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	<title>Comments on: Helen Thomas: Vindicated Again!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/</link>
	<description>Harangues that just make sense</description>
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		<title>By: Bar Sinister</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-313050</link>
		<dc:creator>Bar Sinister</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 17:11:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-313050</guid>
		<description>could someone explain a small difference for me. I buy a lot of hardback books(being impatient). After I have read them and had other members of my family who care to do so read them: I donate them to the LA County library. Come to think of it, the library buys cd&#039;s and books to lend out and nobody obtains any additional revenue from that activity. What is the difference between what both I and the library do and someone who buys a cd and copies it for noncommercial purposes? Or who lets others listen to it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>could someone explain a small difference for me. I buy a lot of hardback books(being impatient). After I have read them and had other members of my family who care to do so read them: I donate them to the LA County library. Come to think of it, the library buys cd&#8217;s and books to lend out and nobody obtains any additional revenue from that activity. What is the difference between what both I and the library do and someone who buys a cd and copies it for noncommercial purposes? Or who lets others listen to it.</p>
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		<title>By: paul from fl</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-313002</link>
		<dc:creator>paul from fl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 14:46:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-313002</guid>
		<description>IRT Helen being right...
...a stopped clock is right twice a day....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IRT Helen being right&#8230;<br />
&#8230;a stopped clock is right twice a day&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Dafydd ab Hugh</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312979</link>
		<dc:creator>Dafydd ab Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 10:08:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312979</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Jeffrey Howell:&lt;/b&gt;

(I&#039;ll assume that really is you.)

The point is that the RIAA is &lt;i&gt;not claiming&lt;/i&gt; in court filings that they can go after people who simply upload CDs to their personal computers for use in, say, an iPod (as we do here at Lizard Central).  They say, rightly or wrongly, that they are going after you for putting them into a shared KaZaA folder.

Now, if your argument is that they &lt;i&gt;weren&#039;t&lt;/i&gt; in a shared KaZaA (or other P2P) folder, that&#039;s a factual difference that is properly resolved in a court.  My only point was that the &lt;i&gt;WaPo&lt;/i&gt; story falsely claimed that the RIAA was arguing they could legally sue customers, &lt;b&gt;even if the RIAA itself believed those customers were only uploading CDs to computer en route to an MP3 player.&lt;/b&gt;

From all that I have seen, the RIAA never made such an argument.  In fact, you have just quoted a refutation of the claim that they did...

&lt;blockquote&gt;* Beyond that, there’s no legal “right” to copy the copyrighted music on a CD onto a CD-R. However, burning a copy of CD onto a CD-R, or transferring a copy onto your computer hard drive or your portable music player, won’t usually raise concerns so long as:

· The copy is made from an authorized original CD that you legitimately own;

· The copy is just for your personal use. It’s not a personal use – in fact, it’s illegal – to give away the copy or lend it to others for copying.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

They&#039;re not saying you have the right to do so; that&#039;s beyond the scope of what the RIAA cares to discuss.  &lt;b&gt;But they&#039;re also not asserting that doing so is a litigatable tort.&lt;/b&gt;

As a published author, I have much experience with web sites that put up e-versions of my books for free downloads... and who angrily tell me I should be &lt;i&gt;thanking them&lt;/i&gt; for promoting my fiction!

I can extrapolate to how much more annoyed a composer would be to find the music for which he should receive a royalty posted for free download on Napster or its successors, with the adolescent explanation that it&#039;s somehow &quot;good for the composer&quot; to give away everything he creates for free.  It&#039;s like saying it&#039;s good for movie-makers when people sneak into the theater without paying.

The reality is that people who upload and download copyrighted material for or from others are &lt;i&gt;thieves, crooks, and liars&lt;/i&gt;.  Maybe nobody ever told them that, and maybe they&#039;re too dumb to understand; but it&#039;s true.  The rule that &quot;&lt;i&gt;there ain&#039;t no such thing as a free lunch&lt;/i&gt;&quot; should be a clue-by-four, however.

