Patterico's Pontifications

10/23/2007

California Fires Worsen (Updated)

Filed under: Real Life — DRJ @ 2:30 pm



[Guest post by DRJ]

The California fires just get worse as the heat goes up, the wind blows, and the largest evacuation in California history continues:

The string of wildfires plaguing Southern California has burned more than 1,000 homes, with new fires breaking out today and hundreds of thousands of people ordered to evacuate. Authorities said four evacuees in San Diego County had died, bringing the death toll to six.

New fires sprang up in San Diego and Los Angeles counties, and more evacuations were ordered in Orange and San Diego counties. As many as 10,000 people sought shelter at Qualcomm Stadium in San Diego. Weary firefighters fought major blazes that have burned since the weekend in seven counties, and officials said containment was days away at the earliest.

In an area as large as Southern California, officials remained focused on how to cope with their individual disasters, and there was little information for the region as a whole. But most officials agreed that all of the numbers grew overnight. There were more fires, more evacuations, more damage and more fatigue among firefighters.

There have been four confirmed deaths and it’s estimated a million people have been displaced, 400,000 acres burned, and 1,500 homes and structures destroyed (1,300 in San Diego alone). Here’s a Google map of current fires.

What a tragedy. Hopefully the Santa Anna Ana winds will die down Wednesday.

Update: There are far more injuries than reported earlier including at least 16 in the San Diego burn unit of which 5 civilians and 5 firefighters are in critical condition. The UCSD facility is ready to take 100 more burn patients if needed.

— DRJ

29 Responses to “California Fires Worsen (Updated)”

  1. It’s tragic that firefighters are being hurt or killed so that rich people can live in fancy homes in the hills while the people of California are forced to pay to rebuild those homes.

    If rich people want to live in the homes, they should have to pay for fire protection, fire insurance, etc. on their own.

    Daryl Herbert (4ecd4c)

  2. Let’s get through the disaster first before condemning the residents would be my advice. I have quite a few opinions about insurance and federal assistance for high risk zones but now is not the time.

    voiceofreason (83f556)

  3. Someone on Talk Radio was insisting the MSM are ‘wildly’ exaggerating the extent of the damage and blamed it on the Sierra Club and its lackeys in Congress.

    The Sierra Club is far too moderate on the destruction of our green areas, if fact be told.

    These Rush Lie-baugh types have taken free speech to its lowest level ever.

    King Pandeen (87ec7f)

  4. I would prefer more centralized development myself, but by no means all of the places burning are “rich people”. Whether living there was wise is another question.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  5. I read a quote someplace that this is not just an evacuation, it is a migration.

    Itsme (811939)

  6. Itsme,

    It is like a migration, and a familiar one at that. There are 2 local families I know of that have relatives coming in from San Diego to stay with them until this resolves.

    It’s reminiscent of what happened during Katrina when there was an influx of friends and family members from Louisiana. Most of the ones I knew were insured and able to return to Louisiana, but a few got jobs here and stayed. According to people I know in South Texas, that was even more common there. So I wouldn’t be surprised if some people that leave Southern California just don’t go back.

    DRJ (fb1a22)

  7. DRJ:

    A sad update. It says that two died from the fire, and four more during evacuation.

    • Officials at the California Geographic Area Coordination Center, which coordinates resources, confirmed that a second person had died in the fires. Ralph Alworth of the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection said that on the first day of the Buckweed fire, a civilian trying to flee got into a car accident, his car caught fire and he died today. In addition, four San Diego County evacuees have died — two in the process of being moved from medical facilities, a county medical examiner official said. The number of injuries also grew, to more than four dozen civilians and firefighters.

    LA Times

    Itsme (811939)

  8. “…Hopefully the Santa Anna winds will die down Wednesday.”

    DRJ…
    Here, in the belly-of-the-beast, we spell it “Santa Ana” like the city; though, I believe that the original derivation is “Santana”.

