Patterico's Pontifications

9/2/2008

Another Example of Why Democrats Lose National Elections: Obama goes to the Abortion Card. Updated

Filed under: 2008 Election,Abortion — WLS @ 5:05 pm

Posted by WLS:

Ben Smith’s blog over at the Politico has this entry from earlier today:

A Virginia reader reports that Obama’s on the radio there with an ad hitting McCain on abortion rights.

That would be the first paid media on an issue Democrats have used in the past as a trump card but that Obama has generally placed behind economic issues in his outreach to women.

UPDATE: Another reader hears the same spot on a country station in Milwaukee, Wis. The campaign hasn’t responded to questions about it, but if you’ve got audio, send it over.

ALSO: Colorado and Iowa.

So, McCain announces a pro-life running mate who last April at the age of 44 decided to have a child who she knew in advance would be born with Down Syndrome — thereby “walking the walk” of her pro-life stance.

Now the news is filled with stories about her 17-year-old daughter being pregnant, and having the complete support and love of her family to have the child and marry the father. Again, another example of leadership on this very difficult and personal subject — and I’m guessing representing a struggle that tens of thousands of American families go through in their family lives every year.

And this is a week that Obama’s campaign decides to start airing abortion commercials??????

And this is supposed to bring him votes how?????

Update

In giving the strategy angle of this a little more thought, I couldn’t get away from the idea that on the eve of Palin’s speech, this is an incredibly bad idea on the part of the Obama campaign.  Unless…..

Unless their polling over the past 48 hours shows significant movement by female Clinton supporters towards the McCain/Palin ticket. 

Virginia, Wisconsin, Colorado, Iowa.

Battlegrounds all (Virginia not so much). 

It wouldn’t take much movement by women in these states to put Obama in serious trouble.  And he can’t win if he loses Wisconsin, Colorado and Iowa. 

Now I think the ad rollout is a sign of trouble for Obama — its meant to remind women that votes on the Supreme Court are at stake. 

Its to keep the Clinton females supporters on the team.

I smell smoke.  Something is on fire.

62 Responses to “Another Example of Why Democrats Lose National Elections: Obama goes to the Abortion Card. Updated”

  1. Here, trolly trolly trolly trolly trolly. . . .

    I DARE YOU!

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  2. I look forward to Palin explaining how women should give birth to their rapists’ children.

    That is, if she hasn’t dropped out by the debates.

    jpe (bd88bc)

  3. Teen pregnancy is nothing new. Abortion rights are abortion rights, the Palin scandal(s) notwithstanding. Something like 75% of Americans support abortion in cases of rape or incest–something Palin opposes.

    Russell (da1856)

  4. women should give birth to their rapists’ children.

    I thought you guys were all about the children? So you’re official stance is to kill the children no?

    Why is it that the child is less of a child under your circumstances? That’s what adoption is for (yes I speak for myself and my beliefs, and I denounce myself; racist!)

    Lord Nazh (ce25e3)

  5. Democrats want to be irresponsible, but at the same time feel “OK” with what they are doing. Palin threatens this feeling.

    In order to try to build some “feel good” room, they lash out (just like spoiled children) at the source of their frustrations. This will lose them moderate voters, but that is not the reason for the commercials. They see their false legitimacy eroding and it scares them.

    McCain needs to press ahead on this front. It will be brittle at first (as we see with the Palin attacks) but it will crack and shatter into a thousand pieces.

    The add is an indicator that the attack is working.

    PashaG (3de24f)

  6. I thought you guys were all about the children? So you’re official stance is to kill the children no?

    Simple question: should rape victims be allowed to abort?

    jpe (bd88bc)

  7. This is just too scummy – panic mode is now officially the MO of the Obama campaign.

    Dmac (874677)

  8. My great-aunt was raped at 17. She gave birth to a son, and 6 more children with her husband after that. Her favorite child to the day she died at 88? Her son that was the product of a rape. Why? Because he was not conceived in love and she believed because of that he needed more love than the others. Go figure. The power of love.

    Re: abortion as a result of rape, I ask, why should an innocent be required to pay the price for the crimes of a guilty parent? They did not ask to be created. Is there any other crime parents commit that we make children pay the price for?

    Dana (084de8)

  9. I ask, why should an innocent be required to pay the price for the crimes of a guilty parent?

    So, women that are raped should be forced to carry to term the children of their rapists.

