Patterico's Pontifications

5/14/2007

Voter Suppression?

Filed under: General — Patterico @ 6:17 pm

According to this TPMmuckraker post, some people consider this phone message, left with numerous voters in Camden, N.J., to be an attempt at voter suppression:

Voters alert! Please note that it is a federal crime to be paid for a vote. I repeat, it is a crime. If you or your neighbor have been offered payment, please report it immediately to the U.S. Attorney’s Office at 856-757-5026.

(It turns out that the U.S. Attorney’s office was not behind the calls, despite an earlier claim to that effect by the Philadelphia Enquirer.)

So if people know it’s illegal to be paid for a vote, that will cause legitimate voters to stay away from the polls??

Can someone explain the logic to me?

62 Responses to “Voter Suppression?”

  1. Democrats pay poor people for votes.

    So, if you inform people it’s a crime to pay for votes, this will suppress Democrat votes.

    So it is voter suppression, obviously. Get it together, Patterico. Damnit!

    Christoph (12b77c)

  2. They discriminate against dead people too.

    ANIMISTS!!!

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  3. Hey, you want to buy my vote? Bring it on!

    Oh, BTW, since buying my vote is not just illegal, but also unethical, and throw in immoral too; just what leads you to believe that I’ll vote for your guy when I get in that booth?

    What makes me the guy who won’t screw his associates?

    Didn’t Jesse Unrah have something to say about politicians taking campaign donations and then voting against the interests of the donors? If it works for the pols, why not the pleebs?

    Another Drew (8018ee)

  4. Camden is largely poor and black.

    Were any such calls made to nearby Cherry Hill, white and affluent? The Pine Barrens, white and poor? If not, why not.

    It’s rapidly becoming part of the standard media narrative that Rove’s purge of US Attorneys was in search of more vigorous creation of bogus vote fraud investigations. Like a quack medicine company that invents a fake disease, the better to sell its worthless nostrums—in this case, attempts to scare Democrats out of the voting booth in those states where it wasn’t convenient merely to purge them by ‘mistake’.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (2a46dc)

  5. I’m fascinated this is even a story…

    Informing people it’s a crime to be paid for their vote is suppression?

    I guess those rules on the books are attempts at supression too…

    Darn laws saying I have to register to vote!

    Scott Jacobs (a1de9d)

  6. Andrew… The difference here is that the illegality of buying votes isn’t made up, and Dems have a history of GROSS violation of those rules…

    For god’s sake, the DEAD VOTED!!!

    Scott Jacobs (a1de9d)

  7. Actually, Scott, when these cases are investigated, it usually turns out that the death records are wrong, not the voting records. Rove’s great crusade has come up with 86 Mickey Mouse convictions. In the same period, over 300 Americans were killed by lightning. Anyone see a federal program to make people wear rubber hats in the rain?

    Both parties have histories of voter fraud, but in the time frame we’re talking about, the fraud you and Rove are chasing after pretty much doesn’t exist. The difference is, he knows that, but sees politically-useful measures to implement in pursuit of the chimera.

    Try finding real cases of voter fraud to post. (I’ll start.)

    Andrew J. Lazarus (2a46dc)

  8. Walking in a thumderstorm doesn’t affect who runs part of my country. Voter Fraud by EITHER party is beyond any possible excuse.

    The difference is, he knows that, but sees politically-useful measures to implement in pursuit of the chimera.

    Yes, and Democrats never do that.

    Scott Jacobs (a1de9d)

  9. Were any such calls made to nearby Cherry Hill, white and affluent? The Pine Barrens, white and poor? If not, why not.

    Who cares? Since the calls are factually correct and not illegal, the motive behind them is really irrelevant. This, if we make everyone obey the voting laws we’re discriminating against the poor black folk, nonsense is getting rather ridiculous.

    Taltos (c99804)

  10. Andrew,

    My understanding from the comments at the linked post is that this was a municipal election pitting Democrats against each other.

    Is that wrong? Or did you just make an assumption?

    Patterico (5ec680)

  11. I the wacky world of Democrats, merely asking for identification is an act of voter suppression.

    Perfect Sense (b6ec8c)

  12. That’s a real case of election fraud… one person voting into two separate districts? One?

    As a commenter put it, “Really, just go ahead and discount his vote and officially claim McHenry won by 85 votes instead of 86.”

    Talk about Mickey Mouse.

