens says that. Its not a full solution to a bigger problem.
    — And what you’re saying is still a repetition of Harry Reid’s lie. Did you watch the debate? Did you pay attention?

    I’m not so happy with some of the choices Bush made of people to put on the bench.
    — Like who? How closely do you follow federal court appointments?

    I can hope Obama doesn’t disappointment too much, since at Saddleback he didn’t disappointment much.
    — Hey, if you like him – then you like him. What is hard to credit, in light of Obama’s leftist stance on nearly every major issue, is your self-identification as a conservative.

    If so, I guess I’ll have to live with it. As you said, “we’re looking for GOOD not PERFECTION.”
    — I’m not willing to take such a risk with the next 4 to 8 years of my life.

    This is why I hardly get involved in debates, especially over the web. But you just seemed too special to pass up.
    — Gee, thanks . . . I think.

    Because you seemed to have a problem with me supporting Obama with the response that no one who says they are a Republican Christian Conservative would do such a thing.
    — Some Republicans are supporting Obama; millions of Christians are supporting him. But, political conservatives? Not so much.

    Which is what started this whole going back and forth in the first place.
    — I would be very interested to see you detail which conservative principles are important to you, AND to have you explain why you are able to accept Obama’s political positions on issues that involve those principles. You mentioned abortion before; start with that one.

    Icy Truth (feba14)

  136. Sam – Because you seemed to have a problem with me supporting Obama with the response that no one who says they are a Republican Christian Conservative would do such a thing.

    Wrong. Many people taking you to task have a problem being lied to (and poorly) by a political hack.

    You’ve been exposed as a moby troll for some time now. You contradict yourself constantly, and then blame keyboards and hurt feelings when it’s pointed out.

    That the leftist Obama supporters cannot fathom honestly stating their support of his candidacy and addressing the issues without including a phony ‘transformation’ or ‘back story’ lie illustrates perfectly the common element to both Obama and his supporters:

    Charlatans.

    Apogee (366e8b)

  137. LOL. You all are too funny. First, since its short…

    Wrong. Many people taking you to task have a problem being lied to (and poorly) by a political hack.
    -That’s just lol. First, your assuming that I have a real crazy yet, somehow logical conspiracy for saying I’m Republican. Sorry, but I’m not that paranoid. It’s funny how this comment blog has become all about me and I’ve become the, “Task.”? LOL. But I’ve rose to the challenge (I guess if that’s what the whole purpose of this is suppose to be). I’m curious though. Is the reason why I have to be debunked as a Republican Conservative because I put McCain down, or voting for Obama?

    You’ve been exposed as a moby troll for some time now. You contradict yourself constantly, and then blame keyboards and hurt feelings when it’s pointed out.
    -Another LOL on the hurt feelings. My feelings have no reason to be hurt. Did I hurt your feelings by changing my vote from Romney to Obama? I haven’t tried to hurt anyone’s feelings here, but sorry if my political opinion hurt yours. If my keyboard had feelings I’m sure it would be hurt though.

    That the leftist Obama supporters cannot fathom honestly stating their support of his candidacy and addressing the issues without including a phony ‘transformation’ or ‘back story’ lie illustrates perfectly the common element to both Obama and his supporters:
    -I’m leftist. LOL. Okay, sure. Your logic shows in that, a person would have to be from the left if they were going to support Obama, a few Republican Governors have as well though. Just something you might want to consider when thinking in assumption that way. And I guess you did miss the part of the conversation when I did indulge Icy Truth on the issues of why I support him.

    You all still think I’m on some left wing, Democratic, conspiracy. Trust me, I don’t have the energy for that and the thought of it just sounds ridiculous from my mentality. As if I’m playing Gothem villain. The only logic I could see to that is, I’m trying to infiltrate the McCain base to try and sway their votes. What your missing though is, I DON’T CARE WHO PEOPLE VOTE FOR. Everyone’s vote is their vote. It’s their own personal possession and they have the right to use it and do with it as they want. All this reaction to my response to a particular poster, who posted a response directly at me. And that “One” response to him/her, wasn’t even meant as an attack. But it sparks me getting attacked by (I lost count at how many people). Why have I typed so many, LOL’s? Simply because I don’t care about blogging, I’m not a blogger, I hardly read them, and I don’t write them. I’m not sure what goes on in these blogesphere’s, but from what I’m seeing from this uproar, I guess there is a lot of people posing themselves for diabolical purposes.