    Right?

    jpe (bd88bc)

  10. jpe -

    I look forward to Palin explaining how women should give birth to their rapists’ children.

    – Six minutes; not bad. C’mere, bitch . . . time for your slap.

    That is, if she hasn’t dropped out by the debates.

    – Read this and then write it down: she is not going to drop out.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  11. And this is supposed to bring him votes how?????

    By highlighting the main difference between left and right on children.

    Obama says children are a punishment and a minority of leftists believe that. What are the words Planned Parenthood use, “byproduct of conception”.

    Most Republicans believe children are a blessing.

    Obama will not gain a lot of votes this way.

    JPE: Answer- Yes, in my opinion.

    tyree (afe523)

  12. jpe, you have to realize that in a country founded upon the respect, and sovereignty of the individual,
    no one should be forced to do anything.
    Our actions should be the result of our free will.
    If you wish to kill an un-born life, that is a decision you have to live with.

    Another Drew (dbf36d)

  13. Obama says children are a punishment and a minority of leftists believe that.

    I don’t think it’ll be tough to convince most people that forcing a woman to give birth to her rapist’s child is punishment. In fact, I don’t think it’ll take any convincing at all.

    I can appreciate the logical consistency of the position, but the post asks about public reaction, and Palin’s is just a loser on that scale.

    jpe (bd88bc)

  14. 12…and more…

    But, don’t make me a party to your actions!

    Another Drew (dbf36d)

  15. #9, before you shoot your mouth off, actually consider the questions below. I don’t throw them into the mix to just make noise. These are serious issues, life and death frankly, and they deserve more consideration than a reflexive knee-jerk snark.

    Why should an innocent be required to pay the price for the crimes of a guilty parent? They did not ask to be created. Is there any other crime parents commit that we make children pay the price for?

    Dana (084de8)

  16. If abortion is murder, then it makes sense to outlaw it in all cases save when it threatens the safety of the mother (leaving aside whether or not that will actually reduce the number of abortions). However, WLS’ post was about strategy, and the fact remains that a vast majority of Americans support abortion rights in cases of rape or incest, and Sarah Palin does not.

    Russell (da1856)

  17. jpe and russell – You speak of the Palin scandal(s). Please expand on this idea. What has Gov. Palin done that is scandalous?

    JD (5f0e11)

  18. Russell –

    WLS’ post was about strategy, and the fact remains that a vast majority of Americans support abortion rights in cases of rape or incest

    – Where do the words “rape” and “incest” appear in WLS’s post?

    I’m sorry, where was that?

    What?

    Dishrag

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  19. JD, don’t you get it? The scandal is that she chose not to abort.

    How . . . DARE she?!

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  20. Oh, so we get to cherry-pick the edges of the abortion issue now? Fine. I’ll play.

    Name me the Senator, who against a majority (approx. 78%) of Americans, says doctors must withhold treatment to any fetus/byproduct which, despite being aborted, is alive and outside the mother’s body. Said Senator worked to make this the law in a state and federally.

    You take your chances scaring folks with your fraction of a percent reality, and I’ll come back at you with mine.

    Ed (f35a20)

  21. Obama in last Thursday also spoke of making abortion safe, legal and rare. From what I can see, including supporting taxpayer funding of abortions, everything he has done is to make abortion more easily available and less costly. Why isn’t he called on his hypocrisy?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  22. Icy, you are correct, the post does not address rape or incest. I apologize for going off course in the thread but jpe’s uh, comment provoked me.

    I denounce myself.

    Dana (084de8)

  23. “Simple question: should rape victims be allowed to abort?”

    Simple question: are you an asshat or else why do you sound that way?

    Dmac (874677)

  24. Oh no, Dana! I was slamming Russell for attributing what you wrote to WLS. You’re inocent in this. Keep rockin’! :-)

    I completely understand you being provoked. Hence my pre-emptive strike in comment #1.

    I denounce myself for not making it clear that I was denouncing Russell.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  25. So jde again tries to hide his and fellow liberal one golden commandment: a “feminists” right to kill inconvenient babies behind a strawman argument.

    Less than 1/1,000,000 of 1% of abortions have anything to do with rape but “feminist” ability kill babies must not be violated. Less than 5% of current abortions have to do with medical issues and as medical advances save more and more babies along with their mothers, the lie of protecting mother’s health is being shown as a farce.