    DubiousD (5739b5)

  13. It’s rapidly becoming part of the standard media narrative that Rove’s purge of US Attorneys was in search of more vigorous creation of bogus vote fraud investigations.

    Oooh, it’s Rove’s purge of 8, now? Sounds spooky.

    Aside from that, what on earth are you talking about, Andrew? More vigorous creation of bogus vote fraud investigations? As opposed to the less vigorous bogus vote fraud investigations? What? Where? When?

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  14. Rove’s great crusade has come up with 86 Mickey Mouse convictions.

    Do those convicts do time at Disneyland? Damn you, Rove!

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  15. Even the voters are beginning to think that buying their votes is wrong. That’s why they had to raise the price of a vote in St. Louis from $5 to $10.

    Glen Wishard (b1987d)

  16. Well, it probably was intended to suppress some votes. Illegal ones, to be sure, but that’s just details. Cf. “immigrants” as a euphemism for “illegal aliens.”

    Xrlq (76d7c1)

  17. Serious question: why is it illegal to buy someone’s vote?

    Voters are free to vote as the please, for any reasons they may have. Our Democratic friends certainly think it’s legitimate to pay people through the welfare system to “win” their votes, and every candidate, including Ronald Reagan, put some emphasis on people voting in their own interests.

    It’s kind of like prostitution: it’s perfectly legal to ask a woman for sex, but it’s illegal to pay a woman for sex.

    Dana (3e4784)

  18. Both parties have histories of voter fraud, but in the time frame we’re talking about, the fraud you and Rove are chasing after pretty much doesn’t exist.

    Really? Tell that to the Hamilton County board of elections, which processed a few thousand registrations for non-existent people in 2004. Apparently they were the result of some group (ACORN, I think) targeting the county. Similar numbers popped up in Columbus and Cleveland, AFAICR.

    In contrast, the suburban counties around Cincinnati had almost no vote fraud. My home county (Clermont) had only one “suspicious” registration in ’04.

    Rob Crawford (240cf9)

  19. Buying votes…

    Why is it legal for someone to promise me cash in my pocket for my vote through a tax cut, but illegal to promise me cash in my pocket for my vote by handing me money? Is there really any difference?

    ……

    Common Sense Political Thought (819604)

  20. Serious question: why is it illegal to buy someone’s vote?

    Undue influence of the electorate. You’re supposed to talk people out of their votes, not buy them.

    Or, it could be the crack.

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  21. “Serious question: why is it illegal to buy someone’s vote?”

    Because you are not merely voting, you are “electing”. It is a responsibility as well as a “right”. Look at the history of the “right” to vote in our country. At the founding only propertied men over 21 could vote. About 50 years later the property qualification was discarded but still only adult men could vote, etc., etc., until today when every citizen over the age of eighteen can vote. Throughout all this time, the voters have not been voting only for “their” government but also for the government of those not eligible to vote. Even today, eligible voters are about only a third of the entire population. The vote you cast will affect children, non-citizens and those who have lost the “right” to vote. To simplify it, think of yourself not as a “voter” but as an “elector”.

    nk (f28d83)

  22. Were any such calls made to nearby Cherry Hill, white and affluent?

    Who would pay rich people for their vote? Not very economical…

    Lehosh (2fc6bc)

  23. No kidding. For the price of one household of rich voters, I could buy the votes of an entire apartment building in a really poor area.

    Great, now I wonder about “Vote Utility” in economic terms…

    Damnit!

    Scott Jacobs (feb2f7)

  24. “As U.S. Attorney Christopher J. Christie noted, the U.S. Attorney’s Office would never engage in such a practice, which clearly could have been used as a voter-suppression tactic.”
    That from your link Pat. Ask the Republican prosecutor.
    Ask Bradly Schlozman

    AF (683024)

  25. You’ll remember that Rove (yes, Rove: he sent the orders to Goodling, as we’ll hear in detail when she testifies) sacked the USA in Missouri so that one of his political operatives could come in (without Senate confirmation, surprise, surprise) and try to influence the close Senate election with last-minute election fraud charges. Do you want to know how bogus those were? Well, the issue was fake registrations compiled by ACORN solicitors—this is an unsurprising consequence of ACORN’s policy of paying people to solicit names—and ACORN itself blew the whistle. So we’re left with a Federal indictment of four losers who netted $8 hour. Mickey Mouse. Stolzman’s other contribution, suing the State of Missouri to make it “purge” its voter rolls, got thrown out for lack of evidence.