They are completely different from those who simply transfer music from legitimately purchased CDs to their own MP3 players to listen at work... just for themselves, not to copy and pass around to all their friends, so the friends get to have their own copies for free without having to buy them -- and without having to put money into the pockets of the people who wrote the music and depend upon it for their living.

I hope you see the distinction; and I hope you are on the side of the copyright holders -- &lt;b&gt;even when they are giant corporations who bought the copyright from the creators&lt;/b&gt; -- and those who deserve royalties... not on the side of criminal freeloaders who think the world owes them everything they want for nothing down and nothing a month.

Dafydd</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Jeffrey Howell:</b></p>
<p>(I&#8217;ll assume that really is you.)</p>
<p>The point is that the RIAA is <i>not claiming</i> in court filings that they can go after people who simply upload CDs to their personal computers for use in, say, an iPod (as we do here at Lizard Central).  They say, rightly or wrongly, that they are going after you for putting them into a shared KaZaA folder.</p>
<p>Now, if your argument is that they <i>weren&#8217;t</i> in a shared KaZaA (or other P2P) folder, that&#8217;s a factual difference that is properly resolved in a court.  My only point was that the <i>WaPo</i> story falsely claimed that the RIAA was arguing they could legally sue customers, <b>even if the RIAA itself believed those customers were only uploading CDs to computer en route to an MP3 player.</b></p>
<p>From all that I have seen, the RIAA never made such an argument.  In fact, you have just quoted a refutation of the claim that they did&#8230;</p>
<blockquote><p>* Beyond that, there’s no legal “right” to copy the copyrighted music on a CD onto a CD-R. However, burning a copy of CD onto a CD-R, or transferring a copy onto your computer hard drive or your portable music player, won’t usually raise concerns so long as:</p>
<p>· The copy is made from an authorized original CD that you legitimately own;</p>
<p>· The copy is just for your personal use. It’s not a personal use – in fact, it’s illegal – to give away the copy or lend it to others for copying.</p></blockquote>
<p>They&#8217;re not saying you have the right to do so; that&#8217;s beyond the scope of what the RIAA cares to discuss.  <b>But they&#8217;re also not asserting that doing so is a litigatable tort.</b></p>
<p>As a published author, I have much experience with web sites that put up e-versions of my books for free downloads&#8230; and who angrily tell me I should be <i>thanking them</i> for promoting my fiction!</p>
<p>I can extrapolate to how much more annoyed a composer would be to find the music for which he should receive a royalty posted for free download on Napster or its successors, with the adolescent explanation that it&#8217;s somehow &#8220;good for the composer&#8221; to give away everything he creates for free.  It&#8217;s like saying it&#8217;s good for movie-makers when people sneak into the theater without paying.</p>
<p>The reality is that people who upload and download copyrighted material for or from others are <i>thieves, crooks, and liars</i>.  Maybe nobody ever told them that, and maybe they&#8217;re too dumb to understand; but it&#8217;s true.  The rule that &#8220;<i>there ain&#8217;t no such thing as a free lunch</i>&#8221; should be a clue-by-four, however.</p>
<p>They are completely different from those who simply transfer music from legitimately purchased CDs to their own MP3 players to listen at work&#8230; just for themselves, not to copy and pass around to all their friends, so the friends get to have their own copies for free without having to buy them &#8212; and without having to put money into the pockets of the people who wrote the music and depend upon it for their living.</p>
<p>I hope you see the distinction; and I hope you are on the side of the copyright holders &#8212; <b>even when they are giant corporations who bought the copyright from the creators</b> &#8212; and those who deserve royalties&#8230; not on the side of criminal freeloaders who think the world owes them everything they want for nothing down and nothing a month.</p>
<p>Dafydd</p>
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		<title>By: jefrfrey howell</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312952</link>
		<dc:creator>jefrfrey howell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 06:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312952</guid>
		<description>I am  Jeffrey Howell. Just a few weeks ago no one new who I was, but now my name is wide spread on the internet. I just want to clear up a few points that might be misunderstood. Yes, I am being sued for downloading or uploading the R.I.A.A. says it is the same. The facts are. Yes, I have MP3s on my computer. However these files were not placed in a “shared folder.&quot; The MP3s are in fact stored in the C:\My Music folder created by Windows, and have always been. The peer to peer program that was installed on my computer shared my entire hard drive. Of the thousands of files the R.I.A.A. found only a few are their concern. All this will not change the fact that the R.I.A.A. states that recording legally purchased music is illegal, and you could find your self in court.