    Hence in the Democratic party, which is beholden to a small group of radical feminist who insist on this barbaric procedure, nominated a nutjob who by his own words said that he opposed a bill which would have required medical personnel to provide care to live-born babies because it might limit Roe vs. Wade.

    Got that? Roe vs. Wade must not be limited even if a few babies must be sacrificed in the process.

    LogicalUS (742bd0)

  26. I never said WLS was talking about rape or incest. He was asking why Obama is pushing this issue, and I answered. Here’s the script of the ad:

    OBAMA: I’m Barack Obama, candidate for president, and I approved this message.

    VAL BARON: As a nurse practitioner with Planned Parenthood, I know abortion is one of most difficult decisions a woman will ever make. I’m Val Baron. Let me tell you – if Roe v Wade is overturned, the lives and health of women will be put at risk. That’s why this election is so important. John McCain’s out of touch with women today. McCain wants to take away our right to choose. That’s what women need to understand. That’s how high the stakes are.

    ANNCR: As president, John McCain will make abortion illegal. McCain says quote, “I do not support Roe v. Wade. It should be overturned.” And listen to McCain’s answer on Meet the Press:

    RUSSERT: “A constitutional amendment to ban all abortions. You’re for that?”
    McCAIN: “Yes, sir.”

    AL BARON: We can’t let John McCain take away our right to choose. We can’t let him take us back.

    ANNCR: Paid for by Obama for America.

    So they’re going for the ~75% of Americans that think abortion should be legal in some circumstances.

    Russell (da1856)

  27. That’s odd Russell, as Obama has never thought of them as his constituents before. Obama always catered to the most extreme fraction of Abortion supporters in the past.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  28. Russell, you do know that the President can’t make abortions illegal don’t you?

    you don’t? sorry…next ?

    Lord Nazh (ce25e3)

  29. At last Russell makes a useful contribution to the group. The words aren’t his but that puts him in good company.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  30. Russell – Do you know the date of that Meet the Press interview?

    daleyrocks (d9ec17)

  31. “In giving the strategy angle of this a little more thought, I couldn’t get away from the idea that on the eve of Palin’s speech, this is an incredibly bad idea on the part of the Obama campaign. ”

    Palin is extremely anti-choice. That’s her weakness — that’s not a popular opinion.

    kirby (76ee1f)

  32. Lord Nazh —

    Russell, you do know that the President can’t make abortions illegal don’t you?

    – Don’t blame Russell for that one (although I’m sure he shares the sentiment); the authors of that Obama ad are the liars here.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  33. Baracky thinks children are a burden, a punishment. Botched abortion? Don’t you dare try to save that baby.

    JD (5f0e11)

  34. Kirby, if that issue were at, or even near the top of most voters’s list of concerns, it would be a problem. But it isn’t. Obama is wasting his money in a desperation move to keep Hillary supporters — most of whom are going to vote for him anyway — from straying.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  35. kirby – What role does the Vice President play in abortion politics?

    JD (5f0e11)

  36. Loving that evangelical outreach!

    mark (a526a4)

  37. “kirby – What role does the Vice President play in abortion politics?”

    We don’t know what role Palin will play as VP yet. Maybe they’ve told her in the last month. But she may be president one day too.

    I hope we’re not a the level where people are saying that VP’s views on things don’t matter, are we?

    kirby (fd73f6)

  38. #31

    Palin is extremely anti-choice. That’s her weakness — that’s not a popular opinion.

    And you know this how, exactly?

    As I mentioned earlier in a dead thread, for a woman so hell bent on forcing her will upon others bodies, I find it odd that she refused to deny benefits to same sex couples in Alaska, when she had the opportunity to go along with the legislative majority in her state to do so.

    EW1(SG) (ae500e)

  39. kirby, you don’t seem to understand that the VP has zero power to change abortion law.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  40. Kirby -

    We don’t know what role Palin will play as VP yet.

    – Take a bold leap and believe that she will not be selecting justices for the SCOTUS.

    I hope we’re not a the level where people are saying that VP’s views on things don’t matter, are we?

    – Not one person here has EVER said that.

    Icy Truth (80b4e7)

  41. “And you know this how, exactly?”

    That its unpopular? From polls. That its her position? from her statements while running for governor.

    “Take a bold leap and believe that she will not be selecting justices for the SCOTUS.”