    We’re accumulating lots of evidence that USAs who didn’t pursue this voter fraud nonsense got fired. Evidence of actual fraud, especially organized fraud as opposed to individual mistakes, not so much.

    Special remark for Taltos: your understanding of motive in law enforcement is wrong. Google for “Yick Wo”.

    Special for Patterico: the Camden election was four Democrats vs. four independents.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (0a9729)

  26. Just because someone’s a U.S. Attorney does not mean that he is not a moron, AF.

    nk (f28d83)

  27. You’ll remember that Rove (yes, Rove: he sent the orders to Goodling, as we’ll hear in detail when she testifies) sacked the USA in Missouri so that one of his political operatives could come in (without Senate confirmation, surprise, surprise) and try to influence the close Senate election with last-minute election fraud charges. Do you want to know how bogus those were? Well, the issue was fake registrations compiled by ACORN solicitors—this is an unsurprising consequence of ACORN’s policy of paying people to solicit names—and ACORN itself blew the whistle. So we’re left with a Federal indictment of four losers who netted $8 hour. Mickey Mouse. Stolzman’s other contribution, suing the State of Missouri to make it “purge” its voter rolls, got thrown out for lack of evidence.

    We’re accumulating lots of evidence that USAs who didn’t pursue this voter fraud nonsense got fired. Evidence of actual fraud, especially organized fraud as opposed to individual mistakes, not so much.

    Special remark for Taltos: your understanding of motive in law enforcement is wrong. Google for “Yick Wo”.

    Special for Patterico: the Camden election was four Democrats vs. four independents.

    Double special: repeat posting, original never appeared.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (0a9729)

  28. Ironically named commentor Common Sense Political Thought asks:

    “Why is it legal for someone to promise me cash in my pocket for my vote through a tax cut, but illegal to promise me cash in my pocket for my vote by handing me money? Is there really any difference?”

    Promising to support policies that may allow you to keep more of your own money is not the same as giving you money. Certainly less of a bribe than promising to support minumum wage increases.

    Tom from LA (47ad59)

  29. NK: while I’d certainly agree with the idea of restricting the franchise to white male property owners (the founding faters were very wise! :) ), the fact is that we vote for people for all sorts of fool reasons: Senatrix Clinton is angling for votes based on her chromosomes, Senator Obama is hoping people will vote for him despite his middle name, people will vote for a winning smile or a real zinger of a one-liner in a ridiculously structured debate, people will vote based on the recommendation of Amanda Marcotte, people will vote because they’ve been promised more money in their wallet by a tax cut, or, in the mayor’s race in Philadelphia, not just on skin color but whether a particular candidate is black enough.

    None of that is illegal, because we cannot control the basis on which voters take their decisions.

    The idea that it’s legitimate to ask for my vote by promising me more money in my pocket via a tax cut, but illegitimate to ask me for my vote by handing me a $20 bill is really ludicrous.

    At least you know the guy who offers to pay for your vote immediately will keep his promise!

    Dana (3e4784)

  30. Tom from LA: At least you know that the guy who offers you money for your vote via cash in hand, as opposed to a tax cut or a minimum wage increase of more welfare benefits will keep his promise! :)

    Dana (3e4784)

  31. Special remark for Taltos: your understanding of motive in law enforcement is wrong. Google for “Yick Wo”.

    Who said anything about law enforcement? Every action has a motive of some sort, my point was that since the action in question is perfectly legal, unless calling people and giving them factually correct information was made criminal and no one told me, the motive behind it is meaningless.

    If this account amounts to voter intimidation then so would a weather report saying it’s going to rain on election day, afterall I’m sure there are poor people without umbrellas who’ll just stay home.

    Taltos (c99804)

  32. Andrew:

    “Camden is largely poor and black.

    Were any such calls made to nearby Cherry Hill, white and affluent? The Pine Barrens, white and poor? If not, why not.”

    Gee, I think I can field that “hardball” (scoff) question for you…could it be, oh, I don’t know, that poor people might be significantly more likely to trade their vote for money?