    Another Drew (8018ee)

  9. The Sierra Club is far too moderate on the destruction of our green areas, if fact be told.

    The Sierra Club and its cronies have done everything they can to block the removal of dead trees (yes, dead trees…the ones fallen on the ground) and dead brush from forests all over the nation. So when a fire starts, guess what? All that dead, dry stuff burns like a giant pile of kindling.

    Is it specifically the Sierra Club’s fault the fire started? No. But all that dead, dry stuff lying around waiting to catch fire certainly isn’t helping. That’s poor forest management.

    Paul (146bba)

  10. The “Santa Ana” winds refer to the Santa Ana canyon where the winds blow through (of course, they blow through any pass).

    They aren’t named after Santana.

    It’s tragic, and now is not the time to blame people. Rescue them, try to keep their property safe, and let’s sort out what to do later.

    steve miller (76040f)

  11. You are right, Another Drew #8, and thanks for the correction. The only excuse I can offer is that I was brought up on stories about Santa Anna, the Mexican dictator, and my education in California lore was obviously lacking.

    DRJ (fb1a22)

  12. Steve…
    I think you might find that the name for the winds pre-date any naming of the canyon…
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Ana_wind.

    Perhaps the canyon was named for the winds???

    Another Drew (8018ee)

  13. The Sierra Club and its cronies have done everything they can to block the removal of dead trees (yes, dead trees…the ones fallen on the ground) and dead brush from forests all over the nation. So when a fire starts, guess what? All that dead, dry stuff burns like a giant pile of kindling.

    Is it specifically the Sierra Club’s fault the fire started? No. But all that dead, dry stuff lying around waiting to catch fire certainly isn’t helping. That’s poor forest management.

    per Paul
    ——————————————-
    Paul would be hard-pressed to prove this lie being spread by Rush Lie-baugh et al.

    The Sierra Club is an immigration-loving tool but does not wield that much stupidity, much less that much power.

    King Pandeen (87ec7f)

  14. I believe the earlier reports about two deaths were wrong. As far as I know at about 6 p.m., there was one death in connection to the fires.

    Edward (e752f8)

  15. No. Disaster. Insurance. Subsidized. By. The. Feds. Build. Where. It. Is. Economical. To. Build. And. You. Can. Afford. The. Insurance.

    Otherwise. Don’t. Expect. Taxpayers. To. Subsidize. Your. Decision. To. Build. In. High. Risk. Areas.

    Do it yourself!

    Christoph (92b8f7)

  16. From the look of things, Andrew, not enough. One-fourth of California’s coastline is on fire.

    DRJ (fb1a22)

  17. I’ll try this one again; Daryl Herbert in #1 and Christoph in # 15: I grew up in San Diego County; I’m familiar with the back country where the Witch (as in Witch Creek) and the 2003 or 2004 Cedar (as in Cedar Creek) fires started. The Cedar fire was started by a stupid city boy deer hunter who got lost–and fired off a flare to gain someone’s attention. He killed 15 people by that act. The Cedar fire burned from the back country down to the outskirts of San Diego and, depending upon who’s counting was either the first, second or third largest wildfire in California history. The current Witch fire looks like it might match the Cedar fire in acreage.

    Now as for stupid rich people who build in high fire risk areas and expect the rest of us to subsidize them; you two ought to be ashamed of your ignorant generalizing.

    Back country San Diego County where these fires started is pretty damn poor. Many of the people live in little shacks or single wide mobile homes; a lot of them get by on government food stamps. Much of the land that is/was originally burned in these fires is Indian reservation land. The Sycuan Indians on the Barona Indian reservation have built themselves a good sized casino and are making some dough–the other reservations remain dirt poor.

    It looks like the Witch fire may ultimately burn 35 miles east to west–it’s made 17 or 18 miles now. It’s jumped a 10 lane interstate highway in at least two places (I-15) and may jump another (I-5) before it burns out at the coast.

    The Harris fire on the border started at Tecate–and while it stayed on the U.S. side of the border for a while, it’s spread across into Mexico and is burning west there as well. I guess we shouldn’t care about those “wealthy Mexicans” who built in the hills.