    Of course very little is ultimately the VP’s decision constitutionally. But as we’ve seen lately, VPs can take on projects within administrations and impact policy. I’m not so ready to be dismissive of her having a role in mccain’s administration — she is his ‘soulmate.’

    kirby (72206b)

  42. It happens to be my position as well, although not quite as inelegantly stated as you hawk it out.

    It also happens that I am not sending squads of goons about to force my beliefs or desires on others~partly because I believe such action would be antithetical to the Constitution (and partly, of course, because nobody has elected me Il Supremo yet. Never fear, I have decided not to run again this year, so Lillie need not worry about anybody playing with her uterus this year either.)

    So in other words, your argument against a Palin Vice Presidency boils down to personal animus: she doesn’t believe what you think she should! And is therefore somehow beyond the pale!

    Not sure why you’re complaining about McCain having an uphill climb about balancing the budget, seeing that the Obamination has plenty of room in his conscription plan to set up a Thought Police agency or three. Perhaps its because you don’t see a future for yourself as a commissar if McCain wins?

    EW1(SG) (ae500e)

  43. “So in other words, your argument against a Palin Vice Presidency boils down to personal animus: she doesn’t believe what you think she should! And is therefore somehow beyond the pale!”

    This is about her answers to a question about abortion policy. Can you imagine that? I object to elevating into power and potentially the presidency someone whose views are opposed to my own!

    my god, so… personal!

    Seriously this Palin pick has sent y’all over the edge.

    kirby (99af7b)

  44. I find it interesting that so many of the “Keep the Government out of My Womb” crowd are showing so much interest in the womb of a 17 year old girl.

    Dave (d51df8)

  45. jpe,

    The child is not only “the rapist’s” child. The child is also part of the woman. As in Dana’s Great Aunt’s case, many women who become pregnant from rape go on to give birth and love those children – despite the circumstances of child’s conception.

    Should all those children be aborted just because the mother was raped?

    kimsch (2ce939)

  46. kirby, not very little. None.

    SPQR (26be8b)

  47. My elderly aunt in Ohio is indeed fired up about Palin, and she was a Hillary supporter. She loves that she is a reformer!

    I talked to someone in MA who said the same thing. And I have been lukewarm about McCain until now.

    GO SARAH!

    Patricia (ee5c9d)

  48. As the most conservative poster here, let’s say why Obama is REALLY running this ad.

    It’s not about Abortion. It’s about class, status, and power.

    Republicans are now the “White Trash” aka working class party — the VP candidate had a Down’s Syndrome Baby, instead of abortion, has five kids, a blue collar husband (horrors!) and a pregnant teenager.

    This is all about class. Obama knows that women, who crave status above all else, will see Palin as “low class” trailer trash “Gov. Britney” with her very own KFed, and vote for him. Abortion is all about class. About having only one designer yuppie baby at age 39, conceived in vitro from a sperm donor, after several abortions in fertile years.

    That’s what this is all about. Women decisively rejected Palin because she’s working-middle class, and they just don’t like that. Women crave glamor, designer dresses, private jets, mansions, limos, etc. and Palin rejects all of that, along with her messy “normal” family life.

    Obama is up 8 points in the polls. All because women are rejecting McCain/Palin in favor of glamor and JFK lite.

    whiskey (e09923)

  49. The radio ad is important because a surprising number of independent women believe that McCain is pro-choice. This will help educate people that he is not and that he will do everything in his power, through Supreme Court appointments and constitutional amendments, to take away the right of women to choose abortion, even due to rape or incest.

    I understand that anti-abortion people are passionate about this, but they make up less than a third of the electorate. The more people know the truth about McCain’s position, the better Obama will do.

    DB (49b636)

  50. Re: the Update

    I spend several days on a PUMA site (lovely folks, really) and they were pretty pissed that THAT DAY (friday) the dem talking-heads were trying to wave Roe v. Wade infront of them, trying to make sure they stayed in line…

    I think a lot of them understand that for Roe v Wade to go away, there would have to be a constitutional amendment, and they seem to have twigged to the idea that such a thing would never, ever happen.

    By playing the abortion card, the Dems only drive the PUMAs further away…

    Scott Jacobs (a1c284)

  51. “kirby, not very little. None.”

    Constitutionally, The vice president does have some small lawmaking power as the VP. And of course, there’s always the chance that, constitutionally, they’ll become the president. On top of all that is the potential role she’ll play on the admin.