    If a campaign starts about the illegality of hiring undocumented domestic help, those calls can go to Cherry Hill.

    headhunt23 (9e1243)

  33. So, Andrew, this is a case of Democrats and Independents acting to “suppres” their own votes ?

    It is nothing short of amazing what the leftists will claim as voter suppression. Not keeping the polls open until midnight ? SUPPRESSION ! Having to wait in line ? SUPPRESSION ! Not being allowed to vote in multiple jurisdictions ? SUPPRESSION ! Not being given multiple ballots ? SUPPRESSION ! Being asked to prove who you are ? SUPPRESSION ! The victim mentality of these clowns is too much ….

    JD (4b6fef)

  34. When society’s lowest common denominator receive calls that describe something about voting, elections, and prosecutors, it’s not inconceivable that the confused LCD will avoid elections. Since a third of Americans believe that President Bush knew about 9/11 before the attacks, and that another 20 percent aren’t sure, it’s clear that millions of Americans might get confused by the phone calls.

    Having spoken to hundreds of low income South LA residents, I’m struck by how useless they think their votes are and they don’t vote. They ask, “What’s the use?”

    Clark Baker (35519b)

  35. Andrew, maybe you had this case in mind. Back in the 80s, there was a huge scandal in Orange County when the Republicans hired polling place guards to watch for illegals voting. They didn’t actually stop anybody, legal or illegal, from voting but the result was Loretta Sanchez in Congress and a fake scandal that still gets revived from time to time.

    Mike K (6d4fc3)

  36. Mike, the GOP doesn’t need to hire guards to watch for illegals voting. First, illegals don’t generally register to vote, preferring to remain as inconspicuous as possible. (Feel free to supply evidence of illegals registering and voting…I’m waiting). Second, Orange County is fairly evenly split. There shouldn’t be any shortage of GOP volunteer poll watchers who can challenge suspect voters from inside the polling place as provided by law.

    Instead of calling this a “fake” scandal, maybe it would be better to wonder: what did the GOP have in mind? My best guess is that they hoped to scare away legal voters who aren’t in the mood for a long talk with La Migra, perhaps because they harbor illegal aliens—maybe even depend on them for a ride to the polls.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  37. My best guess is that they hoped to scare away legal voters who aren’t in the mood for a long talk with La Migra, perhaps because they harbor illegal aliens—maybe even depend on them for a ride to the polls.

    Oh for crying out loud.

    spongeworthy (45b30e)

  38. My best guess is that you are a mental midget. Your best guess imputes motive, malice, and bad faith onto someone based on what ? Your guess. That is all. Nothing more. Is it possible to wrap your pea sized brain around the idea that only the people properly registered to vote should vote ?

    JD (868cea)

  39. Where did I say that people not properly registered should be allowed to vote?

    What legitimate ballot security could GOP-hired rent-a-badges outside the polling place do that the GOP poll-watchers inside couldn’t? D’Oh! (As usual, not one shred of evidence of fraud was offered in the subsequent court proceeding, which cost the GOP a $400,000 settlement.) And I’d say that the settlement, after the country registrar had explicitly warned the GOP not to do this, is prima facie evidence of that “bad faith” I found.

    Every evidence-free comment here merely legitimates my argument that GOP/Rove voter fraud investigations are intended to introduce modalities inhibiting legitimate Democratic-leaning voters.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  40. Andrew – How in the hell is that relevant to this post ? Apparently, voters had a choice between 4 Dems and 4 Independents, according to you ? Is this another example of Dems or those crafty independents attempting to suppress votes by informing people that it is illegal to sell their vote ? Good Lord, you are obtuse.

    JD (868cea)

  41. How about this as an example of voter suppression … In Indianapolis, for the primaries, there were at least 4 precincts that never even opened for voting, and numerous others that opened very late. Clearly, it was some Rovian scheme, no ? Which action actually suppresses a vote ? Not opening the polls, informing people of the law, or having guards at a polling place ?

    JD (868cea)

  42. I’d like to know why the Indianapolis polling places didn’t open. Whether it was incompetence or malice, it shouldn’t have happened and heads should roll.

    My point is that Rove and the GOP have a program going to reduce genuine votes by creating a hysterical fear of fraudulent votes (evidence for which they can’t provide even when it would save their legal butts). Just where the Camden example fits in, as it may be too small potatoes for Rove himself, isn’t clear. What is clear is the general outline. These phone calls (like the rent-a-cops) aren’t part of a campaign for ballot integrity, they’re part of a campaign to frighten voters away.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  43. This sounds like a public service announcement to me – examples of which we hear and see everyday like “don’t shake your baby”, “don’t fry your brain on drugs”, and “wear your seat belt.” Andrew, do these PSAs send the wrong message, too?