“What the Law Says and What it Means
If you make unauthorized copies of copyrighted music recordings, you’re stealing. You’re breaking the law, and you could be held legally liable for thousands of dollars in damages.
That’s pretty important information to have, considering how serious it would be if you were caught and prosecuted by the authorities or sued in civil court. It’s even more important that you understand that when you illicitly make or distribute recordings, you are taking something of value from the owner without his or her permission.
You may find this surprising. After all, when”

“Copying CDs
· It’s okay to copy music onto an analog cassette, but not for commercial purposes.
· It’s also okay to copy music onto special Audio CD-R’s, mini-discs, and digital tapes (because royalties have been paid on them) – but, again, not for commercial purposes.
· Beyond that, there’s no legal &quot;right&quot; to copy the copyrighted music on a CD onto a CD-R. However, burning a copy of CD onto a CD-R, or transferring a copy onto your computer hard drive or your portable music player, won’t usually raise concerns so long as: 
à The copy is made from an authorized original CD that you 		legitimately own
à The copy is just for your personal use. It’s not a personal 		use – in fact, it’s illegal – to give away 				the copy or lend it to others for copying.”

Coppied from the R.I.A.A. website.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am  Jeffrey Howell. Just a few weeks ago no one new who I was, but now my name is wide spread on the internet. I just want to clear up a few points that might be misunderstood. Yes, I am being sued for downloading or uploading the R.I.A.A. says it is the same. The facts are. Yes, I have MP3s on my computer. However these files were not placed in a “shared folder.&#8221; The MP3s are in fact stored in the C:\My Music folder created by Windows, and have always been. The peer to peer program that was installed on my computer shared my entire hard drive. Of the thousands of files the R.I.A.A. found only a few are their concern. All this will not change the fact that the R.I.A.A. states that recording legally purchased music is illegal, and you could find your self in court.</p>
<p>“What the Law Says and What it Means<br />
If you make unauthorized copies of copyrighted music recordings, you’re stealing. You’re breaking the law, and you could be held legally liable for thousands of dollars in damages.<br />
That’s pretty important information to have, considering how serious it would be if you were caught and prosecuted by the authorities or sued in civil court. It’s even more important that you understand that when you illicitly make or distribute recordings, you are taking something of value from the owner without his or her permission.<br />
You may find this surprising. After all, when”</p>
<p>“Copying CDs<br />
· It’s okay to copy music onto an analog cassette, but not for commercial purposes.<br />
· It’s also okay to copy music onto special Audio CD-R’s, mini-discs, and digital tapes (because royalties have been paid on them) – but, again, not for commercial purposes.<br />
· Beyond that, there’s no legal &#8220;right&#8221; to copy the copyrighted music on a CD onto a CD-R. However, burning a copy of CD onto a CD-R, or transferring a copy onto your computer hard drive or your portable music player, won’t usually raise concerns so long as:<br />
à The copy is made from an authorized original CD that you 		legitimately own<br />
à The copy is just for your personal use. It’s not a personal 		use – in fact, it’s illegal – to give away 				the copy or lend it to others for copying.”</p>
<p>Coppied from the R.I.A.A. website.</p>
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		<title>By: SPQR</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312928</link>
		<dc:creator>SPQR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 04:16:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312928</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;&quot;And, even if they did, it’s all Bush’s fault!&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