    Its not that hard: if anti-choicers are happy with this pick for the reason of her views, you can bet that the pro-choicers are going to be unhappy with this pick for the reason of her views.

    “I think a lot of them understand that for Roe v Wade to go away, there would have to be a constitutional amendment,”

    It nearly died in Planned Parenthood v. Casey. Read Scalia’s dissent. That was going to be the majority opinion. Then Kennedy changed his mind.

    kirby (1dc75b)

  52. It nearly died in Planned Parenthood v. Casey.

    What, that a Husband should be informed if the wife has an abortion?

    THAT is your “they almost killed it” argument?

    Sweet jesus, ever time I think you’ve said the dumbest thing possible, you KEEP TALKING and prove me wrong…

    Scott Jacobs (a1c284)

  53. kirby is like a moonbat Turing machine talking points generator.

    JD (75f5c3)

  54. Well, it fails at it’s task, because I’m pretty sure it isn’t self aware…

    Scott Jacobs (a1c284)

  55. “THAT is your “they almost killed it” argument?”

    Have you read scalia’s dissent? That was being written as the majority untill Kennedy changed his mind. Read the dissent and tell me what of Roe v. Wade remains after that.

    Seriously folks.Its over the top here. chill.

    kirby (857adb)

  56. I don’t think woman go for ‘glamour’, which sounds facetious to me, but Obama has the greatest presentation of any candidate I have seen in years. Might be a pleasant change to have a stateman as a leader for a change (if he can lead).

    Democrats lose elections because Republicans have spent decades defining their ideas, carefully choosing the language with which to present them, and building an infrastructure to communicate them. Whoever creates the language controls the debate.

    John (69e4d6)

  57. Kirby, the argument was that RvW SHOULD be overturned. Casey was not on point to overturn RvW.

    And it was in 1992…

    Can you find something… I dunno…

    Recent? Like, within the last DECADE?

    Scott Jacobs (a1c284)

  58. This is a good ad and a bad ad for Obama. His problems aren’t related to his position or McCain’s position on abortion. His problems are the lack of experience. Abortion isn’t the issue keeping Hillary supporters on the sidelines. It’s the experience issue.

    But the good part of this ad is that it reinforces the number one theme of Abortion in America. That theme is that all points lead to Roe. They don’t, but Obama needs to pump some hot air into the myth. The people buy it because it’s packaged nicely for them. The NARAL and Planned Parenthood strategists are smart people. They know how to pull the wool over your eyes.

    My biggest issue with this ad is not what it says, but what it doesn’t say. Barack Obama told Planned Parenthood Action Fund in July 2007 that his first act as President will be to sign the Freedom of Choice Act. This act is a very powerful defense of open, unfettered access to abortion at all stages of development. It will replace Roe v Wade and Doe v Bolton as the legal mechanism that blocks regulation of abortion.

    What is the Freedom of Choice Act?
    NARAL: A Pro-Choice View

    Americans United for Life: A Pro-Life View

    Gabriel Sutherland (90b3a1)

  59. Scott, it pains me to say this but Kirby is right about Casey. We did indeed come one vote shy of overturning Roe in that case, and would have pulled it off if Justice Kennedy hadn’t wimped out in the end. That case was the kernel of truth in the popular “one vote away from overturning Roe” lie that NARAL et al. propagated for years to come, two Clinton appointments later. [By way of comparison, it's clear that today's court would affirm Roe, but it's anybody's guess whether the decision would be 5-4, 6-3 or 7-2, as neither Roberts nor Alito has staked out a clear position yet.]

    Xrlq (b71926)

  60. “Kirby, the argument was that RvW SHOULD be overturned. Casey was not on point to overturn RvW.”

    That would be one argument in favor of Scalia’s opinion being crap. Have you read it?

    “Recent? Like, within the last DECADE?”

    I don’t see why things need to be recent in order to be threats to roe v. wade. Or why you don’t see why putting an anti-choicer (or two) in the white house isn’t a threat to choice — or at least something tha pro-choicers would be interest in.

    You think anti-choicers are excited about her? Does that make sense? That makes as much sense as pro-choicers disliking her.

    kirby (bd6ff9)

  61. The left believes a woman should kill her unborn rapists child. The right believes she should have been carrying a .38 and killed the rapist when he tried it.

    Have Blue (974cdf)

  62. Amen

    Icy Truth (614178)


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