    DRJ (8b9d41)

  44. As there are no apparent Republicans in the Camden election, and not even a scintilla of evidence that Rove gives a flying f@$? who wins that race, your sheer speculation and conjecture are more proof of BDS or RDS than of actual voter suppression. When the dead quit voting in Cook County, and when they actually close a poll in St. Louis, or open a poll in Indy, check back with us.

    JD (0c5b67)

  45. And if they’re that easy to frighten maybe they don’t deserve the right. Note that the right to vote is nowhere in the Constitution…. or Amendments

    SDN (3c90ca)

  46. Well, the issue was fake registrations compiled by ACORN solicitors—this is an unsurprising consequence of ACORN’s policy of paying people to solicit names—and ACORN itself blew the whistle. So we’re left with a Federal indictment of four losers who netted $8 hour.

    Let’s see if I’ve got this straight. ACORN blew the whistle on 4 people committing fraud. They are subsequently prosecuted and convicted…and ROVE DID IT!!!

    That’s nuts, Andrew. Truthy, but nuts.

    Do you want to know how bogus those were?

    Yes, I do. And I have a very simple metric for determining that: Were the crimes committed and were the convicted guilty of them?

    Every evidence-free comment here merely legitimates my argument that GOP/Rove voter fraud investigations are intended to introduce modalities inhibiting legitimate Democratic-leaning voters.

    You mean stupid Democratic leaning voters, don’t you? The legalities of voter qualification are terribly uncomplicated, and anyone who wouldn’t vote because of prosecutions of people who break those very simple laws is an idiot.

    Break the law, get prosecuted. Shocka! And of course, a nefarious Rovian conspiracy. But alas, valiant Andrew has torn back the curtain and exposed the little man at the controls…in his mind.

    One of these days, you’ll have to get out and play in the real world, Andy. This is not the real world. This is hysteriaville:

    My point is that Rove and the GOP have a program going to reduce genuine votes by creating a hysterical fear of fraudulent votes (evidence for which they can’t provide even when it would save their legal butts).

    I think I’ll suppress shopping by creating a hysterical fear of shoplifting. think that will work?

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  47. “Every evidence-free comment here merely legitimates my argument that GOP/Rove voter fraud investigations are intended to introduce modalities inhibiting legitimate Democratic-leaning voters.

    Comment by Andrew J. Lazarus”

    Including your “evidence free” comments ?

    The fact is that supposed language training organizations that got federal money for educational purposes were registering illegals as fast as they could. Those are “Democrat-leaning voters” and that is why the Democratic party is opposed to any crack down on illegal immigration. The irony is that they share this enthusiasm with Republican employers who want cheap labor even if it harms the natural and native-born Democrat voters they should care about. Ever hear the expression “You can’t make an omelet without breaking a few eggs ?” Those eggs you hear breaking are black voters who are victims of the Democrats’ alliance with teachers’ unions and illegal immigrants.

    Mike K (86bddb)

  48. It might be that there are Democrats who place the illegal alien problem above party loyalty. The mayor of Hazelton, PA, who wants a law to make renting to illegals a crime, just won the Republican primary for a third term. More significantly, he also won the Democrat primary as a write-in !!!

    Mike K (86bddb)

  49. Pablo: The actions of Rove’s handpicked USA for Missouri were remarkable in two respects. The DOJ used to make a point of not trying to influence elections with announcements. Second, isn’t it unusual to make a Federal case out of four registration fraud indictments not related to official malfeasance or racial animus? And third, by what stretch of the imagination could these whopping four indictments be viewed as a “massive” “national” conspiracy?

    Five days before the election, Schlozman, then interim U.S. attorney in Kansas City, announced indictments of four voter-registration workers for a Democratic-leaning group on charges of submitting phony applications, despite a Justice Department policy discouraging such action close to an election.

    [A second source]

    Schlozman moved fast, so fast that his office got one of the names on the indictments wrong. He announced the indictments of four former ACORN workers on Nov. 1, 2006, warning that “this national investigation is very much ongoing.” Missouri Republicans seized on the indictments to blast Democrats in the campaign endgame.

