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	<title>Comments on: Stone&#8217;s Silly Catholicism Post Becomes Chicago Tribune Op-Ed</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/</link>
	<description>Harangues that just make sense</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 21:29:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: AF</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-266377</link>
		<dc:creator>AF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 18:07:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-266377</guid>
		<description>Might as well put &lt;a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/03/AR2007060301218.html?hpid=topnews" rel="nofollow"&gt;this up here:&lt;/a&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;But the organization's vice president, Tom Minnery, said that Dobson rejoiced over the ruling "because we, and most pro-lifers, are sophisticated enough to know we're not going to win a total victory all at once. We're going to win piece by piece."

Doctors adopted the late-term procedure "out of convenience," Minnery added. &lt;b&gt;"The old procedure, which is still legal, involves using forceps to pull the baby apart in utero, which means there is greater legal liability and danger of internal bleeding from a perforated uterus. So we firmly believe there will be fewer later-term abortions as a result of this ruling."&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt; Marty Lederman &lt;a href="http://balkin.blogspot.com/2007/06/banning-abortion-procedure-because-it.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;has some comments and observations&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Might as well put <a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/03/AR2007060301218.html?hpid=topnews" rel="nofollow">this up here:</a></p>
<blockquote><p>But the organization&#8217;s vice president, Tom Minnery, said that Dobson rejoiced over the ruling &#8220;because we, and most pro-lifers, are sophisticated enough to know we&#8217;re not going to win a total victory all at once. We&#8217;re going to win piece by piece.&#8221;</p>
<p>Doctors adopted the late-term procedure &#8220;out of convenience,&#8221; Minnery added. <b>&#8220;The old procedure, which is still legal, involves using forceps to pull the baby apart in utero, which means there is greater legal liability and danger of internal bleeding from a perforated uterus. So we firmly believe there will be fewer later-term abortions as a result of this ruling.&#8221;</b></p></blockquote>
<p> Marty Lederman <a href="http://balkin.blogspot.com/2007/06/banning-abortion-procedure-because-it.html" rel="nofollow">has some comments and observations</a></p>
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		<title>By: L.N. Smithee</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262248</link>
		<dc:creator>L.N. Smithee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 01:13:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262248</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;This one pisses me off. Professor Stone’s article was thoroughly discredited, on the University’s own blog, and has been for a couple of weeks now. So, naturally, the proper thing for the Chicago Tribune to do is to publish it in the newspaper, where negative responses to it can be completely controlled by the editors.&lt;/i&gt;

It's a pattern of dealing with inconvenient facts leaking out of non-MSM sources I am seeing more and more:

1. Leftist journalist/editorialist writes/says something patently false; 

2. MSM promotes the falsehood; 

3. Conservative blogosphere investigates and disproves false statements; 

4. MSM bides its time as unchecked false statements continue to spread; 

5. Conservative blogosphere forcefully challenges MSM to admit error; 

6. After another controversy puts falsehoods on back burner, MSM grudgingly report that an alternative point-of-view exists, and all but dismissively says, "It's just &lt;i&gt;them&lt;/i&gt;."

The MSM still hasn't had the courage to admit that Joseph Wilson did NOT "debunk" or "discredit" CIA intelligence claims Iraq was seeking yellowcake uranium in Niger.  As for challenging Valerie Plame's newly minted tale of some passerby being responsible for suggesting Wilson for the Niger trip, the MSM are predictably incurious -- it would have to admit that there was a reason for believing Plame had a role in the mission in the first place, which the great majority of news outlets took great pains to conceal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>This one pisses me off. Professor Stone’s article was thoroughly discredited, on the University’s own blog, and has been for a couple of weeks now. So, naturally, the proper thing for the Chicago Tribune to do is to publish it in the newspaper, where negative responses to it can be completely controlled by the editors.</i></p>
<p>It&#8217;s a pattern of dealing with inconvenient facts leaking out of non-MSM sources I am seeing more and more:</p>
<p>1. Leftist journalist/editorialist writes/says something patently false; </p>
<p>2. MSM promotes the falsehood; </p>
<p>3. Conservative blogosphere investigates and disproves false statements; </p>
<p>4. MSM bides its time as unchecked false statements continue to spread; </p>
<p>5. Conservative blogosphere forcefully challenges MSM to admit error; </p>
<p>6. After another controversy puts falsehoods on back burner, MSM grudgingly report that an alternative point-of-view exists, and all but dismissively says, &#8220;It&#8217;s just <i>them</i>.&#8221;</p>
<p>The MSM still hasn&#8217;t had the courage to admit that Joseph Wilson did NOT &#8220;debunk&#8221; or &#8220;discredit&#8221; CIA intelligence claims Iraq was seeking yellowcake uranium in Niger.  As for challenging Valerie Plame&#8217;s newly minted tale of some passerby being responsible for suggesting Wilson for the Niger trip, the MSM are predictably incurious &#8212; it would have to admit that there was a reason for believing Plame had a role in the mission in the first place, which the great majority of news outlets took great pains to conceal.</p>
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		<title>By: AF</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262219</link>
		<dc:creator>AF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 22:02:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262219</guid>
		<description>&lt;a href="http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2007/04/crisis_at_ave_m.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;Well, this is pretty funny&lt;/a&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;What's going on at Ave Maria School of Law?