    I hear you about Malibu where people build houses in canyons that act just like chimneys–and get burned out every 5 years or so. I might even agree with you somewhat on the point.

    But you tell me that some poor sod who’s eating government cheese to get along in a rural backcountry shack doesn’t deserve help because he, “made his decision to build/live in a high risk area”–well stuff yourself. I’ve got the same attitude when you talk about some middle class homeowner living in Poway or Rancho Bernardo who happens to be at mile 15 of a 17 mile long fire and loses his house.

    I live in the brush line in the Verdugo Hills 10 miles from downtown Los Angeles. The brush is cleared away from the house every year, I’ve got a tile roof (changed from the original wood one) pay high fire insurance premiums in an assigned risk pool etc.

    Fire storms are frightening and terrible things; I suppose we shouldn’t care about the couple of hundred thousand people who perished in a Tokyo firestorm started on orders of General Curtiss LeMay or the hundred thousand or so who died in Dresden or Hamburg courtesy of RAF Marshal “Bomber” Harris. After all they chose to build and live in high risk areas.

    When you guys know what you’re talking about, come back and visit again.

    Mike Myers (d015a6)

  18. I could be wrong, but I don’t think the Sierra Club blocked any chaparral clearing proposals.

    Itsme (811939)

  19. Meaning I don’t think unthinned forests were really to blame in this case.

    Itsme (811939)

  20. Correct, Itsme, while there are undoubtedly many factors in different locations (even the houses themselves serve as fuel), this is simply part of California’s natural ecosystem.

    I’m okay with people building in dangerous wildfire areas… but think they should not be subsidized by taxpayers for doing so. If it’s too expensive to fully insure or self-insure themselves… then they can always move to lower risk areas.

    Christoph (92b8f7)

  21. The canyon was named for Santa Ana… or St. Anne in english
    The winds are strong through there, so locals attribute the naming of the winds to that.
    Others call them “devil winds” or literally “satanas” which roughly translates as something derived directly from satan or hell which is what the Mexicans and Spaniards supposedly called them before the gringos got here and rather unpoetically renamed the weather event after a landmark

    SteveG (4e16fc)

  22. The US taxpayer subsidizes the hurricane prone gulf and east coasts. Florida, Texas and some others double dip and needs a tornado subsidy too.
    Califonia gets floods, fires and earthquakes.

    California’s economy was worth over 1.5 Trillion dollars last year and nearly 1/5 of the USA’s GDP.
    The sea ports, the ports of entry are a major portion of that.
    Clearly those people who work here producing all that have to live somewhere.
    California isn’t slapdash in its approach to new construction standards in fire/earthquake prone areas either. Most people are shocked by the costs per sq. ft. just to engineer a new home here.
    The building codes are strict and expensive to implement. Inspections and enforcement are rigorous and tough.
    New construction is required to mitigate chapparral 300 feet from the developed footprint or to the property line; whichever is further.
    For earthquakes, footings are massive, walls are bolted, strapped, shear panelled, and strong walled.

    That said, fires have a history of burning to the sea here. 70MPH winds at 8% humidity will do that.
    CAT 5 hurricanes will continue to topple structures from Brownsville to NYC.

    Our great great grandkids will be complaining about replacing homes in the dust storm prone areas on Mars…

    All this said, if Barbara Streisand’s place burns down and she had to move to Spain I’d get over it.

    SteveG (4e16fc)

  23. SteveG is making sense!

    It’s true that the Santa Anas affect people’s minds.

    (That said, I do think we could use less sprawl, not only because of fire, but because long commutes reduce quality of life.)

    Andrew J. Lazarus (17dd6e)

  24. Paul would be hard-pressed to prove this lie being spread by Rush Lie-baugh et al.

    Wanna bet?

    A coalition of conservation groups lodged a complaint today in Federal District Court in San Francisco challenging the Bush administration’s new rules for managing the nation’s 192 million acre National Forest System, a magnificent network of forests and grasslands in 42 states that encompasses 8 percent of the country.