    Critics later accused Schlozman of violating the Justice Department’s own rules. A 1995 Justice election crime manual says “federal prosecutors . . . should be extremely careful not to conduct overt investigations during the preelection period” to avoid “chilling legitimate voting and campaign activities” and causing “the investigation itself to become a campaign issue.”

    You are being played. It’s as if there were story after story from the White House about the Negro Conspiracy to Debauch White Women, and after enough of this drivel, plus isolated and unorganized cases of rape, then the lynchings begin.

    Mike K: Mind posting a link about those language training organizations?

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  50. The actions of Rove’s handpicked USA for Missouri were remarkable in two respects. The DOJ used to make a point of not trying to influence elections with announcements.

    Do you have any evidence that Rove handpicked Scholzman to be the interim US Atty?

    The DOJ used to make a point of not trying to influence elections with announcements.

    Any evidence that the announcement was an attempt to influence the election? After all, ACORN dropped the dime on them, which would seem to be an act of transparency and shouldn’t reflect poorly on them.

    Second, isn’t it unusual to make a Federal case out of four registration fraud indictments not related to official malfeasance or racial animus?

    Is it unusual to prosecute violation of Federal law in a Federal case? Have you a more appropriate venue in mind?

    You are being played.

    No. Nice try, though.

    Well, not really, because your underlying premise is ludicrous.

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  51. Let’s see: the US Attorney is in such a rush to announce indictments before the election he doesn’t even get one of the names right. But that couldn’t be an attempt to influence the election. Except, of course, that it was well known that the ACORN registration effort was intended primarily to benefit Democrats.

    Before the circumstances of the indictments blew up in Republican faces, there wasn’t any attempt to hide what good news the investigation was—for Republicans!

    Federal authorities are already investigating this growing scandal involving Democrats and the McCaskill Campaign!

    Democrat-Linked ACORN Members Indicted for Voter Fraud in Kansas City [Official MO GOP press release right before election]

    You could believe it’s an amazing coincidence. You could believe OJ is looking for the real killers, too.

    As for how Schlozman got picked, well, let’s see what Monica Goodling has to say, plus the Rove emails which have been subpoenaed. Of course, we both know Rove placed these permanent-interim USAs, we’re just in a little dance about the burden of proof.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (7d46f9)

  52. There are people who will avoid any aspect of a controversy. If “voting” has become controversial, they’ll not vote. Probably a good thing, IMHO, but does suppress some voting.

    Kevin Murphy (805c5b)

  53. Let’s see: the US Attorney is in such a rush to announce indictments before the election he doesn’t even get one of the names right.

    Funny that the Boston Globe doesn’t say how wrong it was. And they also don’t provide any indication that the typo(?) was the product of haste. Do you have any such evidence? Do you even know what the mistake was?

    Except, of course, that it was well known that the ACORN registration effort was intended primarily to benefit Democrats.

    Yeah, and ACORN acted to make sure that its work was unimpeachable by exposing the crimes committed and, presumably reviewing the work those people had done. That’s a good reflection on them.

    As for how Schlozman got picked, well, let’s see what Monica Goodling has to say, plus the Rove emails which have been subpoenaed.

    So, you don’t know it to be true, you’re simply insisting it is on faith.

    That’s looney, Andy.

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  54. Oh, how’s that Rove indictment working out?

    Fitz? Bueller?

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  55. A somewhat similar letter (warning illegals that their voting was, er, illegal) was sent in Orange County, and the AG’s office declined to prosecute. If you’re not suppressing a legal vote, there’s no crime. Makes sense to me.
    Letter not a crime
    Must be some Rove lackey in charge at the AG Office.
    Oh, wait….

    Patricia (824fa1)

  56. LMAO.

    Patricia, you made my night. Funniest post I’ve seen in the last several hours… Very well done…

    Scott Jacobs (a1de9d)

  57. Geez, Pablo,

    Why would anyone want to get rid of Rove now.

    His “math” cost the Republicans control of both houses of Congress, and his little games have mired the last two years of the Bush admin in endless scandals.

    Like the porker in Reagan’s famous joke…you don’t eat a pig like that in one sitting.

    alphie (015011)

  58. Let’s see, Pablo. We know that Rove has been conducting a crusade against vote fraud, that’s not a secret. We know that many of the US Attorneys were dismissed because someone with authority over them wasn’t satisfied with their attitude towards vote fraud. (Another example.) And we know that the US Attorneys who were installed (without Senate confirmation) conducted investigations, turning up a few score convictions and a lot of hysteria. So the new USAs were doing exactly what Rove announced, publically, he wanted.