We have chosen to reply as a group to repeated inquiries concerning recent events at Ave Maria School of Law (AMSL). We do so to indicate the extent of our agreement concerning the serious nature of the crisis unfolding here, the need for fundamental change if AMSL is to continue to exist and serve its Mission, and to appeal for input from our colleagues in the wider legal academy.

Until now, the majority of the faculty has not made public the outrageous behavior of the Law School's administration. We have remained silent in the hope of minimizing damage to our school, believing that responsible parties would set matters right, and out of fear of escalating acts of retaliation. At this point, however, we believe it is important to allow the larger legal community to know the reality of the way AMSL's administration has abused the power with which it has been entrusted.

Those who have not been closely following events at AMSL, nonetheless, may have heard of a number of events over the last year or so. To summarize: last spring, a substantial majority of the faculty issued a vote of "no confidence" in Dean Bernard Dobranski. The response from the AMSL Board of Governors, led by Board Chairman and AMSL's largest funder, Thomas Monaghan, was a terse restatement of its support for the Dean. This rejection of open discussions, combined with retaliatory actions by the Dean, exclusion of the faculty from governance of the school, and serious violations of academic freedom were subjects of an investigation by an ABAfact-finder earlier this year. In the midst of this ABAprocess, the AMSL Board voted in effect to close AMSL and transfer its assets to a new law school to be located on the campus of Ave Maria University, in southwest Florida.

&lt;a href="http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2007/04/crisis_at_ave_m.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;continue...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2007/04/crisis_at_ave_m.html" rel="nofollow">Well, this is pretty funny</a><br />
<blockquote>What&#8217;s going on at Ave Maria School of Law?</p>
<p>We have chosen to reply as a group to repeated inquiries concerning recent events at Ave Maria School of Law (AMSL). We do so to indicate the extent of our agreement concerning the serious nature of the crisis unfolding here, the need for fundamental change if AMSL is to continue to exist and serve its Mission, and to appeal for input from our colleagues in the wider legal academy.</p>
<p>Until now, the majority of the faculty has not made public the outrageous behavior of the Law School&#8217;s administration. We have remained silent in the hope of minimizing damage to our school, believing that responsible parties would set matters right, and out of fear of escalating acts of retaliation. At this point, however, we believe it is important to allow the larger legal community to know the reality of the way AMSL&#8217;s administration has abused the power with which it has been entrusted.</p>
<p>Those who have not been closely following events at AMSL, nonetheless, may have heard of a number of events over the last year or so. To summarize: last spring, a substantial majority of the faculty issued a vote of &#8220;no confidence&#8221; in Dean Bernard Dobranski. The response from the AMSL Board of Governors, led by Board Chairman and AMSL&#8217;s largest funder, Thomas Monaghan, was a terse restatement of its support for the Dean. This rejection of open discussions, combined with retaliatory actions by the Dean, exclusion of the faculty from governance of the school, and serious violations of academic freedom were subjects of an investigation by an ABAfact-finder earlier this year. In the midst of this ABAprocess, the AMSL Board voted in effect to close AMSL and transfer its assets to a new law school to be located on the campus of Ave Maria University, in southwest Florida.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.mirrorofjustice.com/mirrorofjustice/2007/04/crisis_at_ave_m.html" rel="nofollow">continue&#8230;</a></p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: Kevin Murphy</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262187</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Murphy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 19:05:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262187</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;...the court's opinion is a hodgepodge of confusing and sometimes offensive ramblings...&lt;/blockquote&gt;Gee, you'd think a &lt;b&gt;&lt;i&gt;Roe&lt;/i&gt; supporter&lt;/b&gt; wouldn't try that particular argument.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>&#8230;the court&#8217;s opinion is a hodgepodge of confusing and sometimes offensive ramblings&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>Gee, you&#8217;d think a <b><i>Roe</i> supporter</b> wouldn&#8217;t try that particular argument.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike K</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262186</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 18:58:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262186</guid>
		<description>When I was a National Merit Scholar at a Chicago Catholic high school in 1956, a school counselor and Christian Brother refused to write a letter of recommendation to the University of Chicago on the grounds that it was anti-Catholic. I guess he was right. I went somewhere else anyway.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When I was a National Merit Scholar at a Chicago Catholic high school in 1956, a school counselor and Christian Brother refused to write a letter of recommendation to the University of Chicago on the grounds that it was anti-Catholic. I guess he was right. I went somewhere else anyway.</p>
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		<title>By: Dana</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262144</link>
		<dc:creator>Dana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 14:07:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262144</guid>
		<description>This one pisses me off.  Professor Stone's article was thoroughly discredited, on the University's own blog, and has been for a couple of weeks now.  So, naturally, the proper thing for the &lt;i&gt;Chicago Tribune&lt;/i&gt; to do is to publish it in the newspaper, where negative responses to it can be completely controlled by the editors.