    Icy Truth – Since you chimed into this attack, the responses your comments require are just redundant. Most of the comments you continue to attempt to make have been addressed more than once, and in more than one way. It’s almost as if your ignoring. LOL.

    That’s an obvious answer. It’s why the statement was meant to address your better nature. Its obvious you live on denial lane on a lot of things.
    
– When you assert that a majority of Republicans don’t trust McCain, it looks silly. Polls consistently show that “trust” is the number one factor voters consider when making their decision; McCain did win a few primaries this year; the people who have voted for him did so because they trust him.
    –Like this redundancy… (its been addressed already. If you didn’t see it… well I won’t hold it against you.)

    Like this lane.
    
– When you throw out a non sequiter like “most conservatives thought of not voting this year,” you should expect a negative reaction. You have no proof whatsoever that what you said is actually the case. A few loudmouth idiots on the Internet is NOT representative of the party as a whole.
    –Did you just learn that phrase non sequiter? And whoops! My bad! I’m now seeing that the reason people think I’m a fraud is because I’m a suspected blogster or some sorts. Well guess what? If that’s what you folks witness around here, thats not my fault. I can only imagine what a tedious task it may be to know who’s who lurking behind a keyboard. If you thought that was true for me, I direct your attention to the comment I left for Apogee, but since you favor redundancy I’ll phrase it again. I’m not a blogger or a net troll, so no, I don’t get my information from people on the net unless its a newspaper headline I may read, which is actually how I ended up at this page. It was linked from a CNN story about McCain suspending his campaign. I saw whatever head line this blog has (the page has become too long now to even want to scroll back up to read) on that CNN page and I thought it was a news story about Obama’s response. That’s neither here nor there. If all this funk is just about blog trollers though, all I could do to disprove that is direct folks to my myspace page which I’ve had since… umm, I think 2005′. Don’t quote me on that. But the date on the comments people have left me can show that. http://www.myspace.com/brokendown_idol

    Other than that.. I got nothing else to prove. Your not getting my social security number! LOL.

    Look at his record from 2001. He’s ran with Democrats more than Republicans. Your right this is nauseous when you mishandle the context.
    
– That statement simply IS NOT TRUE; either prove it or retract it.
    –Redundant – I already posted the truth to the truth of my statements, “My Statements,” being the operative words. Maybe you avoided utilizing the links in my statements.

    Bush has said what kind of fowl [sic] curse words and middle finger gestures on mic and video in the past 7yrs?

    – And you approve of him doing that?
    –I don’t care either way. Christians say and do a lot of things. Being a Christian doesn’t make us inhuman or above its flaws, that’s what being a Christian is actually all about. Knowing we are lowly, flawed and need forgiveness and always will. Does it bother you that he’s a self proclaimed Christian doing those such things?

    So, how long does one keep doing the same thing as it continues to not work out? Wait, please don’t answer that.
    
– Too late; you already stuck that question mark on the end. Although, I understand why you tried to retract your inane “McCain is 4 more years of Bush” repetition.
    –Redundant – In the context of what I said, the question was directed at you, not McCain. I never said McCain is four more years of Bush. The question was directed at YOU personally, rather your mentality about democracy and an understanding of why I could cast a vote for someone even if he differs from my opinions. How long does one keep doing the same thing as it continues to not work out is directed at thinking our own personal ways of thinking and doing things are the only way it HAS to be. And it was about weither or not you or if anyone should allow someone a chance or an attempt to apply their logic to a matter, even if they are coming from a different mentality than your own. This is a lesson I learned from my wife. There have been plenty of times when I had to give way to how or the way I would do things and let her apply her logic, even when I don’t agree with her and even a lot of times makes no sense to me. And that took a lot of getting use to. And It wasn’t a retraction either. It was a nice way of saying, “I really don’t care about your answer to that.” :-)

    So you’d like to add, “vain” to also being shallow?

    – No. Republicans have their share of problems, but vanity usually isn’t one of them.
    –LOL. Vanity is a problem every single person on earth has and it infects every part of things we do. Everyone has their vain ways. Look at me? I’m vain in the fact that I keep showing up here to retype comments on the matter of who I really am, when in actuality It really shouldn’t matter what anyone here thinks of me.