    Maybe Rove didn’t pick the specific names, although I think he did—from that RNC Blackberry full of emails that the Bush Administration is stonewalling on. (What do they have to hide?) But maybe Sampson or Goodling or Gonzales picked the specific names: it was all done to further Rove’s bogus war against the Nonexistent Vote Fraud Conspiracy.

    Andrew J. Lazarus (0a9729)

  59. USA’s follow Administration policy = ROVE DID IT!!!

    Brilliant, Andrew. Just bloody brilliant.

    Pablo (08e1e8)

  60. Who do you think set this policy, the WH janitor?

    Rove’s been into vote fraud for a long time. Pattern and practice, is that the term of art?

    And what is in those emails??

    Andrew J. Lazarus (0d40b6)

  61. It’s as if there were story after story from the White House about the Negro Conspiracy to Debauch White Women, and after enough of this drivel, plus isolated and unorganized cases of rape, then the lynchings begin.

    In an atmosphere in which predictably deplorable things have been written after the demise of Jerry Falwell, the above sentence is the most vulgar thing I have read all day. You should be ashamed, although you’re probably not.

    But maybe, Andrew, I should cut you a break. It could be that you are an articulate child prodigy of the tender age of seven. I’m thinking maybe you are too young to remember November 2000, when Al Gore — minutes after phoning George W. Bush and conceding the election — called him back and un-conceded. Maybe you don’t remember William Daley telling crowds of rain-soaked Gorebots they were going to challenge the vote. Maybe you don’t remember how accusations of vote fraud — no matter how flimsy and contrived — became the singular obsession of every liberal in this nation.

    Maybe you don’t remember how leftists in the media pulled their knives on the state of Florida, and accused the GOP of sabotaging poor, elderly, bifocal-wearing Palm Beach voters by making them vote for Pat Buchanan (never mind that the so-called “Butterfly Ballot” was designed by a Democrat), and the unsubstantiated tales of suppressing the black vote by having law enforcement vehicles nearby ballot locations (apparently, Donkey conventional wisdom is if you want to keep law-abiding black people away from someplace they have a perfect right to be, park a black-and-white nearby).

    Maybe you don’t remember the protests that Jesse Jackson organized within hours of the early Wednesday morning announcement that Bush had taken Florida, in which he demanded the trashing of every vote cast Election Day and the scheduling of an unprecedented “re-vote.”

    Maybe you don’t remember the way that the Gore campaign team led a smear campaign against Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris (said Gore spin doctor Mark “FBI Files” Fabiani, “[We] needed an enemy”), and their minions threw in critiques of her makeup to boot (as if this was something that was of any importance when Hillary was First Lady).

    Maybe you’re not even a seven year old genius, Andrew; maybe you’re three, and don’t remember how in 2004, lefties across the country organized locally by the thousands to make maddog sure that the Bush Administration didn’t “steal” the election again. Since you are too young to drive, you wouldn’t remember the bumper stickers that read, “RE-DEFEAT BUSH.”

    Maybe you don’t remember how the Democrats turned their focus from Florida to Ohio when it became clear that was where the election would turn. Just as Katherine Harris wasn’t treated like a lady because she was Republican, GOP Secretary of State Ken Blackwell wasn’t given the mulligan the DNC regularly allotted black men.

    Yes, Andrew, maybe you are but a boy, and don’t remember those things that put the lie to your assertion that Bush Administration efforts to prevent vote fraud in swing states was like a racist lynch mob. Fortunately, Andy, I’m not a boy, and I do remember. And let me tell you, if any group was acting like a lynch mob hunting for voter fraud that by-and-large didn’t exist, it is the Democrat Party. Or didn’t you notice that voter fraud stopped being a big deal only when Democrats were the big winners?

    OK, I was just kidding. I know you aren’t a boy, Andrew. But you sure are acting like one. Grow up.

    L.N. Smithee (d1de1b)

  62. Who do you think set this policy, the WH janitor?

    Oh, I dunno. Maybe the freaking President? Maybe the AG?

    Sorry, I know this doesn’t fall in with your Rove Derangement Syndrome, but tell me, exactly what authority does Rove have as an advisor to set policy?

    Pablo (08e1e8)


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