    I disagree with the author over the law’s effects, but they are tying it up in the courts.

    And here’s one crony:

    Pacific Legal Foundation took action today to derail efforts by radical environmentalists to block sound forest management in California’s Tuolumne County and surrounding areas. PLF intervened to challenge an environmentalist lawsuit that could facilitate more devastating fires in Eldorado National Forest.

    No, it’s not San Diego County, but to deny lawsuits aren’t happening is ridiculous.

    The Sierra Club is an immigration-loving tool but does not wield that much stupidity, much less that much power.

    The power:

    In 1971, the Sierra Club Legal Defense Fund was founded as a nonprofit law firm to serve as a legal arm to the Club’s grassroots operation. In 1998, its name was changed to the EarthJustice Legal Defense Fund. (It now operates simply as “EarthJustice.”) EarthJustice exists to use the courts as a weapon against businesses and public agencies, in the hope of forcing them to operate in a manner acceptable to the Sierra Club. EarthJustice’s aggressive legal posture regarding everything from livestock farms to mining doesn’t harm the Club’s reputation as much as it might, since few members of the public realize that the two groups work hand in glove. Earthjustice sued on behalf of the Sierra Club 38 times in 2003 alone.

    And the stupidity:

    “There’s nothing wrong with being a terrorist, as long as you win. Then you write history.” These chilling words may sound like an Al Qaeda credo, but they aren’t. They are the words of Sierra Club board member Paul Watson.

    And there’s more. “Right now we’re in the early stages of World War III,” Watson wrote in the pages of the radical Earth First! Journal. “It’s the war to save the planet. This kind of action will be getting stronger. The environmental movement doesn’t have many deserters and has a high level of recruitment. Eventually there will be open war.”

    Watson is a nutjob that was thrown out of Greenpeace for being too violent (or resigned in protest, depending on the source.) Wikipedia has more:

    In April of 2003, Watson was elected to the board of directors of the Sierra Club for a three-year term. In 2006, he did not seek re-election. He resigned from the board a month before his term ended, in protest against the organization’s sponsorship of a “Why I Hunt” essay contest.

    A question: why would the Sierra Club elect a guy with this reputation if they weren’t like minded?

    The first Sea Shepherd vessel, the Sea Shepherd, was purchased in December 1978 with assistance from the Fund for Animals. Sea Shepherd soon established itself as one of the more controversial environmental groups, known for provocative direct action tactics in addition to more conventional protests. These tactics have included, at times, ramming whaling ships at sea, and the scuttling of two ships in an Icelandic harbor. Watson remains the leader of Sea Shepherd today and uses the title “Captain” in reference to his role in the organization.

    Hard-pressed?

    I think not.

    Paul (146bba)

  25. Even a blind squirrel finds an acorn… or so I’ve heard

    SteveG (4e16fc)

  26. How did all these fires start? Seems like terrorism to me….

    anthony (918986)

  27. Since Sunday, the Border Patrol has apprehended/rescued some 200 “undocumented workers” who were headed north from the border and found in the path of the Harris Fire in southern San Diego County. Many of the “workers” were treated for severe burns. Poor dumb bastards–passing through a rich space where they shouldn’t be allowed–if I follow some of the earlier posts here.

    I guess we shouldn’t use any governmental resources to help these guys out.

    Mike Myers (d015a6)

  28. Sierra Club just another bunch of enviromental radicals and the infamous Earth Justice and PAUL WATSON is a known envoromental extremist yet TIME named him a HERO OF THE PLANET yet he once said I GET THE IDEA THAT INSTEAD OF GOING OUT AND SHOOTING BIRDS I WOULD GO OUT AND SHOOT THE KIDS THAT SHOOT BIRDS and TIME dose that SHAME ON TIME MAGAZINE and SHAME ON THE SIERRA CLUB FOR HIRING THIS RADICAL bust PETA has also hired radicals

    krazy kagu (6cb3c5)


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