    And most Non-Republicans don’t like us because of……?

    – I don’t know. You’re the Republican here. I’m an independent; remember?
    –“Remember.” When did you announce your Independent affiliation? If you stated it before, I read over it.

    Yeah, I supported Romney, then hop scotched right over McCain to support Barrack Obama. That sounds like a classic move.

    – If there is one thing I give Obama supporters credit for, it is the ability to correctly spell his name.
    –And is being sarcastic something people should associate people of the Independents with? I spelled three names in that sentence, which one is misspelled? Oyawna… I mean Opalma.. grr.. I mean Osama Bin Bama. Is that better? LOL.

    Hey maybe I’ll go read McCain’s website now, seeing Romney has been out of the race since February. LOL.

    – It is time for you to stop slacking.
    –Come, come now Icy Truth. With your Independent retorts, I know you recognize sarcasm when you see it. Since you like being redundant, go back over the statements you pulled that out of and relearn what sarcasm is. (not that I already don’t know you caught it the first time.)

    Naw, I’ve NEVER researched John McCain. Now why didn’t I think of that brilliant idea?
    
– Well then, why did you say that McCain has NO plan for job creation when he actually has a detailed plan in plain sight on his website?
    –Because that’s just things people say to get elected. Just like when McCain says he supports our Vets, but he voted against the G.I Reform bill. And your kidding me on the “referral of his website on jobs right? If your vote is based on the issue, have you looked at Obama’s site? On McCain’s economic web page, the only place he mentions “more job creation” is on his Energy Plan page and he only mentions “job creation,” under three instances. http://www.johnmccain.com/Issues/JobsforAmerica/energy.htm. Read how many times Obama mentions job creation on his economic page if thats your argument, and contrast the two http://www.barackobama.com/issues/economy/#invest-for-jobs . If your honest about the contrast, then you can see why one would say, McCain has NO plan for job creation, because he doesn’t really have a plan.

    It’s still a quick fix, and McCains quick fix. Even T. Boone Pickens says that. Its not a full solution to a bigger problem.

    – And what you’re saying is still a repetition of Harry Reid’s lie. Did you watch the debate? Did you pay attention?
    –Did you watch the debate? Did you pay attention? Did you not hear and see when Obama addressed McCain about the new energy bill that went to the Senate over the summer, a bill that McCain voted against, even though it included allowing off shore drilling, something McCain is for. And I never denied that I totally don’t side with the Republicans on their, “drill baby, drill,” stance. I never said I was against more drilling though. But on this issue, I’ve been this way since the mid-90’s, and it has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans. It’s my own feelings and beliefs on the matter. I always thought America should drill more, but I also know America is the #1 consumer of oil, and for me, the more important issue is changing that with new sources. Lowering our oil consumption as a nation and industry with drilling more is the only way to be independent from foreign oil AND taking control of what I believe is the new evolution in industrialization. And thats always been Obama’s stance. And I’ve been waiting since the 90’s for a politician to have the same understanding. It will create jobs that can’t be outsourced and make us the worlds exporter. Its highly important to me in this election. Germany is already establishing entire city’s running off solar power. Instead of the side of their highways being laced with advertisement billboards, they are laced with solar energy panels throughout the city, that supply solar power to the city and its residents. America needs to get on board with that kind of extreme concept or we’ll be behind and be an importer. And when me and my wife move to South Carolina, I hope it does allow its shores to be drilled for oil if there is any. And off shore drilling should be a state based issue and the state should see some individual income for it, as it is in Texas.

    I’m not so happy with some of the choices Bush made of people to put on the bench.

    – Like who? How closely do you follow federal court appointments?
    –Alito. I Love Chief Justice Roberts though, he’s been outstanding. Thank God Miers withdrew herself. “Whew.”

    I can hope Obama doesn’t disappointment too much, since at Saddleback he didn’t disappointment much.

    – Hey, if you like him – then you like him. What is hard to credit, in light of Obama’s leftist stance on nearly every major issue, is your self-identification as a conservative.
    –When did I ever say I “like” Obama? I actually said, “I have hardly anything in common with him.” My only argument here has been that he’s my better choice based on the three issues I would like to see America tackle in these next four years and where I stand on those three. And there’s always room to be disappointed by people (everyone). I voted Bush two times and my disappointments didn’t go unmatched. And thats not me saying, “Bush bad!,” There are some very good things Bush did as well. No matter who we vote for, there’s going to be some personal disappointments. With every politician, I just hope those disappoints are not too grand.

