Nominee for the dumbest legislative proposal so far in 2008
I suspect Hawaii anti-gun forces are not the first to pursue this avenue, and I suspect it comes in anticipation of losing the Second Amendment case now pending before the Supreme Court banning handguns in DC.
Besides the idiocy of the proposal itself, I’m most saddened by the fact that the Representative proposing it is a personal friend. We agree on little politically, but he’s a great guy.
The “gram” law in MS…
They want to make it illegal to serve food to fat people…
Scott Jacobs (3c07ad) — 2/5/2008 @ 1:24 pmThey want to make it illegal to serve food to fat people…
And deny equal treatment to a disabled group? To the lawyers!
But re the HI bill, it appears that they’ve adopted a tactic of “harass what you can’t ban” as their plan B. Good thing criminals can be counted on to always register their ammo when they register their guns. Even better that coded ammo means trial lawyers can sue ammo makers ad infinitum.
ras (fc54bb) — 2/5/2008 @ 1:36 pmWhat a piker. Just serial-numbered bullets? Don’t we have the technology to imprint the picture and fingerprints of the buyer on the base of the bullet? And where can I buy an “assault pistol”?
nk (4ebdf4) — 2/5/2008 @ 1:45 pmYer in Chicago, so I would suggest most street corners after sunset…
Scott Jacobs (3c07ad) — 2/5/2008 @ 1:46 pmJust for fun, a counter-proposal: all ammo must be shipped thru a gun-control office of the state. The office itself shall, in a timely manner, imprint the serial numbers, at no cost, and then fw the contents to the buyer (such as a gun store). That way, it can be done precisely to spec.
Now, if anything goes wrong – not that it will since gun crime will be eliminated by such registration – it is the state who shall be seen as failing in its duty and the state who shall be sued.
They can operate a contingency fund against this financed by the pensions of the pols who want to pass this law. Since nothing can go wrong, the pols will have nothing to worry about.
/whimsy
ras (fc54bb) — 2/5/2008 @ 1:58 pmThe preamble to the bill, section 1, doesn’t say that the legislation addresses a problem that is rampant in Hawaii, but rather “in the United States”. This is a case of a small state legislator imitating a big state legislator in trying to force a change that only a state as large as California could possibly muscle through.
Iapetus (ea6f31) — 2/5/2008 @ 2:28 pmThis is foolish. Bar Coding is the way to go. On each bullet. With a bar code scanner attached to the muzzle of every gun. And automatic Time Stamp, too! And a radio transmitter to send the info to the State Master Database whenever a gun is fired!
Nothing is too unreasonable to stop this gun violence!!
ManlyDad (22e85d) — 2/5/2008 @ 2:48 pmManlyDad,
Why not require a return coded signal from the State Master Database authorizing the trigger? Criminals could simply be required to fill out a form before they fire (via a Blackberry-style interface on the grip) so that the State Master Database can check its validity codes before responding.
Problem solved!
ras (fc54bb) — 2/5/2008 @ 2:56 pmbar coding — don’t laugh. If they thought it would fly, they’d put a moratorium on ammunition sales until bar coding (or RFID) could be made to work.
The whole point of these techno proposals is to add to the cost, to make things impossible or at least difficult, and to harass whenever possible.
They’ve learned a lot in the tobacco wars.
Kevin Murphy (805c5b) — 2/5/2008 @ 3:01 pmThis is completely stupid. Likewise, California has a requirement that goes into effect in a couple of years requiring a form of micro-stamping on the firing pin of firearms to “code” fired cases with the ID of the gun. The only problem is (1) one company holds a patent on the concept and (2) it does not actually work. It has been shown that the firing pin stamp impression on the fired case is not readable in actual forensic lab tests.
As for serial coding ammunition, ammunition has a lifespan of many decades. People today are firing surplus ammunition manufactured more than 3/4trs of a century ago. And there are people with reloading equipment as well. You can’t make all that uncoded ammunition disappear – they would just create a black market.
It is rampant stupidity of the kind that only the gun-phobic seem capable of.
SPQR (26be8b) — 2/5/2008 @ 3:22 pmWhatever will the police in Hawaii do without any ammunition?