That&#039;s more truth than you might think, one of the excuses that Dan Rather used during the Rather/Mapes forged memo fiasco was that it was the White House&#039;s fault since the WH did not identify the memo as a forgery to them fast enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>&#8220;And, even if they did, it’s all Bush’s fault!&#8221;</i></p>
<p>That&#8217;s more truth than you might think, one of the excuses that Dan Rather used during the Rather/Mapes forged memo fiasco was that it was the White House&#8217;s fault since the WH did not identify the memo as a forgery to them fast enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Another Drew</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312896</link>
		<dc:creator>Another Drew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 02:09:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312896</guid>
		<description>But, But, How can the MSM make a mistake?
They&#039;re perfect!  Aren&#039;t they?  
They say they are; and, as we all know, they never err.
And, even if they did, it&#039;s all Bush&#039;s fault!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>But, But, How can the MSM make a mistake?<br />
They&#8217;re perfect!  Aren&#8217;t they?<br />
They say they are; and, as we all know, they never err.<br />
And, even if they did, it&#8217;s all Bush&#8217;s fault!</p>
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		<title>By: DRJ</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312884</link>
		<dc:creator>DRJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jan 2008 00:55:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312884</guid>
		<description>Dafyyd,

I like your attitude and your blog but I could have done without the waxing image.  It&#039;s just wrong to wax a lizard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dafyyd,</p>
<p>I like your attitude and your blog but I could have done without the waxing image.  It&#8217;s just wrong to wax a lizard.</p>
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		<title>By: Dafydd ab Hugh</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312877</link>
		<dc:creator>Dafydd ab Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 23:41:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312877</guid>
		<description>Funnily enough, Patterico, one of the major reasons I am so quick and forthright in noting those mistakes I see (and I&#039;m sure there are other mistakes I stubbornly miss again and again)... is &lt;i&gt;you&lt;/i&gt;.

Your repeated pummeling of the &lt;i&gt;Los Angeles Dog Tr&lt;/i&gt;-- er -- &lt;i&gt;Times&lt;/i&gt; made a deep impression on me, even before I was a guest blogger here; and the lesson I took from that bloody massacre was that being wrong now and again does not particularly hurt an entity&#039;s credibility.

&lt;b&gt;What hurts credibility is denying that you&#039;re wrong, even when it has become undeniable.&lt;/b&gt;  It reminds half the people of their fathers -- and the &lt;i&gt;other&lt;/i&gt; half the people of their teenaged sons.

Think of it like taking a Band-Aid off of some body part with a lot of hair (or waxing your chest, for those weirdos who do such a thing):  It may hurt a lot to just rip it off, but it&#039;s over quick.  By contrast, trying to pull it off one milimeter at a time hurts just as much... but it continues for days!

Dafydd</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Funnily enough, Patterico, one of the major reasons I am so quick and forthright in noting those mistakes I see (and I&#8217;m sure there are other mistakes I stubbornly miss again and again)&#8230; is <i>you</i>.</p>
<p>Your repeated pummeling of the <i>Los Angeles Dog Tr</i>&#8211; er &#8212; <i>Times</i> made a deep impression on me, even before I was a guest blogger here; and the lesson I took from that bloody massacre was that being wrong now and again does not particularly hurt an entity&#8217;s credibility.</p>
<p><b>What hurts credibility is denying that you&#8217;re wrong, even when it has become undeniable.</b>  It reminds half the people of their fathers &#8212; and the <i>other</i> half the people of their teenaged sons.</p>
<p>Think of it like taking a Band-Aid off of some body part with a lot of hair (or waxing your chest, for those weirdos who do such a thing):  It may hurt a lot to just rip it off, but it&#8217;s over quick.  By contrast, trying to pull it off one milimeter at a time hurts just as much&#8230; but it continues for days!</p>
<p>Dafydd</p>
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		<title>By: Paul</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312873</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 23:36:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312873</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I’m glad that I provide a reason for you to get up in the morning. Thinking of me at 4 in the morning is kind of … well.. flattering…&lt;/i&gt;

&lt;b&gt;Wrong again.&lt;/b&gt; 

I&#039;m in the central time zone, plus I start work at 6:30 am...which would be 4:30 am PST. I simpy read what you wrote over breakfast, and wrote a reply.

Don&#039;t you ever tire of projecting?