One of the greatest things about the internet is that it has removed the ability of the "gatekeepers" to control, restrict or just plain quash dissent -- and that's why Professor Stone's original got hammered, because critics had the means to do so.

The editors of the &lt;i&gt;Tribune&lt;/i&gt; had to have seen the criticism -- but wanted to publish it in a venue in which it could influence people who won't see the criticism of others, and who are restricted in their ability to respond.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This one pisses me off.  Professor Stone&#8217;s article was thoroughly discredited, on the University&#8217;s own blog, and has been for a couple of weeks now.  So, naturally, the proper thing for the <i>Chicago Tribune</i> to do is to publish it in the newspaper, where negative responses to it can be completely controlled by the editors.</p>
<p>One of the greatest things about the internet is that it has removed the ability of the &#8220;gatekeepers&#8221; to control, restrict or just plain quash dissent &#8212; and that&#8217;s why Professor Stone&#8217;s original got hammered, because critics had the means to do so.</p>
<p>The editors of the <i>Tribune</i> had to have seen the criticism &#8212; but wanted to publish it in a venue in which it could influence people who won&#8217;t see the criticism of others, and who are restricted in their ability to respond.</p>
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		<title>By: PCachu</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262136</link>
		<dc:creator>PCachu</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 13:33:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262136</guid>
		<description>Now, now.  AF &lt;i&gt;was&lt;/i&gt; doing his job, which is to ham-fistedly work to change the subject whenever he doesn't like what's on tap.  And since pointing out Prof. Stone's conspiracy-mongering and bald-faced Catholophobia doesn't fill AF with the warm fuzzies, that's obviously a priority.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now, now.  AF <i>was</i> doing his job, which is to ham-fistedly work to change the subject whenever he doesn&#8217;t like what&#8217;s on tap.  And since pointing out Prof. Stone&#8217;s conspiracy-mongering and bald-faced Catholophobia doesn&#8217;t fill AF with the warm fuzzies, that&#8217;s obviously a priority.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262096</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 04:14:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>This &lt;b&gt;&lt;i&gt;is&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/b&gt; an important topic.  The title of this post says Stone is "silly," but this kind of thing is really very dangerous and insidious.  &lt;a HREF="http://www.confirmthem.com/professor_stone_sullies_the_pages_of_the_chicago_tribune" rel="nofollow"&gt;See here.&lt;/A&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This <b><i>is</i></b> an important topic.  The title of this post says Stone is &#8220;silly,&#8221; but this kind of thing is really very dangerous and insidious.  <a HREF="http://www.confirmthem.com/professor_stone_sullies_the_pages_of_the_chicago_tribune" rel="nofollow">See here.</a></p>
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		<title>By: AF</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262073</link>
		<dc:creator>AF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 02:50:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262073</guid>
		<description>To more important topic...
Just doing my job.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To more important topic&#8230;<br />
Just doing my job.</p>
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		<title>By: Patterico</title>
		<link>http://www.patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262062</link>
		<dc:creator>Patterico</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 May 2007 02:13:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://patterico.com/2007/04/30/stones-silly-catholicism-post-becomes-chicago-tribune-op-ed/#comment-262062</guid>
		<description>Six minutes from post to off-topic comment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Six minutes from post to off-topic comment.</p>
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