The bad guys, on the other hand, will have plenty given their definitional disregard of the law.
Bob Leibowitz (3dde57) — 2/5/2008 @ 3:56 pmI know from conversations with friends that this proposal is intended to simply cut off the supply of handgun ammunition into Hawaii. Since the state is separated from any other state by an ocean, the only way to get something here is to ship it. Manufacturers won’t adopt the imprinting requirements for a state that consumes a miniscule amount of firearm ammunition on an annual basis, so the only supply of ammunition in the state will be that brought in by travelers — or a black market. But, it will be off the shelves in all retail and wholesale establishments. That’s the goal.
WLS (68fd1f) — 2/5/2008 @ 4:01 pmI saw that about “assault pistols” and clicked back here to expression my derision.
Ahem: SNORT!
Oh, and is this bill sponsored by the Dillon Reloading Press Coroporation Institute for Legislative Studies and Money-making Extranvaganzas?
See-Dubya (7f702c) — 2/5/2008 @ 4:01 pmGiven the definition they use for ammunition that needs an ID tag (essentially, “fits in a pistol”), the S&W Model 500 .50-cal pistol (link) effectively means that all ammo requires it…
OTOH, this will be a boon to reloader manufacturers…
reed (709d67) — 2/5/2008 @ 4:03 pmThis socialist, un-American clown is a personal friend? What qualities make him a friend? His tyrant streak? His stupidity? His lack of respect for the American way?
martin (f61c6a) — 2/5/2008 @ 4:42 pmAs usial LIBERALS think that guns rather then crinimals are the problem no wonder liberals are such a bunch of idiots they would rather blame a inanimate object instead of the crinimals WARNING WARNING WILL ROBINSON LIBERAL APPROCHING LIBERALS APPROCHING
krazy kagu (0c7fb2) — 2/5/2008 @ 5:46 pmDo you have an opinion on the legality of requiring people to dispose of uncoded ammunition that they purchased legally?
DRJ (517d26) — 2/5/2008 @ 5:53 pmTexas’s Section 6.01(b), Possession as a Voluntary Act. It is not Ex Post Facto to declare a formerly legal conduct a crime if there is sufficient promulgation (notice) of a duly enacted law.
nk (4ebdf4) — 2/5/2008 @ 6:04 pmIs coded ammunition available for purchase?
DRJ (517d26) — 2/5/2008 @ 6:24 pmErr … that presupposes a right to purchase ammunition. The Supreme Court has not granted it to us yet.
Seriously, I went through this with Morton Grove’s handgun ban and Chicago’s ban-in-the-guise-of-registration-ban and the recent and more honest Cook County scary-looking gun ban. It’s an exercise of the police power and in the absence of a countervailing affirmative right anything can be made contraband.
nk (4ebdf4) — 2/5/2008 @ 7:15 pmNK,
I wasn’t trying to make an argument, just get a handle on the facts. I don’t know much about how available coded ammunition is. After reading this AmmoCoding link, it sounds like the product is not currently available. I know what the bill provides but I’m also still curious about what happens to non-coded ammunition that gun-owners may already have on hand.
By the way, it looks like other legislatures are considering this, too: New York, Illinois, and Mississippi, in addition to the Hawaii bill WLS posted about.
DRJ (517d26) — 2/5/2008 @ 7:28 pmActually, I want to know about that too, DRJ. Although not for the coding. I have about 200 hundred rounds of “stale” ammunition that I don’t want to shoot (hangfires, ruptured cases and such) and I don’t know what to do with it. I don’t think I should just throw it in the garbage. I was going to ask a local gun store if they could dispose of it for me.
nk (4ebdf4) — 2/5/2008 @ 7:51 pmCan we code and track Liberals? It sounds like this legislator has never left Mommy’s breast.
PCD (c378fd) — 2/6/2008 @ 6:28 amOf course, there is absolutely no chance of anyone being able to get or make bullets except by buying them at a store. Or if they can, undoubtedly, it would cost tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars and be beyond the means of any average citizen (or lawless individual).
David
David J Harr (084080) — 2/6/2008 @ 11:35 amHe should climb DIAMOND HEAD using tooth picks
krazy kagu (d59162) — 2/7/2008 @ 8:48 pm