&lt;i&gt;You are arguing apples and oranges. My point was and is that blogs are not a viable alternative to the MSM. They need the MSM to be relevant.&lt;/i&gt;

Why? They are incapable of doing original reporting? You know...Who-What-When-Where-Why-How?

Many original stories rise in the blogosphere simply because the MSM won&#039;t cover them.

&lt;i&gt;Most don’t adhere to basic journalistic standards. Much of this is because they don’t have the resources for verification and research that the MSM does.&lt;/i&gt;

Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped that WaPo reporter write that RIAA story, huh?

Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped Dan Rather, huh?

Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped Reuters catch that blatantly obvious photoshopped picture they ran, huh?

That&#039;s just a few examples.

Want more? Simply click on the Dog Trainer archive link. Our host has been playing LA Times Smackdown for years.

How do you explain the blogs beating the MSM like Georgia Tech did Cumberland College in 1912? (Final score: 222-0, the biggest shutout in the history of college football. No, that&#039;s not a typo.)

&lt;i&gt;Just because the MSM stinks doesn’t mean the blogs have or will replace it. At best they will cause the MSM to pay more attention to those standards mentioned.&lt;/i&gt;

Really? When?

&lt;i&gt;I’m not the only person who sees it this way. Read “Cult of the Amateur” by Andrew Keen for a more detailed breakdown of what the internet is encouraging in terms of mediocrity.&lt;/i&gt;

Several people have already refuted this statement; I defer to them.

So... want to go another round? Or have you finally had enough?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I’m glad that I provide a reason for you to get up in the morning. Thinking of me at 4 in the morning is kind of … well.. flattering…</i></p>
<p><b>Wrong again.</b> </p>
<p>I&#8217;m in the central time zone, plus I start work at 6:30 am&#8230;which would be 4:30 am PST. I simpy read what you wrote over breakfast, and wrote a reply.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t you ever tire of projecting?</p>
<p><i>You are arguing apples and oranges. My point was and is that blogs are not a viable alternative to the MSM. They need the MSM to be relevant.</i></p>
<p>Why? They are incapable of doing original reporting? You know&#8230;Who-What-When-Where-Why-How?</p>
<p>Many original stories rise in the blogosphere simply because the MSM won&#8217;t cover them.</p>
<p><i>Most don’t adhere to basic journalistic standards. Much of this is because they don’t have the resources for verification and research that the MSM does.</i></p>
<p>Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped that WaPo reporter write that RIAA story, huh?</p>
<p>Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped Dan Rather, huh?</p>
<p>Those vast resources for verification and research sure helped Reuters catch that blatantly obvious photoshopped picture they ran, huh?</p>
<p>That&#8217;s just a few examples.</p>
<p>Want more? Simply click on the Dog Trainer archive link. Our host has been playing LA Times Smackdown for years.</p>
<p>How do you explain the blogs beating the MSM like Georgia Tech did Cumberland College in 1912? (Final score: 222-0, the biggest shutout in the history of college football. No, that&#8217;s not a typo.)</p>
<p><i>Just because the MSM stinks doesn’t mean the blogs have or will replace it. At best they will cause the MSM to pay more attention to those standards mentioned.</i></p>
<p>Really? When?</p>
<p><i>I’m not the only person who sees it this way. Read “Cult of the Amateur” by Andrew Keen for a more detailed breakdown of what the internet is encouraging in terms of mediocrity.</i></p>
<p>Several people have already refuted this statement; I defer to them.</p>
<p>So&#8230; want to go another round? Or have you finally had enough?</p>
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		<title>By: Charlie</title>
		<link>http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/comment-page-1/#comment-312840</link>
		<dc:creator>Charlie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 07 Jan 2008 20:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2008/01/07/helen-thomas-vindicated-again/#comment-312840</guid>
		<description>We better find out if LaShawn Barber is an illegal alien -- because he/she is doing the work American&#039;s don&#039;t want to do :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We better find out if LaShawn Barber is an illegal alien &#8212; because he/she is doing the work American&#8217;s don&#8217;t want to do <img src='http://patterico.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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