    If so, I guess I’ll have to live with it. As you said, “we’re looking for GOOD not PERFECTION.”
    
– I’m not willing to take such a risk with the next 4 to 8 years of my life.
    LOL. Aren’t you the one that said, “we’re looking for GOOD not PERFECTION?” Are you taking your own words back now? LOL!

    This is why I hardly get involved in debates, especially over the web. But you just seemed too special to pass up.

    – Gee, thanks . . . I think.
    Sure, your welcomed. LOL. Consider it as, you broke my virginity. LOL.

    Because you seemed to have a problem with me supporting Obama with the response that no one who says they are a Republican Christian Conservative would do such a thing.

    – Some Republicans are supporting Obama; millions of Christians are supporting him. But, political conservatives? Not so much.
    –I agree with you there. And I’ll also add that I would probably be the first to admit, that most you would consider the typical conservative and most typical conservatives even, wouldn’t think I was one upon first glance. But I don’t define who I am based on who they are, or where they stand on individual issues. I make that assessment of myself based on the fundamental principles. For instance; This bailout bill, a conservative would be opposed to this bill, but some conservatives will vote for it. Consider the areas where you’ll see me disagreeing with or going against a quote; “conservative stance,” unquote; in this way. The conservatives who will vote for the bailout bill are not going to not be conservatives just because they do. They will still be conservatives, and I’ll still consider them as such. There are things I don’t agree with with them on or half way agree with them on. There are also things I don’t agree with other Christians on, and other Christian Conservatives. R.J White said it nicely; “To put conservatism in a bottle with a label is like trying to liquify the atmosphere … The difficulty arises from the nature of the thing. For conservatism is less a political doctrine than a habit of mind, a mode of feeling, a way of living.” I’m conservative, because my mind tends to always fall on the conservative side of issues and thoughts, and it does so naturally. I have found that I don’t come to a conservative stance on issues based on long reasoning, but its my first thought that naturally goes that way when presented with an issue. In the spirit of democracy, I don’t disallow other trains of thought or the people with them and sometimes in a political matter you weigh the options, as in the case of this whole bailout. And its my feelings that that is what our forefathers had in mind when they created this democratic nation. Also, can I add that I’m trusting my Republican’s in office to not allow Obama to get out of hand. There’s enough of them in Washington.

    Which is what started this whole going back and forth in the first place.
    
– I would be very interested to see you detail which conservative principles are important to you, AND to have you explain why you are able to accept Obama’s political positions on issues that involve those principles. You mentioned abortion before; start with that one.
    –I thought I did that already when I covered my three issues in this election where my vote is going to, and why. Other than that, I said, “I actually hardly have anything in common with Obama,” – redundant, and that would be my third time saying it. On the things I don’t agree with him about, I’m either; 1. Not worried about them, cause I know our differences won’t have (or shouldn’t) have an effect on America, or 2. I’m trusting the Republican’s that are in Washington to not let him get out of hand. Thank God we don’t allot ultimate power to our Presidents. And I would consider all my conservative principles are important to me, maybe some (as we all do with principles) I esteem higher in certain considerations than others at the moment, perhaps. (In case that makes no sense, reconsider the conservative view on the bailout bill). I don’t think a vote for Obama is an act of ridding the country of its conservatism participation on matters. We’ll always be a country of diverse aspects, at all times. Bloomberg is an Independent Mayor of New York, and New York is doing fine and having him Mayor doesn’t mean New York is now rid of all and any conservatism. My vote for Obama is my vote for the three things I would like to see accomplished and/or start getting addressed in these four years. The same things Mitt said he planned to do. Although I’ll admit Mitt would of done them in a better way (thats just my conservative opinion). But you take what you can get.

    In case that doesn’t satisfy what you wanted from me in that question. I don’t believe in socialized government on the people, and government social programs that only enable people to dependency on the system and I worry about Obama in that regards with his political liberal views.

    Should I check back in three or four more days for anymore retort? I feel this convo has exhausted itself.

    Sam (7e6f35)


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